what was going through my head at that

time I do not know I was drinking just

trying to take the pain away

it's tough man

[Music]

so that's a fantastic

hey that's football we'll call it man

united obviously it's all big and you

can have that control over you what

people have a voice Jesse he asked if we

could give him a couple of days off when

things are getting said about you that

it's not true he's gonna voice your

opinion I knew I needed to leave

do you have a suspicion why you won't

pick

um

you do don't you can see it in your face

so this is the whole thing what happened

is there a day that you look back on and

you go that was the hardest day

getting that much abuse and I'm already

down enough and I've got to perform I

was still trying to be Jesse like hey

like about no jokes on that but of

course it's gonna affect me

it's not done much at all this season

I've already gone through things when

you don't know about I felt like in the

world on my shoulders in 2019 your

mother was admitted Hospital

just kind of really cope anymore

did you ever figure out what the root

cause of your mother's Depression was

I think as soon as had me to be honest

[Music]

thank you for tuning in to watch this

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let's get on with it Jesse

[Music]

give me your context what is the take me

right back to when you were in those

early years as you signed and joined

Manchester United I think at seven years

old what was life like if I'd been in

your home if I'd been in your

surroundings in your environment what

was life like

um

life was good obviously Mormon does

split up

an early age especially when I was born

which can make things a lot difficult

um but I still had the the desire the

hunger

so going training we're going to taught

me in training you know week and week

out you know our trials are Everton City

Liverpool so I'm going to be driving up

and down the motorway

constantly

um

you know to support me and and take me

to training and games and then

obviously made a decision to sign up for

United at nine years old you know we had

a you know great team

um no one likes a Pogba

um Ravel in the team so we had a we had

a great team on

um I think outside of that obviously I'm

almost very supportive but that was very

supportive it was you know football mod

you know so I think that support system

especially at an early age is important

did everybody in your circle around you

have high hopes for your

for your career when you were that age

about 10 12 13 did they think you were

going to be a professional football

player oh my grandmother did your

granddad did yeah he

I mean was on their surf pretty much

every day

practicing skills learning new things

um and he had the the belief that would

be a footballer and you know if it

wasn't for him then you know it wouldn't

be in this situation I mean because he

took time out of his day to take me

enough to you know practice my brother

will come down but that will come down

you know we play One Touch

two top football you know pretty much on

a regular basis and that's my happy

place that's where I'm most happy on a

football pitch and like I say my grandma

was you know very important

you know part of me

into Liverpool into City into United on

Trials because you know people

recognized you know their talent but he

was there to push me I I was watching

the documentary and I saw

um

a Granddad who looked

it's rare to see I mean you one might

expect a dad or a mother to be that

pushy and direct and critical but to see

a grandad being that Savage with you at

times was quite surprising can you give

me a flip for anybody that hasn't seen

it can you give me a flavor of how

how um

tough he was at times

well he got he got he got banned a

couple of times

like when I say we're 12 years old or

playing stalk away

and he's come on the pitch after the

game and said you're not fit to wear a

shirt

so you're not fit to wear a shirt not

even if it's wearing a shirt

I'm thinking like the cop was just

looking at me I'm like I can't do

nothing he had me on weights at 10 years

old like lifting weights went into to

man united and said to won the coach's

tiny wheel at the time he said like you

know I want to get my grandson into it

because it obviously is a it was a power

lifter for a great burn right so you

know he wanted me on the way it's an

early early age to try and build a bit

of muscle because you know I was always

small he kind of drove that from you

know being a power lifter you know for

Great Britain

kind of pass it on to me and Mum was a

gymnast it's always kind of tough on her

as well mum took it

the wrong way

um because obviously she's got to be a

gymnast but we're gonna be so hard on

her that you know eventually she you

know she quit on that

um but even with me you know some games

I'd you know not play the best and

you know you get in the car on the way

home and you know I'll tell you that

look oh my toe was sore today like let's

try and make excuses because he saw like

hard on me but he was trying to push

like it come from a good place I'm

saying

so the reason why your mother quit

gymnastics was because he was so hard I

know yeah he was so so tough on her

um and obviously she didn't have really

the motivation to carry on

probably she went strong enough to to

carry on that but you know for me I I

was new to be a footballer so

you know have him you know my granddad

you know my Dad my mom around me at the

time you know trying to push me and it

was difficult even earlier stages

because you know I was living

literally five minutes but you know like

I said my mum couldn't

really cool with me at the time

um and I suppose back and forth from

another one that's a lot

and then like I say I see you driving

from up and down the motorway Liverpool

straight back to Manchester now I would

train at Liverpool for one day have a

game for United the next day so you know

he put the he put the yardage in you

know to get me well or what to eat today

you said you said that your mother

couldn't really cope with you at the

time what do you mean by that

it's depression

um

should be in bed all day

well most days

um

you know go in ask some money for the

ice cream

like still be in bed

so me I was I was happy to go lucky I

I'm bubbly like what's going to play out

with play football my friends

but and you don't understand

you know the situation that you know

your movies in at the time was so young

so I didn't really understand what was

going on

um until obviously it got it got brought

to light you know

Maybe

let's say

about 16 17 you can kind of understand

like what she's going through and and

things like well she'll never talk about

it I should always part it up so your

mother was

suffering from depression even when you

were very very young yeah but at that

time you just didn't realize what it was

no you didn't know it was did she know

what it was

I think she I think she knew yeah but

she would never

at that time would have really a support

system to support her [ __ ] I've really

people around her that you know she'll

go to like she can go to my PA now and

you know go to the doctors and you know

show us all out but at that time

obviously I think she knew what it was

but

she couldn't really caught with it she

can't really didn't know I had to deal

with certain things

um

and you know for me almost okay so I

always play out of fun play football but

for her

she's supposed to go be in bed like all

day she would she could drop me off at

school well she should go off at school

uh eight o'clock in the morning and then

sleep until three o'clock until she bits

me up

that's how bad it was

like she was we were really going for it

so she'd sleep all night wake up to drop

you to school and then go back to bed

yeah she sleep in the daytime

pick me up from school

probably go back to bed again just lay

in bed like cutting a short dark room

everything

and then

obviously you know buff me whatever go

before I go to bed and then she'll sleep

all night

over the last 10 years or so people have

become more aware of what like

depression and mental health is and this

is kind of why I ask if your mother knew

what it was because like 10 years ago if

I'm being completely honest there was a

real stigma around mental health it was

kind of seen as someone just kind of

being a bit crazy and over the last 10

years thankfully we've gotten to a point

where we have a better understanding

that we have physical and mental health

and this is why I say like did your

mother know what it was did she just

think she was just

sad or she didn't have motivation or did

she know she was depressed

yeah I think it was a pull in the

motivation part I just couldn't get out

of bed she's got motivate yourself to

get our bed

even when I woke up

I was dying for it to be there

and I think she came for the

quarterfinals

and that just made me so happy because

in that situation

you know not getting out of bed not

having a motivation but she find that

motivation to come and see her someplace

