I used AI to make $15 billion last year.

>> You did?

>> I did. Because the AI gave us a solution

to the problem that no one had ever

encountered before in the history of the

world. And so my advice is don't try to

outwork the robots. What you want to do

is ask the AI to do something that's

never been done before. And if you want

to create these incredible success

things, you want to locate the magic

opportunity. I know this because I'm an

technology entrepreneur. And we're

[music] the biggest buyer of Bitcoin in

the world. So what is my mission? I'm

preaching the gospel of digital

empowerment [music] in Bitcoin as

digital money. And it's going to be the

best long-term capital asset. And you

can actually own something and someone

more powerful than you can't take it

away from you.

>> What do you mean they can't take Bitcoin

from you?

>> So this is a stack of currency. You walk

through an airport on this, they ask you

if you have cash. They just take it. So

cash in a physical form is a problem. So

what do you do? You put it in the bank.

So the bank then decides whether you get

to keep it and whether you get it back.

But I could move a million dollars of

Bitcoin from here to anywhere, to

London, to anywhere in cyberspace in a

few seconds. So the last thing in the

world you want to save is money.

>> So what about this? Why not just put all

of my money into gold?

>> Well, gold is up 12% a year, but Bitcoin

is up 33.

>> What about the S&P 500?

>> You're going to get double the

performance from BTC that you would get

from like the S&P index.

>> So should I buy a house?

>> I will tell you why you shouldn't buy a

house.

>> And then you sold a bit of Bitcoin

recently after telling a lot of people

sell a kidney if you must but keep the

Bitcoin. So why did you sell the Bitcoin

instead of your kidney?

>> Because

>> Michael, beyond just buying Bitcoin,

[music]

what is a good strategy to build and

become wealthy in your view? And then

>> [music]

>> you have 10 rules for young adults

building a strong foundation for their

life and career. So let's go through

these.

>> So first,

>> This is super interesting to me. My team

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year-over-year and week-over-week, it is

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Do we have a deal? If you do it, I'll

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stayed true to that promise since the

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Really appreciate it. Let's get on with

the show.

>> [music]

>> Michael, because of your success as a

technology entrepreneur, you are a

multi-billionaire from my

math and you're heavily focused on

digital currencies at the moment,

specifically Bitcoin. What else do we

need to know about you in terms of what

you've built and accomplished outside of

that?

>> I always wanted to make a technical

contribution. So, that the early

business was business intelligence. So,

how do you extract intelligence from

large raw data sources and that was what

MicroStrategy did. We created a global

business intelligence company. And

[snorts] I think in 2020, when the COVID

lockdowns took place and the world

turned upside down, that was when I

discovered my greatest idea and it

wasn't even my idea, right? It was

Satoshi's idea, but I discovered Bitcoin

in 2020 and the company today is

$60 billion, but we peaked about 125

billion. So, we got somewhere between

100 and 200 times bigger since we

discovered Bitcoin.

>> And when you speak to the general public

now, when you do podcasts like this,

what is the the essence of the message

that you're aiming to communicate to

them.

>> Bitcoin is is digital empowerment,

digital capital. We're living through

the digital transformation

of assets, and this is just as profound

transformation as digital intelligence.

The real profound breakthrough of

Bitcoin is this idea

that you can take economic energy,

convert to digital form, and tightly

bind it to the person, the family, the

company,

or the country. We can talk about how we

all hate countries, but you know, the

history of the world is all the weak

countries getting smashed by all the big

countries. So, if what you're interested

in in is empowerment and fairness and

equity for the small company, the small

family, the small person, the small

country, the weak,

how do you do it? Well, you basically

encrypt the money, put it in cyberspace,

protect it with a private key. So, like

now you can actually own something and

someone more powerful than you can't

take it away from you.

>> There's two types two types of money

there in front of you. There's dollar

bills, and then I've got a couple of

Bitcoin on the table. What do you mean

they can't take Bitcoin from you?

>> Okay, so this is a stack of currency.

You walk through an airport on this,

they ask you if you have cash. If you

do, they

Cash in a in a physical form is a

problem. So, what do you do? You put it

in the bank.

Well, the bank is is a counterparty. So,

the bank then decides whether you get to

keep it and whether you get it back. You

go to the bank and you ask for it back,

they might ask you why you asked for it

back. If you ask for that much back,

they file a form

with the Treasury Department. You know,

if you ask for too much money back too

soon, right, someone comes knocking on

your door. So, the challenge with this

this is fiat currency

and um you hold this at the pleasure of

the nation-state. I mean, not just your

nation-state. It's like every country on

Earth gets to decide whether you get to

spend this stuff, right? Which is

interesting and if you want to actually

transfer money to someone in another

country, you need the permission of your

bank, another bank, the central bank of

their country, the corresponding bank.

There might be seven different banks

that have to decide whether the money

gets from here to there. So, this is

permissioned money, you know, that's uh

managed by the state and with Bitcoin, I

can take a million dollars. I can

actually encrypt it in a chip in a

physical coin, the Cascascius coin,

and that's a million dollars. I slide it

across and it's literally a bearer

asset, you know, and so that's one

manifestation of it. But, you could also

put it into information form. I could

transfer this to you just in the form of

a private key that I wrote on a piece of

paper and I gave to you.

>> of letters you can give me.

>> Yeah, or I could send you a message. I

could send a text message. So, so, good

luck getting a million dollars of gold

from here to London if people don't want

you to move it, but I could move a

million dollars of Bitcoin from here to

anywhere in a few seconds. The idea was

I don't want to trust Apple or Google or

Morgan Bank or a central bank or a

government, right? And so, in the

extreme case,

you know, two people can meet in Africa

and I can trade you some Bitcoin for

your truck

and I don't need the permission of seven

banks and 16 governments and 32 other

bureaucrats

in order to buy that truck.

>> What is it that most people, the average

person, doesn't understand about the

nature of money as it sat in their bank,

as it relates to the debasement of it or

the sort of inflation of it. Because

most people think if they've got, you

know, $10,000 in their bank and they

keep it there, and maybe getting

interest on it at 4% a year, they're

going to be good.

>> So, this is about $10,000, I guess. Um

1 acre of land in Miami Beach on the

water cost $10,000 about 100 years ago.

I know this cuz I have a house on the

water and I have the the deed of sale,

and it was about on 2 acres and it was

$20,000. The entire house cost $100,000.

And uh it's about $20,000 worth of land.

Today, uh 1 acre of land on this the

same acre

on the water

$10 million?

Maybe $20 million. So, you know

what happened here, right? It's the same

dollar. It works out to be a thousand X

increase in price. So, when land goes

from $10,000 to $10 million, that means

that the currency, the dollar, the money

lost about 7% of its economic value

every year for 100 years running.

If you lose 7% a year

you know, then you get cut in half,

right? 10 times.

