Taking creatine can increase muscle and

strength, but also improve brain health

and performance in sleepdeprived and

high stress states. But there's some new

research coming out showing its ability

to slow prevent things like

Wow. Jeff Cavalier is the physical

therapist and strength coach trusted by

the NFL, MLB, WWE, and even Sylvester

Stallone. He's built a global reputation

for science-based training that

delivers. What do people want? When we

pull our followers, I found that for

men, they want their six-pack abs,

getting bigger arms, develop their

chest, and for women, they want to have

better legs and well-developed back

sizes. So, we'll get into those

exercises. But the biggest problem most

people have is the struggle to get

started. And in doing so, become

paralyzed by inactivity and say, "I'm

not going to do anything at all." And I

get emotional, but it's sad when people

don't ever find that drive and and

motivation cuz like the detrimental

effects that prolonged sitting can have

on your body, they call it the new

smoking. Like if I take away your

health, you're done. So finding the

drive to get yourself on track with

pursuing optimal health is everything.

So if I was one of those people

struggling to get the ball rolling,

where would you start with me? I would

start with and I'm not done yet. Lower

belly fat. How do I get rid of that?

Calories and calories out. What's your

view? You say that there are five key

exercises to maximize your longevity and

quality of life. Can you show me these

workouts? Sure. And then why did you

bring the skeleton with you with the bow

tie? This is Raymond and I use him to

show one of the most fascinating areas

of training that has yet to be

uncovered.

This has always blown my mind a little

bit. 53% of you that listen to the show

regularly haven't yet subscribe to the

show. So, could I ask you for a favor

before we start? If you like the show

and you like what we do here and you

want to support us, the free simple way

that you can do just that is by hitting

the subscribe button. And my commitment

to you is if you do that, then I'll do

everything in my power, me and my team,

to make sure that this show is better

for you every single week. We'll listen

to your feedback. We'll find the guests

that you want me to speak to and we'll

continue to do what we do. Thank you so

[Music]

much. Jeff, you're very much known as

the the king and the OG of online

fitness training, advice, support.

In terms of the mission that you're on

in particular and how your perspective

differs from other people out there in

the market, what is it that you think

makes your perspective different,

unique, and more important potentially

than a lot of the perspectives out there

as it relates to how to how to how to

build up our muscles, how to have a

strong, healthy body, and how to prolong

our health span.

Everybody that for the most part that's

out there trying to put information

out, they should have a level there's a

level of respect I have for everyone

doing that because they're all trying to

help people get better or improve

themselves. I think where I was really

heavily focused was on a more

comprehensive more uh multiaceted way to

do that because my background wasn't

just in let's say strength training or

in aesthetic appeal of of training but

also as a physical therapist and having

a physical therapy background I

understood the importance of not

sacrificing the body in the process of

trying to aesthetically improve the

body. So I believe that when people

understand the why and they do become

empowered to sort of you know make this

their own journey the benefits are so

far reaching it's it's not just the gym

or the aesthetic appeal that you imp

improve it's your it's so many facets of

life that improve because fitness

improves like mental health is directly

related to people's physical health. If

you feel if you look better and feel

better about yourself, your mental

health improves, too. Like every element

of life is improved, I think, with

improved levels of fitness and health.

So, my why has always been to just use

my platform to try to get people to

understand that even the smallest

investments, it doesn't have to be every

bit I do. And I try to stress that in

all my videos, especially when we start

to talk about nutrition, like you don't

have to eat the way I do to get as lean

as I am to still benefit from being

lean. You could be you could have body

fat levels much higher and still see the

immense benefits in terms of overall

health. So, you don't have to do it

exactly how I do it, but take the

information and apply it to yourself.

That to me is the most rewarding part of

it. Because if I can show you how to do

it, the whole thing, teach a man to

fish, right? If I could do that, then I

think I've done something right. I say

all the time, I could take everything

away from you. I could take all your

money, I could take houses, I could take

everything away. I could take even, you

know, relationships away because we

could always find another relationship

potentially. If I take away your health,

you're done.

Health is everything. And what did you

study? So a few things. Physio

neurobbiology was my initial degree and

um I became a physical therapist which

required another three years. And you

became a certified strength and

conditioning specialist as well. Most of

the jobs that were in professional

sports would require some certification

in that regard. So you'd have to have a

college degree, but then you'd also have

to have um um a certification. And in

this case, it was the National Strength

and Conditioning Association. And over

the last 25 years since you got that

certification, who have you worked with?

Who have you helped? And how many

people? The most important thing that

came from that certification was that it

qualified me to work for the Mets. And

what's the Mets for anyone that doesn't?

So the Mets are the New York Mets

professional baseball team. So I work

with some of the best baseball players

in the world. Had a chance to work with

some of the greatest football players in

the world. Like it's wrestlers. was a

big wrestling fan growing up and we have

a lot of wrestlers that that come

through and that's a cool thing because

wrestling though some people may not

like the storyboarding of wrestling

athletically they're some of the most

gifted athletes in the world. I mean,

the travel schedule, the amount of days

that they that they that they wrestle

every week, the the rigors that they put

their body through, whatever you want to

say, the outcome might be determined,

but the the the the bumps and bruises

are not fake. And, you know, they also

have to have that aesthetic appeal, too.

So, it's this combination of athletic

and aesthetic that always appealed to

me. When I look at someone like you and

I see these bulging muscles and I see

how lean you are, I it's very easy to

fall into the trap of thinking, well,

you were just born with extreme

motivation and that's why you are the

way that you are.

Well, I think motivation is extremely

overrated, right? Because like

motivation isn't what produces the

results. It might get you to the to the

show and get you to actually show up at

the gym and initiate the work, but only

discipline keeps you there. And being

disciplined is the number one asset

somebody can have. Now discipline comes

with finding success. So at an early age

if you can or an early training age if

you can experience some success early

you do become motivated again

self-motivated

um to continue on down that path. So my

genetics were never great. I I didn't if

my mom was 5 foot tall my my dad's 5

foot n 5'8 160 pounds not a lot of

muscle. I definitely have surpassed my

dad in muscle, but like I didn't come

from this genetically gifted pool of

cavaliers. There's no there's no way.

But I did have this desire to do

something in terms of training and

taking my body as far as I could. But I

really found the discipline

through the fact that I liked it and I

found that this was feeding me in other

ways. It was it was making me feel

fulfilled. So it was easier for me to

stick to it. you you must deal with so

many people that are struggling that

come to you and they say, "Listen, I've

got these big goals. I'm I'm overweight.

I don't feel good. I've got diabetes

here, cardiovascular problem here,

inflammation here." And they say to you

that they want to change. Yeah. You

know, you can see it in their face.

They're desperate, but they don't change

for whatever reason. We live in an age

now where you have access to the

internet. You have so much access to

information. use it in whatever way you

can to get started on your journey

because the earlier you start the

better. But it's it's it is quite sad

when people don't ever find that spark.

And trying to play catch-up, it's no lie

to it. You're not it's going to be

harder as you get older. Starting or

initiating a training program in your

40s and 50s, though way better than not

starting one, is much more difficult

than if you had started in your teens

and 20s. you know to develop that habit

to maintain that habit it's very

difficult to initiate that the older

that you get but I do think that it's

possible so my best advice to people who

have that struggle to get

started is to figure out ways that you

can eliminate thinking right because the

longer you think the more likely you are

to not be able to do it you know the

thing that stops most people there's

that saying the start is what stops most

people right but at the same token, it's

not the obstacle that's in your way.

