This is how social media starts roping

you in. This is how politics starts

roping you in. This is how cult leaders

will recruit you into a cult. It's the

number one way that we influence another

human being. Micro compliance. And

hypnosis is a great example of this.

Like I can have a person laying on the

floor unconscious in maybe a minute and

a half. And it's very easy to do.

Anybody can learn to do it. But one of

the things you'll see me do at the

beginning of that is like give me your

hand, put both hands out like this, and

then flip them over. You look all the

way up and look all the way down. I make

them do like 50 things. None of the

things that I just did with them are

meaningful. Everything was micro

compliance. And you don't realize that

you're going through massive amount of

compliance in order to get your behavior

to change or influence another human

being. Use what works for brainwashing

because our brains have not developed

one more wrinkle in the last 200,000

years. So a regular example of this is

novelty. Anything novel hijacks our

brain. So if you're trying to change

your beliefs or you want to lose this

weight, change something up in your

life, change your wardrobe, repaint the

walls in your office, you need to tell

the animal part of our brain here

because this has been proven on fMRI

studies that the decision shows up

before we're conscious of it. What about

humanto human skills? So people are

starving to have great conversations

that are very influential, which means

that if I'm an attorney, I can sway a

jury. If I'm a hostage negotiator, I

save people's lives. If I'm a parent, I

raise better kids because I can

communicate in a way that gets the

outcome that I'm looking for. And you

can do that with any of these techniques

like negative dissociation, the

childhood development triangle. There's

this thing called the PCP model. And

when it comes to influencing human

beings, that is the most important thing

that you could ever understand.

>> That might just be the most important

skill in the world. So, let's do some

role playing.

>> All right,

guys. I've got a quick favor to ask you.

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go away as a team and celebrate. And

it's the thing, the simple, free, easy

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So that's a favor I would ask you. And

um if you do hit the subscribe button, I

won't let you down. And we'll continue

to find small ways to make this whole

production better. Thank you so much for

being part of this journey. Means the

world. And uh yeah, let's do this.

Chase, the world is changing rapidly

before our eyes on so many fronts in

terms of geopolitics, but also in terms

of technology with this whole AI thing

that's rapidly accelerating. And with

that, you've got things like robotics

that are on the way and Elon Musk saying

that we'll have 10 billion humanoid

robots in the world in the future. And

these are going to be intelligent robots

because the software within them is now

artificial and it's incredibly

intelligent. One of the things people

say to me a lot is in a world where

we're going to have all this

intelligence, what jobs are going to

remain? And one of the points of

consensus from interviewing all these

great AI experts is that human skills,

any skills that are irreplaceably human,

social skills, people skills are going

to be of extreme value. You spend a lot

of time teaching people these skills. I

asked you a question just before we

started recording. The question I asked

you is, what is the thing you like

talking about the most that you think

adds the most value to people? What did

you say? helping people understand how

to guide human decision and and have

great conversations that are very

influential.

>> What does that mean in in real specific

practical terms?

>> It means that if we are in a

conversation, I become more likely to

help you achieve the outcome that I see

for you. So, if I'm a leader, then I can

do that. If I'm an attorney, I can sway

a jury. I can make a jury pick a certain

decision. If I'm a hostage negotiator, I

save people's lives. If I'm a parent, I

raise better kids because I I can

communicate in a way that gets the

outcome that I'm looking for from

another person. That might just be the

most important skill in the world. I

think it is increasingly so in a world

of AI where computers are going to be

able to handle a lot of the sort of

intelligent white collar related stuff

for us and we're going to be rendered

useful only for that which humans can

do, which is probably this stuff.

>> Yeah. the IRL in real life, humanto

human stuff.

>> And I think people are starving for it.

You've got a podcast that's

non-performative

and people are attracted to realism.

There's so much that's artificial and

performative that people are starving

for realism already. And this is pre-

AI. This was starting to blow up because

it just gave us a sense of something

that was real. We are in a epidemic

right now of loneliness where people are

disconnected from each other and these

human skills are going to matter more

than ever as AI comes out. I

>> I was thinking about what you teach in

terms of human behavior and getting the

best out of people and influencing

people to do what you want them to do.

And um AI does a lot of that.

>> It does. It seems like it's been

programmed to understand human behavior

and to get me to like it. So let's get

into some of that human behavior that

you think is critical in a world of AI.

In a world of AI, if the skills that

matter the most are humanto human

skills,

where does one where does one begin?

Let's understand humans first. Like how

could AI compromise a person? And when

it comes to influencing human beings,

the most important thing that you could

ever understand, whether you're a CEO, a

mom, or dad, is this thing called the

PCP model. And PCP is a three-step

cascade that happens inside the human

brain when we get influenced. Whether

we're doing something massively extreme

like some manurian candidate type stuff

or we we're just having a sales call and

we we make a sale. Everything goes

through PCP. So P is perception.

So the first step to really changing

somebody's outcome, getting you to make

a decision later on is to change how

you're viewing this situation.

So when people talk about owning the

frame of a situation or redefining what

a situation means right there is

changing the perception of it. If we're

just talking about AI AI can say yes uh

Stephen I see what you mean and I can

see why you're frustrated and you know

one of those like standard responses

but here's what's here's what this is

really about and it gives you this layer

that makes you say oh [ __ ] like this is

it's going deep. So now it's hit the P

on the PCP model. So it's modified your

perception of a situation. And how has

it specifically done that there? Is it

because it's acknowledged my point of

view but then given a new one?

>> Yes.

>> So if it just given me a new one, I

might not have believed it. But because

it first acknowledges my point of view

before delivering it a different one,

that's more effective.

>> Yes. So, and the biggest mistake that

people make with language is language

should be resonating and not directing.

If you want to speak well, you're not

directing people to think certain things

or to feel certain things. It should

resonate with what they're already

feeling and then start guiding them. So,

you're getting into their river, so to

speak, and flowing with that first.

Okay. So, let's let's do some role

playing.

>> All right. I say to you, Chase, I think

the sky is purple.

Your job is to carry out the perception

shift.

>> Yeah.

>> What would you say to me?

>> So if somebody says something that is an

idea that's far out there, I'll always

acknowledge it. And I would say like

every human being is different. And it's

fascinating how many rods and cones we

have in our eyes, how we all perceive

things differently. And it's amazing

when you see one thing that you might

see something that's purple and I see

the exact same thing. We may be seeing

the identical color, but our brains are

just interpreting it differently. Or

maybe we have a different word for it.

And it's amazing how much we agree on

and we just don't realize how much

aligned we are with a a situation in

life.

Does that make sense?

>> Mhm.

