This is kind of the definition of a

quagmire and that is I'm not sure at

this point he has any choice but to put

boots on the ground. I would argue at

this point Cara Iran is winning.

>> Hi everyone. This is Pivot from New York

Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast

Network. I'm Carara Swisser

>> and I'm Scott Callaway.

>> Scott, I have officially left your

apartment in New York State.

>> Oh, you moved into your new place? Yes,

I bought a small apartment in Brooklyn

in

>> Parkrooklyn where all the kid core kids

are.

>> I have to say I enjoyed it. We went this

weekend went to IKEA for 17 hours which

was fun. Actually bought a range of

inexpensive furniture and it's very

lovely actually. We we we it's very

nice. I miss you but I have to move on

from our relation our housing

relationship.

>> So do you know how many times I've been

to Brooklyn in 25 years?

>> How many?

>> Twice. both times to be to go to the so

house there. There's no reason to ever

live the island unless you're going to

JFK or LaGuardia.

>> It's nice. We're very well known in Park

Slope. I can tell you that. I got to

stop.

>> I don't doubt it. Royalty in Brooklyn.

Jesus Christ. I can't even imagine.

>> Hi, Cara. Welcome to Brooklyn.

>> I know. That's exactly what happened. It

was two other things. Let me just say

two other phenomena. So, I have all

these books that I get for my podcast

and probably you do too, right? I I I

cannot get rid of them here. I put them

out on the stoop in Brooklyn. they were

gone. Like I have to say I get all these

free books and they're good books and

they're all interesting, but I have to I

like the whole culture of people walking

by and taking things and giving away

things. It's really nice. So yeah, there

you have it. We are now officially semi

not we don't live there, but it's nice

and anyone can stay. All you listeners

can stay at my Brooklyn place. No, you

can stay. I extend an invitation to you,

Scott Galloway.

>> Happen. Um so gonna happen because it

has a key of furniture. That's why

>> uh you went to IKEA.

>> Yeah, I love IKEA.

>> Um don't uh why why do you like IKEA?

>> Uh cuz it's cuz actually it's f it's

it's perfectly nice stuff. If you get

the the more the slightly more expensive

stuff there, it's fine. And it's it I

don't want I don't want to buy more. I

have really nice furniture in where I

live and I just don't need more

furniture.

>> The when I was there, the IKEA sales

lady wanted to have sex with me, but all

I wanted was a was one night stand.

get it.

>> I don't believe you have an IKEA joke at

the ready.

>> I don't think I've ever been to an IKEA.

It's a phenomena. It's um

>> I still was making a furniture all night

long.

>> I don't know. IKEA for me is is like uh

a porn video and that is I'll never be

able to do the same thing at home. It

just it looks different at IKEA than in

my own home when I try it.

>> Yeah. Well, I'm a lesbian so I can

assemble things. Well, I'm very good

with that.

>> You're

>> Are you building a wood canoe in your

living room?

>> I did. I have to build this bed. I gave

up on it.

>> Woodwork.

>> Yeah. The other thing I did, and I want

to recommend I went to my friend Sean

Hayes's show called The Unknown. And

it's a little bit about internet. It's a

little bit about It's really good. It's

a one-man show. Uh it's a M I think it's

by David Kale, I think, is the

playright. What a wonderful show. I have

to We had a really nice time on this

Broadway.

>> It's off Broadway. He started off

Broadway. I recommend it. The unknown.

My Mexican friend

>> builds all my IKEA furniture. I call him

my instruction I call him my instruction

Manuel.

>> Oh my god. Just go. Okay. All right.

Anyway,

>> at least upgrade to At least upgrade to

West Elm.

>> I have Westm stuff. I have I have uh the

other one.

>> Position the brand of West Elm. It's one

of my first clients.

>> I like Westm actually. They make I have

several I have some I have a West Elm

bed here and I love it. I have

>> You know what the strategy was? Well,

I'm patting myself in the back. I my

first strategy engagement.

>> Oh yeah.

>> Uh out of business school was helping

position the Old Navy brand.

>> And it was pretty easy. 80% of the gap

for 50% of the price. And so my big

insight at William Sonoma 5 years later

was

>> West Elm 80% of Pottery Barn for 50% of

the price.

>> Oh, interesting. It's nicer than Pottery

Barn. I think Pottery Barn sort of lost

the

>> West Elm is the fastest zero to a

billion dollar brands in history have

been that axiom. 80% of the 80% of the

kind of industry leader for 50% of the

price whether it's Southwest or Old Navy

or West Elm.

>> It's West's a little nicer. And then

there's the one room and board which is

nice. I get a lot

>> No, they do a great job.

>> They do be I get a lot of their stuff.

>> Not nearly as successful financially

though.

>> Yeah. And then what's the one that has

uh the big air couch? The big uh

>> Well, Restoration Hardware.

>> Restoration Hardware. I have a that's

that has that has all of my stuff in San

Francisco. I got Restoration. Well,

Gary, I I would I used to be very into

merchandising because I was in that

business. The greatest, in my opinion,

the greatest merchant of the last 20

years is is uh Gary Freriedman, the CEO

of Restoration Hardware.

>> Yeah, he had seen Cloud Couch. It's a

cloud couch.

>> Uh he and I he and I are friends. He he

gave me a tour of their space in um

>> in the meat packing district. They It

was really interesting in the

restaurant, which I think does more

dollars per square foot than the store

combined, but they don't serve alcohol

cuz he said he wanted a safe place for

women to come and just hang out. And

then when when people drink alcohol,

they get rowdy and obnoxious, which I

thought was interesting. They have a

beautiful alcohol

>> in Manhattan, like go to lunch there.

It's nice. Anyway, I have different

levels of furniture depending on the

house. San Francisco is all restoration

hardware. Yeah. Anyway, all right. We'll

move on because we got to get to the We

love furniture

day. No, no. I go I went to IKEA. I I

assembled furniture this weekend.

Anyway, before we get to the news, uh

this weekend around 8 million One thing

I didn't do, I didn't go to a No Kings

rally over because I was assembling a

key of furniture. Over 3,300 events

around the world. I went to the last

one, I think, over 200,000 people

attended the flagship rally in

Minnesota. Incredible crowds. Some signs

uh stand out, including you can't bomb

away bomb your way out of the Epstein

files. My country went to hell and all I

got was this lousy ballroom. and balls

for grabs with a sign that said free

balls for Republicans.

They were I love the signs. I you know

it was really a lot of people. Eight

million people. That's a lot of people.

>> I'm in London. Although they did have a

protest here which I did which I didn't

go to but

>> I don't know. I did what all lazy people

do to virtue signal. I reposted Yeah.

>> I reposted other people sacrificing.

>> No, it was they looked wonderful and

festive. I thought Bruce Spring I

thought they were also did the messaging

was excellent. I thought it was

affordability. It's about no kids. It

was everybody has all the progressives

have modulated in a way that I think is

very attractive. Very they're moving

into the James Terico version of

Democrats, right? The hey, what are we

going to hear to help you affordability?

We want a thing. And the one thing I

really like, there was a picture, a

beautiful picture of Joan Bayz and um

>> uh Jane Fonda that was with gray hair

together was gorgeous. I thought that

was I just thought it was visually very

attractive. I think there is a real

movement of people of all these

elections happening and people are so

sick of feeling bad and feeling like

everything's a grift. It just feels it

there was definitely a tide. I don't

know if these protests help, but I like

them. I think they're

>> supposedly Well, first off, it just

feels and I say this all the time, but

my buddy Dan Harris action absorbs

anxiety. It feels really good to do

things with other people. And Timothy

Snder says that protests start to build

an infrastructure for organization and

taking names and people get invested in

it. So they want to turn out again and

they want to register people to vote.

