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i felt like i had been given everything

i've ever wanted and then someone had

gone but you can't have it i've never

felt so lonely in my life

[Music]

2015-16 it was really the first time

that i'd had fame i didn't know how to

cope with it so i just panicked all the

time i just want to sing

the day that i found out that the baby

had died i didn't have anyone to just

fall apart on and that's what i needed

that's what i wanted

when i sent you that voice note it was

around the time when you'd done a big

post about dave he was my guy

and i wish i could have protected him

from himself like he protected me for

myself

that's the bit that hurts me the most

between dave and jamal

the things that those people

gave me in my life are things that i

know i have to find in myself

you've got this bougie-ass place and

you've got kitchen wow i love it

so without further ado

i'm stephen bartlett and this is the

diary of a ceo usa edition i hope

nobody's listening

but if you are

then please keep this to yourself

[Music]

i tend to believe that people's family

are their foundation

and when i was reading through the story

of your family in your early years

actually seemed pretty idyllic

yeah i mean

we weren't my mum and dad i didn't grow

up with loads of money like we weren't

hard hard but we weren't rich

um but when i think about it again like

the one thing that i've learned from my

parents the most

is it doesn't matter about the things

and the specifics it's about the energy

you create within what you have so like

we would go camping in the garden

and my dad would pretend to be a bear in

the middle of the night and we i believe

to this day it was a bear like you know

my mom's like looking out the window

because she's gone in because she's like

i ain't doing this and my dad yeah my

dad's peeing in a bucket yeah they're

still doing it like not in front of us

because that would be weird but like

just they used to just create

these

experiences

and it was all about feeling and

that's what i remember the most from my

childhood

like more so than

anything else like it's weird like i was

in hospital a lot of my childhood

and

i never ever thought i was sick

because my mom and dad never treated me

as if i was

like they would

it was it would never it never became a

definitive of who i was which is i think

even why now i don't

define myself on that i don't want to

even when other people try but

there was just always this

air of making the best of whatever the

moment was

even if it was tough

your dad worked in mental health yeah a

mental social worker how did that

influence your early years

well my dad is a pisces through and

through he's an emotional

honest hilarious very sensitive

um stubborn man and so growing up he's

very in touch with like his feelings and

his emotions which isn't common in a lot

of men you know

and

we grew up

talking

and i spent a lot of time with my dad

when i was young and

he used humor

in his job and with us as me and my two

sisters and his relationship with my mom

she made her laugh and even now my dad's

humor is his defense his his way of

hiding his way of making friends his way

of healing

and

him being a social worker was always

that beautiful thing where he used to

ride the line where he would open you up

know that you were going to cry and then

make you laugh

and you always feel safe when you're

very very sad

and then you laugh

the emotions always kind of

they intertwine like deep sadness and

like

intense happiness are so close together

that like feeling when you're at a

funeral and everyone's crying and then

someone makes a joke and everyone bursts

into laughter like that's the line that

my dad is incredible at

kind of balancing

you're good at that too because which is

where i get it from

some of your hardest moments in your

yeah i make a joke but i use it in a way

to

allow people to feel safe including

myself

to bring out the sadness and the pain

you know and to

to talk about something really really

intense

um or go through a moment that's hard

but then make make a joke or make

light of the situation or laugh at

ourselves you know and then like go into

bird's eye view and look down and go

look at our slot you paid 30 quid to

come and cry

you know what i mean and it's like and

it's that thing if you just come in tap

him back into reality and just going oh

god like it's not

i'm not alone like and it's it's good to

laugh and laughter can feel as

to me as connective as crying with

someone as being intimate with someone

there's that thing that you have where

if you're really in that moment it's

such a release

you said you spent a lot of your time as

a kid in hospital yeah what was the the

first

time you went to

hospital first memory i have i think i

was eight

and we was in epping forest if you end

up in forestry probably not well you can

go it's lovely

in the forest yeah so

yeah it always starts in a forest and

it's like an episode of black mirror so

me and my sisters my dad were in the

park

and he said right let's race to the car

so we started to run and i just remember

i couldn't breathe

and i collapsed and the next thing i

remember is my dad picking me up and run

into the car

we got into the car we went to the

hospital

and my dad has wpw my granddad had wpw

which is a heart problem and so i that

was the first time i was taken in with a

regular irregular heartbeat

i was put on very heavy medication as a

child

um which would cause me to have like

seizures and pass out

um and have

like it was just awful

um so i was in and out of hospital a lot

as a child it was weird like i remember

being let out for the day to go and do

rehearsals for bugsy malone

and then i would go back in so i'd be on

a drip at the rehearsal so there was

always this kind of balance that kept me

present in myself and not and i almost

think that that was that's been my

blessing in my life

like my health has always kept my feet

on the ground

um in many ways but

i never remember being in hospital and

being aware of what i was going through

every memory i have i'm always thinking

about the people i watched and remember

like

looking at going god they need a

magazine or they haven't eaten anything

today or

i wonder how they're feeling i don't

remember being in pain or

coming around from an operation or it's

weird it's trippy it's almost like

it didn't happen

you define yourself as an empath you

said it when you came yeah for sure

and even people that hurt me i feel bad

for the people that hurt me because i

look at why they've hurt me as opposed

to the way i feel

but again

i don't know i try and use it as the

best i can because i know it's just who

i am

when you're in hospital one of the

things that you saw was um which

inspired big white room yeah was a boy

laid next to you yeah so i was in a it

was a ladybird ward

and um

there was a little boy in the room with

me and i remember waking up in the

middle of the night and he was crying

and

praying and had like

all of these like tubes and you know

like

the bloodlines and stuff coming with

this what's it called i don't know what

it's called but like he just had all

these things and he was just going

please don't let me die i'm so scared

don't let me die god i want to i want to

stay here i really want to be here and

he was i can't i ca he was

probably

10 or 11

and

i woke up and i remember just sitting

and watching him

for hours

and just listening to him

and then the next morning i remember

seeing his mum come in and just taking

all the balloons

and i said to my mom like

i was upset and i just remember saying

why

you know why

why wasn't he

why isn't he here now like he asked

so nicely

and my mom just said you know sometimes

god needs his angels closer to him

and i remember that moment stayed with

me for years

you know i was probably 10 when that

happened

and when i was 16 17 i had to write a

song about it was the first song i wrote

and it stayed with me that was the way i

needed to let that

feeling out

you know of like

everybody's looking at me and everyone's

staring at me what do i do now i smile

because i'm still here

i don't want to be here and i don't

remember what i felt like before

you know and obviously since that moment

that experience and then when i wrote

the song i'd also gone through a lot

more

health stuff and experiences

um

but that was the most human thing i'd

ever seen even though i wasn't conscious

of the fact that it was

how long did that last that the health

issues in your sort of pre-18 years in

terms of going in and out of hospital uh

not very long i mean it was it was a

it was chunks of time and i had an

ablation which is like a little

operation they do where they put

two wires through your shoulder and two

wires through your groin and they try

and kind of electrocute your heart into

a normal rhythm

and it didn't work so i get a regular

heartbeat now but i just i don't take

any medication

i believe in good diet

and like how i feel and

i try and do everything the holistic

natural way

um

i don't believe in medicine as much as

other people do

but i think it was funny because i

actually got to a point where i felt a

lot stronger and i was in a stride and i

was i got you know i was in a girl band

and i was at the brit school and i was

like

i'd cut my hair and i was a veto sassoon

model and i was like you know i'm

starting to feel like i can fit in and

i'm not the sick kid that can sing

you know and then i had a stroke when i

was 17.