>> So, I've never I've never had to respond

to somebody calling this guy purple, but

if I can modify how you perceive a

situation. So, let's say we're at a

business networking event and I walk up

to you and I say, let's say I call out

the script, openly call out the script

and I say, "It's it's amazing how many

people are just running the script of I

need to look like a business

professional. I can't say anything that

makes me look emotional. I can't say

anything that's personal. I have to hand

out a business card. I have to like put

on this persona." So, I'm just openly

saying the script that's running inside

that person's head and I'm making you

aware of it, which means that I'm

changing your perception of the

situation. So, anything I can get you

aware of that's running inside of your

own head, I can massively start

transforming your behavior. And we'll

get to identity here in a minute, but

any script that you call out, you're

weakening its power. Ah,

>> so like if you shook my hand super

aggressively or somebody shook my hand

like a like a pretend alpha male and you

call out exactly what they're wanting to

happen and you say, "Wow, that handshake

is really firm. I just read an article a

few weeks ago that only alpha males do

that and you say the quiet part out

loud." So any script that's running in

the background or some kind of social

script, if I can surface that, then I

become a lot more powerful over the

situation because I've lessened the

power of a script. Any script that we

push down is going to be a lot more

powerful in that person. We're

increasing power

>> on that example of the Matt very, you

know, over the top handshake by calling

it out. What have you done? What have

you done in my head? So, I' I'm the one

that's just squeezed your hand really

tight cuz I want to be an alpha male.

>> You call it out. What What does that do?

It It disarms me or it makes me feel

great or

>> No. And and and I'm not saying that

that's a tactic anybody should do, but

if there's a script running here, like

here's what we're supposed to do. You

and I are on a podcast. We're supposed

to make eye contact with each other.

We're supposed to nod throughout this

entire thing. I'm making both of us more

aware of this.

>> And that gives us a little permission to

break away from it.

>> Oh. To break away from it. Yeah. So,

your desire to be the alpha male in the

handshake situation would be temporarily

kind of broken because I'm openly saying

out loud what you didn't want to say out

loud.

>> Oh, okay.

>> Does that make sense?

>> Oh, okay. So, you're like kind of

calling it out but without it being

>> without making fun of

>> aggressive. Yeah. Okay.

>> So, after I shift your perception, I all

I need to do is get you to see a

situation a little bit differently. And

if you turn on the news, oh my god, are

you going to see this all day, every

day, the perception changes. Oh, you

thought it was about this. Guess what?

Here's what they did today. And they did

this blatantly and now it's in your

face. They do all of this stuff to shift

your perception.

And in order to get your behavior to

change, once I shift your p perception,

then I change the C in the in this

model. And the C is context.

And context is the most important thing

in the world. And nobody's talking about

it. Probably everyone watching this or

listening to this right now is going to

get naked today.

They'll get in a shower. They'll get in

a bath. Whatever it is, but some almost

everybody's going to get naked. We're

probably not going to do it in the

middle of an office building like at

work. Context dictates what behavior is

permissible. So, if if you go back to 19

I think it was 1957,

there's this guy running a stage

hypnosis like comedy show, you know,

where they bring people up on stage and

make them do silly stuff. And

one of the guys that's up on stage, he's

knocked out and he's doing all this

crazy stuff. He's an offduty police

officer, so he's concealed. He has a

concealed handgun.

But one of the skits in this or one of

the bits that this comedian does, he

tells the people that all of you are

sheriffs and you can't leave the stage,

but everybody in the in the audience

right here is rowdy. They're making lots

of noise. You need to tell them to keep

it down. So, this starts and the

hypnotist says, "Now they're they're not

even listening to you. They're not

respecting you." And then he says,

"They're they're you can't leave the

stage, but one of them's pulling out a

gun." Then this offduty police officer

pulls out his service weapon and starts

firing into the crowd.

>> This is a true story.

>> True story.

>> Really?

>> Yeah. But is he a monster?

>> Of course not. Because context dictated

what he would do. So if I can change

context to where what I want you to do

is just an automatic thing, I can make

you do anything. The only the the real

skill is just being able to shift

perception and context. If you can just

shift perception and context, you can

radicalize someone on the internet and

turn them into a shooter. You can

radicalize somebody politically and make

them excommunicate their entire family

over a Thanksgiving. I'll give you an

example from UK. In in 19 in 1979, I

think there was a fire in in Manchester

in Wworth's department store.

>> Yeah. And it was during the daytime,

doors were open and it turned out that

most of the people that died were in the

restaurant and these the restaurant was

right by the door. So the fire inspector

looked and they were trying to figure

this out and a psychologist finally came

along and said they died because they

were waiting to pay their bill cuz no

one gave them permission to kind of

stand up and walk out. No one did it

first. So they kind of just went along

with the crowd. And in the context of a

restaurant, you don't stand up and walk

out until you've paid your bill.

>> So the context can also lead us into

something like that. So the perception

of the situation, even though there's a

fire, I'm locked in context of I'm

sitting in a restaurant. And and that's

been tested time and time again where

people will sit in a smoke fil room long

enough to die just cuz nobody else is

moving. So context matters. So how does

that pertain to being able to persuade

people

for like I don't know Debbie in Ohio.

>> Yeah.

>> Who's listening? Yeah.

>> How does she work and think about

context when she's in a sales meeting

speaking to her husband, her son,

whoever it might be?

>> Yeah. So, one of the best things that

you can learn when it comes to being

able to shift context is setting the

frame of what every interaction is and

being the one to openly say what the

frame is as the conversation starts.

Let's say you're talking to a kid and

it's a parent talking to a kid. The kid

thinks they're in trouble. That's the

context they have and I need to shift

their perception of our situation before

I can change their context. Mhm.

>> So, we sit down, we start the

conversation, and I'm like, I'm so glad

that we could have this talk in a calm

way that is focused on learning instead

of punishment.

A massively transformed perception and

context. So, I've changed what this

means and the definition of what's

allowed here.

>> So, context gives us the final P, which

is permission. So, if I change your

perception of a conversation and you can

do that right away and if if I'm

entering into a negotiation and we start

the room with, I'm glad that we could

all come here for this and I know both

of us want to find common ground as fast

as possible and I suggest that maybe we

even start there. So, I'm setting a

frame right right from the very

beginning. It's so surprising how few of

us do that when we go into a

conversation. I was just thinking back

over the last sort of 10 days of my life

in business meetings, very important

business meetings in Los Angeles with

new potential partners and walking into

the boardroom and sitting down and doing

the like formalities of like, oh, hi.

How's your weather? Like, how's the

weather? Where'd you live? Oh, fine. And

then a little bit of quiet. We introduce

ourselves and nobody really sets the

frame or someone sets the frame, but it

isn't you.

>> Yeah. And actually that meeting would

have been much more productive if I had

volunteered up a frame very early and it

was a frame in whatever I'm trying to

get out of that meeting.

>> Yeah. And anytime you're setting a frame

or just kind of setting the perception

of what's going on, especially in

business, start out by a negative first

because people [ __ ] about stuff in

business all the time and then go to the

positive. So you're doing kind of a

contrasting statement. So, like let's

say in in the last meeting you had, if

you said something like, "I'm so glad

we're meeting today, guys. There's so

many people out there that just fall

into these competitive mindsets."

>> Mhm.

>> Uh, and it's really good to do business

with people that are in a collaborative

mindset instead of a competitive

mindset.

>> With what you said, the frame that I

wish I'd said based on the all of the

the context was I'd walked into that

room wanting to get a deal done cuz I'm

sick of [ __ ] talking about it on

emails. Yeah.