Also supposedly the supposedly there's a

tipping point where if you get 3 and a

half% of the population to demonstrate

that usually conotes change. So this

wasn't that cuz that would be I think

about 11 or 12 million people. Just some

data here. The October pro protest drew

roughly 7 million and uh Saturday's

turnout was nine million. So it's

building. And what's interesting or the

most piece of data I thought is that

twothirds of the RSVPs came from outside

major urban centers including

>> including conservativeleaning states

such as Idaho, Wyoming, Montana, Utah,

South Dakota, Louisiana.

>> Yeah. Those protests that takes a thing

for people to do things like that there

like the villages. Did you see all the

little villages carts? Yeah. Yeah. That

was kind of cool.

>> What is traditionally very conservative

and also the kind of the flagship was at

uh Minneapolis where almost a quarter of

a million people turned out. Uh

Springsteen performed. You mentioned

Joan Baz and Jane Fonda, Maggie Rogers

and Senator.

>> So just some context, the Women's March

in January 2017,

previously considered the largest single

day protest in US history, drew an

estimated uh 3.3 to 56 5.6 million

people. So this was bigger. The BLM

protest in June of 2020 drew an

estimated 15 to 26 million people, but

over several weeks, but that was spread

across multiple days. So if the 9

million uh person turnout estimate hold,

Saturday's protest would be the largest

single day demonstration in American

history.

>> People are tired and they want to do

something. And it's not it's not

hopeless. I went to the women's one. I

actually I took my sons to that. I made

them wear [ __ ] hats. Well, that's the

way it goes. Anyway, it was we had

actually had a wonderful time. I like

doing things like that with my kids

because they can see things in action.

Okay, moving on. Uh, President Trump

says the US is in serious discussions

with the new regime in Iran, but he's

also threatening to completely destroy

key energy sites if a deal is not

reached. That's a nice way to negotiate.

This is the Pentagon preparing for what

could be weeks of ground operations in

Iran, according to the Washington Post.

Total number of US troops in the Middle

East are now 50,000 around 50,000. That

is insane amounts of people. roughly

10,000 higher than typical levels. Uh

the Iranian military is warning that any

US occupation would lead to captivity,

dismemberment, and disappearance. It is

worrisome with all those people there.

There's always something bad going to

happen. And as the war drags on, markets

are sliding down with NASDAQ and Dow

falling into correction territory last

week and the S&P down about 7%. Markets

are sort of a a trailing indicator of

some of this stuff, I think. But um I

think it it's creates a jittery feeling

just because of the shifting back and

forth. And if you noticed, a lot of

Trump people, especially Marco Rubio and

JD Vance, were not on any of the Sunday

shows. They're avoiding all the cabinet

members are avoiding the Sunday shows.

Um, I had a really interesting interview

before I went to New York with Tom

Tillis, which I think you should all

listen to. It's up today. I mean, he was

expressing great distaste for this whole

action. Um, we had a he's a obviously a

very conservative senator from North

Carolina. He's leaving Congress so he

feels like he can say whatever he wants,

which he did. Um, so what do you think's

happening here, Scott? I mean, the back

and forth and the people are sort of

trying to get out of the Trump blast

zone on this situation. I'm sorry to use

that metaphor, but

>> well, to say it's complicated is an

understatement, but I'm one of the

people that would argue that

>> we've been at war with Iran for the last

47 years. The first act of this regime

in 1979 was to take Americans hostage.

The question is, is this escalation in

the war? Uh, was it a smart idea? And I

think if it had gone 72 hours in terms

of getting some coordination with

European allies and even Gulf allies,

>> you could have potentially declared

victory and really had a win. Um, but

this is kind of the definition of a

quagmire and that is I'm not sure at

this point he has any choice but to put

boots on the ground because I and I had

Senator Warner on my podcast. I would

argue at this point, Cara, Iran is

winning.

>> Yeah, that's that the IRGC has shown

that they can they can push back the,

you know,

>> the great Satans of Israel and the

United States. And what is at the end of

the day, I think this is an enormous

failure of uh our intelligence director

uh Tulsi Gabbard.

>> Yeah.

>> To not contemplate or consider a

scenario where they cut off the straits

of Hormuz. She probably advised that.

She didn't want to go. She's the America

first. Greg, her ad and Vance are on the

maybe not so much kind of group.

>> Yeah, but you okay, but they they're

claiming now that they're going to try

and work with their allies who are all

saying [ __ ] you if you're going to be

this much of a prick to us. But they

they're doing [ __ ] in reverse order.

They should have secured the straits of

foremost before doing this. They should

have contemplated, well, what happens if

they start firing Shihad drones that

cost $20,000 and it cost us 2 million to

shoot them down? What if they start

firing them into Dubai? So some basic

scenario planning and intelligence from

the people char I mean

>> I think he got that. I think some guy

told him to do this like I the

>> there's no leadership that it doesn't

matter if it doesn't bubble up

>> which is what Tillis said. Tillis was

like I he always tries very hard not to

insult Trump himself but he's like the

advisers and he's particularly for

example went after Steven Miller on

immigration. He particularly goes after

the adviserss. He's like he's either you

have an adviser who's stupid and just

like tells them dumb things or you have

an adviser who knows better who says

nothing, right? Who doesn't who tries to

like assuage the president versus and he

goes either way his adviserss suck, you

know? And I think that's true, but at

some point it's treating Trump like a

toddler. Oh, we managed to keep him this

or that. So, it's a complicated

situation there is this guy wants to do

what he wants to do now and he has

advisers who are either too weak to tell

him the truth or tell him the truth and

then get fired or slapped for it kind of

stuff. I don't know. It's a problematic

sit it's not certainly not the the group

of rivals that Lincoln had.

>> Well, but a lot of people would argue on

the opposite side that basically

Secretary Rubio is a shadow president

making these decisions and so is his

son-in-law Kushner. So,

>> right,

>> you know, which is it? Is he listening

to people or is he not? Because it to me

this is just such a striking

intelligence failure to not do some

basic scenario planning around what if

and we are now in a position of weakness

where I mean the general not the

consensus but when I speak to people in

the intelligence community there's a

feeling okay the most obvious next step

here is that he feels to save face

because the RGC has said [ __ ] you you

can pretend you're talking to us we're

not talking back we have dispersed we

anti we did scenario planning we We

anticipated what if our leadership is

killed and they have dispersed military

and executive authority out to the

various regions. So they're like cut off

the head of the snake. That's okay. We

the snake's going to keep moving. So

there was no basic uh essential basic

scenario planning here. And the general

feeling is that he will land troops

potentially on Car Island and then try

and secure Kar and do a deal to exchange

Carg for opening the Straits of Hormuz.

>> Right. No, but that's what we had

before. Like one of the things that

>> I'm not arguing it's we're in a good

spot.

>> One of the things when I talked to

Tillis and when I also talked to Warner

is that the same thing you're talking

about these drones and everything else

like the word obliterate that he

obliterated it months ago the nuclear

facilities but now he's obliterating

more and you know tell us who's sort of

had seems to have run out of [ __ ] was

like yeah we obliterated again and then

we obliterated it like you know

>> you can't that's like to say you

obliterate. All right. So essentially

what you have

>> making fun of Trump. I believe that's

what was happening there.