It's the fact that the path of least

resistance is more inviting. So, you

wind up saying, "Well, I you know, I

could just sit on the couch and watch

this. I'm not going to go to the gym."

And believe me, there's even nights now

for me where I'll be with one of my sons

and we'll be in his room putting him to

bed. I might fall asleep in there, you

know, and wake up and it's late at

night. I don't even think I let my dogs

out. I go right outside. I walk.

Sometimes I'm literally half asleep as

I'm walking, but I know if I can get to

the gym, get in there, turn on the the

music, and kind of put the lights on,

and do one warm-up set, I'll I'll be

good. And if I even sat down for a

second, I might find that path of least

resistance to be a lot more inviting and

that couch to be a lot more comfortable.

And then once it becomes something that

you enjoy, because for the most part, I

think you probably enjoy it now, right?

The process, it becomes a lot easier to

make that automatic step. But there's

still going to be days, you know, maybe

a long day of shooting, you know, and

you're going to be like, h, not maybe

not today. But if you stop the

negotiation with yourself and you just

go and make that first action, that's

all it usually takes to get you through

the door and you realize that you know

what you're what you were set out to do.

When you think about all the many

millions of people that have watched

your videos, I mean, it's actually

billions of people that have watched

your videos and consumed your content,

you must hear a lot of different types

of spark. When I say spark, I mean the

moment in someone's life where they

something happened and it stuck. It

finally stuck. What are the kind of

things that you hear? Oh man, they're

life-changing. Like that it it is it's

part of the why that keeps me going, you

know, hearing some of these stories. I

had a live event a few years ago, first

woman that we ever had. So, I was I was

a rookie. I didn't know how it was going

to go, but part of that event was a

competition that we ran. So anyway, we

we had a guy who was in his uh late 50s,

first one to do the competition. So he

he drew number one. Okay. So he goes and

the first thing we had was a 300 yard

shuttle, which is just a 50 yard

distance. They had to run to the cone

and back. That's 100 yards back and

forth again and back and forth again. It

was extremely hot that day. It was like

95 degrees because of course I ran the

event in July and it was like, "Okay,

this is not going to work out so well."

So anyway, he goes out, he comes back on

the last run. He uh he starts to

windmill his arms. He's he's losing his

balance forward. And I'm like, "Oh no."

And he crashes down, wipes out, scrapes

up his knee, blood all over the place.

Okay, next kid comes up. He He's up now.

He goes by the second station, he's

overheated. He tried so hard. He has to

stand out the rest of the competition

because he overheated from I was ready

to to put a stop to the games because I

said, "We just weren't prepared for this

heat in this first time." And anyway, we

continued. So, the fourth drill up for

the man that I talked about in the

beginning was a sled push. And we had

put 225 lbs on the sled, but that sled

was on the pavement out in the parking

lot from this gym that we that we hosted

it at. And the friction of the of the

sled on the ground was not really

something that was accounted for. It

made it even more difficult. Well,

again, he's got that bloodied up knee.

He's he's pushing it. He gets it to the

end struggling. And now he has to pick

up at the end 100 pound kettle bell and

walk it back. He goes down there. He

grabs a kettle bell after a long, you

know, multiple attempt to get the sled

down there. And I finally run down there

and I said, uh, his name is Craig. I

said, "Craig, dude, you don't have to do

this. You're good. You're good. It's

okay." And he's like, "No." And he says,

"I'm gonna do it." And he starts walking

and he's crossing the legs over each

other. It looks like he's gonna go down

again. I put my arm around him. I said,

"Man, listen. you don't have to do this.

He says, and I get goosebumps from

think. He goes, Jeff, I have to do this.

He goes, I was diagnosed with MS, you

know, four years ago, and I can't feel

my feet. I got to do this.

And it's that kind of drive and and

motivation. And you never know because

you don't know who the what they're

dealing with, you know? And I get

emotional, but it's it's like that's the

kind of stuff that gets me going. We had

another guy who uh competed at our event

and he was doing uh the push-up portion

of the competition. It's the second year

and he was doing his push-ups. He wasn't

going all the way down. So got down to

like I don't know two three inches away

from his chest. So I go over to him. I'm

like um hey dude just a little bit

lower. Get your chest down. He says, "I

can't because I have a port in my chest

and I have stage four cancer and I can't

get all the way down because of the

port." He wound up dying two months

after the

competition. So, when you realize that

people do this for reasons that you

don't like, it's not just to go to the

gym to get a six-pack. It's it's going

there to for reasons we'll never know.

And I think that those those kinds of um

moments are more than touching to me as

you can tell. But like they're they're

they're just they show the power of will

and that is something that we'll never

be able to quantify

within that as well. I was thinking

about how that guy who wouldn't put that

100 pound kettle bell down for him.

It it was actually about a

story he wanted to tell to himself. It's

something that he wanted to do for

reasons that are much more about one's

identity and one's self-story as we call

it. And uh on that particular point,

it's one of the things that I often

think about with fitness and working out

is if I can be the guy that grabs the

keys that day when I don't feel like it,

then how that permeates through the rest

of my life and how I show up in the rest

of my life when there's things I don't

want to do and how that then shapes me

over time into somebody who is able to

have the difficult conversation, is able

to confront the thing, I think is like

really understated. I actually was

reading this um I think Andrew Hubman

told me this. He said that they've

neuroscience has found a part of the

brain which is associated with doing

hard things. Yes, I saw that. And I

think he said basically that that part

of the the brain and I'll put this up on

the screen grows the more hard things

that you do. So you basically build the

muscle of being able to do hard things.

And the minute I learned that, I oh,

this makes a lot of sense because the

more I was able to make the workout

stick and the health and fitness stick

and now my diet is like as we sit here

now is extremely disciplined. I've like

changed as a person in other areas of my

life. Like I've got more organized with

like my my possessions and well, you

realize what you're capable of too,

right? Because I think we underell our

capabilities. And I think that in

reference to those two men that I just

talked about, like when you're staring

at the face of something that seems to

be much more dire than again what level

of fitness you have, you realize that

there's a much deeper well that you can

tap into to do things that you don't

want to do. Yeah. And I think the people

that are lucky enough like yourself to

have found that have found the keys to

the kingdom to be able to you know take

themselves to another level of awareness

and self-awareness that does 100% like

you said play out in other areas of your

life. you know, when you can do the

difficult

thing, it's still not an automatic that

you're gonna be able to have that

difficult conversation with somebody,

you know, but you know that you have the

capacity to do things that you didn't

really think you could and it gives you

that confidence to actually go and carry

those out. Interesting thing on that

that uh study that uh Andrew Hubin was

talking about was that if you start to

like the thing that you actually didn't

like in the beginning, then it no longer

challenges that area of the brain. that

area of the brain starts to shrink

again. Oh, really? So, it it has to kind

of which is cool because it means that

you need to continue to seek challenge.

I was thinking a lot about this over

Christmas and New Year's. I was I sat

down with one of my best friends and

said to him, I said, "What exercise and

what thing do you dislike the most and

we basically made a list of them and

then we started doing those things. For

me, it was actually running and it was

leg day and squatting." Yeah, it also

made me cuz when I asked him why he

didn't do those things, the list of

reasons he gave were things like my legs

aren't insert excuse, my brain insert

excuse. And we both came to realize

together that that was just a bunch of

that we like made our

identities and it was now limiting us.