>> And meetings, meetings, meetings,

meetings, meetings. So, I wish I'd

walked in and said something words to

the effect of, "I'm so glad we could

meet in person to finally really make

progress on this because there's been so

much talk about theoretical deals and I

feel like getting us together can get us

much closer, much quicker to figuring

out

>> a real deal that we can work on." Words

to that effect cuz I think that would

have started the conversation away from

the theoretical.

>> Yeah.

>> If I just called it out. But

unfortunately, I didn't say that and we

spent a lot of time just talking about

theoretical stuff again.

>> Yeah. And you can do that with

permission at the beginning with a

permission phrase and just say, "Hey,

just so I understand, and I may be I may

be wrong here, but what I understand is

the purpose of this meeting is for us to

kind of compile all these Zooms that

we've been on for months and months and

finally get something done and put a bow

on it that we have some kind of finished

product. Even if it's not perfect yet,

we have something tangible."

>> And that's that's permission. So you're

like, "I might be wrong about this." But

of course, they'll probably agree with

that. I think the same applies actually

for romantic relationships. Thinking

about having an argument with your

partner, you can go in just emotion

versus emotion. If you don't take a

minute to just

>> define

>> define what we're trying to accomplish

from this

>> and then when people drift because they

do in emotional situations, you've got a

frame to bring them back into that you

pre-agreed on,

>> you know, cuz when you get those emot

they'll bring up something your mother

did six, you know, four years ago or

something you and it just drifts away

from the frame.

>> Yeah. And if you watch the media, uh,

especially the opinion side of the

media, they talk about a politician that

they don't like, what do they start out

with? This is going to scare you. In

another piece of terrifying news, here's

what this guy did today up on the stage.

This politician did. So, they set the

frame for it to be terrifying. They're

setting up your perception from the very

beginning. And then if I if I change the

context

in one context, yeah, maybe this

politician's a bad guy. Another context

is this person is a threat to democracy.

I've heard that phrase a lot.

>> A lot. And that mean And what do we do

to threats to our entire democracy? We

kill them. So we start radicalizing

people instantly without them really

even processing that they're they're

internalizing that. M

>> we were radicalizing people just through

that context.

So if you can modify perception and

context, you can give someone that

permission, that final piece to do

anything. Let's go back to the police

officer in the hypnosis show. He had the

permission to start firing his firearm

because of the context of being attacked

by someone with a weapon.

>> Mhm. So once the context shift, your

social permission of what I'm allowed to

do, like I don't strip down and get

naked in my office, but I do when I'm

standing in front of a hot shower,

that is the permission to do things

differently. So if you want someone to

do something that they normally wouldn't

do, the question you ask yourself is, in

what context would the decision I need

this person to make be an automatic

thing? If we agreed on 10 different

things out of 11, then we the automatic

thing would be for us to sign an

agreement together.

>> Okay?

>> Or if if I'm being shot at, the

automatic thing for me is to draw my

weapon and and fire back. So it's an

automatic behavior based that typically

in another situation would violate

social permissions. Like I don't have

social permission to to behave in that

way.

>> I was reading about the story that you

referenced. I think I found the one in

December 1923. The New York Times

reported on it regarding a tragedy in

Croatia where an Austrian hypnosist

ended up firing into the crowd and um

killed three people and wounded several

others before he was snapped out of his

trance. Upon realizing that he had done

it, the officer reportedly arrested the

hypnotist on the spot,

which is strange to

>> That's called cognitive dissonance.

>> Yeah.

Wow. Okay. So, PCP, I understand that.

One of the things I was thinking about

is, is there any way for my audience

listening now based on everything you

know about SCOPS and the way that we're

manipulated with media, is there any way

that we might be able to help them be

more objective in a world that is trying

to force them into one frame or the

other? because I'd, you know, as a

podcaster, this is maybe a selfish

thing, I speak to so many different

people and I'm going to speak to someone

on the right, someone on the left, up,

down, left, right. I don't really as

long as I think I'm going to have be

able to have a conversation with them.

I'm going to meet them as I find them

and I'm going to have a conversation

with them. And there's really no

external pressure that's going to change

that. Yeah. Unfortunately, like I've

I've had all the external pressure in

the world and I'm not going to change

that because I have to do this myself

for a long period of time. So my the

thing that's going to keep me in love

with this job is to be able to follow my

curiosity and not be trapped by anyone

else's pressure. But that requires your

audience as well to be open-minded.

Which means that if I sit here with

Kamala Harris or with Donald Trump, I I

want my audience to come into the

conversation with as an open mind as

they possibly are able to.

>> Let's talk about how to manipulate your

next podcast guest into being more

open-minded.

>> Okay. And this technique is something we

teach called negative dissociation.

And the way that it works is I'll make a

small, it should sound like an

observation about the world. So in our

discussion, let's say we just sat down

and I'd say, you know what, I'm I'm glad

I'm interviewing with you. There's a lot

of people out there that are just so

closed off and locked in these little

rigid beliefs. And I'm not sure whether

it is they're just terrified of what

what people are going to think about

them if they step outside the lines

>> or if they're scared of being

open-minded for these other beliefs. I'm

not sure which one it is, but I mean you

meet these people so often

>> and you're going to nod. You nodded your

head while we were saying because what

is what I'm saying sounds true

>> and it probably is but you're making

that person very covertly agree that

they are not that person. M.

>> Does that make sense?

>> That makes perfect sense.

>> So throughout the conversation, what

you're really doing is you're not

getting them to make an agreement about

how they're going to act. You're getting

them to make an agreement about who they

are as a human being.

>> Mhm.

>> So the moment you can get them to

covertly make an I am statement in their

head, you're hacking your way into that

person's identity.

So like, let's say you said that, they

nodded, and then maybe a few minutes

later you're like, I I got a confession

to make. I, you know, I had social

anxiety growing up. How did you get this

open about everything? Have you always

been this way or was this through some

kind of like leadership training or

something like that that you went to?

>> And the moment you answer that question,

I've got you to commit. Now you're fully

committed uh to being wide open for the

rest of the conversation.

>> What would you assume they would then

say in such a scenario?

>> They're like, "Uh, I don't know. I I

think I've always been really open. I I

haven't been really scared about what

people think about me and I've always

tried to wear my heart on my sleeve. So

now you're getting to make all these

commitments

>> that they're going to be like that going

forward.

>> Yeah. Okay. I mean, you're not

permanently changing a human being,

>> but it's a temporary change that they

will make for one little compartment of

a of an interaction with you. And is

this because you're really you're

speaking to their you said their

identity, their sense of who they want

to be. And that's heavily driven by

social perception of what I think of

them.

>> Yeah. Uh but it's not who they want to

be. Uh it's who they say they are.

>> And those are different.

>> So

and man, Bob Chelini's got a great

example of this. They got these uh

people to stick signs in their yard.