>> Again the the key word in all of this

coming out of Ukraine and now this war

is asymmetry. And that is wars and

shaping of you know energy routes and

ability to solve things without when

diplomatic means have failed have been

based on very expensive platforms and

technology no one else had access to. It

has gone the entirely other way. And now

you can essentially build a drone for

$20,000 with a two-stroke engine similar

to what's in a motorcycle. And that's

like to say you're gonna obliterate it.

If if we all of a sudden declared war on

Texas and most of the Southwest

actually, which Iran is bigger than, and

said, "Okay, how do you find every

little factory that's pull push pulling

together lawnmowers?" That's what you're

up against. you're not going to be able

and then they launch 40 of these things

and the defense systems get confused and

all you need it's similar similar to the

Department of Homeland Security or the

FBI they have to stop every terrorist

attack right

>> and the notion that just one

>> one

>> one ship is set on fire or the Burj

Khalifa is taken down in Dubai

>> that's all they need and what's actually

stopping this and you can imagine

>> if you're if you're transporting tens or

hundreds of millions of dollars of a

product called oil through a dangerous

area, there needs to be insurance

against that payment against that that

substance arriving at its destination.

In other words, there's cross party

collateralization in insurance. And

right now, I would argue what's actually

holding up the straits of Hormos is I

don't believe any insurance company is

willing to insure these tankers right

now.

>> Yeah, I don't know what I would do if I

was running these companies. Anyway,

we'll see what happens. It's still

confusing and it's gone on far too long.

This confusing and I think that's the

real problem. He's really stuck in a a

quagmire.

>> A quagmire. This is the definition in a

corner.

>> If he had after 72 hours said we've

we've further diminished their ability

to fund proxies. We have substantially

denigrated their launch capabilities. We

have we have made the the the leadership

infrastructure much more insecure and

diminished it vastly. we are now going

to work with our Gulf allies and

European nations to try and maintain a

sense of security and keep in a box. He

probably could have declared at some

level victory.

>> But Scott, chaos follows this guy. The

chaos is his his brand right now.

Anyway, um

>> agreed.

>> Uh let's move on. The boys are uh really

back together. Speaking of which,

speaking of chaos, Elon Musk joined a

phone call with President Trump and

India's Prime Minister Modi about the

Strait of Hormuz. It's unclear whether

Mus spoke on the call and neither

government mentioned his presence in the

official readouts. Meanwhile, as we all

know, SpaceX is preparing to launch the

largest IPO of all time, reportedly

targeting a $ 1.75 trillion valuation,

which is kind of a lot over their

revenues, but okay, fine. That's a Musk

company. Musk reportedly wants to have

investors come to SpaceX's seat

facilities and rocket launches. He does

that a lot. He invites people in to show

off his wares of impressive wares. He

does He's doing that with robotics, too,

which are pretty cool. Um, the company

is also considering limiting share sales

by early investors, a preferential

treatment for investors in Musk's other

companies, which is why they suck up to

him so and reserving a large That's why

they buy Twitter, so they can get into

this. And reserving a large portion of

the shares for individual investors.

That's fine. That's great. Speaking of

making amends with his enemies, text

released as part of Musk's lawsuit

against OpenAI show that Zuckerberg

tested Musk saying, "Looks like Doge is

making progress. I've got our teams on

alert to take down contact doxing or

threatening the people on your team. Let

me know if there's anything I can do to

help. Oh, he does want to content

moderate. Musk hearted the message and

then asked Zucker would be open to

bidding on open AI with him, which the

two seem to have spoken about on the

phone. I mean, these people say one

thing in public and another in private,

but talk first about um the phone call,

then the IPO, and you know, Mark

Zuckerberg will talk to anybody if it

means a deal. So, that's what I think

about that.

I don't I I don't have a problem with

the president inviting people into a

call that he thinks can help achieve the

objectives whether it's someone who has

domain expertise whether Musk is the

right person to have on the call but I

think the president should bring to bear

any resources he thinks going to result

in a more productive conversation

and Modi is probably wants probably

wants uh you know Starlink or maybe Modi

and Musk have a pre-existing

relationship who knows or maybe like you

said he's just showing them off. The

staggering thing for me is I I can't

wait for the S1 because the target

valuation of 1 8 trillion. This company,

you know, it's projected or generated

roughly 15 to 16 billion and about 8

billion in profit in 2025.

That means at the IPO it's trading at

109 times trailing revenue.

>> That's a must company, right? Are you

going to do like you did with Weiwork?

I'd love to see.

>> Oh, but that's more than pound. Oh, no.

No. This is a real company. It might be

overvalued. Yeah.

>> But we work as it scaled lost more

money. This is a company with

unbelievable

product and moes. It's But two things

can be true at once. Is it an

unbelievable company with I think

probably the widest moes in the business

world right now? Absolutely.

>> For now.

>> For now. Um but everyone feels like a

distant number two. Like who's the

number two here?

>> I don't know. I think people will catch

up in this. I think I take a lot

everyone said no when it catch Tesla.

Everyone caught Tesla and it was a lot

faster than we thought. Right.

>> Yeah. But manufacturing manufacturing an

EV versus a launch capability.

>> I just I think

>> you think someone's going to catch up.

>> I think I think Bezos is working on it.

I think a lot of countries there's ones

happening in Europe. I think look it's

not going to be the only one and

everyone's going to be like why are we

you know it's sort of like the Lockheed

problem right? I think a lot of people

think it's an attractive thing. 90% of

launches.

>> I get it. They are the only remember

when he said it.

>> They are the only company in the world

right now that is capable of putting

humans into space.

>> Yep. Yep. And when you look at when you

look at space and whether it's energy or

connectivity or or or space military or

space defense, they're all for a while

going to have to come through SpaceX. At

the same time,

>> no question.

>> At the same time, is it worth

>> Yes.

>> 109 times revenue? I don't

>> situation. Tesla is declining

precipitously and yet it still trades at

a ridiculous.

>> But Musk owns roughly 42% of SpaceX. So

this IPO could make him the first

recorded trillionaire in history. And on

Kyi the odds that he'll become the a

trillionaire this year are 71%. So

there's almost a three in4 chance

according to a lot of people

>> that Musk is about to become the

trillionaire. And that is in my view

really uh troubling uh because I think

as a species we need guard rails and

money directly translates to power and I

don't think any unelected person should

have this much power.

>> Yeah, he definitely pushes himself into

every single aspect of our lives, you

know, in some way and he'll do a

trillion dollars. Say he takes

>> politically he'll be problematic. say he

says, "Okay, I'm I'm going to die soon

and I want to be worth five trillion and

I'm going to I want to I want to decide

who the next president is. I'm going to

take 3% of my net worth, which would be

$30 billion." There's there's evidence

that he had influence on Trump's

election with 250 million.

>> Mhm.

>> So with

>> But he didn't in Wisconsin with 25.

That's a lot in that state. Like I think

it's a mixed bag. When he shows up, it's

a lot of money. When he shows up, it's a

lot of Yeah. No, you know, I think

>> Citizens United and a guy being worth a

trillion dollars.

>> Agreed.

>> Is really scary.