Are there things like that in your life

that you just Oh gosh, you avoid

conditioning, running, I try to address

those things and do them knowing that I

should do more of them, but there's

always more more to do. One of the

things you must have figured out from

all the content you've produced across

all the these channels is really like

the essence of what people want and and

I you know because you'll see from the

views and the engagement and these

things you'll build this sort of mental

pattern of oh okay people are really

interested in this. So if you had to

summarize for me the essence of what you

think people are looking for and when I

say the essence I mean like the why why

why the very bottom of that what are

those things? Oh, I think I think

insecurity is definitely a factor. I

think um a feeling of wanting to be

accepted is is part of that. I think a

feeling of wanting to be more capable,

right? Because I think a lot a lot of

men carry insecurities of how capable

they are. You know, if the moment arose

that they needed to, let's say, protect

their family or do something that was

physically needed to be done, how

capable would you actually be? And I

think a lot of us feel insecure in our

preparedness that way. So I think that's

a driver. Um I heard this quote many

years ago. It says change happens when

the pain of staying the same becomes

greater than the pain of making a

change. And I was thinking if you were

my trainer and I was one of those

stubborn people who were struggling to

get the ball rolling. Where would you

start with me? Like what would you do if

I was super stubborn? I tried for three

years. I'd never made it stick. But but

clearly there was health consequences

playing out in my body. Where would you

start with me to get me going? Probably

the conversation, you know, I I would

start with always with the conversation.

I think it is important to see if you

can understand the why for somebody

because if you if you ask this question,

this is an interesting exercise to do,

but if you ask the question of like why

do you want to get in shape? Um you

might say I'm too fat right now. And I

would say to you, well, what would it

mean to you to not be as fat as you

think you are? Well, I it would be

better because I'd have a six-pack. What

would be important if having a six-pack?

Well, I would like how I looked in the

mirror more. Why would it be important

for you to like who you're looking at in

the mirror? Because I don't feel like

I'm enough right now because I'm letting

myself down because I know that I'm not

doing the things I need to. Why is it

important to not let yourself down?

Right? So when you start to ask the

question multiple keep digging you find

the why very quickly and a lot of times

it comes from pain from childhood. It

comes from pain of of letting others

down. It comes from a feeling of

inadequacy that you developed either

because it was you know drilled into you

from your parents or or others or

because you just never lacked the

self-confidence to actually feel better

about yourself. I always say that most

people who are lifelong gymgoers, they

all have some level of pain in their

life that caused them to seek this out

because it's the one thing they can

control. It's the one area where it's

like I can I don't have to listen to

anybody. I have to do what I have to do

for myself and I'm in control of my

body. And I think that a lot of times

people or or it's an escape, you know,

where you benefit from the endorphins

that are released through exercise and

it's your escape for doing something to

make yourself feel better. But that a

lot of times people get into fitness as

an escape from some of that pain. So if

if if I had you had come to me in the

very beginning, I would have started

with that conversation and tried to find

out why is it that you can't stick with

this? You've tried and you stopped. And

I think that people need to understand

that. And finding the why to get

yourself on track with pursuing optimal

health is everything. What about the

very top then? Like how does it manifest

like the the title of the video or the

thing? I mean the top is uh abs, biceps,

chest and uh and you know low back pain.

I mean people actually come to me for

one of two things. Again I think it's

having the two the two hats of physical

therapist and uh strength and

conditioning coach. I think people come

to me to fix something or to improve the

look of something. So we have lots and

lots and lots of views obviously based

around fixing issues um low back pain,

postural issues, knee pain, shoulder

pain and how it disrupts their ability

to carry on in life or through their

fitness pursuits. Then there's the other

side of it where people of course they

want their six-pack abs and then they

want their arms and they want their

chest. And I I highlight those because

the fact is that is where people are

most interested because it's, you know,

it's it's the it's the beach muscles.

But that's it's a fact of life. People

want to improve those areas. What I try

to do when I when I bring people in

through that track is to also make them

aware that it's okay, this is cool. You

want your abs, that's good, you know,

but obviously it's going to require a

healthier eating plan. So I know I can

have a much broader impact on their

overall health and life if I can get

them to eat much healthier than they are

right now. So I always feel that you can

come in for whatever your top level

interest might be. But my mission and

goal is to make sure that you understand

there's more to it than that. I've kind

of broken everything you've said into

three sections which is people want to

look good, they want to perform in

whatever that might be and they also

want to be able to do it for a long

time. They want to live long. Yeah. So

under if we start with looking good as a

topline category, what are the things

that you think are the subcategories of

looking good? The amount of fat that

someone carries. So how lean they are.

Yeah. The aesthetic development of their

muscles. what their bodies are shaped

like because, you know, you could lose

weight, but as you've described before,

skinny fat isn't really an attractive

look. Um, so I think they want to

develop their muscles in specific ways.

What is it the difference you see

between what men say they want versus

what women say they want? What do men

come to you and say that they want to,

you know, as a a trainer of athletes,

it's it's sacrilegious to me, but they

really discuss anything in the lower

body, right? They're not talking about,

I just want really big legs or I want to

have, you know, strong developed glutes.

I mean, it's just not really high on the

list. So, pretty much everything is

going to focus on, you know, from the

waist up in terms of the aesthetic

desire, bigger neck for men. For women,

it's the opposite, right? For women,

they focus first and foremost below the

waist. They want to have better legs.

They want to have stronger legs. They

want to have well-developed backsides.

They want to like, and there's probably,

I mean, a cultural importance upon that.

You know, people are, you know, men are

being judged aesthetically on their

upper bodies more than women are, and

women are being judged more

aesthetically on their lower bodies. So,

we're we're feeding into those desires,

especially, you know, one scroll through

Instagram and you're just reinforcing

everything I just talked about in that

category as well of looking good. Um,

nutrition. Most importantly, the level

of body fat that you carry is going to

be impacted by nutrition. So, let's

start with fat and lean. Mhm. If I want

to be lean like you and I want to have

low body fat,

where does one begin?

What happened with me and what I always

advise people to do is start just by

looking at globally from 30,000 foot

view. What do you know you're doing in

like not well right now? Like are you

drinking excessively? Um do you end

every night with you know a pint of ice

cream? like you know you're doing some

things wrong. So you make one pass at

the obvious stuff and you just do it for

a couple weeks, you know, and you see

how you progress and what will normally

happen is usually those are the most

offending the biggest offenders when it

comes to nutrition that you will notice

some quick weight loss when you stop it.