and then it kind of again kind of took a

dip and then i'd get back on my feet and

i'd get signed and then i broke my foot

you had a stroke at 17. you had a stroke

in hamley's you know it's the toy stop

yeah yeah yeah yeah i worked there doing

now jazz now art

um and i was like i don't feel very well

and i was like doing a lot

i've always been someone that's like

overexerted myself and probably doesn't

know when to take a break

and yeah i lost the feeling on the right

side of my body for almost a month

and now all my issues have been on this

side

like this side of my body so i know like

it's so weird cause like when people go

my god you had a stroke and i'm like

yeah i don't even think about it

i don't define i don't want to define

myself on it i don't want to introduce

myself with it

because like i'm grateful it happened

because

if those things hadn't happened in my

life

you know the many years the the uterus

issues i've had the fertility thing the

miscarriage like

you grow in moments of sadness and pain

you know and i grew up in those moments

and i didn't take my body for granted

and i think it's actually given me more

moments of beautiful

success and joy in my life not

drowning my body in alcohol and drugs

and

having to take moments of still and

resting and

it was almost like

a very young age a very pivotal time of

my career kind of starting to take off

and more of a this could actually be my

life why

my body was would always keep me safe

even though it was

shutting down

it would always just remind me to go

you're not superhuman you could die

don't [ __ ] this up

you know and so it almost feels like my

health has just always had my back

when

my life has gone

like this it's always kind of going to

take a second and for a long time

i felt like i was cast with this spell

that like every time i kind of got

somewhere like i was just about to break

america and i broke my foot and i had to

pull out of opening for katy perry on

tour and all these things that like

you know you've got your thing you sit

with your team and you go this is going

to happen in this and great and

everyone's excited and then i get sick

and

you know even to recently

i was about to release my album and

my first single and then i was in a car

accident and i had a throat issue where

i had nerve and tissue damage and i

couldn't sing and then my meniere's and

i went deaf in this ear and

but now i don't even want to release

that album because i don't really like

the music really and i'm like maybe

that's why it happened i just feel like

i've been protected by

my health being

what other people would see as bad but

every time something happens to my body

i'm always like okay

what am i not listening to

like so i feel like that's my personal

way of looking at it in my journey so

like when you say

you know how long was that for it's kind

of been my whole life

you know even up until

recently when

you know right when i got my voice back

and i started doing these shows and i

finally was told i could sing again and

i phoned my agent and i was like i have

to do like a

i don't know like a residency somewhere

and i started doing these acoustic shows

and i was like i really want to do stand

up you know i want to do comedy i want

to make people laugh and sing that's

literally my purpose right

and then the day before the first show i

have a miscarriage

and i still went and did it

you know not because the show must go on

but to me like

jessie j and jessica cornish like jessie

j's just a brand name they go hand in

hand they're the same person

you know the reason that my music exists

is because my life exists

you know i write about [ __ ] i go through

you know so i want to stand in the

middle of the pain even when it's

terrifying and you're being exposed but

even in that moment i was like

this

i know this happened for a reason

you know like

the day that i found out that my the

baby had died

this man and i you know i can't make

this stuff up and i always wish someone

would see these things happen but i was

on the street crying

uncontrollably i felt like i'd

my body had gone numb like i was just on

the street and i

i was standing there and i couldn't move

i literally just stood at this bush for

like two hours

and i was phoning everybody that i knew

to try and answer the phone and just

because i was by myself i was in santa

monica

and this man came up to me and said

i don't know what's going on in your

life in this second but i know that it's

happening so that you can talk about it

and help other people

and i remember just going that's the

story of my life

and the anger i felt where i was like

why can't this just be about me

like why why do i have to help someone

else

and then i realized that is what i've

been called on to do

like i know that what i do is so much

bigger than me

it's not about the song or the the

accolades or the awards or this

it's about the feeling that you can hand

over to someone that they can't find

themselves

and

i have experienced so many things that

are so randomly rare

and then also i've experienced things

that aren't rare at all but no one talks

about

and the amount of women and men that

have been close to someone losing a baby

or having infertility issues or

losing children themselves or even women

that have had children that don't know

how to connect with their children

talking about that pain

not only

helped me but helped other people and i

know that like going back to what you

asked me before like i know that's so

much of my purpose as much as hard as it

can be in moments

i get so much

peace from knowing that

pain that i know i can handle

and have a different perspective of

than someone else that might not

that i can share that with them and give

them a different perspective as they can

me but obviously i do it on a

maybe a bigger platform

it is such an amazing feeling for me

to be able to give that to someone that

can't find it on their own

it's a heavy weight to carry to always

have to be the inspiration though right

yeah for sure but it isn't always the

case

um but i think it's just understanding

that

like understanding that

after i did that first show

a huge part of me regretted it

because i was angry that i reacted as

jessie j i reacted as my brand i reacted

as

i need people to know i'm okay like i

don't want people to think i'm this

always sick

always

ill always have something going on like

didn't she just

go deaf that's the comments didn't she

just

like da da da da you know like when you

go into a new relationship people like

wasn't she just with so-and-so and it's