>> It also has effects of if this guy is

he's like the Soros or he's the Soros of

the right essentially now, right on some

level. And I do think it has a negative

impact and and alerts people to this

situation that he I don't think money

buys everything. He's he's failed in a

number of areas like Doge. he's failed

and like he fails quite a bit which of

course is his his brand is I fail and

then I succeed. Um

>> I think in a close election which most

presidential elections are he could

absolutely swing it.

>> He already has he already has had more

impact than any individual in recent

history especially killing people across

the globe with Doge. I mean again I I

it'll we'll see what happens here but

they certainly it's going to be the

blockbuster IPO and it will be

overvalued by a lot given you know

they'll have a lot of the skis to cover

and then they'll have the money to do

so, right? To to sort of create that

moat even wider.

>> Incredible. It's an incredible I won't

even call it a product because what it

really is, it's global infrastructure.

Um they have the largest commercial

satellite constellation. It's no, which

by the way is no longer NASA, it's

SpaceX. And as of May 2025,

Starlink controlled more than 7,600

satellites or 2/3 of all active

satellites in orbit. The majority of new

satellites launched globally in late

2024 were Starlink. And SpaceX plans to

scale to 42,000 satellites. That's up

sixfold.

>> Yep. They control global global

information system.

>> Making Starlink the deacto broadband

backbone in space and projections for

the end of 2025. 6 million subscribers

and 62% of global satellite broadband

revenue um going to one company. And

most competitors can match SpaceX's

price, cadence, or reliability. I know

Facebook has tried uh Amazon has tried.

They're all trying. I I I always feel

like this is these are these high water

marks for these people, but that's I I

you know it you have to hand it to him.

I remember when he talked about it for

the first time to me um that the

creating this two people were talking

about this at the time. Him and oddly

enough Jerry Yang had an investment in a

low and it's the first time I learned of

it. So I got real I learn I I I got

caught up on the topic like what it was

going to do. But Jerry Yang had an

investment in one and it was he's the

first person who talked about it and

then Musk that same year started talking

about it. This was a long long long time

ago and it was really at the time I

remember thinking no one's talking like

this like everyone else was like doing a

[ __ ] dating service or some dumb

thing.

>> It comes down to some very boring

numbers and that is the cost to launch a

kilogram of material usually a satellite

into low earth orbit. And this is what

SpaceX's Falcon Heavy rocket can launch

into a kilogram for. They can launch a

kilogram into space for $1,500.

Uh Aron's 5G, it costs them $9,200.

Their Electron product cost $19,000.

Their launches, SpaceX's launches occur

every 2 to three days. No other provider

is within range. So they are they are 6x

less expensive. The Chinese certainly

have capabilities here. So anyway,

>> do they I don't know that much about

Chinese.

>> They do they and so you know one of the

things it'll be interesting to see what

happens here and what the these forces

are really powerful and he is very

powerful single person. It does put him

at great risk too of being a not just

not a physical target. That's not what

I'm talking about. But when something

like this happens there's always forces

against it that I think that we that

will start to build. He becomes and he

becomes soros. He becomes Soros in a

weird way.

>> But I I feel much more benign about

Soros. Why do you

>> I do too, but I'm talking about to the

right he or the Koch brothers like pick

pick whatever one who's or Henry Ford

back in the day. There was also a Texas

billionaire and I can't remember his

name a million years like in the 20s

that did stuff like that.

>> But there's a different like so and cork

the Koch brothers they were all quite

philanthropic.

>> Well not him not not Elon for sure. Musk

is not. And Musk is infinitely more

powerful and has a technology that can

basically decide

>> wars. And this is a guy who is

reportedly addicted to ketamine. What

could go wrong?

>> Things are wrong. Let me just tell you,

I'm glad.

>> It does feel like a bond film, but less

than is glad she's in Park Slope. I'll

be protected by the lesbian.

>> Oh yeah, you're safe in Brooklyn. Yeah.

A nuclear device gets detonated 500

meters above Midtown. Yeah, Brooklyn's

going to be fine.

>> No, what I mean is that like if he's

coming after me, he's he's not a fan of

Caris Swisser. Um, but maybe you should

make nice with them.

>> That's what I don't get about I talked

to one of these guys that is building

the bunker in New Zealand, a guy, you

know, and

>> and I'm like, you realize if [ __ ] gets

real

>> and you fire up the G650 and had to

peace out to New Zealand, you realize

your your pilots are going to kill you

and [ __ ] your wife, right?

>> That's correct.

>> And the table went quiet.

>> I know. I said that to one of them who

had a plan. I said, "What's your plan?"

I said, "I'm going to kill you and take

your motorcycle out to your

>> [ __ ] your wife." I was like, "Of

course." And then they were like, "You

could see them calculating, how do I

stop Cara from killing me?" I said, "You

won't see me coming."

>> You think if if if the [ __ ] goes to

where these think people think it's

going

>> Yeah.

>> This the people who die right away are

the lucky ones.

>> I Exactly. I sometimes think that living

in Washington, I feel okay about that.

Anyway, let's not go there. Let's not go

there. Congratulations, Elon Musk, on

your SpaceX victory.

>> You're still terrible person. No matter

how rich you get, you're completely

unlikable. Anyway, oh, I have to say one

Brooklyn thing. So, I was it was there

was this crazy cyber truck parked across

the street. I thought, "Oh, who's doing

this?" Right where my apartment is and

it was tricked out. It was all manner of

[ __ ] on it. I didn't know. It was some

sort of commercial thing. And you know,

there's a bunch of teen boys and they

weren't they were just hanging out and I

thought first they were like admiring it

and what was really funny is and they

weren't they weren't sort of typical

parks. I'm trying to like they were they

were sort of sitting in front of it like

talking about it. I'm I went over and

I'm like what do you think? And I wasn't

making an opinion. They're like what a

douche. And it was like they were like

it was interesting because I just

interviewed Louis Thorough uh Thoru. Uh

who's Justin.

>> Oh you you interviewed about the

manosphere.

>> Yes. Exactly.

>> You're beating me to my content.

>> I'm so sorry. I'm way ahead of you.

>> How was it? That's Justin's cousin.

>> Fantastic. I know it's Justin's cousin.

Um he's also a great filmmaker. Uh, I

got to say was really interesting is one

the point thing you pointed out is even

though a lot of these manosphere guys

are really popular, there's also a whole

group of young men who are like they

they mock them and enjoy being in on the

joke and mocking them at the same time

and also liking some of it but mocking

them. And that was going on in front of

the Cybertruck. They're like is such a

douche but like whatever. And they were

so cool and I was like, "Oh, I feel so

much better about you after talking to

these guys because they were so cool and

they also were in on the joke and I

don't know, I just felt better." Anyway,

yes, Louis. Yes, it was great. And we

talked of you

>> just so you know.

>> Good. I'm glad I'm supposed to have him

on. I wrote a my number. I wrote a

review of the of the show.

>> I loved it.

>> Yeah, it was really illuminating for me.

>> Can I tell you the one line I loved the

best of all? I liked his I like his

interview style and I was actually

looking at as a professional how he does

the interview style. I agree.

>> When he's work when he's HS whatever tdy

whatever ticky talkie whatever tick-

tockie um he was working out and he goes

is this your leg day he's British and

the guy goes of course it is you know

like like an [ __ ] and like shows off

his thigh which is quite a beefy thigh

>> and Louis Lou Louisie looks at him and

he goes you could work on those calves

and the guy just melts and I was like I

love you Louis thu I love him pronounced

it through. Unlike Justin, they

pronounce it differently. Um,

>> anyway, it he has all these lines like

that in there that he just eviscerates

these people with kindness in a way

that's really

>> Yeah, I agree.