What do you think are some of the

offenders that we don't realize are

offenders? I've had so many in my life

even like ketchup and Yeah. I thought

white rice was great. Yeah, I mean,

white rice is actually there's a place

for carbohydrates in people's in

people's diets, I believe, but um you

have to have a healthy respect for them

because they're the most likely to be

overeaten. Like the desire to eat five

steaks is not there for most of us. Like

you but you could pound a whole plate

full of rice and then some or pasta and

then some because they're they're they

are much more chemically pleasing to the

body. So, I think people need to uh be c

cautious of overconumption of

carbohydrates and they're not aware of

portion sizes really impacting them

because they'll say, "No, I had I had

rice and uh and and pasta and and I

would say I have rice and pasta too

every day, but like I probably don't eat

as much as that person does." So,

portion sizes when it comes to that is

one of the areas people do not have a

good awareness about. the kind of hidden

offenders. I mean, there's sugar in a

lot of things that is used just to make

these things more appealing, especially,

you know, like yogurts, right? People

will have, you know, fruit on the bottom

yogurt, but it's like loaded with sugar

or I my first experience was oatmeal. I

was reading the bodybuilding magazines

in my teens that every bodybuilder ate

oatmeal in the morning. So, of course, I

was buying Quaker Oats, but I was buying

those little packets and they have brown

sugar in the bottom and it's like they

were loaded with sugar. They were not

the equivalent of Quaker Oats from a

from a like a a

canister. And so here I'm thinking I'm

doing something right, but I'm not

because there was more sugar in that

than there was in a in a a bag of or in

a a bowl of tricks cereal. What do you

look for in the on the package? I always

look for sugar and fat. That's what I

look for. So B dietary fat there are

nine calories per gram of fat versus

four calories per gram of protein or

carbohydrate. There are much more

calorie dense foods. So when you have

fats on your plate in any way, shape or

form calorically the that dish is going

to increase pretty quickly. So you have

to be mindful of them. If you if you

want to lose weight and achieve a

hypocchloric state to get there, you're

going to have to take in fewer calories

than you're than you're than you're

burning. That's why I would look at fat

content. But sugar is just really not

necessary. It's just one of those things

that our bodies do not need and um tends

to be uh too inviting to the point where

people have a hard time stopping eating

sugar. So, I think that's one of the

fastest ways to um to get yourself on

track is to is to try to minimize the

sugar content in the food. And then I

look for protein because I think that

protein has a lot of benefits in terms

of improving that ratio of fat to lean

muscle and also for its ability to

satiate you. So, if you're eating a

higher protein food, you're likely going

to find yourself feeling satisfied and

full faster than if it's just a

carbohydratebased meal. So, those are

the three things that I look at every

time I turn a label around. Protein,

sugar, and fats. And what does your diet

look like? I eat uh breakfast in the

morning. And I have usually, again, I'll

give you typical meals. I have uh

oatmeal. I even put like some pumpkin in

the oatmeal itself, some canned pumpkin

just for some additional uh vi vitamins

and minerals, protein shake, um and some

maybe some egg whites. So, I get good

amounts of protein. And for lunch, I'll

have like a grilled chicken wrap. Again,

trying to prioritize protein at every

single meal. And I'll try to have a

Greek yogurt that has limited sugar in

it. Um, then I'll have a protein shake

usually after work only because I know

that when I get done with work, usually

at 6:00, I come home, the kids are

there, they want to play. I wind up just

having something to tie me over,

realizing that my dinner's going to

occur later at night after my workout.

What happens though is that workout

occurs at around 10:30 to 11 o'clock at

night. So dinner happens at around

midnight for me. Um that's always again

based around a protein first. So usually

chicken or steak or fish and then

fibrous carbohydrates. So it's going to

be something like uh I I I like

edetamame. It's um you know it has good

protein uh in it and I'm not fearful of

the soy protein that's there especially

in that limited amount. broccoli and

then I have my f my starchy

carbohydrates which my favorite of all

time is uh sweet potatoes. So I'll have

sweet potatoes or or pasta or both. I'm

still shocked that you're eating dinner

at midnight and that what So what time

do you train? So I train around 10:30 or

11 until around4 to 12 or so. Is that

suboptimal?

It's it's only optimal because it's when

I can consistently do it. Okay. If I

could change that, I would probably work

out at 5:00 p. p.m., you know, but I

always find that there's still work

going on. People still need me at that

point in the day. Why not the morning? I

have a very difficult time waking up.

I'm one of those people that act like a

zombie for probably uh 15 minutes before

I'm feeling ready to go. I'm very much

the same. I probably eat a bit too late.

I train a bit too late, etc. And as I'm

listening to you, I'm almost listening

to myself. And I know the rebuttal is

that, well, Stephen, if you went to bed

earlier and you ate earlier, then you'd

wake up and you'd be able to train in

the morning. Yeah. Well, how do you feel

when you wake up? Do you feel energetic

as soon as you wake up? Or do you feel

No. Yeah. Um, I'm very similar to you. I

wake up late. Yeah. And if I wake up

late, then I feel fine. But if you try

and wake me up at 7:00, the chances are

that I went to bed maybe at midnight or

1:00 a.m. So, there's not enough sleep

taking place there. But having worn this

whoop for a while, who are a sponsor,

I'm an investor in the company, hashtag

ad hasha. Um, one of the things I came

to learn was that when I eat close to

the time I go to sleep, my body isn't

actually asleep cuz I could see my

resting heart rate so high through the

night. So, my body's actually just

working on the the food, so it's not

restoring my body. So, what are my goals

for this year is to try and not eat

after 9:00 p.m.

I I think it's a good goal in terms of

establishing a more regular sleep or or

or time to go to bed because the number

one thing I think people need to

understand is that when it comes to

sleep, the the routine of sleep is

what's most important. I believe even in

cases of lower sleep totals um there's

actually 27% of people report sleeping

uh less than six hours a night and 20%

of people sleep four to five hours. I

actually fall into the category of

sleeping probably 5 to 6 hours uh most

nights because I get to bed late and I

get up around 7 o'clock each each

morning. Do you sleep track? Uh I don't

sleep track. I did for a while. Um, I

don't sleep track. I actually, you know,

I've tracked my cortisol levels and my

levels of cortisol have actually

improved even as my sleep time, my total

sleep time has diminished. Now, there

is, and I hold on to this um as a

possibility, but I haven't tested

myself. There are two genes that are

actually responsible for uh short

sleeper syndrome. In other words, where

you can get away with less sleep because

it it optimizes gene expression for

wakefulness and brain stem activity that

allows you to wake up easier. And the

downside to that is that only 1 to 3% of

the population has that. So unless I got

really lucky in terms of that, then I

might be, you know, playing a game that

I ultimately can't win. Um, but I think

that there is a possibility that some

people can operate better on lower sleep

totals than others. On this point of

being uh

lean, one of the things people are most

obsessed with getting rid of

is lower belly fat. This stubborn belly

fat that occurs right right there. Right

there on our little mannequin here. You

don't have a pouch. That's what we call

it. Me and my friends, we call it a

pouch. um we can be, you know, very lean

elsewhere but still have a little bit of

a pouch there. Some people think doing

sit-ups is the way to get rid of that

stubborn belly fat. What is the answer

in your view? It's the level of

strictness of nutrition. And when I mean

the level of strictness, it's not just

in the foods that you choose, but

the consistency with which you choose

them. So, how long can you sustain this

really clean diet? And I hate the word

clean diet because usually when people

say they eat clean, it's actually the

first thing is a red flag that they

don't. Um, but I think it comes from

having a sustained ability to eat in a

very restricted way. When men put on

body fat, that is the first place to go

on and the last place to come off. And

one of the biggest areas for that, you

mentioned that I don't have one, but I

mean, as as ridiculous as that's this is

going to sound, when I start to see a

little bit of fat on my body, it's right

there. And it's because that is the

absolute first place to go on. This the

shamefulness of of how your body does

this. And what it does to us is that it

kind of works from this top down

approach. Like you lose fat first from

here and then it kind of goes down and

the last place is here. So it works in

this top down approach. Well, by the

time you get all the way down there,

you've lost the fat in your face. You've

lost the fat in your neck. So, like, you

know, I I sometimes I look at myself in

the mirror, I'm like, man, you're gone,

you know? And I hate the way that like

my my face gets sort of caved in. But

it's sometimes the price that you pay in

terms of maintaining a lean physique.