like that was two years ago but

they live in a little bubble of when

they want to discover things you're

talking about doing the show the the

show after the day after had a

miscarriage like in the sense of the

reaction of of going

i must the show must go on i must

i after that show i surrendered to my

pain

and for nobody else but myself and

that's something that i've i don't think

i've ever done

and a lot of grief came out

grief of of grandparents of friends of

people that i've lost that it all came

out in that moment and still is to be

honest it was only four months ago that

this happened five months ago

so

i feel like a lot of grief that i had

stored in

interviews where i was like you know and

you've just got to find this and it's

always looking for the silver lining i

actually just enabled myself

to just break open and

be miserable and sad and

not have a quote at the end of my

moment and just go no it's [ __ ]

and i'm broken and it's awful and i'm

sad

but knowing that the light would come

and it did and

it is

um

but knowing that speeding up my

process of grief

because it makes somebody else feel good

is great but also not going to be

healthy for me

do you remember the day when you found

out that you would struggle to well the

doctor told you that you would struggle

to have children oh yeah

it was in the middle of a really major

busy time for me it was right before

bang bang

and i was doing all these different

shows

and i basically would have this extreme

pain

like

agonizing pain i would pass out it was

awful and they were like you have ibs

and i was like no i don't

i know i don't have ibs

like

and they would just be like yes you do

that's what it is and i was like no i

know myself i know my body

i know it's not ibs

and i stuck with it and i was like i

went to keep kept going to see different

doctors and i finally got diagnosed with

endometriosis which is very common and

then

i had an operation

that you know they took all the

endometriosis my endometriosis out i

went home

i still live with my parents

i went home and i was still in agony

and i was still having the episodes

and so i went back into hospital

and they did another operation where

they discovered i have adenomyosis

which is a form of endometriosis that

goes into the wall of the uterus

so they're

little cells that you can't take out

unless you take your uterus out

so

they were like you either manage the

pain which at the time i was like how do

i do this

or

we take your uterus out right now and i

was what 26

and also and he was like i would

recommend you to do that

you know this is only going to get worse

and i said i'm good

i'll go home and i'll look at other ways

i can

look up and manage my pain and that's

when i went plant-based that was you

know years and years and years ago

and it definitely helped and improved

and

i changed my lifestyle and

kind of slowed my pace down

you know after that record the bang bang

sweet talker record and i took a long

time

not off but just slowed down

and that's

when i wrote the rose album and so

there's like behind the scenes there's

always a story for everybody um but yeah

that moment was super pivotal for me

a lot of things happened at once i was

reading that i think it was around the

time you're in australia yeah in 15 2016

time and you were you'd lost your

grandparents yeah within like four or

five months of each other you had a

breakup yeah

i broke up my first breakup that was

kind of public because i was someone

that was just you know was famous and

just discovering myself you know like it

was really the first time that i'd had

fame in america too

and so like when i was famous in the uk

like i obviously i came here a lot and

it was kind of great because i was like

i could just do whatever i want and no

one cares so it was kind of like i could

just

escape to just live

completely in the knowledge that i would

leave my house or my hotel

and for the whole day no one would be

like

you know like or just come up to me with

a camera phone or whatever and i just i

needed that i was still quite young and

you know and i i miss staring at people

and

getting away with it

you know what i mean just like watching

people eat or like

staring at someone in the car next to

you and knowing they're not going to

look over and be like

you know and so

i remember coming here and just having

that and then i didn't have that as much

anymore here

and i just

felt really trapped

really trapped

like

that was the lowest point that i've had

in myself

in this industry was

2014

15 16

in when i was back and forth from

australia and

in that time that's when i moved here

in 2015.

when you say trapped what's the symptoms

of being trapped what is that what does

that manifest i just felt like i

couldn't breathe

i felt like everywhere i went someone

was watching me

i felt like i couldn't eat in public

because someone would film me

and comment on it comment on what i was

wearing comment on my body comment on

i just it felt it always felt like i was

being followed that was the biggest

thing where my anxiety came from

and

someone

telling me

or giving me something that i would then

have to focus on that i never saw like

that i have a big jaw that i have like

this or i have cellulite or i have that

like where i would never even it wasn't

a thing and then someone would go have

you ever noticed that she like says like

um or like like like like a lot and then

i'd be like conscious of the way i spoke

and

you know like as when you first get

somebody commentating on everything you

do in r

i was just like

how do i

how do i live unconsciously now

like

how do i

go to the beach

without feeling like

i'm in my underwear in front of someone

hiding in the bushes taking pictures

how do i do that

you know and i still don't know

sometimes even now

and so i just

i felt like i couldn't

it felt like i had to re-learn how to do

life

like i i was comfortable going in front

of a hundred thousand people and singing

a song no problem

but going to perpetual in my car

i literally was i don't even know how to

do it i would drop the thing

like i i like wouldn't be able to lock

the thing on the car because i would

feel like someone was watching me and

like i it just destroyed me and i

remember just i wouldn't leave my hotel

room

like

i went out and bought like 50 hats

and even though it probably wasn't as

bad

as that

no you don't go to how like and i get

that even me talking about it now like

i'm conscious that the people watching

this going all right well you [ __ ]