These giant ugly signs that say drive

safe on them. And the way that they got

this like 85% of this neighborhood to

stab them into their yard, nasty, stupid

looking sign was a week prior, a week

before they knocked on their door and

they said, "Hey, I have a one question

survey. It'll take 15 seconds. Do you

support safe driving? Yes or no?" Of

course, everyone's going to say yes. And

then so now they've made a commitment

about who they are. Do you support? So

it's who are you as a person? And they

said, "All right, thank you so much for

that." And just to show your support,

could you put this tiny small sticker in

the window of your house facing the

street? And they're like, "Yeah, yeah."

And they go stick it on the window. But

they're more likely to do it because

they just said yes. But anyone who said,

"Yes, I support safe driving

a week later would stick that giant

stupid looking sign in their front

yard." And the and they double blinded

this. They did it in another

neighborhood where they didn't go door

to door first. They just went door to

door and said, "Hey, can we stab this

giant ugly sign in your yard?" And like

1% of people said yes, as opposed to

like 85% in the other neighborhood. But

it's a tiny agreement about who you are

as a person. So this is the power of

precommitting. Getting someone to

pre-commmit to something before you ask

them to do it.

>> Yeah.

>> And you get them to precommit in terms

of their identity and who they think

they are and who they want to be.

>> Yeah. But you're not getting them it.

I'm not using this technique to go to

make you sign a contract. I'm using it

to just make subtle shifts in how you're

behaving in our conversation.

>> So if I wanted you to focus on me more,

>> I'd do the opposite of the negative

dissociation thing. And remember, I'm

not talking about you because if I'm

sitting here saying, "Oh, Stephen, you

pay attention so well in a

conversation." That sounds super weird

and manipulative.

>> People say that to me all the time.

>> Yeah, maybe they want maybe they want

you to. In reality, if I do the opposite

of what that negative dissociation

statement did, and I I make a positive

group of people and assign an attribute

to them. So, that's how you would do

this. So, it's like, you know, Stephen,

it's amazing. Every time I meet these

really high performing CEOs, all of

these Fortune 100 companies that I work

with, you sit down with one of these

CEOs, it's like they all have the exact

same quality. You sit down with these

people and they stop what they're doing

and they just completely tune in to

other people when they talk to them.

>> So, I'm taking a quality that I know you

admire, like CEOs, all this kind of

stuff,

>> and I'm assigning a trait to that. and

you're going to nod and you're going to

that sounds kind of true but it also

means that you're agreeing that you are

also that type of person

>> but I'm never saying it about you. So

this is if I'm talking directly about

you which is what so many influence

people teach out there like oh I can

tell that you this or I can tell that

you're the kind of person that blank and

blank and blank. This is called aiming

language. my ang my language is aimed at

you and you can feel it and people can

feel that there's something going on if

there somebody's sitting there making

guesses and weird assumptions about

them. So anytime you're using any of

these techniques, it should feel and

sound like you're making an observation

about the world. It's interesting how

the sort of power of pre-commitment can

also be used on yourself to get you to

do things.

>> Yeah.

>> As you were saying, I was looking down

at some research here. Then there's

multiple studies that I find

fascinating. One of them is a study

conducted at MIT with students. Um they

gave these MIT students three major

papers for their semester. One class was

given ultimate freedom. They could turn

in all three papers at the very end of

the semester with no penalty. The other

class was forced to pre-commit to

strict, evenly spaced deadlines

throughout the semester. And the

students who had total freedom performed

the worst and experienced the most

stress. the students who pre-committed

to certain deadlines produced the

highest quality work and gave the best

work and got the best grades. It proved

that intentionally restricting our own

future choices through pre-commitments

is often the best way to beat

procrastination. And I remember the

study they did with people on a beach

where they had a fake thief run past

someone next to you on the beach and on

the beach and grab a radio and 20% of

people would chase the person. But if

someone had said to you uh in a

different study where someone runs up,

grabs the radio, but someone has said to

you seconds earlier, hey, I'm just going

to get an ice cream. Can you can you

take a look?

>> Can you just watch my stuff? 95% of

people would then chase the person

stealing the radio because we've made a

pre-commitment to another person. So

pre-commitments can work with yourself

or, you know, with others, which is

fascinating cuz especially to yourself.

I find that interesting that I can

change my own behavior by making a

pre-commitment attached to my own

identity. Um

I guess there's one more I'll share

which is this the study around savings.

They found that people who committed to

saving even if they wrote on a piece of

paper were up to five times in terms of

percentage terms. They went from saving

3% to saving 15% roughly 15% just

because they' done a pre-commitment even

years earlier that they would they would

save.

That's beautiful. I love that. And and

you're kind of just pre-doing your own

identity. And if if somebody wants to

master that, you make it about your

social commitment to yourself, to other

people, but publicly say like I am this

kind of person to yourself. So it's not

like I'm the I'm going to go to the gym

tomorrow. It's I am the kind of person

that goes to the gym is a much more

powerful identitybased action. And

identity is the number one thing in the

world when it comes to persuasion and

influence. There's basically the way

that I teach this to intelligence people

is when you're good at influence, you're

building two walls. One wall is anxiety

and the other one is cognitive

dissonance.

And the hallway that you're creating is

the relief from those from those things.

>> What are those two things? So I know I

know what anxiety is, but what's

cognitive dissonance? Well, the the

anxiety is like if I don't do what I

say, I'm going to have some so I'm going

to face social rejection or if I if I go

here and I and I break this rule or I

don't do this, I'm going to break a

social contract with somebody. The

cognitive dissonance is I am the kind of

person that does this and if I don't do

this, I'm not keeping with who I said I

am and and who I agreed to be and I'm

facing cognitive dissonance. So that's

like when

some politician wins the presidential

election that someone doesn't like. Like

you have that cognitive dissonance.

Either A I have to decide that wow a lot

of people like this person or B

everyone's stupid. And it's a lot easier

for me to just say everybody's stupid

and we always take that path. So

cognitive dissonance means that it's

bouncing them back into the hallway

every time they bump up against

something that they've previously agreed

to. And identity is the way that that

you can hack your own behavior so fast.

And the way that I explain this to

people, it takes 30 seconds to

understand it. If you were an Olympic

athlete and you had a a a badass body,

like you had a healthy diet, everything

was in in perfect shape. You woke up

every morning. You had great energy and

all that stuff. And one day you woke up

for some reason and you're 295 lbs.

and you wake up and you look in the

mirror and this something weird happened

overnight,

how fast would you get back to that

body? It would be lightning. You you may

set world records for for weight loss

because your identity is with that body.

It's not that, oh, I need to I want to

lose this weight so I can be healthy.

It's this is not me. And anytime you're

feeling this is not me or this is

against my who I am as a person, it's

the most powerful motivator when it

comes to influencing other people and

influencing ourselves

and like a goal like a weight loss thing

that I that I have a lot of my clients

do is to download the face app. There's

like an app that'll make you look super

fat and real real obese and print it off

and put it on your refrigerator.

>> And then people are like, "Oh, well,

aren't I programming my subconscious to

be fat?" Like, no. You're pro You're

programmed to go away from bad things

first. Never to positive things first.

It's always a way. Your ancestors live

because they mistook a a rock for a

bear. Not the other way around.