Right? So, what do most people not know

about about money? What they don't

realize is that the best currency,

money, my money being a medium of

exchange, unit of account, store of

value, the dollar, the best in the 20th

century and the 21st century, the US

dollar

lost 7% of its value every year going

for 100 years. That's the best it's ever

going to get.

It's not that good for everybody else.

If you go to most other countries, they

lose 14% of their value, and so they

collapse in about 30 years. So

what you have is a situation where if

you store your wealth and currency and

and the money of the society, the

question really is just are you going to

lose most of your money within 10 years?

That's the weak currencies in in Africa.

For example, most currencies in Africa

you couldn't hold you your wealth even

for 10 years, maybe 5 years.

Or are you going to lose all your money

in 30 years? Hyperinflation happened in

Brazil, happened in Argentina, you know,

that's Mexico, that's most places, and

that's the status quo. The average fiat

currency, you know, collapses in about

29 years, I think.

And then the best is if you happen to be

a citizen of the greatest nation in the

world and you win all the wars, you're

just going to lose all your money in

you know, half-life is 35 years. You're

going to lose your money over the course

of 100 years.

>> So, should I buy a house?

>> So, you get to the next interesting

point which is that $100,000 in 19, uh,

26

in Miami Beach

today would be worth $100,000, that

house,

50 to 100 million dollars.

So, the house is better, right? In fact,

if you're trying to preserve your

wealth, you have to acquire scarce

desirable property.

So, your choice is do I buy real estate?

Do I residential real estate? Do I buy

commercial real estate? Do I buy a

private company? Do I buy a public

company? Like stocks? Do I buy

collectibles?

So, let me tell you why you shouldn't

buy a house.

Because, uh, there's a 2% property tax

on houses in in Florida, which means

that if you buy a house, you pay 2% of

the value every year.

2%, you know, means that every 36 years

you actually pay the cost of the house

in tax to the government. Not a very

good store of value because, uh, you're

taking on a massive tax load

and you're taking on a maintenance load.

But having said it, it's still a better

deal than just holding cash in a bank or

holding cash in a safe. You know,

commercial real estate looks a bit

better, right? Because with commercial

real estate, you can offset the tax, the

insurance, and the maintenance cost with

rents.

So, what really works out with

commercial real estate most of the time

is you buy a million dollars commercial

real estate, you have a bunch of fees,

you charge rent. The rent offsets the

maintenance cost. You don't really make

any money on the rent, but the

underlying million dollars appreciates

7% a year every year. And so, you

actually can build wealth

with commercial real estate if you can

just cover the maintenance expenses.

>> Most people are are told that the way to

build wealth when they leave university

and they get into the working world is

to buy a house. So, most people that's

what most most people do. They They get

a job, a 9:00 to 5:00, they take the

money they get from that, they go and

get a mortgage, they buy a house, and

they move in. That's kind of what we're

all told implicitly. Is that a good

strategy to build and become wealthy in

your view?

>> The only way that it's a good strategy

is

you're buying the house in a

jurisdiction where the property taxes

are manageable. Then yeah, you can you

can generate some wealth. But if I flip

that and you end up taking a 7% mortgage

and you get massive tax and massive

insurance expenses,

then that same investment, you know,

works out the other way and it it

crushes you to death. So,

a better idea generally is commercial

real estate if you're if you actually

have the, you know, the business acumen

to to get into commercial real estate

business cuz you can pass all the

expenses through to your tenants.

These things are all hard, right? Real

estate business is hard, starting your

own company is hard. Investing in other

companies is hard. The conventional

thing, the safe thing is I just put all

my money in a money market and I get

paid 3% and then after tax I've got 1.5%

and the currency is losing 7% of its

value a year and you're just losing 5 or

6% of your wealth every year for your

life. So

that's why Bitcoin is such a compelling

thing. That's why people that believe in

Bitcoin are passionate about it because

the average person shouldn't have to be

a real estate expert. They shouldn't

have to be a tax expert. They shouldn't

have to be capable of launching their

own restaurant or bar or bakery. You

shouldn't have to be a stock picker. Why

shouldn't the typical person just be

able to take their money, put it into an

asset which appreciates in value 15% a

year and they don't have to worry about

it?

>> What about the S&P 500? They can just

put it into the stock market, right?

>> Yeah, John Bogle's real contribution and

the success of the S&P 500 is this idea

that

currency is not a store of value.

Real estate is illiquid and scary and

difficult and inefficient and high

maintenance. So what is the liquid

capital asset that it can I can buy and

it turns out to be like SPY. It's just

the S&P 500 in the form of an ETF. So

that has returned 15% over the past 6

years.

Over 100 years?

Maybe 10%? Something like that?

>> Every year?

>> And if the US dollar is losing 7% of its

value in scarce desirable terms over the

course of 100 years and you're getting

10%

you're getting a 2 or 3% boost and

in return for accepting the volatility

of being invested in the stock market,

but it's not a bad idea, right? If you

want the conventional best idea to

preserve your wealth without taking on

individual, you know, corporate risk and

individual real estate risk, I just buy

the S&P index and wait.

>> What about this?

This is gold.

>> Yep.

>> Why not just put all of my money into

gold?

>> It's not an awful idea to buy gold. Gold

is up, um,

12% a year

for the past 6 years. So, whereas the

S&P's up 15, gold's up 12, the NASDAQ's

up 18.

Bitcoin is up 33.

Okay, so,

generally, if you look at the world and

you say, "Where do you want to save your

money?" You want to buy a capital asset.

Gold's a winner, S&P's a winner,

diversified tech stocks are a winner.

Bitcoin is a winner. Now, you're going

to say to me,

"Well, so then, well, why Bitcoin?"

Well, the answer is, if you're living in

Turkey, if you're living in Argentina,

if you're living in Brazil before the

currency collapses, or Mexico, or

Venezuela, or any country in Africa, you

don't get gold, you don't get the S&P,

you don't get QQQ. You can't buy

diversified real estate in the US. Those

options I named are a Western world

conventional capital assets. So,

the big mistake,

don't invest in non-capital assets.

Don't put all your family's money in

soybeans, you know? Don't buy barrels of

crude oil, don't buy cotton, don't

invest in things that a factory or a

robot or an AI can generate infinite of.

You buy things that the robots and the

AIs and the big factories cannot pump

out by the million gallons. And so, what

is that? It is maybe an ounce of gold,

it is a share in the 500 most desirable

companies in the world, it is one out of

21 million Bitcoin. All of those things

are things that the robots are not going

to create infinite of. Those are capital

assets. Which capital asset

is a function of where you live

and what your mindset is. If you're

living in a war zone,

my advice is Bitcoin because you're not

carrying this through a checkpoint,

right? Like, you know, if if you need to

go through an airport, you want

something that you get to keep and take

with you.

>> You talked about the robots there.

>> Yeah.

>> And uh when we say the robots, I think

we mean both the the surgeon robotics

we're seeing, but also artificial

intelligence that's going to empower

them to be very, very intelligent.