ask to be famous get over it

like there's no space to feel like you

know what there's parts of it that are

amazing

but there are parts of it that are so

toxic and unhealthy and so inhumane

and no one

has a lot of space to be

um like to have any empathy for that and

that and i'm not talking about all the

time and just about that moment in my

life i just felt like i had no one i

could talk to

that had experienced it to guide me

to go

you're okay you're safe like

no one's gonna hurt you

you know and

i just felt so alone i felt like i was

hovering above everybody in every room i

was in like i wasn't able to just exist

playing a game at a friend's house that

i was always just like is everyone

thinking about what i'm saying and

they're going to repeat it and

so i just

panicked all the time

of that someone was going to misread

what i was saying or

if i was in a bad mood and i went to

like a

fish and chip shop and i was like we

didn't want to take a picture

that they would then tell someone else

and it would get to the daily mail did

that happen oh all the time

jessie j demar i mean there were times

where

i then would almost i remember i

remember for a little while for a couple

months i became what the press told me i

was

because i got so tired of justifying

that i wasn't mean

and i wasn't a diva

that was like here let me just be what

they say i am

because that's what people think i am

anyway and even when i am nice

like someone i remember going into a

room and being like hi everyone and no

one responding and me going

hi

and everyone's like this like

you know like when you're like at that

it's weird it's like a and that was like

and i'm talking about that time and it

was like peak

kind of everywhere fame saturday night

saturday night tv and

it was just such a trippy experience and

me just was like everyone hates me no

one likes me anymore

so i'm not going to try and be liked it

didn't last very long

if you could go back and speak to jessie

that was going through that that wasn't

staying in those hotel rooms and that

was yeah stumbling to put the petrol in

our car and

reacting to the media what would you

what advice would you give her

bird's eye view babes

just

imagine the best piece of advice i was

given from a therapist

was perspective

like

imagine the world go above it imagine

yourself flying above it and really look

at what you're stressed about

like get outside get some air

just get outside go to a park like take

a walk

you know and and also

be honest to your friends and your

family about how you're feeling and

allow them to be there for you because i

think everyone was kind of

everybody was kind of

swelled up in

i mean you've experienced it yourself

recently going from

being able to do whatever you do and no

one knowing who you are

to then everyone knowing who you are and

then everyone around you doesn't

instantly go are you okay they go this

is great

isn't it amazing

are you having so much fun and you don't

feel like you can go actually no

some of it's great but some of it's

really weird

and i need you to hold my hand

and i'm a little scared

and now i don't know how to get on the

train

when i never used to think about that

and now i have to rethink about it and i

go can i go on this central line on a

saturday at peak time

no

so how do i get to where i need to go

because my status is way higher than my

money

and i can't afford a driver

you know and your and your mind is going

who do i talk to about this

where do i and that's when i was 25 26

and i shaved my head and i did all of

that i was just like

what is happening

and who do i tell that will understand

you know

so yeah

did you find anyone that understood um

yeah i think

i had to learn that

talking to my loved ones

i remember sending out a message to

everybody going saying unless i am

in danger

or you don't think i've seen something

that's really bad that's been put in the

papers i don't want to see it amen oh

that's the worst i don't want to see it

i don't want don't send me a link of me

on the beach because i was there

my friends and my family sending me

links of people criticizing me have you

seen this

[ __ ] i'm like yeah i said to my mom and

dad and my brothers and sisters super

early doors yeah don't just do that in

the comments section on this website

tell me don't send me the link i'm not

bothered i'm not looking if you want

also the thing that they need to be

focused on and this is what i had to say

to my friends and family

stop focusing on

what the other people are saying

focus on helping me be someone that can

be within that

like

it doesn't matter what [ __ ]