>> Yeah.

>> Never the other way around.

>> Yeah. So, you're not going to

accidentally program your brain, and I'm

I'm the brain guy, but put that on the

fridge, and you start you start hacking

into your own identity, but you're doing

it in a way that your mamalian brain,

the thing that runs the show, can see it

and understands it instantly. There's no

words, there's no motivational phrases

or anything like that. It picks up on it

instantly and starts setting a course

forward because it's cognitive

dissonance that you're creating for

yourself. I remember near Iel who I

interviewed who wrote the book on like

procrastination called indistractable

said to me a phrase that's always stayed

with me. It's probably, you know, we

spoke for six, seven hours, I think me

and Nia, there just this one phrase I

always think about. He said that humans

are discomfort avoiding creatures and

like we think that we're pleasure-

seeeking creatures, but when he said

discomfort avoiding, I really like

interrogated him. I was like, yeah, but

what about like horniness that makes me

have sex? And he was like, well,

actually that horniness is a form of

discomfort. Your body is sending you

this sort of almost irritation which is

making you take an action. And I stress

tested it across many areas of my life.

I was like, actually, he's he's right.

I I'm trying to avoid discomfort. And in

your example of seeing myself on the

fridge, yeah, I I would I would want to

avoid that. It would cause such

dissonance to my identity that I would

do everything to avoid that.

>> Some big ass fat Steven on the on the

fridge.

>> Yeah. I mean, that's actually every

couple of years. What gets me back in

shape is like catching myself in the

mirror or because I'm always on camera.

Sometimes I don't see myself kind of

getting out of shape and then I watch

the podcast back and I'm like, "Oh,

fuck."

>> Yeah. like Jack didn't tell me like no

one's told me and then then I'm like

right gym every day again and

>> uh interesting

>> and it's social because you're I mean

you're making this commitment in front

of a million people.

>> Yeah. What else do you think is

important to know as we head into this

AI world where human skills and people

skills going to be more important than

ever. What what other frameworks have

you got for me that I should bear in

mind or or ideas

>> as we go into AI? your leadership style.

Everyone's leadership style needs to be

front and center and I know there's a

lot of books out there that are

technically about leadership or but I

think they're about management and they

call themselves a leadership book. When

I teach what's most important when it

comes to understanding oursel is

developing authority. Uh but that

authority has those five traits of

authority. This is confidence,

discipline, leadership, gratitude, and

enjoyment. Do you do show notes where

people can download stuff in the

description?

>> Yeah, sometimes. I'll send I'll send

this inventory to you where people can

take this quiz and it's it's the most

revealing thing about your leadership

power.

But what people tend to do is seek out

the wrong type of authority. I've

learned this with 20 years of working

with people. That we will tend to seek

one of these little avenues that looks a

certain way because we think that's what

leadership is supposed to look like.

That's what authority is supposed to

look like. But there are three types and

the three types that I've broken them

down into and how authority channels to

other people because authority looks

different in different people. So it's

the president,

the professor and the artist

and we can have that authority. So like

the artist you could think like somebody

like Johnny Depp, the president you can

think of somebody like uh Obama. The

professor, you can think of like the

classic movie professor. It still

broadcasts authority, but it's not loud.

It's not extremely directive. And the

artist can hold a ton of attention.

>> Mhm.

>> And in some rooms doesn't hold any

attention at all. The authority is still

there. The attention isn't. For somebody

that's super calm, even if they're the

CEO of a company, they might be the

professor and the whole time their idea

of what leadership looks like is this

president.

So they're faking their way into this

thing and it never feels real. They

still like even though their authority

is really high, they have this weird

feeling of inauthenticity because

they're pushing towards the wrong

authority channel.

>> What's the cost of that?

I think that it detracts from your level

of authority which automatically means

that you're getting less outcomes that

you want in life

>> because your inauthenticity to both

others and yourself um like pays a toll

on you. So if I'm inauthentic to you

then that's going to hurt my authority

but then if I'm inauthentic to myself

it's going to hurt my happiness I guess.

>> Yeah.

>> I'm going to feel like I'm again going

back to your point about identity living

life.

>> Yeah. Yeah. And I think when people say

authenticity, we should note that what

we call most people call authenticity is

a costume of childhood beliefs. Like my

authentic self and how I act is

typically what I was in childhood. How I

deal with conflict, how I make friends,

how I stay safe, all these little

patterns that I learned when I was eight

or nine. I'm still repeating a lot of

that stuff. So when we say authenticity,

it's always important to think that it's

authenticity plus a removal of ego and a

willingness to receive social injury.

And that's the best way that I've ever

been able to describe that to somebody.

It's like if I'm being authentic in a

conversation, then I'm willing to

receive a social injury for it.

>> Cody Sanchez said something to me which

has stayed with me. She said, um, again,

I'm going to butcher it, but words to

the effect of,

"I won't be friends with anyone in

private that won't say something in

public that will cost them something."

And going to your point about social

injury, I think what Cody's actually

saying is like that's how I know that

they're authentic is they're willing to

risk something for something they

believe.

>> Yeah.

>> I also think this is how you know a

brand's authentic. like are they willing

to cause social ind injury in the near

term for something they believe in the

long term.

>> Yeah.

>> You know.

>> Yeah. And a lot of what a lot of the

recent brand debacles that we've had is

they thought they were doing something

to avoid social injury that caused a

massive social injury

>> because people said you're not being

authentic to your audience.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah. When they tried to do like get

into identity politics and stuff like

that and

>> Okay. like like extreme virtue signaling

and stuff like that. Yeah.

>> Which backfires.

>> Can we go into this childhood

development thing really quick? Sure. I

think it's super important for people to

know. Sure.

>> And I'm I'm a behavior profiler and

>> if if anybody listening didn't know

that. And one of the things that I teach

everybody is this thing called the

childhood development triangle. So it's

just three sides of this triangle. So

when you're growing up, what did that

child have to do most of the time to

earn and keep friends? So friends is

one.

And then to feel safe. What did the kid

have to do to feel safe? For some kids,

safety was like,

I don't know, somebody gives me a hug at

the end of the day. For some kids, it

was like, am I going to eat today?

>> For some kids, it's like cracking jokes.

>> Yeah. And

>> I'm going to crack jokes and keep

friends. I'm going to feel safe by

becoming really loud and dominating the

room. I'm going to become safe by

getting really small and shrinking so

nobody notices me or I'm going to become

safe by being hypervigilant because I

don't know if dad drank before he got

home or if he's going to start drinking

when he got home. So it's like what did

that child what are the scripts that

that child needed to run on autopilot to

feel safe to make friends and then to

get rewards and that would be the third

side and the rewards for some kids might

just be like appreciation and it's

typically just appreciation affection

love

and that tends to get written in

childhood and the kid who writes all

these permanent scripts they put them in

a backpack and carry them all the way

into adulthood.

Yeah.

>> And 90% of us are walking around with

this exact triangle governing our life.

And if you look around at people at

work, you see this woman who every time

there's a meeting, uh, she wants to

speak up a lot, but then she shuts her

mouth and her body shuts down and all

this kind of stuff. You're seeing an

eight-year-old who got yelled at at a

family dinner table.