at World Cup

that was like I was I told her like I

was really part of her I was it's Brave

what he did because

you know every day in bed depressed no

motivation and just to find that little

bit of motivation just to come and see

you know a son that'll work up and don't

forget she's got you know I've got my

little sister and little brother as well

so

you know she's got to deal with them as

well

um which is always tough but like I say

to find that motivation to come and see

me at work what was

important for me especially because I

wanted to I want to live there anyway

regardless and I didn't even know she

was coming until I was in the lineup

singing national anthem for Messina

you've seen him really I know just give

me a Goosebumps straight away that was

so emotional after that and I wanted to

perform at the highest level and win the

game just for a I think there's a

there's a video on on my Instagram of me

hugging her for like

two three minutes I've seen it and it's

there's some things I can that can make

you happier you know as a person but

just to be there and get up and get

changed and get dressed

and have that motivation so not a World

Cup that's what made me happy

this is a bit of a difficult question

because it's not always obvious but did

you

did you ever figure out where

or what the root cause of your mother's

Depression was

um

not really no I think

I think as soon as she had me to be

honest I think it was just difficult for

her to

love and a child

um

you know took over most of the time but

you know she was still there she was

still a mother but

just hard for us to do over and

you know we had certain instances where

you know we would be in Ben should we

like trying to stretch my legs and that

like I'm like what's happening I didn't

know what was going on I didn't know she

had depression at the time also I was

such a young age

um but for it was just normal like

normal for her and she's like you know

stretching my life you got training

tomorrow and I'm like

oh what's going on like I didn't realize

what was going on so I shot them like

phases where you know should do

um

you know some

extraordinary you know stuff stretching

your legs I'm confused yeah it's like

like stretching my brains out like

before like we went to sleep

just like it was strange for me because

I knew I trained next day but

if I heard I was probably not like

natural normal

so I mean like I still don't still don't

resonate with me today I'm probably not

resonate with her today of what was

going through ahead at the time like

especially when I was born

like Gucci handle that situation of

having a kid so you're saying basically

before you would go to sleep she was

stretching your legs in a way that

didn't make sense like as in yeah I was

like I just want to go to sleep right

why well another question like I'm

another question but she was too like

astronomy stuff

and this lasted this has lasted up until

today since as young as you can remember

till till today

yeah

and I think she's just a lot she'll

still always have depression

but she can cope with it now she can

handle it because I've said we've got

the right support system around

but still it's

like I say I've got my little brother

and sister who she looked after and you

know what

just come on mum's come on lease some

bones to be honest

especially from like even a documentary

she was nervous to do that like she was

crying in the car like the director

sport tour I said you're going to be

involved in it she's crying like the

nervous she's caught with it

but you know she's found a courage final

motivation you know to do it and

that's still a big thing even though

she's going through what she's going

through

but like I say we can we can handle you

know certain situations now

emotions you said about bottling up your

emotions and generally you know

I think men in particular have a real

problem with kind of expressing their

emotions for various reasons because

we're you know we're Macho and masculine

and whatever else but

um did you learn at a young age at all

how to express your emotions did you see

did you have models in your life where

people were emotionally expressive

no

only with

only mum I'm an underground nod I would

always say love you like how are you

okay

but like that side

right not not much

like rally hog

more of a you know fist pump but you

know sometimes you want to see that

that love inside especially from you

know our father

and you know me becoming a five result

that's all I want to do with with hope

you know Express you know what emotions

or

um so I mainly got it from like my mum's

side Granddad none mainly

like say

I think it does come into a realization

where

you know we've seen a documentary and

you know as far as what's the point in

you know it's a short life what's the

point in

in arguing all the time because my mom

and dad never seen eye to eye so

I can understand from my mom's

perspective where

you know she don't want to see him but I

mean that's come to our realization

where it's like look

let's go together let's have a coffee

let's sit down you know documentary

really you know walking up and and

realize Life's too short to you know

because it becoming games and

my mom it'd be asking like this is your

window box so he's in the Box are you

using the box and I'm like my mum but

I'll I'll sit in the stands and and I

know it shouldn't be like that but you

know that's how it is but he wants that

you know to give in us again but I can

never see what I'm doing it

I never see them giving him time of days

to be honest

has your mom been able to find a new

partner since

she picks

yeah she picks um

not the best people to be honest

um she puts a lot on us this

but

she kind of fries off that for some

reason like the bad boys

and

you know the situation that we're in

you know you can't be

coming out with these guys and doing

what you're doing with these guys

because you know it comes back to me

they've had a lot of drama

with

most of them to be honest and

the last guy

hung himself

which is

it was deep

um

but it

you know what narcissists are like like

one minute you'll be given to the world

and then next to be like who you with

like he texting blah blah

I'm I'm speaking I'm like Mom these guys

are not good for you like they're not

good for you but some

somehow she thrives off them situations

and gets a buzz off it and becomes happy

so

I was in a situation where it's like

do you want me to be happy

um being with these guys or

you know bring her back down to earth

so it's a difficult situation but

like I say yeah the guy you know hung

himself in the end

um

and then

I think after that my mom realized

um you know she can't be you know dating

these people

it's difficult I completely relate to

what I can completely understand

not that I've had that lived experience

but I can understand what you're saying

with this conflict of I want her to be

with someone but if it's a bad option

would I rather her just be alone and

then you know

I was thinking as you were saying that

about many of my friends who have been

going through difficult situations with

their mental health and what ends up

happening because there might be a gap

somewhere or something missing or

something not quite stable with you you

end up attracting someone like a mirror

who is also a little bit

unstable or who isn't in the best place

and you're kind of are toxic together in

a way

and often I think with some of my

friends it's like you just need to work

on yourself first before you yeah you

try and find someone who you know

because a lot of the time we end up

trying to look for someone that will fix

us yeah which is never a good thing I

think that's what she she did

someone to

because you know she's not she's got

friends but she doesn't she don't go out

with her friends and you know be social

so

I feel like her having you know someone

uh

you know she could go to his house she

could do things with him she could be

happier

but on the other side it's like

that's they're not good for you at all

you know to bring they kind of bring you

down in a way manipulators and

manipulating and they're well aware of

you should believe it right she believed

like

like would I don't know would go

probably would go somewhere like me my

mom Daisy and maybe travel something or

something like that the guy was texting

like where are you like what are you

doing who you with all right what's your

family no you're not no you're not no

you're not yeah and it's like

I don't know my mom's like dealing with

this and I'm like how can you deal with

that

I'm thinking how can you deal with this

and let's block him

but she just like she loves the

attention she loves it narcissists

Target people like that that they can

control in such a way be coercive and

manipulate and sort of take advantage of

their self-esteem and stuff that's what

narcissists do because an individual

like that a narcissist like that would

never

be successful in coercion and

manipulation of

um someone who would go what the [ __ ]