>> Yeah.

>> How has this changed your thesis in how

you view the future? Cuz it's it's a

profound surprise, I think to all of us

that artificial intelligence is

accelerating at the rate we're seeing.

>> Technology fails until it succeeds. When

I was at MIT, people were trying to

make, uh you know, speech recognition

work. It just didn't work. For a

thousand years, people wanted to fly and

it didn't work. And in 1902, the New

York Times declared that every learned

scientist knows that you'll never be

able to fly. And then in 1903, we fly.

In 2023, you know, the AI started

working. You can see what's happening.

We've affected the digital

transformation of intelligence.

Cars are going to drive themselves.

It's pretty clear that anything that

takes massive human labor, you know,

whether it's lawyering, writing a

contract, or composing a poem, or

composing a script, or composing

It's like, you want a book?

Tell the AI what kind of book you want.

Here's my 10, you know, I want this. I

want it to be set in London. I want this

protagonist. Can you make it like that?

Put some more violence in it.

Uh you know, Voltaire, right, was

impressive because he created, you know,

this much literature. And and when he

did it, it came out of the mind of one

man, and that was quite amazing.

And you know, I think we're always going

to admire the people that did it first.

Right? But, you know,

the AIs will think for us.

You know, put the AI into the robot.

We're not that far, right? Like when I

sit when I sit and I talk to my voice

assistant, whether it's Chad or whether

it's Grok, and it's it's like she knows

everything, and she keeps getting

smarter.

You know, you know, every single week

she gets smarter, and it's like what

happens when they go into a robot? It's

like

Well, you can you pretty much can

imagine

a billion robots, and maybe we'll pay

200 bucks a month for a robot, and the

robot will just pretty much do

everything.

And so, the question is do you want

someone to do everything, to cook, to

clean, you know, to take out the trash?

Would you like a self-driving car? Of

course, you do. We're on the verge of

these perfect products, right? That

like we'll get to the point where we're

like I I I I

You used to actually have an oven that

burned things?

Like what?

What what it was stupid? Yeah, it was

too stupid to know it was going to burn

the

Huh? Why don't you just put intelligence

into the appliance, right? What why

would you ever have an unintelligent

appliance, right? At this point, when it

gets exponentially cheaper. We used to

get in traffic accidents.

Right? Like like the big reveal, right?

The big the big inversions when people

realize that the self-driving cars are

safer than the person-driven cars,

right?

It's like you used to make mistakes.

You know, the irony, of course, is now

when you send a message to someone, if

you want to prove that it came from you,

you have to actually put errors in it.

Right? It's like if you put errors in

it, I believe you typed it. You know,

the AI can draft the thing as though it

had a PhD in English, and it had 20

years experience as a copy editor. And

so, we're reaching this point where

lack of of effectiveness is just

laziness, right? Like, if you wrote

something which wasn't perfect,

it's cuz you're lazy, not because you're

not perfect. I mean, the AIs create

perfect documents. They do perfect

research.

The robots will do any amount of work.

And I I think Elon makes this point,

which is we're about to trip over an age

of abundance.

>> Do you believe that's true?

What What does that say about Bitcoin?

Because I'm looking at some of the

quotes here that Elon said about the age

of abundance. And he says, "In the

future, where anyone can have anything,

you no longer need money as a database

for labor allocation. If AI and robotics

are big enough to satisfy all human

needs, then the relevance of money

declines rapidly. I'm not sure we will

have it. If you are stranded on a desert

island with a trillion dollars, it will

be pointless because there is no labor

to allocate. In a benign scenario, we

will have universal high income. Much as

universal basic income mean anyone can

have any products or any services that

they want. Universal high income via

checks issued by federal governments is

the best way to deal with unemployment

caused by AI/robotics.

Because AI and [snorts] robotics will

produce goods and services far in excess

of the increase in money supply, so

there will be no inflation. Work will

become optional, kind of like playing

sports or a video game. You can go to

the store and buy vegetables, or you can

go and grow them in your backyard

because you like growing them.

That's what work will be like. AI and

robotics are going to make so much stuff

and provide so many services that they

will actually run out of things to do

for the humans. Money is fundamentally

information. The true constraints of the

future won't be financial. They'll be

energy and mass.

>> He's half right. I agree with with part

of what he says. That is, consumer

goods, consumables, utilitarian goods uh

will become abundant. But, there are

always going to be scarce desirable

goods that will not become abundant. And

I think he overstates the case. Money

will still be valuable, wealth will

still be valuable. But, I'll give you an

example.

Henry VIII didn't have clean water.

Did not have heat, did not have cooling.

These things the King of England did not

have. And technology gave all these

things to the middle class.

And so, if you live in the middle class

today, you know, you can have your

appendix out, you know. But, Henry VIII

didn't have dental crowns, he didn't

have x-rays. So, you get modern medical

care, you know, the infant mortality

rate has plunged. Life is safer, clean

water, clean air, right?

Clean food. And technology gave them to

us. We stamp out infinite Coca-Cola,

infinite Hershey's bars, ice cream,

right? Running water.

Right? Electricity. So, all of those

things have been given to the middle

class, the working class in the

developed world. Right? Not everywhere,

but let's say in the developed world.

But, everybody doesn't get a Hampton's

house, everybody doesn't get their own

private jet, they don't get their own

private yacht. So, what happened with

the explosion of affluence?

Massive utilitarian entitlement, lots of

cars. But, you know, okay, so everybody

gets a car, but how many people get a

Porsche? What happens with humanity is

we always invent the luxury car.

We come up with the trophy asset. And

And again,

>> But, but most people don't actually want

that. They want to be able to like feed

their family and not have to worry about

the bills. So, all of those people,

you're saying that those people are

going to be They're going to be good.

They're not going to have to work.

>> I'm saying that if if your aspiration is

a good life,

if you want infinite food, infinite

energy, infinite education, infinite

entertainment,

right? You're probably going to get it.

My point is, in theory, right, why does

money matter today?

Cuz everybody, you know, has electricity

and water. Because people want to buy

something more than water. By the way,

water is the proletarian drink.

>> What does that mean?

>> It means that if you go to a restaurant

and you don't and you can't afford

anything else, you ask for a cup of

water,

right?

>> [clears throat]

>> And then if you have some more money,

you get yourself a Coca-Cola or a soft

drink, and that costs five bucks. But if

you have more money, you buy yourself a

vodka. And then when you have more

money, you want to buy yourself the

specialty high-end tequila. And and

eventually people find a way to spend

$38 on a drink.

And uh, you know, in New York City, you

know, you can see that everywhere. Why

do we go to restaurants and pay $300

to eat at a restaurant? Because you can

actually feed yourself on three bucks a

day. And the answer is,

there's always going to be a hierarchy

of affluence, and people are going to

find things to aspire to that will be

more than

the utilitarian mean that everybody

gets. If I give you a universal health

care, people want private health care.