>> That's all. But you're just seeing it in

a grown-up body. I have two examples

that are super front of mind that

completely align with what you've just

said. I have two colleagues that I work

with and I got six months into working

with one of them and I could always tell

that there was something not quite right

because whenever I was in the room they

would they would stare at me a lot and

um they would be a little bit more on

the pessimistics pessimistic side than

I'm used to. And one day at dinner, I

was talking to them about their

childhood and they offered up that their

dad was his mood could change rapidly

and he was always pointing out why

something would never work and why and

he was an extreme pessimist. And

suddenly this person who is in my life

suddenly made sense. I completely

understand it because you grew up in

that environment where to be safe

>> um you

>> agree with it

>> had to pay attention to to the authority

figure and then yeah you had to also you

learned maybe that you know pessimism

was a way to safety yeah safety and then

there's another colleague who's actually

in the room over there and I'll ask her

before we publish this if I can say this

publicly but similar thing she she

expressed to me that she had a dad that

was his mood would change rapidly and I

said to her one day I said Um, I call

her Sarah. I said, "Sarah, you're always

staring at me." Whenever I look at you,

you're already looking at me and it's

like you're like overanalyzing and

overthinking. And she explained to me

the same thing. She said, "When I grew

up, my dad's mood would just change like

this." So, every time I'm preempting,

I'm like a radical preempter. I'm

thinking 20 steps ahead of like what

might go wrong or, you know, which makes

her exceptional at her job. But I would,

you know, you know, one might assume

that that comes at some kind of cost.

>> Yeah.

>> So, safety. Yeah. Very true. Very true.

And the the way that I explain this, if

somebody wants to like it's not where

you can kind of go back and like sit

there for five minutes, put it on a

post-it note, and then figure your whole

life out. I wish I had a cool a trick to

do that. But the way that like I want

people to think about this is going back

to your childhood, a lot of those

things, these are just contracts that

were written in a child's voice. And

when you start hearing these patterns

repeating in your head, force yourself

to hear the voice of a kid. That's all

it is. It's just a kid who made these

choices. It's not an adult. So, we're

typically three different people, all of

us. We have a work self, like a

professional kind of self. We have a

home self, and we have a self with

friends.

And what is that as a kid? That's

classroom, playground, home.

So I'll typically take people through

this process of where were you around

authority figures which is like

classroom or home. What were you around

when your all your friends were around?

You got made fun of or you had to become

really small. And that that goes on the

friends side of the triangle and that

that talks about how the social patterns

that are going to show up for me. And

somebody says well I keep attracting

these negative people into my life. Why

do I do that? And that that goes to

these patterns because if I do this, I

know this is going to happen. I know

that's going to happen. It's just

completing a story archetype.

So that's the childhood development

triangle. And it is really powerful to

start understanding our own patterns.

And I'm not saying that you can go out

there and there's like here's six steps

that are going to change your whole

freaking life if you if you do these six

things. The awareness is what you want.

You want massive like self-nowledge and

and self-awareness

>> uh with the side agreement of I am not

special and I'm completely okay if I am

never understood because most of what

happens uh when we get into arguments

with our spouse, we get into these

[ __ ] arguments with people at at work,

it's our argument to be understood more

than it is for us to come to a solution.

I need you to understand me. So getting

okay with the idea that you might not

never ever be understood is like step

number one. Number two, I am not

special.

And that that helps us to open the door

to start coming into a lot of these

things. But if you if you're a leader at

work, you can start seeing these

patterns in your employees and you can

be like, I see an eight-year-old there.

And if you get to a point where you're

seeing some of these a behavior that

might have pissed you off in somebody

that works for you and you're like,

"Wait a second. Now I can see exactly

what's going on because this, this, and

this probably happened." You don't need

to make some prediction or

fortunetelling thing about their

childhood, but you're starting to see

these patterns and you know now how your

team's going to respond in conflict. And

if they if it's a conflict and it's

social, you're seeing all their friends

patterns. If it's a conflict and

somebody might be losing their job,

you're going to see their safety

patterns come out and you'll see your

own.

>> So, do you think I should go to the key

people in my life, maybe my team, and

ask them these questions about around

how did you make friends? Is that the

question?

>> What did you do to make and keep

friends?

>> What did you do to make and keep

friends? And what was the safety

question again?

>> Like what what did you need to do or

avoid to feel safe?

>> And the rewards one,

>> what did you feel? And this one's always

you want to put the word feel in there.

What did you feel like you had to do to

earn rewards? And what were rewards to

you?

>> Okay,

>> it was appreciation. Or somebody that's

like hyper significance driven, like,

I've got to have the Rolex, I've got to

have the Ferraris, and all of this kind

of stuff. They never got rewards because

their parents ignored them unless they

brought home a certificate. Their

teacher called and said they did a good

job. They played the piano recital and

did a great job. And lots of people were

acknowledging them and clapping for

them. They only got acknowledged when

they were socially significant.

>> And am I right in thinking here that

these are fundamentally interlin in many

ways? Because when you're talking about

safety, I was running through my head

the things that made me feel safe and

they were rewards

>> that I could tell my friends about.

>> So I like I touched all three of them

and part in part because we, you know, I

was thinking I was very different to my

social group when I was younger. We were

a black family. There wasn't another

black family that I knew of. um um other

than maybe one other kid I think in the

area in Plymouth in 1994 or five. Um so

some of the material things I wanted

like the the shoes that everyone had

made me feel safe cuz they made me fit

in.

>> Y

>> and that you know and that got me

friends. Y

>> or at least I thought it did.

>> So like for me it really was like an

interconnected triangle.

>> Yeah.

>> That's just one of many examples that I

could think of. it does tend to do that

and I will typically wait for somebody

to figure that out and as they're

filling it out they they're kind of like

oh I did this because of this to get to

this

>> and it you'll see a little cycle start

happening.

>> Uh but it's great for self-nowledge but

if you're a behavior profiler that's

what's going to run people. You're going

to know how they're going to respond to

conflict. You're going to know what

they're going to avoid. You're going to

like if you're putting teams together I

know what people I want to have working

with each other. And it doesn't have to

be some complex 9hour thing like you can

see this stuff in everyday life. And

you're not saying that I need to

radically change.

>> No. But what if one part of this

triangle or one behavior I've learned

for safety or for rewards or for friends

is making my life worse?

>> Yeah.

>> You know what? It could be ruining my

life. Like it could be the things

standing in the way of me having a

romantic relationship or getting a

promotion or building a business. It's

like getting in the way now. Yeah. What

do I do, Chase?

>> So, you you've identified the pattern.

Let's assume that you've you've got it.

You're like, "Oh, I've got this [ __ ]

that's that's happening on repeat." The

part two of this is I need to focus on

that being a kid

that belongs to a child and I need to

write down like this. Here's how that

child wrote the contract, made the

promise to themselves, developed the

contract. And then even if you make it

up like when let's I'm going to write

down a little thing. When did this kid

bring it into adulthood?