are you texting me when I'm with my

phone the [ __ ] do you think they

wouldn't they wouldn't survive there so

they find that they find their way to

people who they can easy targets yeah

exactly his Target

if I say like looks leave him she's like

yeah yeah I'll block him block him look

she'll unblock him the next day

tough man

it's difficult it's hard

it's difficult

difficult difficult thing

um off you go into to Manchester United

um when did you when did you get in your

view your first real break in Manchester

um

Apollo and Jose are coming really yeah I

mean not in the South it's relaxed

Ferguson

I'll make it when I'm 23. I'm 23 24. so

you know I always believed enemy always

believed in me

um I think when they were always coming

I went ready to play first team football

yet

and then I think

especially on the van Gogh

um

you know gave me the confidence to play

but

still it was difficult because

you know I was at a stage where

played the first game on the van Gogh

the money six months out

January came

went online to Derby

and then the season after that was that

kind of make our break

so I left it till

October

time

and if I weren't playing then then I

knew I needed to leave

and then

he played me at CSK Moscow way Champs

League

like starting what's up okay

freezing cold minus five whatever it was

really was like don't wear gloves

like what is that don't wear gloves

that's okay

I don't wear gloves played well

and after that stayed in the team so

it's kind of a that's kind of a make-up

break time for me why is that comment

don't wear gloves significant

to you

because

you know especially at United we're

brought up

go wear black boots

no gloves

no long bombs in training just like the

basic things we brought up with that so

when you go into the first team of

course in the warm-up you don't want to

wear clothes

but for the game you know Back to Basics

how we grew up

don't wear gloves in the game

it's about values right it says values

you know it's morals it's the way you've

been brought up you know United

put that into us an early age

a lot of that comes from Sir Alex

Ferguson right I'm super you know I've

sat here with a bunch of extra Alex

Ferguson players Rio Gary Patrice

how would you describe the um the

culture at Manchester United during that

Sir Alex Ferguson period what was the

culture like

it was good yeah always but a real

scoozy gigsy

um you're not always but not even on

tour

um you know it's good to go on tour of

them and you know I think

you know real being real always was

there for advice I always had to speak

to

um you know on a regular basis like

Muslim schools are the same

um were they honest and critical as well

though are they tough

some of those senior Lads

um

yeah because the winners

and you know they've been there and done

that and you know did one trophies

before and

you know it was unfortunate that I went

in you know any of the teams that you

know won the Prem or are Champs league

but you know even on tour it was you

know you still win games and

you know going on tour with them

especially with you know so Alex was you

know an amazing feeling remember being

on a bench me and Pogba got called up

for

it's about to manage against Newcastle

you'll not knowing if I'm gonna play or

not but still just to be there and see

how you know they are in a change of

room and you know see that winning

mentality and

I think being at United is all you know

it's

been installing you from a young age you

know winning is important talk about how

you win

just win and I think they've been so

successful in over the years

um you know winning trophies

just by having that winning mentality

celex Ferguson leaves

now it's funny because I'm a Manchester

United fan I'm a big fan and I've had

season tickets over the years and

um go to most of the games at home still

today

and it and from what I've heard it went

from being like a like a family

to

being run by Ed Woodward and it feeling

less like a family like one of the

comments one of the waitresses meant

said to me was you know when Sir Alex

Ferguson and David Gil were here they

would come in here and like chat to us

and they knew all of our names every

single one of our names and then when

Silas Ferguson left one of them said to

me they don't beat it they don't speak

to us anymore it's different I

so Alex was like month a month

like

when we're training with the first year

bring us all right 16 17 train with the

first team like they give you that

confidence know your names know all like

from probably

under tens

to the first team it's not everyone's

name

you take this time out to understand you

as a person or saying your family

and like I say you know things change

[Music]

um

you know but with him

you know it was good that you know if

you could understand the family side get

to know your family a bit more

um you know understand you as a person

you'll see a progression like I say you

said 23 34 you'll be in the first team

you know to head up you know you can

kind of get a big eagle but you know for

me it was nothing's guaranteed anyway

so I'm just gonna work my ass off 10

times you know more you know so being

that first team

Rio said to me that when his granddad

was Ill Sir Alex Ferguson not only knew

but he knew what um Rio's Grandad's

favorite whiskey was flowers were and he

sent it to the hospital bed before

anybody else he got it there so Rio said

to me whenever I've asked the senior

players why stuff was so good they all

said they would all just before you even

get the words out they'd say man

management that's what you said though

and I think I think even this day and

age now

I feel like it's important

even with Josie Josie used to FaceTime

me like randomly

a couple times I'll be driving and be

FaceTiming me I'm like where are you

where you kid

I'm just driving home within salvages

where's Marcus

I don't know everything is at home okay

enjoy

just little things I little calls here

on there even you know Steve Cooper not

gonna ring me let's have conversations

wanting to understand you a little bit

more very soon so I think I feel like

it's so important why

because it shows that they care it shows

and when they care you care back yeah

right okay it works yeah like I'll

understand you a little bit more than

you know as a person not just as a

person like how are you like how you

operate

not in football I want no outside of

football as well

same with the lads like one way outside

of football I get to know your families

and I think

well I learned that from was England

we've got a soft gate

money management top

got to the 2018 World Cup got to the

rooms

see a picture of them me and my mum

see a picture

me and Marcus

right home

so when you got to your room at Camp

yeah

in the hotel

like I thought I was at home

he really has got the best out of

England in my in my lifetime in the 30

odd years that I've lived I've never

seen an England side that looks so happy

and cohesive and honestly ego free

um and then it's showing in the in the

tournaments we're playing we have hope

like I was I was out in Katana I was in

the stadium for the England France game

and even though we lost it I walked away

happy because we're playing great and

we're challenging what's he done in your

view

um to that England side to to create

that atmosphere in that culture

I don't think he understands

you know others players I think

when he first came in he was the first

person to give him a debut of England

I played with him on the 21s you know on

the studies values and and the way he

did things

and then you know coming into you know

the senior team you know give him a

debut what are his values New View

um

I mean he cares about the players a lot

and

like I say he wants to understand you

know the player

um

you know so for me you know being from

it on a 21 level and obviously being

with a senior team

you know this this trust already there

anyway

but

you know it takes a lot to trust a

person and

you know for someone new coming into the

team

um

you know we still understands the person

and like I say he wants that trust and

the trust back on

you know you can speak about anything

not just football it's about anything

and you know we'll understand and I'll

ask about oh how's your mum how's your

dad this little things go a long way and

I think you know the money management

side of it

is is very important especially

tournaments anyway

but

you know the group was a collective you

know understand is his values and the

way he does things

um you know so people knew coming to

come you know it's easy selling shall we

because it'll pull you straight away and

like speak to you and set you down and

you know talk just talk and that's it

and I think it's so important what is

you know a lot of managers are known for

you know sir Alex Ferguson's one of the

trademarks of his style is the hairdryer

I know that's kind of like over gas by

the media and stuff because you hear

what

um a caring man he was but when you

think about Southgate style compared to

these other managers you've had like van

Gala Mourinho and all and Moyes Etc

what's his style South Gates

it's different but it's still got the

the hair dryer I don't know really yeah

yeah it surprises a lot of people

but

you need that though because

you know our manager is you know nice

and unless you you know get away with a

lot of things here and there like he's

he's on it I will tell you if you're in

the wrong way or not

I don't know what what player you are

who you are it'll tell you something

wrong or not

but

you know another hand is still

he still wants to create that good vibe

you know with a team and

you know he'll shot one

you know it's needed but most of the

time it's just you know simple you can

speak to him you know we'll speak to the

group

um you know simple words

you know enjoy the game with you know

we've been here before

go out go out win the game you know have

fun do the tactics all in the week but

you know it's not something like that

you know he's a good guy as well

I think you know it goes a long way

especially you know with England team

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that but also thank you huel for