donald from manchester thinks about my

outfit that i wore

what matters is

that i still feel confident

wearing those things after i've i may or

may not have been forced to read those

comments

because that's the other thing like fan

bases will sometimes shove that in your

face going can you believe this and it's

like i don't want to see it

i don't want to read it and sometimes

you're like they you literally can't

avoid it

so your closest friends and family that

was the biggest thing for me was making

them understand like

i need you to be there for jess who's in

the dressing room

not worrying about what the people think

that are in the audience watching jessie

j

i need you to care about the girl

backstage

before i even step on the stage

when you're a performer and you're in

the public eye yeah you see it you've

got to create basically a brand as you

call it yeah you make the distinction

between jessica and jesse and whatever

and they're really the same person but

yeah man same person is there a point in

your life where you

your identity got too caught up in being

jessie j yeah for sure when i wouldn't

know what to wear like i'd wear a cat

suit and like

my bob wig to like

like a family barbecue because i just

didn't know how to like tone it down i

was just on this hamster wheel of like

dude

like

and i just didn't know how to like i

didn't know who i was away from working

you know so like

one thing i realize now is that you are

a product of your environment

you are a product of your environment

and i see that in my my niece and my

nephews you know like and all the young

people i know and i watch my best

friends and my close family members have

children and i see how different their

kids are because they they are a

reflection of their environment you know

and the beauty that they can have if

they're

brought up in the middle of nowhere in

the countryside but then they're like

not streetwise and they kind of

you know and all these things and so

like when i look at like how i was

in those pivotal moments of my life

and i think this is why i have so much

empathy for young art like younger

artists and like i really care about

how they're protected

um

and just young people in general

like

protected from what the world is telling

them they are as opposed to them

discovering themselves

like i was a product of when i wake up

i'm working like this is what you wear

this is what you do this is how you act

this is what you say

and so like i didn't know how to switch

off like i would literally have to leave

the house on a full face of makeup and

like without

it was weird it was like a trippy i

remember going on holiday with a couple

of my girlfriends

and we were going for dinner and like

i was so stressed about what to wear and

how to do them and it was so dumb it's

not even like important but it was

moments like that when i was just like

god i need to chill out i'm not jesse j

right now but i didn't know who i was

i literally had no clue like what my

favorite color was or what food do i

like to eat because i would just get

given this is what we've got

this is what you've got time to eat for

so long it was so

unhealthy fast it was just everything

was so speeded up

and i was like what do i want to what

are my hobbies

what do i like to do other than just

sing and travel

i can travel to sing

i don't know

and that's when i was like okay i need

to take a second and after that third

album i took like four years

and disappeared

in that time you've got record labels

telling you presumably who you are who

they want you to be not even you know

what it's one thing i will say about my

record label

you know for as much as

we you know you always have your your

your disagreements with anybody in power

and anybody you know that's

you work for or work with or work under

or work next to like but my record label

have always supported me

um

to the best of their ability and and to

the best that i understand like the rose

album the last album i put out was my

favorite that i've ever put out was it

the most successful no was it the most

authentic to who i was at the time yes

did it have the biggest support for my

label no

did that matter to me at the time no

because i knew that the music was great

yeah would have been great

had they been

more supportive but

it didn't

again it didn't def it didn't take away

from the purpose of what that moment was

for me personally

so no they've been great they've been

amazing and even now they're super

supportive that like

first time i'm talking about it that i

had an album that was done

ready to go

and i listened to it a couple months ago

and was like this ain't it

and then i went back in the studio three

days ago to kind of start again

and maybe i'll use some of the old songs

maybe i won't maybe i'll rework them

but there just was something that wasn't

right and they're like we support you we

love you we got you

we see you we understand you i've been

with them for almost 15 years

what i've struggled to find is an

internal team

like people that are immediately around

me

like an assistant a manager that kind of

manager yeah managers assistant no

they're just a team

that's where i'm at right now like

you know i just let go of my sixth

manager two days ago

yeah

no hard feelings

no

great great people amazing at what they

do just not right for me

and i know it's because there's

something i'm doing wrong because i keep

picking the wrong people

so i know i need to look inwards and go

what am i doing wrong here is it because

i know i know what i want and i don't

really say it because i don't like to

cause waves in the ocean

kind of like a smooth sailing moment but

i also

know what i want i know what i deserve

and it's taken me a long time to be

confident in saying like i know i can

really sing

but i've just never had a team that

really get it

that like had the same passion as me and

like

live for like

the moments and like taking risks and

not being afraid and like

to like

you know and i'm i guess maybe i'm

talking about it right now because

if someone that's meant to be for me in

my life might see this because

you know like i say all the time like

people go what are you going to do now

like if you've got a new manager lined

up and i'm like

no

i didn't let them go because i've

secretly been meeting people like that's

not who i am

like one thing for sure is i'm loyal and

like i'm respectful but like when you're

your manager is like a it's almost like

a marriage you know you go into a

contract and you hand over a very big

important part of your life

you can't look for a new husband while

you're still married it doesn't work

like that

and i have no idea who good managers are

no idea

and i don't know if i ever will

i'm 34 i've been doing this a long time

but i also know that i've got so much

more to do

and i feel like i've barely scratched

the surface

and i know in my heart in my instinct

i don't just trust my instinct i act on

it

and it was a big brave thing for me to

do just to go guys i love you but i know

this ain't right i'm moving on

what wasn't right about it outside of

the passion you're looking for what is

what is it you're looking for from that

team that manager it's so funny because

when someone goes what do you what are

you looking for in a manager

for me it's just a feeling i just

thought like it's someone that

i'm such a hard worker right

and i'm very disciplined

i'm very professional

i can hand a lot of stuff by myself

and i think that exposes a lot of people

to do one of two things go she's good

or i need to work harder

and a lot of people go she's good

and i just want someone that

can teach me

about music can send me