>> It's a really good show. Anyway, uh

Elon, good luck. Anyway, uh let's go. Uh

Elon, you could work on your calves. Uh

okay, Scott, let's go on a quick break.

When we come back, Anthropic scores a

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rules and restrictions apply.

Scott, we're back anthropic to score a

win in his fight with the Trump

administration. Obviously, a federal

judge in California granted a

preliminary injunction temporarily

blocking the Pentagon's efforts to label

the company a supply chain rest. The

judge didn't mince words in her ruling,

saying, "This is a classic illegal first

amendment retaliation." Exactly. She

also called it a quote Orwellian notion

to brand an American company a potential

adversary for expressing disagreement.

The Pentagon is pushing back, expected

to appeal, of course, with senior

official Emil Michael, another Loathome

character, tweeting, "The ruling is a

disgrace." Oh, Emil, get over it. The

final decision in this case could still

be months away. There's also a second

lawsuit pending in DC. Anthropic won the

battle. You know, it's it's problematic

to be in this ridiculous fight. I think

it'll be over by midterms when they they

jack Hegath out of the place. But also a

potent and Emil too also a potential

factor. Anthropic is reportedly

considering going public as soon as

October. That is problematic for them.

Um so what do you what do you and

related a federal judge has put on hold

the $6.2 billion merger between Nextar

and Tegno which would create the largest

operator of local TV in the country 69%

o over the former 30ome percent amount

you're allowed to um bring together. The

judge granted a request from Direct TV

arguing the merger violates antitrust

laws. A 14-day restraining order has

been issued and a hearing is scheduled

for April 7th. Eight attorneys general

have filed a separate lawsuit. Um, I'm

going to just play this. Let's listen to

what our least favorite FCC chair,

Brenda Carr, I'm sorry, Brendan Carr,

uh, had to say at CPAC.

>> President Trump took on the fake news

media and President Trump is winning.

Look at the results so far. PBS

defunded. NPR defunded. Joy Reed gone

from MSNBC.

Sleepy Eye Chuck Todd gone. Jim Acasta

gone. John Dickerson gone. Coar is

leaving. CBS is under new ownership. And

soon enough, CNN is have new ownership

as well.

>> Boy, this guy is just just not doing his

job. Honestly, it's seriously he's such

a suckup to the Trump administration.

He's just explicit about it. And he's

also not very smart. He's a [ __ ] Um,

so talk about these these next star the

the anthropic thing. It looks like

everything as usual Trump does he does

something aggressive and stupid and

loses in court, but he still does

damage. So talk and then you can talk

about Brenda if you want, but that's up

to you.

>> Well, I'll go in reverse order. Brenda

Carr has no business in the federal

government. You're you're not supposed

to go into the government to use it as a

means of attacking your political

enemies and freedom of speech.

>> Yep. I mean, just the notion

this guy makes gals look thoughtful and

that is the directly calling out people

who don't agree with your political

views and then weaponizing government to

try and get people whose views you don't

agree with off the air. That's I it's

like it's just so blatant. It's okay.

So, when we get to appoint an FCC chair,

we're going to go after Hannity. And

>> I mean, is that is that where we're

headed? You want us to start blather on

this idiotic stuff. I don't care. He

annoys me.

>> No. Look, with it's just not qualified

to be in government. With respect to

anthropic, most major AI companies have

bent the knee to the government and

worked with them in any any military

context. I want last year, Google

dropped its ethical guidelines that

included a list of applications it would

not pursue, including weapons and

surveillance,

>> but it used to be able to do so without

a problem.

>> Is that right? And then they put in

guidelines and then they I thought they

were they relaxed their guidelines.

>> They did relax them. But I'm saying they

used to be able to say no and nobody had

a problem. They just didn't work for

them. That's all.

>> Well, that's the whole point of private

enterprise. You get to choose your you

can fire your clients. Just the way

consumers get to pick companies,

companies get to pick their consumers

unless it's based on sexual orientation

or race or what have you.

>> Meta changed its policy to allow US

government agencies and contractors to

access its llama models for national

security purposes. Open AI, which once

stated its goal was to benefit humanity

as a whole, now has multiple contracts

with the military and defense

contractors. And by the way, I don't I I

I don't mind when companies like

Palunteer say, "We're going to work with

the government on in the defense

department." I get it, but you should

also have the right to not to. I don't.

So Anthropic is really they're the only

major AI company that has drawn a public

line on autonomous weapons and mass

surveillance and now it's the only one

being punished for it

>> but it's also winning in court which is

good but it's still is it problematic

for the IPO from your perspective?

>> Well IPO the the the threat to the IPO

is a bunch of companies say there is

there all there are alternatives out

there. We appreciate your stand Dario

but for the time being we're not

expanding our enterprisewide

relationship with you because we don't

want to be put on a list

>> right

>> uh now having said that having said that

again see above what I believe is the

biggest commercial opportunity in

decades is um to say no and if you look

at what's happened to Anthropic they're

now getting 70 cents on the dollar of

every new AI dollar being allocated to

AI from the enterprise. So, it looks as

if their ability to say no and get a

court to say, "Yeah, this is [ __ ]

This is socialism, cronyism, whatever

you want to call it, it looks like it's

it's setting up really I think anthropic

right now. I've said that I think

anthropic at this anthropic at this

moment is worth more than open AI." What

happens is the mark that people invest

at is a bit elucory because if they get

a preferred return, meaning no matter

what happens, they get their money out

sooner or they're getting a guaranteed

17.5% return, which is what Sam is

offering to private equity firms, then

that $850 billion number is a bit of a

head fake because as long as I'm getting

17.5% regardless of what it goes public

at, but I would argue right now the an

the momentum around anthropic is really

strong and the momentum around open AI

is really uh is really weird.

>> So you think it won't affect it? What

about the next star thing? Speaking of

mor on Brendan,

>> well we heard I was actually really

moved. A lot of people pushed back on my

comments about how local news is a dying

business and a lot of people push back

and said

>> I hate to hear this. It's a it's really

important work. And also to be fair,

you know, there's a lot of local

corruption

that and the only check on it is local

news. You know, seven I remember seven

on your side.

>> Seven on your side.

>> From the hills to the seas to the San

Gabriel Mountains. I'm Jerry Dumpy.

>> Yeah.

>> Who by the way, Ted Baxter from Mary

Tyler Moore was based on supposedly

wasn't supposedly Jerry wasn't very

smart. Um but he had broad shoulders and

just made it all the time. I love Dorian

Gensler in DC when I was in college. And

they also had Bruce Herschensson and Jim

Tunny and Point Counterpoint. And that

27 minutes of real news was bested by

the 3 minutes of two people arguing like

crazy.

>> If it had been that era, you and I would

have been a good local news team. Like

>> I would have predicted hail the size of

of canned tomatoes. I I would have loved

being a weatherman. I actually took

meteorology my senior year when I was

trying to figure out what the [ __ ] to do

with my life my senior year in college.

I thought I could be a weatherman and I

took meteorology.

>> I thought I was thinking about a

weatherman.

>> I was going to go in the military and

you were going to be a weatherman and

here I am.

>> Perfect. Yeah. David Letterman started

as a weatherman. Anyways, but we got

push back saying how important or I got

pushed back saying how important local

news is. And so I agree they they do a

great job that you know God be with you.