If I give everybody a house, someone's

going to want a house twice as big.

Everybody's always going to have a

reason to want something more, you

>> Because we're status orientated animals.

>> That's the cynical way to look at it,

but the other way to look at it is, I

wanted to be sitting on a mountain peak

skiing, but not that mountain peak,

because the snow's not good on that

mountain peak this week.

>> And it's too busy on this one.

>> Yeah, and that one was too crowded.

You know, it's like there's always going

to be

some exclusivity, you know, there's

going to be a quest. So I I think that

money's not going away. I think it's

pretty obvious if you look around you

that that Uh, people still need money.

It is true

that the basic needs in life, basic

transportation, basic energy, basic

health care, all of those things can be

manufactured in quantity and they'll get

progressively cheaper. We'll call them

consumer goods.

>> If this uh knowledge work does become

I guess taken by the robots and the AIs,

there's some people say there's going to

be new jobs created and everyone will be

fine. But it's not clear to me that

there will be enough new jobs created in

a period of time um to satisfy the

demand of people to have something to do

professionally.

>> It used to be everybody was a farmer,

right? And then all of a sudden in

America we have new jobs like called

accountants and lawyers and film

producers. You're a podcaster. Your job

didn't exist 20 years ago. It did you

know, the job description did not exist,

the business did not exist. There's a

lot of things that exist today. Yeah. I

There are people that make a living

putting on makeup and clothes and

posting on Instagram and that was not a

job that existed 30 years ago.

So, there'll be a lot of new jobs.

There'll be dislocation. There's going

to be political unrest. What do I think?

I think this is the best argument in

favor of encouraging a free market and

allowing uh liberal

uh unregulated

businesses to prosper because

if you have a progressive society and by

the way, the United States is sort of

more progressive.

>> Define progressive in this context.

>> You're allowed to start a business.

You're allowed to sell product.

It's not illegal

to

to create a podcast.

By the way, you you can't do what you're

doing in Cuba.

>> Yeah.

>> Right? In North Korea you couldn't do

it.

>> I read something crazy last night about

driving autonomous cars. It said lawyers

are trying to stop block EVs because

these particular lawyers make a lot of

money from litigating car accidents.

>> We wouldn't want people to not crash.

>> Yeah.

>> Like Yeah, so the point is there all

sorts of laws in restraint of trade.

Like you can't have an Airbnb. In the

face of modern technology, if you have

modern technology is creating

dislocation, if your goal is to

embrace the technology,

create maximum productivity,

and then minimize the disruption and the

inflammation,

then the more degrees of freedom you

offer,

the less pain there'll be because in a

more free society, you're going to have

10,000 new kinds of businesses pop up or

100,000 new business opportunities that

no one conceptualized. And they'll be

threatening to the status quo, but

they'll be rational and they'll create

value, and then they will create gainful

employment, and they'll create wealth

for all the people that are displaced

right by by the technology.

>> Steve, what you doing?

>> Uh just making myself a delicious

coffee.

>> From the freezer?

>> From the freezer. You not heard about

Cometeer?

>> No.

>> Oh my gosh. This is going to change your

life.

Couple of months ago, the founder of

this business called Matt sent a big

shipment of this coffee to our office in

London. What most people don't know is

that the processing of coffee takes out

a lot of the taste. So what they do is

they flash freeze it at the optimal

moment when it's most tasty. And they

send you in the post the coffee in these

little frozen ice cubes. Now Matt sent a

big shipment to my office. I moved it to

the kitchen. I said to the team, knock

yourselves out. And then I saw so many

messages in our Slack channel of people

going, "Oh my god, what the hell is

that? It's so delicious." All I have to

do is pop it out in the morning using

the little button on the back of this

thing. I pour my hot water in, and I mix

it,

and that is done. You can get $30 off

your first order of Cometeer Coffee if

you go to cometeer.com/steven.

Try it and please Instagram DM me,

LinkedIn me, and let me know if you love

it as much as I do.

One of the things you've heard me talk

about quite a lot over the last couple

of years, and this is something that's

true in business and content, but also

with everything in life, is that

consistency is the thing that really,

really compounds. The same is true in

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happen, leads go cold that shouldn't

have. And when this happens, a lot of

leaders look at it and think they have a

people problem. When actually, it's a

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You know, earlier you were talking about

how you can get AI to write a book. I

was thinking as you were saying it, the

interesting thing is, I now ask my AI

um what book I need to read.

And to make that book for me, versus

being prescriptive to it and because it

has what it this huge memory on me. It

knows what I'm I'm dealing with. It

knows the businesses I'm building, the

problems I have. And so, I just say,

"What What do I What's the question I

should be asking you? Or what should

book should I be reading?" And then,

"Can you make that book for me? Make it

20 pages. I like it in this particular

style cuz it's my favorite style of

author. And then I I want to download it

as an MP3 file and listen to it on my

way to work. I have 43 minutes.

Could you say what should What's the

question I should be asking you?

>> Yeah, you're you're using You're using

that as an example, but at the end of

the day, you have to govern the state

space. For example, anybody could say

what question should I ask, but the real

issue is what's the What are the input

constraints? If you're a baker in

Nigeria

in Lagos.

>> Okay, yeah.

>> Right? There's a certain set of

conditions that are different than if

you happen to be a fireman in Los

Angeles.

>> Yeah.

>> Right? And so

what's the state space that you're

exploring in order to create a

contribution?

And I'll give you an example like um

I used AI. I used AI to make $15 billion

last year.

>> Is that a true story?

>> This is true.

>> Okay.

>> You did?

>> I did. Yeah.

And I used an AI to make $15 billion in

a way that no one would ever conceive

that you could make $15 billion.

>> This is a true story?

>> Okay. Yeah, let let's let's go back to

me in 2025.

We have a company that has billions of

dollars of Bitcoin. Uh $30 billion of

Bitcoin. We want to actually raise

capital to buy more Bitcoin. We maxed

out the equity markets. Uh we became the

largest issuer of convertible bonds in

the in the world. And we maxed out the

convertible bond market. And And uh that

was our journey in the first 5 years of

our Bitcoin.

>> To simplify this for Jenny Davis, you

borrowed as much money as you could from

traditional means.

>> Yes.

>> Okay.

>> Yeah.

>> To buy Bitcoin.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah.

>> By the beginning of 2025, we had issued

as many convertible bonds as you could

issue. We were the largest issuer in the

world. And it wasn't scalable. So, we

needed to invent a new type of security,

a new type of credit instrument that we

could use to borrow money to buy more

Bitcoin.

So,

we went to the AI. I went to the AI and

I started exploring how do I design a

preferred stock.