performances from aretha that i've not

seen or

hey have you heard this new music or

have you read this book or

like you know what i was thinking be

amazing if we did this like okay so you

want to do this i need

the drive the passion like people that i

can relate to

like the way they

see the world and

feel the world and like

like i get told and i'm so grateful

i get told all the time you're one of

the best singers in the world

there's some singers down the street at

church that are the best singers in the

world

that no one will ever hear other than

than god and the people that are in the

church

but that doesn't mean anything

like if you're not doing anything with

it

you know and i and and

i just want a team of people that

represent me even when i'm not in the

room you know have you seen what you're

looking for elsewhere

i don't even know i don't even i don't

know

i know i look at other artists and go i

should be doing that there's no reason

that i shouldn't be there i shouldn't be

doing this or

i know that the music that i make

like i've always said this metaphor with

my career right

is i feel like

if my career was a shop i feel like i

sell ladders outside

but rose is on the inside

so i feel like

what i put out there isn't always what i

actually

sell

that isn't actually always me

that i feel like i'm

convinced or

i'm i'm i'm always a little afraid to be

a diva to come across like i'm arrogant

or this that and the other but like i

know the best moments of my career point

blank have been when i have followed

my

instincts acted on my own

heart like when i did the china tv show

everyone was like why is she doing why

why do you want to do a singing

competition i said just i just know this

is what i need to do you know even the

rose album

like i know that the people that

discovered that

were who needed to discover it and i

just know like

the only thing in life that is important

is to just not trust your instincts but

to act on them

be yourself and not be afraid

to know that even if you're in a room

full of people that if you know that

this is gonna work

just don't

be disheartened by everyone else's

projection of their own fear that they

can't deliver for you

i guess you'd also rather fail at being

yourself than succeed at being someone

else as well right and i've succeeded at

being someone else one honey p

that's one hundred percent yeah that's

good

one honey yeah just professional

you're like um

but like i love to write songs right and

i can sing so i go in the studio and i

can make music but sometimes i'm like i

love this i love these songs but

i wouldn't buy this album

i wouldn't i wouldn't put this on and

listen to it

and i'm grateful that i know i've been

accepted into so many different

spaces in the industry like the musical

theater world and like the pop world the

r b world the soul like i'm so i love

music and i grew up around a lot of

music and i grew around a lot up a lot

around different cultures and races and

walks of life and i'm so

so happy that that was my foundation and

that's what i am and i also need

management to represent that

i don't want to walk into rooms that

everyone looks the same

you know i'm tired of it

and

i wanna

make music that makes everybody feel

like that they're welcome and make music

that makes everyone feel accepted and

seen and understood and

i need my team to reflect that and i got

to do a better job

at making those decisions

one of the reasons i ask is if you've

seen it somewhere else

because it's because when you're a

obsessed person you're obsessed about

your craft

um i think we all and i'm speaking from

my own experience here we all struggle

when we don't feel like other people are

meeting us there

oh yeah you know what i mean and i see

this with founders specifically in

companies where they're they're just

absolutely obsessed and all in on their

dream and then they look at their team

who aren't at that standard don't seem

to care as much aren't you on sending

the aretha tracks at two a.m in the

morning yeah aren't going above and

beyond and they're thinking well you you

must not be right you must not care you

must not want to be here

um so there's a certain expectation no

for sure 100

and it's not that i'm saying i'm i

expect them to be me

i think it's just

people that even want to talk about

music yeah yeah you know like a lot of

managers like

when was the last time i went to see a

show like at the end of the day to me

that when you're a musician and you're

in the industry

i need a team of managers that are like

in

they're at the party they're not

trying to get me an invite they have to

be there and like coming you know what i

mean it's like

so i just i think that

i don't know what it is and i don't have

the answers and i don't know

i know what it is that i want

sometimes i don't know how to

to say that until i'm experiencing

experiencing that it's not what i want

and then i'm like no

like

this isn't right but i know that

it is also me

and i know that i have to be more vocal

on what it is that i want and what it is

that i deserve

and i just feel like i'm always taken

for granted and i just

i just

i just want to sing and like

really

be in the mix and work hard like the

fire in my belly now is like

what do you mean by being relaxed

it's weird when you've had success

like

people always say to me like yeah but

you're jessie j and i'm like what the

[ __ ] does that mean

i haven't even been invited to the brit

since 2011.

so what does it mean

i'm jesse j like

what is my success to you because it's

different to me obviously

you know and i think people go

and a lot of the time especially other

artists

they see that maybe you've had success

in places that they haven't or that

you've got something that they have and

they go yeah but why aren't you just

content with that

you know and everyone's everybody's

different with what they need to feel

successful

does comparison ever get the best of you

in your industry

no

you've never looked at another artist

and gone maybe i should be doing more or

no i look at other eyes and go man i

wish i was more confident

i wish i was more like i see people work

in a room and i'm so shy that i come

across rude when i'm in a room a lot

with a lot of people

i instantly go into that no one likes me

no one's going to get my sense of humor

like i have so

so many insecurities that

i don't think i've even been consciously

aware of until like the last year

since covered and like taking a break

and then coming back to it and i'm like

oh my god like

i don't think anyone in this room knows

who i am and i don't know why i'm here

and i'm so awkward and i hate this and

what the hell am i doing and i hate this

gown i'm in

what am i doing here like i have those

moments all the time

and

the perception

and reality is such a weird like

experience to have of what you think

people think of you and then what they

do think of you and

it's

i don't look at other eyes and go god i

wish i was doing that i go

i wish i was more

sociable or more confident at

work in a room or

talking to people

because i know that what i have is

because i have it and what they have is

because what they you know like i don't

ever want to be anyone else i don't want

anyone else to ever be me

but

no comparison isn't the issue for me

it's it's

frustration that i know i'm capable of

doing the things that someone else might

be doing in my own way

but i don't know how to invite myself

into the room

and i'm like and they're like oh my god

like you want to come in

come in

but it isn't always me going hi can i

come in

because i don't know how to do that

without feeling like an absolute

[ __ ]