Um

>> so next star Ta.

>> Okay. Sorry. A judge has temporarily

blocked what is it a $6 billion merger?

>> Yep. 6 months.

>> Between Nextar and Tegna, which would

create the largest operator and uh the

number from 30ome% to 69%.

>> Yeah. 2/3. Basically, they'll have a

lock on it. And a US District judge uh I

think it's in Sacramento granted uh

temporary restraining order siding with

Director V who argued Directory V. God,

they're still around. Which argued the

merger violates federal antitrust laws

and eight eight state attorney generals

led by California's Rob Bont filed a

separate lawsuit. And then no uh in the

ruling he noted that companies do not

contest the merger will increase

NextStar's bargaining leverage to

extract higher fees. And what does the

ruling mean? It means that Nextar and

Tegna can't integrate options integrate

operations for 14 days. A hearing is set

for April 7th to decide whether to issue

a preliminary injunction. So like you

said, if if the merger goes through,

NextStar would own roughly 260

television stations across the country,

reaching about 60% of US households. And

like you said before, it was about 39%.

And the deal does violate FCC rules

limiting how many stations a single

company can operate.

>> Brenda let it through, but go ahead.

Well, so as we as we said, look, it's

not a great business to be in unless

you're in a swing district where they

just basically start trying to advertise

like crazy. Less than half of television

stations report generating any profits

from news. And last year, about 40% of

surveyed local television stations

reported decreasing their news budget.

And local television has lost, get this,

about half of its media spending market

share since since 2017. The business has

been cut

>> in half in the last nine years and as of

June last year

>> local TV accounted for just 6% of total

media spend. Digital video digital video

on the other hand accounts for about

50%. So I look I I don't

I mean it we're going to I think at some

point we got to end up with and people

hate the BBC but I like a certain amount

of public funding.

>> I'm troubled right now. We should talk

about that but later another time. a

certain amount of public funding for

what I'll call

>> local

>> yeah local public news. I think there's

like what Craig Newark did I I think is

really important and I I don't know if

it's a philanthropist. I don't know if

it's government funding like we do at

the BBC here with a house tax.

>> I don't think anyone should own 60% of

any industry even

>> that does feel uncomfortable even I

don't care. They can they can eke out a

good little business from it and and

influence things in ways that just and

they're also they're the ones that sort

of sucked up to Brenda during the Kimmel

thing. Yeah.

>> Yeah. You know, I just nobody I don't

want a liberal running 60%. I don't want

anybody like I just feel like it needs

to be dispersed. Even if that problem is

like a lot of media, it's a bad business

if you don't have monopolies. Um and

then it's just an okay business. I I

don't know whatever it's I hope they

stop it, but they're not going to. But

nonetheless, I hope then the industry

dies and I hope there

>> I'm just wonder entrepreneurial local

efforts going on. And there are a lot of

them by the way across the country in

Mississippi and Baltimore. So let's just

have new stuff and forget these these

compromised

>> I'm shocked you didn't bring up Vox. The

our companies in play.

>> Oh yes. Oh yes. Would you like to

discuss that?

>> Uh well I I have first off let me say I

have absolutely no insider information

here. Um

>> and I have a lot.

>> You have a lot. I'm on the outside.

>> Supposedly Vox is in discussions with

Comcast who's an existing shareholder to

take

>> Versent not Comcast

>> I'm sorry Versant. Yeah. Which owns

>> like Quasant

>> MSNBC and CNBC to take the pods. Then

they would sell the digital business and

also sell off NY. And the way I would

loosely describe it is the digital stuff

is a shitty business getting worse.

Anytime you're dependent upon Amazon,

Meta, and Google, eventually they will

screw you and take all the margin. Uh

those are difficult businesses. The New

York Magazine is a trophy asset. What do

I mean by that? There is some crypto or

hedge fund douche that will pay an

extraordinary amount of money to own New

York Magazine.

>> There's a lot of people. It does well,

too. It doesn't It's not like a big

>> It'll trade at an irrational price.

>> Yeah, it will.

>> Football teams make no money. They got

sold for five, seven, and 10 billion

dollars because some guy wants to go

from being an overweight tech guy to the

sexiest man in Cleveland by owning the

Browns overnight.

>> Okay. Can I just say it's also a really

good journalistic enterprise and it does

okay. I'm sorry. I'm going to

>> Okay. It It won't go for an okay price.

I'm I'm saying it'll go for no It'll go

it'll go for an irrational price.

>> It's a nice property.

>> The new owner is not going to be into it

for the cash flow or for journalism. The

new owner is going to be someone who

wants to say I own NY Mag. It's like

going billionaires own football teams.

Democrats own media companies. It'll go

for

>> So Scott will be buying it soon.

>> It's a trophy asset.

>> It's a No, I'm sponsoring the Met Gala.

I don't know if you heard. And I'm

taking Emily Rodicowski. If that's what

it takes

her because you didn't introduce

yourself when you were in her presence.

>> I got is I got texted Vanessa Freeman

who I think is a wonderful writer that

covers fashion text me. He's like, "Do

you have any thoughts on the Met Gale

and Jeff Bezos?" I'm like, tech has way

too much money, way too little cool.

Fashion has way too little money, way

too much cool. This is an exchange of

value.

>> Yes. A good quote. Good.

>> This is the most expensive midlife

crisis in history. Wouldn't it be easier

for these guys just to buy a Ferrari and

start banging their assistance

>> or penis enhancement

>> versus sponsoring the medala? But

anyways,

>> back to New York. Yes, it will sell. We

know this. So,

>> so NY Mag will go for an irrational

price.

>> My arm

>> and then the trophy assets. And I'm not

talking my own book here because PropG

is independent. We just sell our ads

through Vox, but Pivot is co-owned by

Yum, Mei, and Vox.

>> Well, no, they don't own it. We own it

and they're our partner for the next

three years. I wish you would do that

correctly. People think they own it, but

they don't. We do.

>> Okay. We own We own it. Uh, and we can't

do anything with it for the next three

years. But anyways, the

>> That's okay.

>> Uh, those are the assets. podcasting at

Vox and I'll just talk about us uh is

growing, you know, 25 plus percent a

year, maybe 30% a year. And when they

and when they get scaled, they're

amazing businesses because quite

frankly, there's just not there's not a

lot of cost involved in these things.

And you're seeing and quite frankly, I

also think we're benefiting from Trump

to the extent that I think people are

really hungry for thoughtful,

I don't want to call it progressive, but

a thoughtful push back.

>> We But we also do good. You did Warner,

I did Tillis, we do all kinds of manner

of things.

>> Anyways, the the the crown jewel is is

the Vox Media podcast network. But the

the thing that makes the most sense

here, which is what Jim is doing, is

that when you have a conglomerate that

doesn't have really obvious synergies,

which quite frankly I would argue this

one doesn't. People, the market looks at

the shittiest asset in the portfolio,

which is these digital properties, and

it assigns that valuation to the entire

thing. So the disposition of assets is

accretive to shareholders and Jim has

figured that out and he's going to split

up the company and he's going to have a

very focused podcast company that tries

to industrialized podcasting and video I

would say because podcasts are video now

>> that's that's a great point because

effectively what you have is podcasts

are the new TV shows with a lower means

of cost of production but I would argue

if he sells he'll get an amazing assume

and I don't I again I see above I have

no insider information here he'll get an

amazing irrational price for New York

Mag. He could sell the digital stuff for

a dollar and just be a podcast company

growing 25% a year and it would be worth

more. So this it makes all sorts of

strategic sense. Comcast is probably

Comcast I think invested

>> Comcast did invest. Yes. And so did

>> Comcast was the initial investor.