Um, especially naturally because that's

how your body starts to lose fat and

especially as you age, you start to lose

collagen and skin thickness. So, it

looks even it's even more of a

challenge. But this top down approach is

sometimes good because it allows you to

start to see like the upper row abs

underneath the chest or so when you

start to get into better shape. You

might have noticed this yourself. You

start to see like okay my my lower chest

isn't as saggy anymore. It's actually

starting to take some shape. Well,

what's cool is that's actually that

little spark of motivation that like I

want to keep going. I can see the top

ab, right? I can see the top ab like

there it is. I can see I have them, you

know? I actually have them. You I got a

two pack, but I have them. Well, you

continue down that path. Sometimes you

sharpen up the diet a little bit more.

Sometimes you take one extra night of,

you know, uh, socializing or drinking

out of the schedule and you start to see

it, you know, go even lower and you

start to get that second row of abs,

then it becomes a question of how

motivated you are to actually discontin

what level of sacrifice is required or

is worth it to you to continue. And

that's the caveat that I always say I

mentioned early on like is it that

important to you? Because I could tell

you that at 10 11 12% body fat, you're

going to look amazing and you're going

to look better than 98% of all men. So

whether you have that little tiny, you

know, area of fat around your waist,

you're still going to have your abs.

You're still going to have defined

shoulders and arms and, you know, some

veins popping out and other places. like

is that is that good enough so that you

experience the health benefits you

already would be you you be there

aesthetically you're probably really

happy with where you are now compared to

where you came from and you still get to

live a life that's not as filled with

sacrifice yeah to get there and that's

the battle people have to have to um

wage and ask themselves what is how

worth it is it to me is is the game of

weight loss basically calories in

calories out I I just need to have less

calories than I burn. Yes and no. So, to

lose weight, you're going to need to be

in a calorie deficit. Um, but if you

took that approach and just ate whatever

you wanted to, let's just say you ate

Twinkies in a deficit, you're not going

to get the same outcome because the type

of weight lost is going to vary

depending upon what you ingest. So, if

you don't ingest enough protein, you're

just eating Twinkies. might lose weight,

but you're also going to lose muscle in

the in the in the process. So, if you

want

to deter the loss of muscle and and

maximize the retention of muscle and

maybe again even slightly build in that

deficit, then you're going to want to

prioritize protein. So, it's not just

the calories in, calories out that will

get you to lose the weight. But when you

ultimat loss, they really want to make

sure that they're maximizing lean muscle

at the same time that they're losing

weight. if they want to look a certain

way, function a certain way, it's it it

it's gonna matter. What are the big

misconceptions we have about abs to get

rid of the body fat by doing those

crunches and stuff like that doesn't

work, you know? Um I think that's

probably the biggest misconception. I

always remember Llo. Lazlo was a was a

guy who worked on my house as a

contractor when we were building it. He

would come up to me just he was like the

typical male, right? He was in pretty

decent shape. He worked every day,

active. He's like, "I gotta get in

shape, man." And I was like, "Well, you

know, how many days a week do you

train?" He said, "Well, I don't really

train. I just, you know, do a couple

push-ups and stuff." I said, "Well,

you're gonna have to probably train.

What do you do for your nutrition?" I

kind of eat what I want. And I was like,

"All right." But he wasn't really

overweight, you know, but it's the

typical. And I He goes, "Just tell me

what I could I just want to know what I

can do for this. What's a good exercise

I could do for this for for his belly

fat?" For the belly fat. It's just

pointing at his stomach. And it's like

there's still that belief that there's

just an exercise or two that you need to

do for that. That's not how that's not

how it is. Abs are not going to be

gotten through just the exercise. It's

always about nutrition. It's always

about nutrition determines body fat

levels above everything else. Now, when

you get lean enough, if you're not doing

any type of uh ab training, you'll

probably have less defined abs because

you won't have the development of that

muscle. There's nothing different about

the abdominals and the biceps or the

quads. There's still muscles that can be

developed. And because of the anatomy of

the abs, there's that line down the

middle and the packs, right? That's just

caused by a suturing down of something

called linear alba. It's just a

tendonous sheath. When you develop the

muscles themselves through either

crunches or resistance training, right?

Even weighted ab work is is helpful in

this case. The muscles are just growing

just like a bicep would grow. And as

they grow that you can't change the

suturing down of the tendonous sheath.

So they're sort of growing out more

prominently from that area. So you get

more visible abs. But that's the only

way to really do that is through

training to hypertrophy the abs. But

you're not going to get there if you

don't first attack the body fat that's

over them. And that's only going to come

from nutrition. You know, sometimes you

see um older bodybuilders, like former

bodybuilders, and they kind of look a

bit bloated. What is that? I mean,

that's usually anabolic steroid use that

causes that or growth hormone. Um, that

doesn't generally come from natural

occurrences where your where your belly

gets so bloated like that. I mean,

sometimes if you have um different types

of hernas, you can get hernas actually

within the abdomen, not just in the

ingral um, you know, in the groin area.

That could cause some of that distension

in the abs, but not that global bloating

that you get there. That's really

usually a tell a telltale sign of like

growth hormone use. Something that

they've that they've abused that causes

the

the organs underneath to actually grow

and cause distension pushing out of the

belly. That's the organs growing

underneath. Yeah. It's actually is a

pretty disturbing visual when you think

about it, but it's not a it's certainly

not a healthy thing to have. And uh you

know, there's always a lot of

repercussions to um going down that

path. you know, they might look short

term the way they want to look. And I

would argue that even in those

cases, you know, the the the the large

super large Mr. Olympia look, I don't

even know if that was ever aesthetically

appealing to me or even a lot of people,

but um it it definitely leaves behind a

lot of a lot of damage. And people do

that at a variety of different ages now.

I think even people that aren't training

to be bodybuilders, I can think of

several people that I'm aware of who

have started taking like TRT and growth

hormones pretty young. And I'm actually

seeing a little bit of that same body

shape. I don't even know what it is, but

yeah, I mean I think it look at TRT is

becoming such a

prevalent path for people. I don't like

that that's a prevalent path. I don't

want to come across as somebody who is

anti-TRT because I've been I've been

reminded of that and that on some of the

videos I've made about it that look

Jeeoff there's a lot of cases where

people have extremely bottomed out

testosterone levels and there's nothing

medically that can be done other than

replace the testosterone that's not

being made. I completely appreciate

that. But as you've noted, the rise in

interest in TRT is coming from a lot of

the documentation of people talking

about their use of it and and how, you

know, they it's it's physically changing

them and they're doing it at at a rate

like it's it's becoming option one. Like

what about maximizing your natural

potential first, you know,

before declaring yourself as low

testosterone even at levels like of 400

and 500 and then going and using

testosterone like you're going to be on

that for the rest of your life if you

pursue that path. You know, once you

decide to replace your body's own

natural testosterone level with

exogenous testosterone, you're going to

have to rely on that for the rest of

your life. Now, some people can get off

of that and then try to restore their

body's ability to produce testosterone,

but that's not a given. So, be prepared

that once you go down that path, that's

one you're going to have to be on for

the rest of your life. Have you ever

taken TRT? No. No. Would you ever?