so i just kind of go

and hope that someone might go maybe

jessie j wants to come in

and you want a manager that's going to

say jessie j needs to be in there or to

go or to go

go on

you can do it stop don't get in your

head

i think that i can give off that i am

i'm grateful that

i can sing

and i'm grateful that i'm

love to sing live like i love that i've

never mind and i just that's not who i

am i love that like i

even if my voice is horse or whatever i

always put myself like in the exposure

like firing line right

what i love and hate about myself is

that

i can be put through the most ridiculous

experience like throughout the day i

could literally be set on fire and i

could probably still sing

and i hate that because it means that

people go

she'll be fine whatever the situation

and i think that's a big part of it is

that i've been i've trained myself to

be good in situations where i haven't

had people i haven't haven't had to let

people think that they need to level up

for me to deliver

like that's what has to change

because what's going on in here and

what's coming out and what people are

seeing can be two very different things

and i'm not connecting those dots

for anybody really but myself

because it's only going to make me have

a more of an enjoyable experience

those four years that you referenced

that you

i don't know how to discredit

disappeared

what was going on when you disappeared

oh my god what was going on i did the

voice

because i wanted to kind of

stay in the in the vibe

i did the china show

yeah the china tv show which was one of

my favorite things i've ever done

billions watching 1.2 billion people

watch the final and i bit my tongue

before i went out and sang whitney

because i was so stressed and i was just

blood in my mouth

um um trust me i'm very close to i have

[ __ ] myself on stage before that's what

i'm saying i'm so bad

so bad

it's so bad

fingers in the news

i had a few words to say about one of my

sponsors on this podcast my girlfriend

came upstairs yesterday when i was

having a shower and she said to me that

she tried the heel protein shake which

lives on my fridge over there and she

said it's amazing low calories you get

your 20 odd grams of protein you get

your 26 vitamins and minerals and it's

nutritionally complete in the protein

space there's lots of things but it's

hard to find something that is nice

especially when consumed just with water

and that is nutritionally complete and

that has about 100 calories in total

while also giving you your 20 grams of

protein

if you haven't tried the heal protein

product do give it a try the salted

caramel one if you put some ice cubes in

it and you put it in a blender and you

try it is as good as pretty much any

milkshake on the market just mixed with

water it's been a game changer for me

because i'm trying to drop my calorie

intake and i'm trying to be a little bit

more healthy with my diet so this is

where heel fits in my life thank you

hill for making a product that i

actually like the salted caramel is my

favorite i've got the banana one here

which is the one my girlfriend likes but

for me salted caramel is

the one is there a pressure in that four

years where people are saying why isn't

she giving us an album oh yeah it's

always pressure

yeah

and i it took me a long time to realize

that

i

can't you can't

squeeze from the lemons you gotta

nurture the roots a little bit you know

what i mean you can't just keep asking

the lemons to grow and there's no it's

not been potted in the ground

and i just needed to be regrounded i

just was like i wrote the whole first

album second album i wrote

pretty much the whole thing by a couple

songs the third album i wrote two songs

and when you listen to it i wrote two

acoustic songs get away and you don't

really know me

and everything else was burning up bang

bang didn't write any of them loved them

but it wasn't where i was

and i was exhausted and i was like just

i'll sing whatever you want and i was so

grateful for the success of masterpiece

burning up bang bang

in the us

but it was nowhere near where i was

mentally and trying to match those two

things was my

probably my most important thing that i

could have done so when that album ended

and then obviously i went for the first

my first kind of big

just my first big breakup it wasn't even

that it was public it was just like my

first big breakup that people knew about

um

lost both my grandparents i remember

when i i lost my grandad i had to

perform in central park right after

and i was really close to my granddad he

was a professional jazz drummer i

traveled the world we had the same heart

problem

just you know just very much he

understood the industry and would always

kind of give me advice

and just not being able to grieve and

like all of those things and was just

going to go and i need to take a second

to like process my life like i haven't

stopped since everything took off

um

and then

i went for a moment where i was like i'm

done with music i'm out really oh yeah

sat with my labels like drop me don't

want to do this anymore

i can't do it i'm emotionally exhausted

didn't know how to just i just didn't

know how to

write songs anymore i was just like what

do i even want to sing about when was

this 2016.