And so I said, I think I want to create

a security that's not a common equity

and I don't want it to be a bond. I want

it to be some hybrid in the middle. A

preferred stock, you know, for the

layman, it's it's just a security that

could be anything. You can give it any

terms. I can sell you a preferred stock

and give you the right to put it back to

me in 12 months and it looks like that.

I can give you a guaranteed coupon on

it. I can give you conversion rights and

and make it look like equity. So, we

used AI to design a convertible

preferred stock called STRK. When we did

it, no one had ever created a preferred

stock that was backed by Bitcoin before

and and we'd never issued it and so it

was kind of a combination of financial

engineering and digital asset

engineering and legal work and

securities law.

So, we built it and

and, you know, when we asked the lawyers

and the bankers, they're like, well, no

one's ever done it before.

Okay. And and you know, their their

their answer, by the way, is no one's

ever done it before and people don't do

that. So, we don't think you should do

that.

And we're like, well, everything else

that people have done we've maxed out

and so we're kind of at the point where

our growth is going to stop unless we

find a way out of the box. So, we're

going to have to do something no one's

ever done before using

new technology, right? We're using

digital capital. We're using uh

digital intelligence and we're using a

digital treasury company. So, three new

forms of something in order to create

value.

And after we'd done three of them, we

decided what we wanted to do was create

a short duration credit instrument, one

that would be would trade stably around

$100, around par.

And we're trying to figure out how do

you get a preferred stock to trade at at

a stable level? It's what what you would

call technically short duration credit,

but it's like we're trying to create a

money market type instrument where

people can buy it at 100, sell it at

100, collect the yield, and not worry

about it trading up and down or being

sensitive to interest rates.

Well, if you do that, you have to vary

in order to get it to trade stable, if

you want the price to be stable, you

have to change the dividend rate.

And so, we created an instrument

that where we could change the dividend

rate every month. Now, had anybody ever

done it? No. In the history of the

world, no one ever created a variable

dividend rate preferred stock.

Is it illegal? No.

Why has no one ever done it? No one ever

had a reason to do it. They never

thought to do it.

The lawyers, the bankers, the

conventional investors, they're like,

"Well, we've never seen it done before.

We're not sure you can do it."

We go to the AI, we said, "Well, can we

do it?" They're like, "Of course you can

do it. Just do this, this, and this, and

this, and it Well, they said they don't

like that. Well, just do this, this,

this."

>> Which AI?

>> Chat GPT.

Open AI.

>> So, Chat GPT made you $15 billion?

>> Yeah, because the short of it is, we

brought our IPO to market, it became a

$2.5 billion IPO, the biggest IPO of the

year to date.

And then, we put a shelf registration on

it, we sold another $8 billion of it.

So, we sold 10 and 1/2 billion dollars

of that instrument, plus 4 billion of

the other instrument. So, we basically

sold $15 billion of credit, which kind

of equates to the company making about

$15 billion.

>> I'm thinking about what this means

generally for the average person

listening.

>> Yeah.

>> Because everyone's like searching for

business ideas.

>> Right.

>> New ideas. And you're telling me that

you you can use AI now to come up with

novel business ideas and solutions that

are outside of the box and that would

generate value for people. Um you though

there is it's almost like hearing that

there's an arbitrage opportunity with

this intelligence.

Now, I was reading something the other

day that said only 2% of households have

a Chat GPT or AI subscription still.

So, do you think there is an an an

arbitrage there for people who go to AI

now and and can build business ideas

from it?

>> If If you're an entrepreneur, right? If

you If you aspire to create a business

or create something of value, then it's

the no-brainer is you definitely should

pick one or more of these AIs and maybe

you want to become adept using multiple.

They're They're just different tools.

It's It's kind of like saying you got to

learn how to use a computer and you got

to learn how to read reading, writing,

arithmetic, right? Just basics.

And then

once you've done that, you you do need

to have some domain expertise in

something, right? The question is

what are you going to do, right? You

either want to create

a new product or you want to create a

new service

or you want to radically transform an

existing product or service using AI to

be much cheaper, much better.

But to my mind, you know, I would try to

create something magical.

Like for example can you create

something that does everybody's

accounting, does you know, does the work

of a million accountants and sell it for

10 bucks a month?

Right?

>> If you're 18 now, if your kids came to

you and said, "Dad, what should I

go and study at university? And what

shouldn't I study at university?

Would your answer be different now as we

stand on the foothills of this new

technology?"

>> You want to study the new thing, right?

You want to learn the new thing. And so,

if you look at the history of of

science, the real question is, what's on

the S-curve?

>> On the S-curve?

>> The whole theory of the S-curve is for a

thousand years we try to fly.

And infinite energy makes no progress.

You cannot fly. And then in 1903

all of a sudden we can sort of fly.

And in 66 years we go from flying 20

miles an hour to flying 300 miles an

hour. First a fighter jet, then a

passenger jet, then we have like rockets

that are unmanned. Then we have manned

rockets. And then we have rockets to go

to orbit. Then we have rockets to go to

the moon. And so that's an example of an

S curve. But then you know what happens.

In the mid 70s, we designed the 737, the

747.

And we hit a wall. You know, and 737 is

still the primary airplane for the next

50 years.

And if you look at the efficiency of an

airplane from 1975

uh to the year 2025, over 50 years,

the modern airplanes are 15% more

efficient.

Like So, what you got was a diminishing

return. And when you're on the S curve,

things are doubling every 3 years.

You're doubling, you're doubling, you're

doubling. You're exponential growth.

And then you hit diminishing returns.

And then you stagnate. And then you

stop. And then things are just not

getting any better. So,

>> Let's show an S curve on the screen. And

also

uh the the new S curve coming in below

it.

>> Like when I was at MIT, you know,

everybody basically flocked to uh

electrical engineering and computer

science. Because that was the cool

thing. And so, the mistake to make when

you go to school is

you get at the end of the S curve. You

basically start studying something that

has hit diminishing returns. And once

you hit that diminishing return,

no material progress may take place for

100 years. It might be that you just

can't break through. Propulsion

technology is the limiting factor. Like

why don't we have planes that will fly,

you know, supersonic, you know, on um

you know, a tank of gas that's that's

this much, right? Or fusion drives.

Well, cuz we don't. Now, on the other

hand,

semiconductors

uh started exploding. And semi And

semiconductor technology has continued

to advance. We haven't hit

that limit yet. And that's that's why so

many profound breakthroughs were made in

computer science over the past 50 years.

>> This is kind of hit a nice curve, hasn't

it? As a form factor, my iPhone here.

You know, that over since the iPhone, as

you said, since the iPhone like 6,

it hasn't really gotten thinner, but uh

the battery hasn't really taken a leap

forward as such. So, we're now looking

for another form factor to interface

with computers.

>> Yeah, you know, the iPhone 1 didn't have

cut and paste.

And we didn't get cut and paste till the

version 3.

And so, there was a rapid improvement

versions 1 through 6 or 1 through 7,

call it.