I need to stay small in order to stay

safe. Let's say it's one of those

things. And then you just start telling

yourself that is a child's voice. That's

a child's voice. So you the voice is not

going to go away. That's the sad part.

That's like me you trying to not

complete the sentence Mary had a little

in your head. You can't get rid of it.

No matter how hard you try to delete

that, it's repeated over years and

years. Just like one of these things

that that what truly changes for you is

hearing a child, hearing a misguided

child who developed a coping mechanism

for the world,

not knowing that they were like they

just assumed, I'm going to have this

forever. I'm going to need this as an

adult. I'm going to bring this into my

adult life. Part two of this is you make

a like a wallpaper or something for your

desktop and we talked about being

negatively uh motivated. We're away from

negative things.

You make a like a motivational wallpaper

that has your big limiting belief on it

and then take it to an extreme. I had a

client that had this if I say small I'm

going to be safe. Uh and he was in a b

like he owned a business but he wouldn't

go get these big clients and he wouldn't

he wouldn't go do this. The guy's got

three kids and I said, "I want you to

make a desktop wallpaper that says, "My

kids don't deserve for me to be

successful.

And I want you to look at it every

single day when you turn your computer

on." Because that's exactly what your

belief is saying.

Because if your kids truly deserved it,

it would override the belief. So you

just need to write the belief in plain

English. And what it's truly truly

costing you in your life is my kids

don't deserve me to be successful. My

kids don't deserve money. And that's

what it comes down to. And every day you

look at it, you you have a feeling of

disgust. And there's a hyper awareness

of that thing running in your head.

You're going to be more prone to hear it

when it does come up. And you're also

training yourself to hear it as a

child's voice, which means you're going

to start hearing fiction. You're still

hearing the same sentence, but you're

hearing a fictional story. There's two

parts to this. I I love this, and

there's two parts to it that I think I

wanted to talk about. The first is in

doing so, in waking up in the morning

and seeing my wallpaper that says like

my kids don't deserve a great life or

whatever. Um, of course it's going to

motivate me to take action, which is

then going to start to build new

evidence once I take action, once I win

that big client and I realize that

everything's fine, which is going to

change my life. And then the second

point I wanted to point out is like

people listen to podcasts like this and

they write this stuff down and then they

have relapses and things don't change

fast enough. And I think that can

sometimes make them feel hopeless or

inadequate because they heard it on the

diary of a sea or whatever and then they

did it for a bit and they struggled and

it didn't quite work out and then they

went back to their old behavior. And I

think in part this happens because we

live under the presumption that this

stuff is easy and it's fast and that at

some point in the future I can fix my

trauma. Like I think one of the best

realizations I ever had was realizing

that the [ __ ] that I've carried with

me in that backpack since I was a kid

that the stuff about what will make me

safe or what will reward me or how I'll

make friends or who I am or whatever my

survival mechanisms they will be be with

me forever and actually instead of

trying to delete them or like throw them

out the backpack what I was able to do

yeah

>> is like turn down their ability to make

the decision.

>> That's it. That's it.

You've totally got it. And and I would

say this for anybody out there that

you're trying to go through this and

you're having a hard time. I get it.

It's totally tough. The number one way

that we influence another human being,

let me just kind of metaphor this for

one second. Uh when you watch a

hypnotist,

and hypnosis is anybody can learn to do

it. It's a it's a pretty easy thing. So,

it looks very dramatic, but one of the

things you'll see me do at the beginning

of that is like go ahead and give me

your hand and I'll hold their hand for a

second. Like, put both hands out like

this and then flip them over. That's

great. Now, just just to test your eyes

really quick. Look all the way up and

look all the way down. Look all the way

left. Look all the way right. All right.

Then, spread your feet a little further

apart, a little closer together.

Actually, no. Face this way. Now, I will

make them do like 50 things. None of the

things that I just did with them are

meaningful. None of them.

Everything was micro compliance.

So this is how social media starts

roping you in. This is how politics

starts roping you in. This is how cult

leaders will recruit you into a cult.

Micro compliance and you don't realize

that you're going through this massive

amount of compliance. So like you go

through a doctor's physical and they go

through like this 90point checklist.

they've made you do 50 things and then

they recommend a weird drug or they

recommend you get on some other drug,

take some time to think about it because

our brain it's hardwired for these micro

compliances. So I say this to say that

if you're going through any of these

things and you're trying to change your

beliefs or you're trying to change

something in your body, use what works

for brainwashing and figure out a way

that you can get micro compliance with

your own goals on a very regular basis.

small little wins. So your brain has

that just like hypnosis, just like cult

recruiting, just like brainwashing,

small little things at the very

beginning. So everything in influence

should be looked at as a wedge.

>> Everything.

>> It reminds me of that famous study they

did where they got people to give

electric shocks to other people, the

Mgrim obedience experiment.

>> Yeah. and they managed to get a member

of the public to give another member of

the public lethal electric shocks just

through sort of micro compliance but

also through authority because the

experimenters were like wearing white

jackets, white overalls, etc.

>> And here's the second thing in that

experiment that's going to going to

perfectly tie back to this.

>> So this experiment that you're talking

about happened at Yale University. It

was 1962.

Uh, and we I mean there's tons of data

on it, but essentially strangers would

shock another person seemingly or what

they thought was to death just because

some dude in a lab coat told them to.

But what they didn't account for, and

even Dr. Mgram's book was called

obedience to authority. They thought it

was all about the authority, the lab

coat, the guy's tall. Uh, it's a

professional setting. But really think

about if you go back to our ancestors

like the most important resource to your

ancestors was your was focus there's

nothing more important than focus and

the number one way to generate focus and

you because you if if I don't have your

focus I can't command authority right so

focus is always first my focus authority

tribe and emotion those are the four

things that govern a mammal all mammals

dolphins doesn't matter so I have to

have focus before authority and they

didn't talk about that. And the way to

get focus is through novelty.

>> Novelty meaning something unexpected is

occurring. So like if you walk past the

same bush every day 10,000 years ago and

your job is to carry fish from the river

and suddenly you walk past that bush and

you hear a big ass uh stick snap,

all of your focus,

all of it is on that stick. Not it's not

on your kids. It's not on your health.

It's not on anything that's going on.

It's to this new unexpected piece of

information that hijacks our brain.

Anything novel hijacks our brain. So if

you see like and it follows that

pathway, focus, then authority, and then

tribe, but what's everybody else doing?

And then emotion, then how do I feel

about it? So it's and and what happens

is we are hardwired to respond to these

things. You cannot decide not to respond

to novelty. Your head turns to to loud

sounds. All this stuff happens.

So the way that if if you're trying to

do this like brainwash yourself is

change your house up. Change something

up in your life. Change your wardrobe.

Repaint the walls in your office. Move

your furniture around. Buy a new car if

you if you can. I want you to like just

imagine is how would I influence my dog

in this situation?

I would need imagery. I would need

something to shift. If I move the

kitchen table to the side and move all

the furniture, when my dog comes out of

the bedroom, he's going to know

something's different.