so after you lost your grandparents and

yeah

2016. and then i'm and then i had to do

this campaign cause i needed money

honestly like i was like i need to still

make money to be famous

like you gotta still be protected and i

have to like wean myself off of this

lifestyle if i'm gonna not do this

anymore

and i got offered to do a campaign with

makeup forever which i've always wanted

to do anyway because i i love the brand

and i said and i said i'd love to do it

and they're like we won an original song

and i was like i don't want to do an

original song cause if i do an original

song

people think i'm bringing an album and

it's a single and marilyn i was like

i'll do a cover

so i met this guy called camper

and he was in the studio and he was like

yo man like i got some tracks and i was

like no tracks

don't play me anything i don't wanna i

don't wanna do this no more he's like

come on let me just play you something

and i was like no no i'm good seriously

please don't i was like auntie i just

need to do this get the check go home

don't make me emotional don't you know

it's there

don't pull out that part of me like i

don't want to i was trying to pretend

that i was something different to who i

was and he played me this beat and he

was like i'm gonna go smoke i'll be back

in five minutes

and i was literally i was just sitting

there and he played me this this track

and i was like

sitting there and the engineer was just

like i'm in the behind the engineer and

i just start typing

on my laptop

and the engineer's like

you need to turn this off or and i was

like no no it's all right keep it on

and can i just jump in the booth real

quick

and i wrote this song called think about

that which became the first single of

the rose album

and i remember camper coming in going i

don't know who you think you are but you

can't stop writing songs

like this is what you do

and i think i'd realized that

really up until that point

a lot of my successful music had been

this kind of like everything's great

doesn't mean anything and i was like

that's what people want and i don't know

how to

deliver that

all the time when i can deliver it and i

do write songs like that now because i'm

not ignoring the pain

so i'm writing about both so they get

both as opposed to me ignoring all the

good like ignoring all the bad stuff so

that manifests into everything and then

that's all i want to write about

you know

and so i just started to write the

narratic queen and then i wrote

someone's lady on the spot and then i

wrote this and i wrote that and i kind

of had this album i was like

what do i do now

uh okay

you know and

when i went on that tour i fired my

managers during that tour

just firing managers left right and

center that's just been come a hobby of

mine

um can you imagine how insecure the

seventh manager's gonna be

or they're not you know the thing is i'm

such a loyal person if you look at

everyone in my life my production my

tour manager my hair and makeup ten

years deep

like i love my people

but i also need you to show me that you

really understand how valuable i am as i

would to you

you know like i can't

i know what it's like dating managers is

like dating

you know and i do believe that like such

an important role doesn't always just

fall into your lap and it's right

and i honestly think that most artists

will admit that they ain't happy with

the management

most people in the industry would admit

that they're not happy with their agent

or their management there's always

something else they could be doing and

like when you've voiced what you needed

and it still doesn't change and then you

voice it again and it still doesn't

change and then you go yeah

you know well i actually think i'd enjoy

this more if i didn't have

this

especially when you're making money off

not doing much

you know i'd rather

be by myself for a second and it'd be a

bit chaotic and me learn and like go

right what do i need what do i want what

do i need what do i want that's one of

the uh two of the questions that i think

a lot of people manage to get clarity on

during

terms of part yeah moments of turmoil

the pandemic yeah

exactly what was that to you that whole

two years

the pandemic was uh

probably the worst and most beautiful

thing that i think's happened to the

world

because when else would we all have to

stop

and not just stop and be like oh i'm

gonna keep going to work and like you

know just really take the weekend off

like stop

like

not have our clutches of our hobbies

not have our clutches of our friends and

family that we may see or visit or talk

to

but really

go inwards and have no escape from it

if i was a fly on the wall in your

wherever you were living during the

pandemic what would i have observed i

mellowed a lot in the in the pandemic i

let go of a lot of things that i held on

to as like

clutches to kind of be able to do my job

like i'm a very organized person

and

i realized how much time i wasted on

things that really didn't help

me

like having certain amount of

this or

being overly prepared i'm a very overly

prepared person

i cooked a lot

and i wrote an album

that's really good

but i just don't know if i really love

it why

i don't know who the audience is

when i listen to the songs i don't see

the people that are listening to it with

me

and

i have to be able to see that how did

that happen

if you write something i'm guessing

usually you write it from a place of

your own pain or whatever yeah so

there's gonna be people out there

feeling the same human experience

music reflects where you're at right

well it should

and

in that time i think

it was a very anxious at all everyone

kind of wanted to like falsify this like

we're good right

we're okay like we're okay we're good

we're gonna be fine and like you can

feel that in the music

it just feels a bit like too much

and i think that

what i think people are craving more

than ever right now is just like

real

like and i also know what i'm good at

and i listen to it and go there's like

about five or six artists that i can

imagine doing this

i want to make music people only know

that i can do

and it ain't that

so

and it might be that i might come full

circle and go you know what i was wrong

huh joke

took three years but we're here

but i'll get there you know there's no

right or wrong answers i don't believe

that anything we do in life is wrong or

right i just think we've got one and

make a decision and then we'll learn

from either which way we went has your

grief over the last year impacted your

perspective on that piece of work

yes

yeah

i feel like my grief is here

right now

like it just comes up and it comes out

my eyes or it comes out my my in my

songs

but it it it feels like it's

um

has a place to

has a place to live in my life now

which is why i probably feel so

vulnerable at the moment because

as i said to you like

losing

having a miscarriage and losing the baby

and then

most recently losing jamal edwards

when you don't just have one person

that you associate with grief but you

have a handful of people that

you realize that no one else

that you have in your life give you that

gives you what they gave you

and you realize that you have to find

that for yourself

like that's the

the hardest

part of grief for me that i'm

experiencing right now

um

like i don't even it's

like

even me crying like this like i can't

stop it like they're not tears where i'm

like you know when you can't not cry

like i'm not even trying to cry it's

just like it's here and it just comes up

um

it puts everything in perspective that

all the things that we worry about

and all the things that we are concerned

about

nothing matters if someone just loses

the like

when you watch someone

i don't know if you knew jamal

you did his parents called me yesterday

oh i love brenda

um

he was um i'd spoken to him

um a few months uh a few weeks before he

had passed yeah

yeah yeah he was when i was 18 and i've

this has been to the top of my twitter

he was my my

the evidence that i could make he's

successful yeah so i would stalk him

around skype when he was on skype and

i'd try and get him to speak to me yeah

it's it's crazy how much

time he made for everyone i can't

he was like so special like

you know and when someone passes you

always want to remind everybody of like

the good that they were but he was

like in another league of

i can't explain it like when

i was standing

you know

at his funeral and just looking around

and the impact that he made

so one-on-one with everyone he knew

because he never said no

he always had the time

and

i know how much he wanted to live life

you know and how

unfair it feels that

of all people

that that could have happened to that it

happened to him

i know that his passing has enabled

me to make the decisions that i'm making

in my life right now and my career with

more

strength and belief in myself like

jamal was someone that i spoke to when

i didn't want to do this anymore

when i didn't feel like

you know

being told that you're a great singer

was enough like it often wasn't you know

and i would phone him and he would just

remind me of i mean i met when i was 17.

just remind me of

the bigger picture and

just his energy and

the fact that he talked himself into

every room

and then talked about everyone else

you know i just

you felt his you felt his power when the

world found out he had gone

everybody was sad even people that

didn't know him

because

his

legacy that's been a word that's been

used a lot with him

it's funny because

the biggest legacy that i think he

however many

businesses he started and things he

invested in and

platforms he created to to elevate

everyone else

it was the feeling that he gave people

to me that was his legacy

and like

that's why i missed the most

and i when i i sang at his um homecoming

and everyone's like how did you do that

i said because i was singing to him i

was singing for him it wasn't a

performance

you know i know that

he would have loved that

i gotta just hit i just hear him going

geez you know like come on

are you wearing vegan shoes and that

um

but i think that the biggest thing that

you learn when you lose someone so young

that you love and admire so much

is that life is too short

to sit

anywhere other than where you're

supposed to be

and if you're sitting at a table where

you don't feel like you're being fed

even if you're bringing a plate of food

you politely just leave

you know and i and i know that he has

inspired me to

demand more from myself and from other

people

um

in my career you know me and him

had so many plans of projects that we

were doing together as i'm sure you guys

were probably supposed to connect in

some way

and i know that wherever i

was supposed to receive from him

for those things i have to find within

myself

so because no one will ever be that

so

sorry i'm so crying right now like i'm

such an emotional person and i really

live from feeling

and i'm not afraid anymore to be

vulnerable and i think that the first

first line of change with anything

through grief or anything like that