creating a product that has helped me

and help my health stay intact in my

busiest days over the last couple of

years

why did Manchester United not reach the

levels on the pitch during that era

because when I look at the players that

we had I mean [ __ ] hell we signed

some unbelievable players it's not

people often criticize the glazes for

lots of reasons but when you think about

the money spent on players on the pitch

we spent the money yeah it's like Oh Mr

Billy I think it's almost a billion

billion billion we spent in players in

that period yet we couldn't we couldn't

seem to win we couldn't seem to get that

cohesion right through that sort of van

Gaal Mourinho era and even the David

moyzera

um what's your assessment on why that is

like what why wasn't it

I think it didn't click of course it won

you know with Vanguard when the FA Cup

when we know Europa League

Cowboy cop

could these these world-class players

are coming to United and I'll be honest

they're looking average

so they would come from a club where

they were banging and me and my friends

we celebrate our Manchester United chat

we're like here we go Lads every year

and then it's like they'll become half

the player

it's strange because a lot of players

have come in unveiled

like I say oh

you know relaxing training

top

like this this is

quality training quality

when it comes to a game this thing clip

for some reason not on

is it pressure

you know when I was playing especially

with Roman

you know Alexis we decided to enjoy

football and of course it's gonna be

hard to win a premise if you know been

so dominant for for many years but even

to win Europa League you know carabao

cup Community Shield

like we're winning trophies but

I think when

Jose left and trophy stopped

that's difficult

another new manager

it's kind of like you

you have to like kind of prove yourself

over and over again

it's kind of like you know

false like fake promises really I think

that's what the heart of it yeah like

you know you get I I you're doing more

like you know you're playing this game

not playing during the time under social

yeah because I've played at first and

then obviously when when all first came

in you know unbelievable you were all in

out of control that's what I'm saying

yeah and then

I said to me before the season you know

if I don't play

x amount I gained before December and we

let me go alone in January he said yeah

so then play and generally come West Ham

came in and install people wolves you

know debating you know is he fair enough

is he ready to to go into a team like

that and start straight away that nearly

didn't happen did it it was off and on

and off and on

honestly

I literally with my brother

watching Skies what's news

Dave always on the phone I'm like yeah

I'm coming I'm there like you want me

down there

edible Rings no you're not going there

it's off it's done

it's crying I was crying

me and bro just crying I was like to do

is play football

it was

all right it's back on now yeah

I do is play football let me let me just

go and play football please

as soon as I got there hit the ground

running

that's probably one of my best seasons

to be honest

like I think nine goes five assists in

from like February to May

I still didn't go Euros after that

and that was a main integral Euros how

did that feel when you found out that

you won't go in after having one it

probably arguably your best ever year in

football before at West Ham when you

were you know widely considered to be

the most informed player in the league

how did it feel

it's heartbroken because

you know

growing up I was what I do represent my

country

and play for England

and

to not play

the first half of the season

than to go to West Ham

on the phone I was in there quite easy

took it into into the orals but

didn't pick me like I say weren't strong

enough to probably say

look why I'm not picked well that's

helped probably yeah what do you think

yeah like

what what I could have done to get into

this yeah should I score 10 11 12 goals

I don't know do you have a suspicion why

you weren't picked

um you do don't you I can see it in your

face no because

I could see that smirk you do I don't

know because

I was thinking of

form

how how can I not be picked do you think

it could be something else

because your form you can't argue with

it can't argue for him

off the pitch

off the picture was sweet I was in a

good mental space so I don't know what

it could have been then

this is what I'm saying who knows and

maybe

one day we'll probably get

you know the reason

but to this day

not sure why

in 2019 as as shown in the documentary

your mother was admitted Hospital

what was what was

what was the cause of that

of that happening what was the lead-up

of events that sent her to hospital

just a depression it was just so bad

that

she couldn't really cope anymore and

I think she needed to go away and get

help

but

then leaving me with

my little sister who was probably 11 at

the time and

you know my little brother who's

probably like 15 at the time

for me I was still going through my own

things as well

so

I went really the the big bro that they

wanted at the time

because they always get like

the phone The Laffy Jesse the bubbly

Jesse

by that time I was going for my own

stuff anyway so I was just autopilot

your mum's in hospital you've got two uh

younger siblings that you're now primary

carer of and how are things going on the

pitch you're saying that you just

weren't present on Pitch

swear now like

mentally

went there

like I'd be on a pitch but

still my mini pitch really yeah I don't

want to play I Don't Wanna I don't want

to quit football

I've never quit football but

I would have needed a break if a lot

down income wouldn't need a break 100

and is this in this is an old first year

or second year

yeah it's like the second year on

almost gone into games I

smile bluntness

it's not up here it's just like I didn't

want to be an ass but it's all

of course I'm gonna play about and then

you're getting abuse

that was kind of what tips it over to be

honest

after the Derby game what happened

so we won

but you know as soon as you get on the

bus it's no Jesse [ __ ]