>> Yes. But the investment went over to

Versent just so you know.

>> Well, okay. The Robert Robert's family

is ready to get some money back. They've

been in this thing for 10 years, 11

years. They've probably said, "Okay, we

want some money back. You need a

strategy here."

>> I think it's going to be very

interesting to see.

>> Yeah, we'll see. One of the things that

I think reporters have gotten wrong

about it, and I I'm not going to say

much more because I do know a lot is you

can't, one of them is like you can pick

off these podcasters what's it worth

because you can you actually can't once

you have a good and Scott and I went out

in the market and looked at lots of

people and there a lot of them were

great, but a lot of them don't have

stuff, right? And so this would be

attractive to people who it's really

hard to sell advertising well. It's

really hard to do distribution well.

It's very hard to do production well.

And Vox does that well. And there's a

couple of companies like that that do it

well too. There's Crooked I think does a

nice job. So it's valuable and it's not

as easy to replicate as you think. And

getting picked off is you sign four-year

deals everybody. And some of people have

guarantees. We don't happen to have that

but uh because we wanted more more

revenue to us. Um, but it's harder to do

than you think. And even if you're not

satisfied with the advertising sales or

whether you got big or not, it's there.

Box is one of the better ones, which is

why we stayed, right? And and and we

could certainly sell our own

advertising. It's just a slog and it's

hard. It's really hard to do it well.

And so it is an attractive asset and

there's a lot of people this could plug

into a lot and just use your

imagination. And also not just companies

but individuals who want platform who

want

>> CNBC needs to do something.

>> Exactly. That mean you know you're

seeing CNN trying to do podcasting with

Jake Tapper and Anderson.

>> CNBC is local news with with sleeveless

dresses and Andrew Ross Orin. I mean

plus

>> they're going to be your new friends.

>> By the way, why why does Joe Karen get

sleeves and none of the other people do?

Um anyways the

>> we do not want to see that. Mark

>> Brian Roberts and Comcast they are very

>> it's not Comcast. You have to say Vers.

No, it's not whatever. It's not the They

own only a certain portion of it as a

public company. It's similar. There's

others anyway. It would help Vers, which

also needs to be innovative. So, in that

regard, but there's lots of others.

>> MSNBC,

MS Now, I'm sorry, MS Now, MS Now and

CNBC need a growth strategy. They're

they are in businesses in structural

decline. The average age of M MS Now

viewer I think is 64. CNBC at 67. The

average age of a podcast listener is 34.

The average age of pivot listener is 42.

They need an audience that isn't is

going to be around for another 5 or 10

years that buys [ __ ] that is in the

midst of buying homes, having kids,

making investments, buying mutual funds.

And they're smart people. So they do I

mean CNBC does an amazing job. They have

some of the finest financial journalists

in the world. MS now has some of the

most talented people in the world. So,

but what they need is is they need a

structural growth engine. They need to

find platforms that are growing and are

attracting

>> audience. And they've been trying, but

they're they've definitely been trying

more than other.

>> You know who probably inspired this

whole idea?

>> Me. What? No.

>> Other than you is Nicole Wallace.

>> Yes. Because Nicole, who's got a very

popular show on MS Now, started a

podcast that immediately

>> went to the top of the I would bet

Nicole's podcast is probably doing seven

or 10 million a year in ad revenue,

which doesn't seem like a lot, but I bet

six or seven of that is go close to the

bottom line. So, you got to think the

folks at Versant, Comcast, Roberts, Joey

Bag of Donuts, HBO Now, whatever you

want to call it, it have said

>> they got to be looking, they've got to

be looking,

>> they need to be in this business. Look

at the charts. You and I are near the

top as in Pivot. Uh individually, both

of us are. All your market stuff are. Um

lots of lots of Vox podcasts are near

the top and over all the the network

ones. We're often we're always higher

than all of them. So anyway, it's

interesting. It's an interesting time.

We'll see what happens. And we're

nothing at all. Nothing at all might

happen. We'll see. Anyway, um uh it

makes sense to us though. Uh uh we'll go

on a quick break and when we come back

the White House launches an app.

>> Support for Pivot comes from Anthropic.

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Scott, we're back with more news. The

White House just launched an official

app for iPhone and Android featuring

press releases and affordability

tracker, and an ICE tip line. Of course,

the Trump administration says the app

offers a direct line to the White House,

letting people text the president sign

up for newsletters. But those features

just link to White House contacts forms

that are already there, letting the

administration access users personal

information and some additional privacy

concerns. People digging into the app,

it took 5 seconds, found that it's

tracking GPS location data every four

and a half minutes. It's a privacy

nightmare. Do not download it. Um, just

very briefly, then we'll get to Winston

Fails. I would rather give my ex-wife

access to my text message history than

sign up for I mean who is [ __ ] stupid

enough to do that?

>> I know it's not trustworthy. Don't sign

up for it.

>> You think?

>> No, but I mean I wouldn't mind that the

White House has an app. It's just this

one is a People were like, "Okay, a

company doing this, you'd call them

scummy. The government doing this to its

citizens." The same people that are

demanding voter roles

>> that are that are that are targeting

people that are hiring Palunteer to

surveil people and you want to sign up

for their app

>> don't and it's really sad because the

White House should have direct

communication with people but to help

people not to take advantage of their

[ __ ] information. These people like

literally but someone who does apps is

like I I would think this is scummy for

a scummy person, right? Not our federal

friaking government. Very typical of the

Trump administration. Do not get it. do

not get it. And also an ice tip line.

What kind of person are you that you tip

on people? Gh,

>> as my grand my grandfather was, you

know, a mob mob adjacent, I would say.

Not really in the mob. Um, but like I

hate a a rat. A rat a rat. Like, you

know, it's fine to say see something,

say something. You see a bag in an

airport, yes, report it. But reporting

on your fellow citizens is if they're

not criminals, if they're not criminals,

[ __ ] you for doing that. You terrible

people. Anyway,

>> yeah,

>> one more quick break. We'll be back for

wins and fails. Okay, Scott, let's hear

some wins and fails. I think I shall

start.

>> You go.

>> Um, I, you know, I really, I have to say

I really like Slope. I didn't think I'd

say that, but I do. I'm a Manhattan

girl, but I really enjoy uh being there

and uh spending time there. I like going

to different places and but I mostly

want to say the win is Scott Gallery for

being such a good landlord to me when I

was in New York.

>> That's nice. Thank you. He's been

generous and I love his apartment. It's

wonderful. I I love being in like a lot

I feel really good about cities and I

feel like New York feels great.

Washington does feel great. I'm going to

San Francisco soon. I just I'm very uh

I'm very up on cities these days and

like kind of the creativity that you see

everywhere um in in them and just kind

of just a I just love a melting pot of

people. I really do. Um so I really I

I'm I'm winds are cities again. melting

poted $3,000 a square foot.

>> Yeah. Who's melting?

>> No way. But I'm just saying I went all

over. I went all over the city and and

it just was I just love a city. I just

love a city.

>> I so could have predicted you to end up

in Brooklyn.

>> I No, I would have done

>> I would have done the West Village, but

Amanda really likes that area and she's

friends there. And I get it. And I get

it. I get it. I get it. Anyway, um

>> Oh god, you're going to have

Birkenstocks.