And at that point, you start hitting

diminishing returns. And if you were to

do some utility function, and you were

to score on a scale of 1 to 100, you

would have gone from like 5 to 70 in a

hurry, and then you would have gone from

70 to 90 over the next few iterations,

and then that you're 91, 92.

You hit that limit, and I if if you are

starting a company, right? You don't

create another iPhone.

Right? The [clears throat] real question

right now

is uh

can I create smart glasses where I have

something that's like my Maui Jim

sunglasses, I put them on, they weigh

nothing, and they have the camera, and

they see what I see, and they hear what

I hear, and they know where I am,

and plug that into AI, and in that

point, I can just say, "Hey, Eve, what

is that?"

You know, "Where am I? And tell me about

that." And and it's like

"Why do I have to type anymore?"

>> When I met Mark Zuckerberg, he showed me

the the device that's on the way from

Meta. This is not secret, cuz I know

they've talked about it publicly. Which

is just a it was just a plain wrist

strap with no screen on it.

But it linked to the glasses.

And in the glasses, when I looked

around, I could see all of my screens

and everything like that. And I And if I

just because of this wrist strap, if I

just click, it clicks on all the stuff.

So, I was just like, "Hey, with this

little wrist strap. The wrist strap

again was just like a cotton bracelet,

very thin cotton bracelet. And as I just

looked around, I could click on

everything and open things and call

people and send texts and go on YouTube,

etc. And it was just up here in my

peripheral. You imagine again, imagine

that on an S curve. At some point it's

going to be a some sort of like almost

like contact lens type thing

that's that I can just

>> By the way, this is why you should study

fantasy, right? Because they have this,

right? In magic worlds, right? This is

like

you know, like I just wear my talisman.

You know, I have a necklace. What does

it do? Oh, it makes me omniscient, all

powerful, immortal, indestructible. I

live forever. What what what do you have

to do to make the product work? Nothing.

I'm wearing the wristband and I walk and

every door opens to me and stuff

happens. And here's where Elon gets it

right. It's like the number one

engineering mistake is engineers want to

optimize the part that shouldn't exist.

Like make the parts go away, right? We

start on the topic of what should you

study,

right? It's It's study technologies that

allow you to create magic things that

your parents could never

If your parents would say that's magic,

you're on the right track, right? So,

like how about What's better than the

wristband? Just like How about you just

like implant one pellet?

>> Neuralink.

>> Yeah. Maybe it's a Neuralink. Maybe it's

Maybe it's when I'm born, there's a

slight implant and now I I hear like I

can talk to the AI in cyberspace

forever.

>> But should you go study that because

conceivably the artificial intelligence

and the robots are going to be the ones

that create that technology. If they

have a PhD in everything and that's

accelerating.

>> Yeah, well, I guess we're back back to

the what should you study? You ought to

study digital intelligence or digital

assets. If you can generate,

you know, generate proteins, generate

generate any kind of

life form or enzyme or protein or the

like, maybe it's interesting.

But I think with regard to AI,

you don't want to learn how to do things

that AI can do. What you want to do is

learn how to ask the AI to do something

that's never been done before. Like if I

were to go back to school, 95% of what I

learned, uh, probably wouldn't want to

study.

>> What about a surgeon? Do you think

you're going to be a surgeon?

>> No.

>> What about a a lawyer?

>> No.

>> Accountant?

>> No.

>> Driver?

>> No.

At some point, what you have to do is

ask

the AIs aren't really answering the

question yet, but you have but you have

to ask whatever is the marginal question

that hasn't been answered by the

civilization. Maybe I'll take it I'll

take that position, which is

the way you create value in the world is

you bring something into the world that

wasn't here before.

>> This is something that I've made for

you. I realized that the Diary of a CEO

audience are strivers, whether it's in

business or health, we all have big

goals that we want to accomplish. And

one of the things I've learned is that

when you aim at the big, big, big goal,

it can feel incredibly psychologically

uncomfortable because it's kind of like

being stood at the foot of Mount Everest

and looking upwards. The way to

accomplish your goals is by breaking

them down into tiny, small steps, and we

call this in our team the 1%. this

philosophy is highly responsible for

much of our success here. So, what we've

done so that you at home can accomplish

any big goal that you have, is we've

made these 1% diaries, and we released

these last year and they all sold out.

So, I asked my team over and over again

to bring the diaries back, but also to

introduce some new colors and to make

some minor tweaks to the diary. So, now

we have a better range for you. So, if

you have a big goal in mind, and you

need a framework and a process and some

motivation, then I highly recommend you

get one of these diaries before they all

sell out once again. And you can get

yours at the diary.com.

And if you want the link, the link is in

the description below.

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so much.

Beyond just buying Bitcoin, is there any

sort of actionable steps that the

working class should take right now to

pre- prepare for this robot transition

that you're talking about?

>> I mean, the actionable step is is

learn

>> Learn about the robots.

>> digital. Right?

>> Digital.

>> Like understand digital. For example,

how much content's available on YouTube

right now? Like

>> Infinite, right now.

>> Right? What can you get for free on

YouTube and what can you create of

value, right? If you're in the business

of content creation, my advice would be

study digital channels. As As like,

should I go and become a stage actor on

Broadway?

It's It's a It's a

a much smaller thing. Mr. Beast can get

100 million subscribers, you can get 20

million subscribers. You're not getting

20 million subscribers if you do the

thing that your parents' parents did.

So, I think that you want to look at

digital platforms. There's There's

digital communication like Acts or

Instagram, there's YouTube and

and the like, but there's also

There's also digital intelligence.

>> Let's just just test that first point a

bit. I guess a lot of content creators

are thinking at the moment now because

of these frontier models that can

produce video content, pictures. A kid

in Mumbai or Manhattan, where we are

now, can set up an agent while they're

asleep and say, "Listen, just post 100

videos while I'm asleep on this every

single platform.

I actually I'll make five agents and

I'll ask all of them to post 100 videos

each. So, you're going to have this you

have in terms of supply and demand,

presumably that's a supply shock.

There's this slop tsunami coming in. And

then if you look at demand of attention

online, it is arguably fixed. Financial

Times did a report said that young young

people are actually starting to come

down in terms of time spent online. Uh

slightly older generations are starting

from a lower base, but they're still

going up, but they're starting from a

lower base. So, you've got a tsunami

slop of supply and fixed demand.

I get this even this business feels a

little bit insecure. Actually, a lot of

the major podcasters are actually down

on YouTube. If I look at the top who I

would consider the sort of top five

podcasters in my niche, um every single

one of them is down at least 50% in the

last 20-ish uh 12 12 24 months.

>> Well, the solution is certainly not to

not pay attention, right? So, for

example, if you're in the business of

creating content right now, you would

ask the question, can I enhance the

content with AI?

Or can I better market or distribute the

content with AI?

>> What is the moat?

>> The moat's going to be the most talented

content cre- the person creating the

best stuff that everybody wants to see.