>> Yeah. I think this is one of the great

secrets of good marketing is that it

beats your brain's wallpaper filter. And

um I wrote a little bit about this in my

last book about this idea of beating the

wallpaper filter. I think we talked a

little bit about it last time, but I

talked about a study where they got a

rat and put it in a maze with chocolate

at the other end of the maze. And they

looked at the rat's brain as it went

through the maze the first time and they

saw that the rat's brain was like

exploded with activity. It's smelling

the walls. It's trying to figure it out

like and then they put the rat in the

maze the second time and there's like

almost no brain activity because it's on

autopilot. It knows the maze, so it

doesn't need to use any of its cognitive

resources. Its cognitive resources can

be allocated to new surprising things.

The maze is no longer surprising.

Whizzes through the maze to the

chocolate. And even like as you think

about how you got out of your bed this

morning and got down to the kitchen, you

didn't have to think.

>> So you paid no attention. Yeah.

>> Um but you would have paid attention if

you walked down there and your like sofa

wasn't there.

>> Um and how does that then apply to

marketing? So, like how do you surprise

people is like a central question of

anyone who's trying to build a personal

brand, start a podcast or do marketing.

Um, but I guess also to to persuade

people. It's one of the things I think

about a lot when I talk on stage.

>> Yeah.

>> Is I know I'm competing with your mobile

phone, your Twitter feed, or your Tik

Tok. So, I have to do something almost

like every 10 seconds to like catch you

off guard. And Mr. Beast, I guess, is

the great master of this. is probably

why he's got half a billion YouTube

followers

>> because the minute that video starts,

>> yeah, you're hooked in.

>> You're hooked.

>> But this I mean that's the power of

novelty. I would challenge anybody to

take this challenge. If you're scrolling

through short form content, watch for

something that like jerks your

attention, like some kind of weird

novelty thing that happens. And that

video is probably short 20 maybe 40

second video that that

captures your focus through novelty. The

next video watch for an authority

figure, a famous YouTuber, a celebrity,

a politician, a pop singer who thinks

that they know politics, all that kind

of stuff. Watch for an authority figure.

Next, watch for a tribe signal. So, a

tribe signal is going to be here's how

many people agree with this. Here's lots

of people doing one thing. These tickets

are selling out. Here's the Taylor Swift

concert. Here's everyone cheering at the

concert. Here's how you're supposed to

behave is basically what that means in

the tribe section. You're supposed to do

what these people are doing. And then

watch for the emotion. So, watch for

this pattern. It'll be a focus

generating novelty. Then it'll be

authority. Then you'll see tribe. Then

you'll see an emotional video. And guess

what happens after the emotional video?

>> Wow. ad.

>> Much of the reason most people haven't

posted content or built their personal

brand is because it's hard and it's

timeconuming and we're all very very

busy. And if you've never posted

something before, there's so many

factors in your psychology that stop you

wanting to post, what people will think

of you, am I doing this right, is the

thing I'm saying absolutely stupid. All

of these result in paralysis, which

means you don't post and your feed goes

bare. I'm an investor in a company

called Stanto, which you've probably

heard me talk about. And what they've

been building is this new tool called

Stanley that uses AI, looks at your

feed, looks at your tone of voice, looks

at your history, looks at your best

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should post, makes those posts for you.

You can also just use it for

inspiration. And sometimes what we need

when we're thinking about doing a post

for our social media channels is

inspiration. Building an audience has

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think it could change yours, too. So,

I'm inviting you to give this new tool a

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now to get started. I've had so many

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this platform work for me?" Maybe the

copy wasn't good, the creative wasn't

strong, but usually the problem is

they're not having the right

conversation because that ad never

reached the right person. And if you're

in B2B marketing, that is much of the

game. And this is where LinkedIn ads

solves that problem for you. Their

targeting is ridiculously specific. You

can target by job title, seniority,

company size, industry, and even

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About 130 million of them are decision

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the right people. And LinkedIn ads also

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If you want to give them a try, head

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And when you spend $250 on your first

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Terms and conditions apply.

>> I heard you say something as well that

um if you want to persuade other people,

you should make them feel clever.

>> Yeah.

>> Explain this to me.

>> I

refer to this as maybe the most

dangerous persuasion skill there is.

And what I'm the 10-second brief is I

basically I'm going to put a Lego right

here on the table in front of you and

I'm going to put another Lego right here

on the table in front of you and I'm

just going to keep having the

conversation to where eventually your

brain is going to be like, "Oh, I bet

those things go together." So the idea

came from you. So I'm going to give you

one piece of information and another

piece of information, but I will never

put them together for you. And the

reason is that any idea that you think

came from your own mind, you have no

ability to resist it.

So all I have to do is make you have an

idea.

So a regular example of this is let's

say you're watching the news and they

say uh local Austin woman has been

reported missing. Neighbors said that

earlier this day people saw her arguing

with her boyfriend.

>> Oh yeah. details after the break.

>> So, yeah.

>> And your brain is like, "Oh, I know what

happened. Oh, I know exactly what

happened." But they make you feel

clever.

>> Yeah.

>> They give you a piece of data and a

piece of data, but they don't tell you

to put it together.

>> The media do this all the time.

>> Yes. And if you can do this in a

courtroom,

it you it will be the biggest unfair

advantage you'll ever have in a legal

standing because it'll win lots of

trials.

The way that like if there's a formula

on how to use this is here's a piece of

information here and it's a piece of

information that you will absolutely

agree with that makes sense to you and

another piece of information that makes

sense to you. It it has to be two things

that that make sense to your brain

because it's like you're not going to

experiment with something that you're

not familiar with. So, two pieces of

familiar information close enough

together where the brain is going to

say, "Oh, you know what I can do? I'm

going to put those two things together."

>> Isn't this how conspiracy theories take

hold as well?

>> Oh, yeah. Cuz I, you know, Yeah. You

know, there's a big um there's a big

enduring conspiracy theory that someone

like Bill Gates has done things that are

nefarious as it relates to health. And

like I guess the two pieces people are

connecting is they're saying, "Well,

he's worked a lot. He's very rich and

powerful and he's very very interested

in health,

>> biotech,

>> and and vaccines and all these other

things." And and you know, someone very

very very very powerful. We often think

of, you know, very powerful, successful,

influential people as being somewhat

like evil or not having our interests at

heart. And then someone who's spending a

lot of money on like health and medical

side of things um

is is quite an unusual thing. So we put

two and two together. We have you know

we think they have bad intentions

because they are a billionaire and that

word is you know comes with certain pre

preconceptions and then health and then

a pandemic happens and I think people

you know

>> this is how I think a lot of

conspiracies

>> name a movie from when you were a kid

where the bad guy or where the super

rich person in the movie wasn't the

evil.

>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

>> I mean it's programmed into the media.

It's a definite programming that was

very deliberate in our country. It's

like always the rich people are evil. Uh

but then people will say, "Oh, well Tony

Stark was rich. They made him a

sociopath."

>> It's interesting because I think, you

know, I can make the case that at some

point it's intentional. But at some

point also, it becomes such a clear

stereotype that you have to follow that