blah blah like why are you playing froze

blah blah

and

she fell at Luke shot back to be honest

he came down off the bus and I started

shouting I'm arguing whatever but don't

be friends or United fans but

like I'm human I mean of course it's

gone off at me like I'm already down

enough anyway

I'm already going through things what

you don't know about

and I've got to perform on a weekly

basis

and when you're performing you're not

performing it 100

so of course it's going to be critics

and you know you're not playing that

well

to be abused like that

it's kind of what kind of what tips with

her

that was like I was like no I can't this

is I can't be asked anymore

like I need I need a break I need to

find something some motivation some fire

in my belly again

to get going again because you know I

can't can't be doing this I

might be another game next week and I'll

be like Oh I'm like just can't be

awesome I can't I don't want to play

just during that time that time period

of everything what was going on mum look

after my little brother and sister when

I I felt like underwear on my shoulders

there's this really kind of like moving

haunting part in the documentary where

I think you broke your older brother has

Louis had videoed you lying on the sofa

completely yeah still your eyes are like

blank that's how it was

like

even at training like just masking it

just

my skin you know the depression side of

things

the anxiety

like I was still trying to be Jesse like

yeah a bunch of jokes or not but

you know it comes to a point where

you actually need to say something

because I felt like

the world was on my shoulders and

had no one sent to like can't speak to

anyone about anything I didn't want to

speak to another I thought you know what

I can deal with this I can handle this

I'm good enough to deal with this but

come to a point where

it's like look Ollie

this is what's going on

we kind of kept it

in all close-knit to be honest but even

just to have like Ollie say like you

know how's your mom how is she doing

like I could have a conversation with

him kind of a conversation with a kind

of conversation with liaison woman and

that has helped a little bit more

just having done a conversation and

letting people understand like what I'm

going through

and then I think I did it I did a piece

for the paper

um you know talking about and

I still don't think people really fully

understood you know what was going on

until until like like I said documentary

came out

in order for you to

um

be able to have those conversations with

the people you first had to make the

decision to like for you to talk about

how you're feeling because once you open

up then they can give you that support

you talked about how it's difficult to

do that when you're a young man did you

realize in that moment that you were

suffering with depression could you see

see yourself and your mother

oh yeah probably yeah

I think the video sums up the woman want

to solve for I'm actually Layla for like

three minutes

just staring to finish I don't know what

I was thinking don't know what's going

for my head at the time but I could say

like I was I was I was drinking

something like that like before bed like

having nightcaping like it's not about

nothing

I'm not doing that far

all right what I need is something

just trying to take the pain away

and like put me at ease somehow I'm like

trying to forget what's going on but it

makes 10 times worse

do you feel the online criticism do you

are you exposed to it

no don't read it you don't read it no

have you ever gone on Twitter and looked

at what people are saying no I think

that's the worst thing anyone can do

some players must do that though right

players do it yeah but I don't know why

because

see if I'm strong enough to handle it

now yeah I

I'm showing a tangled negative comments

criticism whatever

concentrating football there's no point

going in Search and Phil yeah in a sewer

yeah there's no point why search for it

because I'm thinking about like you know

we talked a lot recently about players

like Harry MaGuire being on the

receiving end of a lot of criticism and

stick

in My Views most of it's completely

unjust

um but

I've always wondered if players actually

feel that criticism and it impacts their

game

yeah I think so can you see that when

you're in the dressing room if you know

a place like been slammed in the press

or online or whatever can you see

them drop like their head drop a little

bit and then yeah they probably try and

mask it a little bit yeah

just to like be strong like I can't

handle it but

something like we are human

of course criticism is going to affect

us especially when you know the pundits

are saying it and it's

especially them you know with a pundit

saying it more than you know a comment

on Instagram or

[Music]

um

or any social media because it gets

highlighted more you know when the Press

with

um you know a pundit saying that's all

of course you're gonna see it or

someone's gonna send it here

but then it's kind of masking it trying

to be strong

and then you gotta go and perform but

I think the majority of players you know

in this day and age are strong enough to

know what anyone says anymore

you you did perform when you went to

West Ham you really really performed as

we've discussed

um I think a lot of people were

expecting you to stay there because you

performed so well and it just seemed

like you finally found your your groove

consistent you scored the goals you've

got the assists

what was your thinking at that point

when that loan comes to an end did you

want to stay at West Ham you wanted to

stay yeah Manchester United when did you

come back

yeah so I had a year

yeah I went into my final year after

that then

and I still wanted to go on I wanted to

go online and

John because I weren't playing again

so

Newcastle was on the cards in June deal

with donor FM

obviously the United Squad weren't big

enough

so let a couple players got online

and then when it comes to me

John irungu was like no like you're not

going alone

I was like um

well he's gonna know he's got let me

score an enjoy if I'm not playing there

so let me just go online all right let

me play football to Newcastle yeah

and um

[Music]