There are videos being created like,

here's a walk-through of a 16th century

warship.

And you know, I don't know if you've

seen a guy constructs the entire warship

from the keel and he creates the ribs

and he shows you the lower deck and the

ballast and he takes you through every

step and it's a three-dimensional uh

video animation.

Takes about an hour and it's absolutely

riveting. I have no reason to care about

16th century warships, but I can't take

my eyes off it because it's just so

fascinating to see him explain

everything.

>> Are you saying creativity is the moat

still?

Or understanding what humans want and

then delivering it it which I guess is

creativity.

>> Let's say the Led Zeppelin example. But

what what you see in human history

is

within 10 years of whenever there's a

new technology platform, there's some

geniuses. They push it to the limit and

they do 95% of everything that can be

done and it all happens within 10 years

and they live forever. So

why didn't anybody before Beethoven do

stuff with the piano? Well, the piano

comes out, some genius does stuff with

the piano, right? And between Beethoven

and Chopin and you know, and a a few

players, it's like it's not clear to me

if humans try for another 10,000 years,

they'll do

much better.

So with Led Zeppelin, you had electric

guitars and amplification and everything

kind of clicked late 60s.

Like the sound of the early 60s was not

quite there and then by 1971, 72, you

could do some amazing stuff. And if you

think about all the classic rock between

1970 and 1980,

you have human creativity pushing the

edge of the envelope in so many

directions and then you hit this

diminishing return. And then along comes

sampling, right? And then you get

Swedish House Mafia and Avicii and

that's new technology and then they push

it to the extreme.

And then along comes YouTube and Justin

Bieber comes out of nowhere, you know,

and Mr. Beast comes out of nowhere and

they push it to the extreme.

And what you see with every generation

is

I give you a new thing, whether it's a

piano or electric guitar or internet.

Think about Facebook and Mark Zuckerberg

and what he did at just about the point

when you could do that with the web and

then think about the early mobile apps,

you know, WhatsApp and the like and it's

like

what you want to do if you want to

create these incredible success things

is

you want to locate

the magic opportunity right at the right

point on the S curve where it just now

became commercially viable to do it and

is a zero to one moment and you want to

be there. You want to be the first

person

that applies that technology, right? To

this new idea. Like what did our company

do to to go from nothing to 60 billion

dollars or from 1 billion to 60 billion?

We were the first company to take

digital capital, Bitcoin,

and put it together with digital credit

and a digital treasury model. So, we

created a credit instrument, a security

that you could never created before. You

couldn't have made it 10 years ago. You

couldn't build it on top of anything

other than Bitcoin. So, we needed to get

to the point where we had 10 or 20

billion dollars of capital

and then we could create this thing that

was a multi-billion dollar thing and

that becomes resident and that window

is like 12 to 24 months. And you go

through that window and you create

something that might be a hundred

billion dollar thing because you go

through if you went through 36 months

early, you smack into a wall and you

fail. And if you wait,

like at this point, our company is 20

times bigger than the next biggest one,

50 times bigger than the company doing

something similar. Did we plan it? Not

at all.

We found some extraordinary cool thing.

We committed to it with all of our heart

and soul and we declared we were going

to make it work come hell or high water

and we got punched in the face a hundred

times and every single time we ran into

a problem,

we stopped, we recalibrated, we went a

different direction and the process of

creating something beautiful,

like the beautiful thing, like everyone

wants a bank account that pays 10%. So,

if you can figure out how to give people

this thing they want with a new

technology

that was impossible that did not exist 5

years or 3 years earlier.

Then you resonate in the society, right?

You would go viral. Like we were just

the first ones to get there. It

exploded. If you gave me a billion

dollars right now and said run a

marketing campaign, it wouldn't be as

effective. Like you couldn't buy the

success with a billion dollars of

marketing. You just have to that let's

up guys. They didn't spend a billion

dollars marketing. You got to be in the

right place, the right time,

and you have to have the courage

to offer people the new thing.

>> I have been thinking a lot about this.

This idea of you said, you know, if you

spend a billion dollars you couldn't go

as viral as that. And if someone came

along and spent a ton of money today,

they couldn't go as big as

let's say Michael Jackson.

When we go back through history, I was

thinking about this this idea because I

watched the Michael Jackson documentary

recently and he was

at a level of fame that is I don't think

we've ever seen since. And I think part

of the reason why it was because there

was a constraint on the distribution

channels back then. So in my house,

there was 20 albums over there, books of

albums, and Michael Jackson was like

three of them. And then the other way

that we could consume was the TV over

there and there was like six channels

and MTV was one of them and it was

Michael Jackson all day.

>> [snorts]

>> In the world we live in now where

there's my phone experience is a

completely different phone experience to

yours because of AI. AI is learning what

I like and showing me my own little

version of the world. I wonder [snorts]

if it's possible to be

as big as a

Michael Jackson once was for anybody

these days. And actually I even with the

YouTube you mentioned earlier, I wonder

now if fame or cool being a content

creator or a musician once looked like

this

this sort of like high ceiling and then

you're known for a hundred years like

Michael Jackson.

And now with algorithms that are

personalized, does it now look like

this?

Shorter and shallower.

>> Is it possible to get big? You could

say, well, I can't get as big as Michael

Jackson, but on the other hand, Elon

Musk got big.

Right? Like Like there are things that

get big, right? Companies get big.

OpenAI went from nothing to how many

users in just a few months.

So I I think what you could say is going

viral is about hitting a resonating

frequency in the civilization, whether

it's an artistic frequency or it's a

political frequency, or it's a it's a

technical frequency. Yeah, there are

some things

where there's going to be a glut.

There's going to be Well, let's take

Instagram, right? It's like

on one hand, a billion people have like

bad photos posted online, but on the

other hand, there are people that

managed to get, you know, 8 million

followers, and they, you know, are the

Kard- Kardashians, you know? You have

these people that get massively big, and

that's the other side of the equation.

So

I don't really know how it all plays out

except for the fact that it seems clear

that there is room for human creativity

and innovation.

And if your goal is to make a

contribution,

right? If you're at the If you're in

your working years where you want to

upgrade the world and make a difference

and be remembered for something,

then a a pretty simple principle is

don't keep doing the same thing over and

over, working harder and harder every

year, fighting against the modern

automation,

you know, epidemic, right? Don't try to

outwork the robots. It's like you're

you're lamenting, you know,

how difficult it is for a content

creator, but let me remind you that it

used to be you would go be a college

professor and teach 200 students a year

for 20 years and you would feel that

your life contribution was 4,000

people's whose minds you touched.

And now you get 4,000 people a second.

Okay? So, you're charging yourself

against,

you know, the next thing, but if you

look back in time, technology has given

us the ability to amplify

our intellect and amplify

our creativity

in a way that is

unprecedented in human history.