If it's proven down the road that it's

something that could be beneficial and

safe, I want to say I want to I'm aching

to say 100% safe because that's what I

want. than maybe I would if I felt like

I was really suffering from, you know,

the the the loss or the change that my

body was going through. Cuz I don't want

to just let myself get old. I want to

try to do what I can, but up till now,

the journey for me has been completely

natural and to do it in a way that it

feels most rewarding because I haven't

had to do anything. So, I feel like I'm

most inspired by my ability to keep

going. And I'm I'm going to be 50 this

year. What about let's do living long

then. Um, when we think about longevity

and what it's going to take for me to be

live a long time but be strong into my

later

years, where what areas do I need to

focus on training and and staying strong

and where do I need to invest my energy

and time? So, this is where I think when

I say if you want to look like an

athlete, you got to train like an

athlete because like the hallmark of

their training is that it's multiaceted.

So, you can't just have one element

developed and be a great athlete. Even

if you look at someone as

one-dimensional, I'm not doing this

saying this to put them down, but

onedimensional as an arm wrestler,

right? They could have grip strength and

forearm strength and rotator cuff

strength, you know, to be able to

actually turn somebody over, but if they

have poor nutrition, poor sleep, poor

recovery, they're likely going to lose,

especially because your neurological

output and grip is directly correlated

to your ability to recover.

If you don't have more than one

element de developed, you're not going

to be your best. So when people are

looking, the general population is

looking to become healthier and feel

better, it's not going to be one thing.

First and foremost, I believe that

getting on a training plan that

prioritizes the building of muscle, so

hypertrophy and strength building is

going to be really important because we

are going to again like I talked about

before, you're going to naturally lose

strength every passing decade. You know,

up to 8 to 10% per decade as you as you

pass the age of 50. So, you need to make

sure that you are doing something to

save that off. You can dramatically slow

that down by engaging in strength

training and engaging in regular weight

training with the purpose of trying to

build muscle. But you you have to do

that. The brain ages. So

having challenges to your balance,

having challenges to your ability to

maintain muscle recruitment because

that's again neurologically your brain

your neurons start to fire at a slower

pace. You need to train these things.

reactivity, reaction, your reaction

skills, again, balance drills. These are

all little parts of things that people

can do. I always remember seeing this

old man. He was in a he had an obstacle

course he built. I don't know if you

ever saw this, but it was a video. He

was like 89 years old and he made this

obstacle course and he used to add every

week or so he'd add one more obstacle to

his course and he built it in his

backyard and it was like a balance beam

and then a net that he had to climb and

all these things. He used to run the

obstacle course once a day. Wow. And he

said that like he would try to find new

ways to challenge his body so that he

would keep his brain guessing as to

what's next. And again, whether or not

it he was he was uh finding this thing

to be something he didn't want to do,

maybe it was also feeding into his his

his uh increases because of he was doing

the things he hated to do. But the but

the idea was he maintained his fitness

by being completely multiaceted and by

incorporating some of these balance and

reaction type drills into his approach

because it is important. The fall risk

improve uh increases exponentially as

you get older. Um a lot of it has to do

with something we'll talk about um with

the thoracic spine and losing mobility

there, but like you need to factor those

types of things in. Flexibility and

mobility feed into that. Like you can't

I always talk about there's a there's a

pyramid, right? If you look at the the

the old nutrition pyramid, there's a

bottom which is supposed to be represent

the the like all the things you're

supposed to work on and then it kind of

fine-tunes and works its way up. At the

bottom of the pyramid, most would say is

strength, right? You got to you got to

maintain your strength. And then above

that, you got to maintain your your

muscle mass, like the amount of lean

muscle you carry. And above that, your

ability to perform because of those two

attributes. So to be able to actually do

things and if it was an athlete it would

be like their skill work would be at the

very very top. So could you if you're a

baseball player you know how well do you

swing the bat? You know how well do you

feel the ground ball? Like it's that top

level skill work that comes up here. Is

cardiovascular in there? Cardiovascular

is in there as well as well. Yeah. Your

your conditioning would be right you

know depending upon who you talk to in

terms of longevity and performance and

the sport you play is going to fall

right above or below strength.

Now, I would argue that there's a few

things underneath the whole thing. It's

just like a tree. You see the tree above

the ground, but you don't see the roots.

And this in the pyramid sits on the

ground, but what's underneath the

pyramid? The roots, your stability, your

flexibility, your mobility. Because if I

took the strongest person that could

squat 600 lb, but now I'm going to put

you on a stability ball and tell you to

do the same thing. You're not doing it.

I just took away your amazing strength

because I took away your stability. And

if you can't obtain certain positions of

your body because you lack the mobility

or you lack the flexibility, then I've

also taken away and I've weakened the

strength that you have. It's there. Your

strength is there, but it can't be

expressed because I took away the

stability. So, the real root of

longevity in fitness is really in your

ability to maintain mobility,

flexibility, and stability. Flexibility

is the muscle length and in the in the

ability to change the length of the

muscle. Mobility is the joint

excursions, the ability to move your

joints and in and um their full range of

motion. So, it's it's a muscle or joint

thing. Still the same concept, but

they're working on different elements.

Do you think people realize that that's

so important? And do you think they

enjoy it? No, I think people hate it.

And I think that I mean some people like

it. If you're into the practice of yoga,

Pilates, you you will likely gain a

quick appreciation for how much better

you feel when you do those types of uh

exercises that will improve mobility and

flexibility. But for the average gym

goer, no, it's either going to get

relegated to the last thing they do uh

before they leave the gym or not at all.

And I think that that's going to have a

big impact on how well they feel. I

think that when they talk about the

fountain of youth, stretching and

mobility is probably the thing that

makes people feel the best. I've heard

that people say that and I agree to

almost a full extent, but I think that

if you are just limber and loose, but

you lack the the strength, you are never

going to be as functionally capable as

you can. Actually, I I have this band to

sort of show that like if somebody was

just completely flexible, right, and you

were trying to shoot this band across

the table, I don't have a lot of tension

to be able to generate to to get any

kind of force to do that. On the

contrary, if somebody was

um strong, right, maybe even muscle

bound, I don't have any flexibility here

to again really create much of a elastic

output here or to get a lot of force

generation. But if I were to take this

band and sort of get that optimal amount

of flexibility, but also the strength in

this case, the muscles, the tension, I

can shoot that band a lot further, a

with a lot more force and a lot more

ease. Our goal should be not just

athletes should be striving for this,

but our goal should be to have the right

amount of muscular tension and force

capability with the flexibility and

mobility because that's only at that

point that you actually can express

probably the best performance possible.

How much work have I got to put in to

become more flexible and to improve my

mobility? Not not much. It just has to

be consistent. So, I mean, I think if

you were to devote even five to 10

minutes a day of stretching the areas

that are tight, and again, this is very

individual. Like, one thing that I

always stressed, even when I was in

baseball, every player from me got an

individual program, and it was based off

of a comprehensive assessment. So I

would go through the assessment on each

player and you would find that either

based on position um and the demands of

that position, body type, you would find

certain requirements of a program that

needed to be in place to maintain

optimal health. You would get tight in

certain areas. You would have things

that would need to be strengthened more

than others. People have to be willing

to a seek out where these the deficits

are and b to actually pursue a program

that would work on those deficits. And

then when you have that, again, the

comprehensive list doesn't have to be an

hour a day of doing those things. You

prioritize that list and you focus on 5

to 10 minutes of extra work with it.

It's funny. I make a lot of videos on,

hey, do this every morning, do that

every morning, do this every morning.

But it's only appropriate to the people

that have the deficits that I highlight

in the video. People think they have to

combine all of those things into a whole

separate career in order to be able to

pull them off. That's not necessary. You

can you find the ones that have the

biggest impact. But I don't think that

having, you know, doing stretching

requires long duration of these things.