he's like what do you want days off I

was like no that's what I'm gonna play

football all right would you want days

off yeah so this is the whole thing what

happened

so then

to stop the loan obviously I was pissed

um

and then when he said about the days off

or not

I messaged him I was like you know what

I'm gonna take two days off now

just because you said that

so then they put out

um Jesse's last for two days off in the

media what went on Twitter straight away

no I didn't ask for two days off

he asked me the open days I was put I'll

put it out there the facts

how how what was the dressing room like

at that point you know when because a

lot of players would obviously when all

Ronaldo comes in obviously all

eventually ends up getting fired et

cetera Etc

um

it did feel like you know they use this

phrase or the managers lost the dressing

room or there's from a fan looking in

you could just see that there was

something wrong with the culture at the

club players would come in there that

were world-class as we said earlier

world-class else were coming they were

becoming [ __ ] average players you

know you've got all of these these

rumors leaking you've got all of this

stuff happening players at the club

feeling like their trust has been broken

like you said you've been lied to a few

times it just felt like some there was

no someone didn't have control of the

place no it won't there's no control I

don't think like you say when Sir Alex

was there it was full control like a

fortress yeah

Fortress everything goes for him

contracts everything like commercials

like everything

of course Generations change

players grow up people have a voice what

like you say when

things are getting said about you that's

not true

you're gonna voice your opinion like say

what happened back in the day it'd be

squashed there and then with Sir Alex

but like you say no

people have got platforms to to voice

their own opinion and write what they

want do you think players have lost lost

respect not in this sort of um Eric Tana

gear but just in that period that

followed through these managers and the

Soul share if you think players from

what you'd seen had kind of lost respect

for the club

probably uh it looked like that yeah

probably it looked like this wasn't

there

the same control you know control right

there's no there's no structure there's

no there's no balance for people doing

what they want pretty much on it it's

like a free throw

yeah it's just a free throw I mean

like you say

people saying something like

that's never happened ever

at United

people are sending stuff onto a run I

think up in the parliament as well

like you've got a lot of scrutiny all

right guys one of the best midfielders

in the world like

I've known him since like 16.