>> Yeah, I think I think in part it's I'm

wondering now if we're kind of

we technology said, "Okay, you can reach

more people." TV, radio, all these

things. And actually now with

intelligence, it's saying, "Ooh, we can

figure out exactly what Michael wants."

So, we're starting to live in these

smaller echo chambers where your

creative idea or your creative piece of

content reaching lots of people is going

to become harder because the algorithms

are now in the way and they're deciding

who sees what.

And they're optimizing for

the the I guess the platform, the the

platform's monetary desire. The other

thing that I think is really interesting

and I've been mulling for the last

couple of months is that that which is

really really hard and scarce and

actually you could say something being

hard and scarce are are the are the same

cuz to create something scarce is also

hard, like you did with that financial

instrument. Very few people on Earth

could have created that. We don't run

public companies, we don't have the

information, etc. Or even that YouTuber

you mentioned who walks you through

those

the 1600s or whatever. That is very hard

to do. I theorize that actually pursuing

that which is hard and scarce Getting

you to come here today is not easy. So,

that's kind of my moat. Michelle Obama

coming and sitting down with me here is

still kind of my moat. Um is is is what

we should aim at.

What do you think of that as a theory?

>> I agree. Let's say you have a business,

whatever your business is,

right now the right thing to do is to

spend an intense time with the AI

considering what are all the ways you

can upgrade and improve the product or

the service you create, right?

Uh, for example, like the it used to be

you do this in English and the issue is,

well, what if What about Japanese or

Chinese or French or whatever? And, you

know, the hard way is you learn 20

languages and, you know, but then how

does your guest How do we translate it

or you hire, you know, we used to spend

money to hire translators, but now

you could have the AI translate this

into a hundred languages, right? Now,

the question is should you

or not? Can I enhance it?

Right? It's interesting when someone

describes something, but you're like,

let's just put up a chart of the S curve

there. And then the next step is can I

market it better or distribute it

better? And the next step is

am I creating something that'll be

valuable in a decade? Well, will it be

valuable in a hundred years?

>> Well, this is probably a good time to

mention this. 24 months ago we started

exactly that, which is

>> They're all aliens, you just never see

them.

Arabic

>> Tell me.

>> Yeah, and and ask yourself how many

people that do podcast interviews offer

that level of quality of content? And

>> I can see that

>> I think that you're I think you're

outstripping like I don't know that

anybody else has done it that well.

Right?

>> We started almost three years ago and

for the first 24 months it was a tragic

failure. So, you had the data scientists

in the corner of our office failing for

24 months. And then about 12 months ago

for the first time ever we saw that the

translation technology underneath us had

improved and that we could get the view

duration in Spanish to be higher

[snorts]

than English.

>> And how many months do you think Jimmy

Page spent trying to master the electric

guitar?

More than 24 months?

>> a lot longer.

>> My advice to an entrepreneur is

you focus, you commit.

If you're successful in less than 4

years, you got lucky. It's pro- Yeah. If

it takes you 10 years, well, between 4

and 10 years is is very, very normal.

If you haven't had success by the

10-year point, you're probably not cut

out for the business. But, you know,

what you're doing is it's totally

logical. It's like, is AI going to

remake this industry? The first issue is

can you make the product better? And the

second question is what's it worth?

Right? Right? You can do that. Can you

get paid? You know? And by the way, even

if you didn't get paid,

I would argue that your audience have

limited attention span. It's like, I

don't have time to listen to every Lex

Fridman, every Joe Rogan, every Diary of

the CEO, and every one of the next 20.

And so, I'm going to become loyal. I'm

going to become a customer and a fan of

whoever serves me the best content. And

certainly, if I'm a native Portuguese

speaker

>> [snorts]

>> or a native Russian speaker, you all of

a sudden just leaped, right? To the top.

>> This gets to my point about hard and

scarce because

people in in Portugal maybe have never

heard Michael Saylor before in

Portuguese.

So, in terms of scarce, it's actually

the only interview now available that is

2 hours long of Michael Saylor talking

in Cantonese with Steven, you know?

And so, that the we then are competing.

We have That's kind of the moat then,

right?

>> And that that becomes a benefit to all

your guest. You're the distribution

channel for me

to send the message of digital capital,

digital empowerment to the world. And

then,

your guest become your moat. I think

that

with every single business, it's pretty

clear you have to ask the question, is

technology going to cannibalize my

business or disrupt it, and am I going

to be the one that embraces it and

evolves and grows with it, or am I going

to fight it? And then of course,

you're in a dialogue with the market.

For example, the great thing about what

you've done is if you've done it, you

can look and see how it runs and how and

whether YouTube actually expands your

reach, and then you can look at the

engagement and and figure out whether or

not you're able to monetize that,

whether you're able to

able to convert that, and then you tweak

it, right, and adjust, and you're

6 months or 12 months can be enough that

you have a lasting advantage forever,

right? If you're 12 months ahead of

everybody else,

>> and you're compounding in

>> Yeah, it compounds over time, and then

maybe they never catch you. Like it's

That's you know, but that's the story of

every business.

Right, that's the that's the story of

Ford Motor Company and Standard Oil,

that's the story of Microsoft, it's the

story of Facebook, it's everybody's

story, which is

you just have to focus, commit, and then

if you're good enough,

invariably what happens is is your

customers

will make you the winner.

The world needs someone to do what you

do.

Like someone had to has to win, right?

There needs to be a winner. The audience

out there wants they want what you do.

They want they they want to walk into

the living room and figure out what

Obama was thinking, or they want to

hear, you know, what Mark Zuckerberg was

thinking, and they want someone to bring

them into that living room. They want

you to host them in. They need someone

to do that job. You don't

you don't have to be

what, perfect or better than anybody

ever lived. You need to be better than

the people that are currently doing it

now, or you need to be one of

you know, a handful of people that are

that are doing it because at that point

right, the audience comes to you, the

guests come to you.

You're making a market, right?

You're the market maker in that

information.

It's just the real key is

know what your value proposition is,

stay in your lane.

You know, don't don't try to compete in

an area where you're not going to be the

best in the world.

But on the other hand

right, the the one thing that's pretty

clear is that anybody can have the best

in the world in like 2 seconds at their

fingertips. And so you don't want to be

the third best. You don't want to be

mediocre across a bunch of things. You

want to be exceptional in one area.

Figure out what that one area is and

then

maybe you have 2 million followers then

200 million followers, right? Then

eventually, you know, over 100 years 2

billion. You

You just You just have to have this

vision.

>> One of the things that comes with the

pursuit of being first is you go over

the hill, you take the arrows as the

phrase goes. And so even in that

experiment that I just showed you that

we started 3 years ago, which was trying

to figure out how we translate the

diversity into lots of different

languages. It sounds simple. Problem is

you you discover you could up.

Spanish words are longer. So the video

in Spanish is 3 hours 10, but in English

it's 3 hours it's just 3 hours. And then

the video's going to be out and then