It just simply requires consistency of

them. You you say that there are five

key exercises you need to be able to

maximize your longevity and quality of

life that kind of dovetail into this.

the single leg Romanian deadlift, the

squat and reach, the sumo stance hold,

the posterior chain push-up, and hip

abductions.

Can you show me these workouts? Sure.

As you can see from the space I'm in,

you don't need a whole lot of room to be

able to do these exercises. They're

incredibly accessible. They're actually

scalable with a low barrier of entry.

So, no matter what level of ability you

bring to these exercises, you're going

to be able to do them. All right, so the

first exercise up here is pretty simple,

but it does demand some balance. And it

also will teach us a very critical

biomechanical requirement, which is a

hip hinge. So, it's called the single

leg RDL. What you want to do is you want

to hinge. Pretending that there's a

drawer behind you that's open, you're

going to close it with your butt. Then,

you reach forward, but at the same time,

you kick back the opposite leg and

engage the glute on that side, lifting

it up to create a bit of a

counterbalance. So, your goal is to see

if you can get even up to 10 without

losing your balance or having that other

foot have to contact the ground. Next

exercise is something that we call a

squat and and reach. And what we do is

we get down to the ground like this,

down to a squatting position. And we

anchor our elbows into the sides of our

knees. Okay? And then from here we post

up on one hand, reach up and rotate and

follow it with your head as you go up as

high as you can to the sky. Now the goal

here is to try to hold this position for

up to 60 seconds. That is what is lost

when we get into these chronic positions

like this right with our devices at our

computers. We get to this rounded

thoracic spine, this upper portion of

the spine. Doing this will give us the

mobility that we're lacking. So the next

thing is something we call a sumo squat

stance. It's a squat stance hold and

it's based off of something called the

horse stance which again we work on

getting hip mobility and hip stability.

Right? And again we're going to still

work on the hip in all three planes. So

what we do is we get down feet wide and

squat down into this position here. Now

the beginner version of this is to

simply keep your elbows on your thighs

for a little bit of support. But what I

want to see as tall of a chest as I can

get the same way that we just did

through that rotation to maintain that

area of the spine, that thoracic spine,

and getting extended because we know

that when that spine is extended, the

shoulders will go with it and the

posture will get away from this position

and more to this open upright position.

If we don't do it in that beginner

format, then what we're going to do is

cross the hands over. Okay? Get in that

down position. Reach up and

out.

Okay, that is a 30 second hold up to a

60-second hold depending upon how far

you can take it. The next thing we do is

we got to work on that upper body a

little bit. So the upper body, you

should still be able to do the exercise

that is often times the benchmark for

upper body strength, which is the

push-up. But we can do it in a way where

we get bigger benefits both front and

back side. So we call this a posterior

chain push-up. For a push-up, you want

those hands underneath the shoulders.

Okay? I'll demonstrate one, then we'll

do it together. You want to be able to

push up all the way to full extension.

You also want to have tightness through

your quads and glutes. So you squeeze

your butt together. You straighten your

knees out by contracting your quads. And

then you get a good firm holding plank

position here. Now, when you go down,

normally people would stop here or they

wouldn't come up all the way. You go all

the way down to the ground. At this

point, you slide your hands out in front

of you, point your toes, keep those

quads contracted, squeezed, tight, and

then lift up into what we call a

superman. Right? From here, you're going

to train all the muscles in your

posterior chain from the back of your

heels all the way up to the tip of your

fingers. Right? Come down. Slide it

back. Come up into that good firm

push-up. Don't lose any of that

stability. Come down. Slide up. And

lift. The final thing is something that

looks so darn simple, but it actually

has a lot of functional carryover. We're

talking about just a sidelineing hip

abduction. Okay? And what we do is we

get in this position here. We position

our toe down in front of us. So, you

want to basically point your toe down

into the ground. Okay. From there,

you're going to slide your leg back

behind you. Okay? As far as you can take

it and then lift up. And right when you

do that final lift, you're going to feel

a contraction right here in the glutes.

in particular in the glute medius.

That's the muscle that's controlling

that rotational element of your hip

joint and the stability and the strength

that's needed to propel your body even

on a regular walk without your hips

dropping down side to side. You don't

want to let that happen to you. You want

to be able to hold this position for 30

to 60 seconds. Some of the mistakes

people make is in order to feel like

they're getting the lift, they'll just

rotate their body to let the hip flexor

do the lifting. Remember, we don't need

the hip flexor to do the lifting. We

want the glute medius to do the lifting.

So, you need to make sure that you're

rotated forward the entire time. And

that's it. There's the five essentials.

Quick, simple, and incredibly effective.

No fancy equipment, no gym required,

just a little bit of space and

consistency. Now, back to the diary of a

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Dr. Daniel Lieberman came on the diio.

He explained how modern shoes with their

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already purchased a pair of Viva

barefoot shoes. So I showed them to

Daniel Lieberman and he told me that

they were exactly the type of shoe that

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movement and rebuild my strength. But I

think it was planttoicitis that I had

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feet. And what what is the context there

with those workouts? Why why did you

choose those workouts and what do these

kind of signal? Are you saying that if

I'm able to do those then there's a

probability that I have the strength and

flexibility conducive with longevity?

Yeah, those are good standard exercises

that will measure at a at a high level

how much of a deficit you've acquired

over the years from not doing them. So,

you should maintain the ability to do

those exercises because they're going to

reflect the global approach at least to

working on flexibility in your groin or

working on the strength in your hip

abductors. Because the hip abductors, if

you look at most leg

exercises, the squat, the deadlift,

they're occurring in the sagittal plane,

which is this front to back plane. One

of my favorite exercises of all time is

the lunge, right? I love the exercise,

but it's still occurring front to back

in this plane here.

Getting exercises that work the other

two planes and mostly through rotation.

But working this frontal plane, this

side to side is really important to

producing a complete person, right, with

complete levels of strength. And because

they're not the primary exercises that

do that, like that sidelineing hip raise

that that we I show you is not one of

the big exercises that are most

important that are going to be up on

your list. you're going to do your

squats first and you're going to maybe

not never do those. But it doesn't mean

that that muscle didn't matter, right?

That those muscles are there for a

reason and they need to be developed. I

remember so many times taking some of

the most powerful baseball players, the

leading home run hitters, and then

testing their hip internal or external

stren uh rotation strength and it being

incredibly weak. Like incredibly weak.

And you say to yourself, "How is that

even possible?" because it was never

actually directly trained. And does it

have a carryover? Obviously, they're

doing really, really well in terms of

their performance on the field. I still

think it would have a carryover to

improve performance on the field, but

more importantly, one of the players in

question actually wound up having a lot

of knee pain throughout his his career.

And there are missed games because of

knee pain. What What could his career

stats have looked like? They're already

Hall of Fame worthy. What could his

career stats have looked like if he

didn't miss all those games? So they may

not have improved performance directly,

but they could have kept them healthier

and having other issues be avoided by

doing them. So I think that these types

of smaller movements are really

revealing of what might be going on

underneath. And the nice thing about

those is that anybody can do them. Like

it doesn't require a gym, doesn't

require an elaborate setup. They're

really good assessment tools for people

who just want to see where they stand.

Why did you bring the skeleton with you

with the bow tie? Uh the bow tie. I

mean, he came dressed even more than I

did. I think my t-shirt, but this is

Raymond. So X-ray is his full name, and

then Raymond became his uh short name.