like she kids Got Talent one like he's

one of the best midfielders in the world

and still he can't perform at United

so there's something wrong

in some way

you got one of the best midfielders in

the world you can't perform and then

during the season when you're in

National Grid and he goes to France

let me see how he plays the fronts

it's like

yeah guy's sick

let me come back like

Alexis or not I told you

I don't know what it is I don't know

what I can't say what it is I don't know

what it is

I enjoyed my time on the draws either

like I'd want one of my best seasonal

drills later I was gonna I'm gonna say

that of all these managers van Hal you

know Mourinho oh in the in movies in a

post solex folk scenario when did it

most feel like there was control and

that United was starting to be more like

United

um probably Vanguard to be honest really

yeah

a

yellow structure

like everyone understood what he wanted

like some people didn't like I love Van

Gogh

um very tactical knew I wanted to play

and everyone bought into that

and then of course Josie

best manager in the world just wants to

win

but like you say had that mind

management as well and had the belief in

me and the trusting me to perform

if you could waive a one then if I give

you one then I said okay

in that all era in that post Alex

Ferguson era do one thing

to fix

the club's issues what would you have

done with that one

wish have been you know what it is I

think uh the saw behind

on like with everything

like

you see like six facilities see

tottenham's facilities when we go there

a lot of England and that one between

left on them

like people on Mars head

even like like the social side of things

and I went to him like tivan so eating

about like YouTube and let's do like

content

now they're so behind on everything

I just want him to just get up to date

on like the new things are happening

like the things that are popping what

does that matter

you gotta be relevant you gotta stay

relevant but in terms of like the

training ground it obviously Ronaldo and

appears Morgan interview talks about the

jacuzzi and the the chefs and the food

and the facilities and the weights

training equipment and he left years ago

yeah he says he came back and it was all

the same yeah

how does what impact does that have when

you as a player

you want the best things you want

especially like you know it's one of the

biggest clubs in the world so you know

you want the best for the best and

you know of course you want the best

food on

um you know you want a swimming pool and

the jacuzzi in this island which is it's

still there but

you know it's like

um modern like

modernized because

like you see like you know cities

facilities or not

and like you think like I'm like

black girl today like catch up a little

bit like because like you're way behind

at the moment

is it is a symbolic thing like as in

it's just a it's kind of a symbol that

you're not keeping up with the other

clubs you're not investing in the in the

small stuff which as a player you go

well then

well we're also behind on the pitch and

we're just behind just down in general

because

like back in the day we have like tables

on a table and like

um like pool and everything

so like you like mentally you know happy

and you know with a dart ball and stuff

like but

nothing

and like just just go in you train and

you go home

sometimes you are like stay at a

training ground sometimes

you know play that sort of lads and you

know play table tennis for the boys or

not

but

this is like like I say just need to

catch up a little bit more and I'm

becoming a little bit more modern

because he changed like the canteen or

not but

you know to

to be relevant and stay in this day and

age you know you've got to be more a

little bit more modern

is that because of the the ownership is

that the like the people at the top of

the club just don't understand what's

important for the players because they

spent their money on players but to hear

that they didn't spend the money on

things behind the scenes kind of speaks

to the fact that I don't know because

Sir Alex Ferguson probably could have

called the shots back in the day and

said we need this we need this we need

this we need this

whereas these days

don't know what's going on

and of course now they want to sell the

club

what the fans have been wanting them out

for you know a long time but did the

players care did the players take a view

do you think

um

not red it was just like I say just

behind was just behind

on a lot of things

um

let me tell you what you want that

modern you want the modern things

you want the things that are

you know popping off at that time

but I don't know

like who called the shots about you know

changing the training ground or

on things a lot but

like I say just just to catch up a

little bit and let me see what what city

you're doing on that right so

frustrating round

best facilities

no one talking back in the Press

about the about the team you um you

chose after your timer

um Old Trafford after your contract to

come to an end to go to Nottingham

Forest a lot of people were surprised by

that a lot of people would have thought

you would have gone to back to West Ham

where you'd had an unbelievable run or

even to Newcastle or something like that

why why did you choose Nottingham Forest

newly promoted team

they've just been promoted right yeah

um

why why Forest

I finished all the love

to show

you know the Wilderness and the hunger

to want me

dude Who's Gonna Fly me here and

everywhere to

to get a deal Over The Line

um

things brought down at West Ham

negotiations

which obviously I can't get into too

much but

no I'm not even showed

the love

a lot more than

you know West Ham and

you know when you think about it you

know I've been at West Ham anyway before

and you expect

like you see what I can do I'll see what

I've done so you expect him to be like

yeah like you know what I will show you

the love like

this is the contract blah blah let's