>> No, I'm not. I never wear Birkenstocks.

This is never happening. No, I wear

Vans. Let's be clear. All right. And my

fail is um Oh, God, there's so many. But

I think the worst one is

>> I mean, I was going between Melania

Trump's robot for teaching children,

which I'm like, worst idea ever. I'm

sorry. Like, I don't mind robots folding

laundry, and I'm sure we'll have them,

and I don't mind them delivering things.

Fine, whatever. But teaching children

should be done by people with help from

technology. That is fine. But this

personalized educators for American

children and her walking out there. I

couldn't tell which was the robot and

which was Melania, which is a typical

joke, but honestly, what an idiot. I

She's really What an amoronic thing to

to feature at the White House is a

featured stage and to stage the idea and

insulting teachers. I I my my kid just

got in, my little kid got into the same

public school Claire is in for next

year. And I went walked by the teacher

and I said, "Alex, I mean Saul got in um

to the class and she was like, "Yay,

go." And I just love I just I love the

teachers. They really are dedicated and

committed, the ones we have dealt with,

especially in public schools, but all

the schools that the kids have been to.

Um and so I just hated that that thing.

And the second one was Trump signing the

US currency. It was always been a

Treasury Secretary person. Just another

grotesque like look at me, mommy didn't

hug me moment. So just gross. Just just

like I can't wait till we get rid of all

this stuff off all all the gold in the

office which has gotten out of control

and the whole thing. I can't wait we

tear it all down. Every bit of it. So

including getting his signature off the

dollar when when he puts it on. Anyway,

Scott,

>> I like those. Uh so my win is and you

mentioned this. I watched Louis

Thorough's documentary The Manosphere

and I I really I it was very

illuminating for me. Um, and a few of

the takeaways,

uh, first off, these quoteunquote,

you know, icons of the manosphere, these

podcasters or the folks portrayed,

>> they're grifters and they don't even buy

the things that they don't even buy into

the ideology. There's always a crypto

scam or a trading platform.

>> Yeah.

>> Or or, you know, buy their course or

whatever it is. Um, and they themselves,

this is not about ideology for them.

This is just this is just purely a

grift. And

>> and I think a decent

>> they're selling ideology as a product.

>> Well, and they're also trying to sell

masculinity and what I would argue is a

decent proxy for or a decent query for

masculinity is simple and ask yourself a

question. Are you optimizing for

attention or for service? And these guys

are optimizing for attention. Full stop.

And the other takeaway is I thought that

uh Louie really did a good job of

exemplifying that

um strength is more about he's this

slight guy who's a bit awkward and he

owns the room when he's in it.

>> He does

>> because he's quiet. He asks hard

questions.

>> He's not mean. And the other thing, the

takeaway I think for younger men

watching that is it's okay to

occasionally absorb a blow. And that,

and I didn't learn this until I was

older, I thought if someone was rude to

me or coming off in traffic, I had to

restore equilibri equilibrium to the

universe and get back in their face. And

at one point in the documentary, his

subjects were making fun of him, mocking

him, and he just takes it. It's like, I

got a job to do. The other thing that

kind of rattled me was,

and I think this is true of the

manosphere, and it's a lesson for the

left, I don't think I think a lot of the

young men who are quoteunquote in the

manosphere or drawn to these these these

men or these I don't know what you would

call them grifters.

It's not that they necessarily buy into

this [ __ ]

um ideology of dominating women or I

mean actually some of these some of the

stuff it actually starts off fine. Be

fit, take control, be aggressive,

initiate your life, manifest success and

then it comes off the [ __ ] rails and

it's usually about just dominating women

and being a total misogynist.

>> But what you found, I thought what was

most interesting is when they

interviewed some of the acolytes, the

people who are really drawn to these

people.

>> Inspiration. It's really upsetting

because what these kids, what these

boys, and they aren't boys, what they're

looking for,

>> Yeah.

>> they're not, it's not that they're drawn

to this ideology or this political

viewpoint. It's not even they're drawn,

I I don't think, to the misogyny.

>> They're drawn and they're so desperate

for community.

>> They are.

>> They want a reason to hang out with and

have a common bond

>> among other young men.

>> Yeah. They want to get better. They want

to feel better about themselves. They

want to improve This is where the left

has failed.

>> Mhm. I agree.

>> What orthodoxy or ideology on the left

creates a community for young men.

>> Yeah. What is it?

>> You you said that early on when

commisers didn't have stuff on her thing

about men. I don't think they

>> tell young men they're the problem.

That's not a community to rally around.

>> And pointed that out. And I think I

think what we have to do is like feel

like we're in it. Like I I the questions

I got, you know, I have expert

questions. One was for the guy who did

adolescence, Jack. And then I had

Gretchen Whitmer ask a question which

who's been doing a lot of man boy stuff

in in the state because she understands

it and so you're right. You're 100%

right. Okay.

>> Anyways, my win I thought Louis Thorough

documentary the manifest I found it so

rattling. I thought these young men just

so sad. One one of the young men he was

talking about his brother took his own

life. You could tell these young men are

just so desperate to find community and

a sense of safety and and other people

who it's not even the ideology they're

bonding over. They're just bonding.

Anyways, uh that's my win. My fail is

that I can I believe that the Democrats

continue to show a lack of creativity

and leadership around a series of

incentives of what they are going to do

and spell it out very specifically what

they are going to do when they get

control of the House and potentially the

Senate. And it should be something along

the lines of the following. Everyone is

saying, "Oh, we can't go after these

individuals despite their crimes because

they're just going to get a pardon."

[ __ ]

If you look at the law, once once

Democrats control of Congress and

Senate, they have subpoena power. Once

they get subpoena power, they should go

after specific individuals for crimes.

And then they should coordinate, and

this is the key, with the attorney

generals in blue states and start going

after these individuals who are no

longer protected by federal pardons. So,

for example, the attorney general in

California might decide that if a trade

on crypto went through and that family

members of the Trump administration were

illegally manipulating markets or

engaging in any sort of insider trading

that California AG can coordinate with

Democratic representatives to bring a

case against them and that case is not

subject to the protections of a federal

pardon. They need to sooner rather than

later put these people on notice that if

you are murdering people uh under the

oposes of a secret police, if you are

lying under oath, if you are engaged in

crypto scams, if you have companies that

overnight get contracts from the

military violating the imalments clause,

be clear,

>> it's crazy. and a a a candidate for

president or a senator or Democratic

representatives should outline specific

cases they are going to bring against

specific individuals in coordination

with specific AGS in specific states

that are not protected by a presidential

pardon.

>> Yeah.

>> And and who's done that?

>> Mhm.

>> [ __ ] nobody.

>> Some of these attorney generals are

working at it. Scott, I think that's not

fair. I think they are preparing them.

>> We got close

>> Yeah.

>> with what was her name? Fanny Hill.

Fanny

>> in Georgia, the Fulton County.

>> Yep.

>> But unfortunately, she like Chrissy

Gnome was [ __ ] her number two, which

blew that case apart.

>> Yes, that did.

>> But there is real opportunity here.

>> There is. I think there's more. I'm

being contacted by a lot of I think

attorney generals are really starting to

coordinate quite a bit on around these

things. And one of the things that's

critical for all of you people waiting

for a Trump pardon. Remember, he's not

going to give it to you till the very

end because he's loyal only to himself.