So I I broke him out, God, I probably in

2011 or 12, and he became a fan favorite

pretty quickly. But I think people like

the visual. And for me, he's not the

most mobile guy. He's lost his lower

arm. He doesn't have another arm on this

side, and he doesn't really move that

well. But what it is important is he's

also lost his legs. He's lost his legs.

I got a leg over there if I need it. But

the spine. See, for me, again, I focus a

lot

on the ability to function in space. And

rotation is probably the area of biggest

deficit. It's what we lose the most. And

the reason for that is because the area

of the spine that's most responsible for

functional rotation of the torso is

going to be here in the thoracic spine.

So what that is is anybody that wants to

measure on themselves, it's right at the

bottom of the of the neck. So at the

base of the neck, the height of the

shoulders, and it runs down just to

below the rib cage. So right where the

rib cage ends is where the thoracic

spine ends. It has so many farreaching

implications because it shares its range

of

motion between two different directions.

So its ability to go front to back

again, he can bend forward and back. We

can slump forward, we can go back,

right? You want to have ideally about 40

degrees of flexion in that area and

about 25 degrees of extension through

that area. And just us sitting here

alone, you know, we probably tended to

get a little bit of this posture while

we were getting comfortable and talking.

We kind of get a little bit rounded out.

When you use up motion in this

direction, and imagine what that looks

like when people are on their phones or

at a desk all day, you're going to start

to lose the motion into extension.

You're going to get too flex. Well,

every time you lose a degree into

flexion, you actually lose a direct

degree into rotation. So, you're because

you're sharing that motion. The motion

is only available in a combined way. So,

if you want to take up motion this

direction, there's going to be less

motion available here. If I have a a a

thing, if you let me grab this, put this

over your back. Over my back. Yeah. Just

like this. Yeah.

Now, allow yourself to slump forward.

Pretend you're on that phone, right? Get

there. Now, just turn from the shoulders

in one direction. Slumped over. Okay.

Now, take a peek down the barrel of that

thing, you know, behind you and see

where you're pointing. How about how far

rotated you are? Yeah. All right. Cool.

Now, come back. Reset yourself. Now,

take back that mobility that you lost

through your thoracic spine. I'm getting

crumpled. There's your rotator cuff. So,

get yourself up right now. Nice posture.

Act like I'm I'm watching, right? So,

get there. Now go ahead and rotate again

in that

direction. How much more did you get?

Yeah, I got another like 20%. Right. So

maintaining thoracic extension maintains

your ability to rotate. The ability to

rotate in space is one of the most

important functional requirements we

have. When you're when you're falling as

you get older, you're likely reaching

spontaneously to grab something to

regain control before you crash down and

maybe break a hip. Mhm. Functionally as

an athlete, your ability to perform is

all about rotation. You know, you don't

usually just move in one plane like

this. If you're a football player,

American or not, you're rotating all the

time. You generate force as a soccer

player, you know, by kicking across your

body, right? By throwing a baseball,

it's all about rotation. You need to

hold on to rotation. But what what we

lose is the ability to extend at our

spine. By the age of between 50 and 60,

people will have lost 25 to 35% of their

ability, their mobility in this area.

You see it as well. You see what people

get older, they look stiff and they kind

of look robotic. Awful. My grandmother,

God bless her soul, she lived to 97

years old. Wow. But at that age, she was

literally a right angle. She was

literally she had a walker. She was

completely bent over at that walker.

Could hardly get herself back up. She

had lost all of her extension. So, she

could not rotate at all. And again,

functionally, it's the most important

movement you can make, I think, is to be

able to rotate through your torso to be

able to do things. So, I think that

people need to focus on, again, you go

back to that whole concept of like, what

do you need to focus on? Well, I could

tell you some great exercises to do to

maintain your strength, but if in the

process of getting a really strong

squat, you've also lost thoracic

rotation. I can't deem you to be a

really healthy individual because you've

you've you've given up one of the most

important things that you need to

maintain. Cuz I I thought that aging and

then basically turning into that right

angle was just inevitable because you

see it in so many older people. They

often are like bent over and you you

kind of think, well, why don't they just

stand up? Yeah. Well, it's it's

impossible because, you know, you're

losing that that fight to gravity,

right? Gravity is going to win

ultimately, but it doesn't have to win

completely. So, the more that you work

on maintaining your ability to extend

through the thoracic spine, then you

don't develop those downstream

adaptations that happen from always

being there. So, what happens once you

get in this position, you lose

flexibility through other joints. Again,

if you get get in that position again,

actually turn a little bit. Try to raise

your arm up as high as you can from that

position. Okay. Now, just straighten

yourself out. Go up tall. Now, raise

your arm up again. Like, yeah. Why?

Because you've literally mechanically

blocked your shoulder because your

shoulder blade has to be able to rotate

around your rib cage as you raise your

arm up overhead. Okay. Right. A great

percentage of ability to move your arm

over your head is not just the ball and

socket that's over here to get your arm

up there. It's the fact that your

shoulder blade has to rotate with it to

allow it to go up there. I could

actually block your overhead mobility if

I went behind you right now and just

held your shoulder blade. If I held your

shoulder blade in place, you wouldn't be

able to raise your arm up maybe more

than here because it has to rotate in

order to be able to get to the top.

So when you realize that this epicenter

of dysfunction can have these

far-reaching benefits where all of a

sudden a perfectly healthy shoulder

can't move up overhead and then what

happens then if you can't move your arm

up overhead right and I say Stephen get

your arm up over your head like I can't

no get your arm over your head you'd go

like this you you'd lean your body back

because your arm can't get any higher so

you're going to lean your body back what

are you leaning from your low back so

now all of a sudden you're asking a an

area of your spine that's supposed to be

stable, right? The low back, the lumbar

spine is supposed to be a stable area of

your body. You're asking it to now

become a mobile area of your body. And

you're you're asking for motion that

it's not naturally inclined to want to

give you because this area didn't give

it to you, right? The upper thoracic

area didn't give it to you. So now what

does that happen? Now you're asking that

to do too much. The muscles can become

spasm. You can damage the joints in your

low back. Now you're causing a problem

somewhere else. So this area has has all

these farreaching benefits. Another

thing that can happen too is when you're

down like this, I mentioned that this

area of the spine we tal about is

actually connected to the ribs. Yeah. If

you're in this compressed position where

you're rounded forward, hunched over,

you actually don't even get good lung

inflation. It's like trying to inflate a

balloon inside of a box that won't open.

You can't get the lungs to inflate

properly. lack of properly uh operating

lungs are going to cause you to be more

fatigued throughout the day and they

cause you to feel uh less rested at

night. So these the this area has so

many up and down ramifications that you

need to really focus on it and it it's

one of those things again if you were to

ask me how many people do I think

directly work on this area

10%. At most what have I got to be doing

that at my age? I'm I'm 30 in my early

30s now. What have I got to be doing now

to make sure that when I get older I'm

not hunched over and I am I do have that

full range of mobility? Yeah, there's a

few things like again anytime you try to

approach any of these dysfunctions, you

know, we talk about um the mobility

flexibility part being the the

foundation of that. But then there's

also a strength component because like

you can free up the mobility and

flexibility, but can you maintain it?

The strength is just going to help you

to maintain it. From a mobility

flexibility standpoint, you can simply

go up against a wall, right? And what

you what what you're supposed to do

there is put the back of your head

against the wall, your upper back

against the wall, and your butt against

the wall. So, you're going as flat as