negotiate let's talk

it went like that for some reason they

didn't want you to sign no they want me

to sign them kind of rush it it's like

kind of rushed

like it'll be like Wednesday and be like

Sunday Friday like there's a deal let's

let's talk like you know me

like I'm not respect yeah like it's just

show a little respect like I've been

there I've helped your team like we've

got got to Europa League

I show a lot a bit more respect on that

well nothing I'm just like listen

like we love y'all

we want your all right the manager will

come to your house

like the owner wants to fly you to

Greece like sand deal like doing

everything in the power to get the the

level alone

on

you know for me it's a new challenge

different challenge

another team of course I've known All

the known as United all my life

um

and I remember leaving

United

the last day

and

the physio that we had from under 18s

obviously is with the first team now

he's like I remember the FA Cup goal I

believe you've got you know run when you

when you won you've caught like I'll

always remember that goal like yeah

I was like

you know I'm leaving leaving crying all

the way home on that like couldn't

continue on emotions or not and then

like it lasted a long time like I've

been there all my life

like I know everyone in the club

from like staff kipman

thinner ladies

you know

Mike Glennie who scouted me you know to

United and like that that's been my life

United

but how did you feel about the club when

you left it

did you feel let down like disappointed

yeah a little bit

they say false promises here and uh

not really give you a reason why you

know you went playing

so yeah kind of let down to be honest

like say didn't really get a sand off

we've been there that long

I think I deserve one but when you get

in that car or you when I've been in the

moment it's all worth like I've you know

quit my business that I'd started seven

years in when there's hundreds and

hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of

employees and my first reaction I got to

be honest was like I was like when I

knew I was going to quit I was so mad

and I wrote this email and it was kind

of bitter and whatever else when I

realized I was actually going to send

this email there was this little pause

and this is when I was in I was in

Portugal at the time and I got really

emotional yeah because that's when you

look back and go I'm actually going here

yeah like a hit shot yeah it's all said

and done now yeah and I'm I'm leaving

and so I've redid the email and it was

like a really nice one it was like a

thank you to like the board and stuff

for taking the chance on me and stuff so

yeah it's tough tough though because

that was tough when he said that when a

physio said that

I was gone I was gone crying all the way

home in the car

and people don't know that

like people probably thought like oh

yeah he's like he's happy silly but I

needed to leave

I wasn't playing

so why am I gonna like I got for the

contract but

what's the point I'm not gonna play so

I wouldn't rather

like yeah biggest club in the world but

happiness is more important for me and I

needed to be happy and go somewhere I'm

loved on

it's been a difficult start to the

season for Nottingham on the pitch

um as we sit here now I believe there in

the relegation Zone in the table

what's your what's your view on the

start of the year for Nottingham

I think it's always going to be tough

especially with new players coming in I

think 22-23 yeah crazy

so it's always going to be tough but

I feel like

I feel like especially the Tottenham

game The Palace game you know we started

getting a bit more momentum

everyone knows you know the rules and

responsibilities now we played with each

other

um you know a lot more and you know we

understand each other a lot more so I

felt like

you know the connection was especially

Tottenham and the palace game and then

obviously now we've had a break but I

think they break and doors does go to

regroup and

you know really you know reevaluate and

you know see what

what the main aim is for the season and

you know of course we don't bring my

location so you know we won't be winning

games on a way we need to do a lot

better

because

um you know we're struggling away from

home at the moment but you know home

games can be really crucial on key

because the atmosphere is

nothing I've like I've never heard it

like before I've never been a nightmare

feel like that for the game like Etc I

got goosebumps every time

and I feel like we need to really

I think this big D I think everyone

knows what the situation I'm in anyway

on just about

you know

maintain and keep working hard

because the attackers have got to score

and you know we've got to do our job

um

you know it's different from me because

you know I've been playing United and

you know of course we have all the ball

and you know we're getting shots and

chances on that of course it's gonna be

difficult I'm not even where you know

you might not see the wall as much and

you're not getting as many shots and

you're not create as many chances but

you know I thrive off these moments and

these and these challenges it's a new

challenge and

you know I'm happy to be there

um you know I love training I love I

love playing playing in the games and

that's the most important just to be

happy for me

off the pitch you know you're 29 now

players I think the average age of a

player usually goes I don't know 32-ish

I don't know

what are you thinking about off the

pitch what's going on in your world I

know you've got your you've got your

brand you're doing several Investments

and sort of deals you've got a media

company give me a view of what what that

looks like

so even you know I don't I've always you

know off the pitch I've always I'm

always on the go I always want to know

what the next thing is to do

what's the next investment what can I be

involved in what can I do Esports comes

gaming love gaming

Esports team let's do Esports team

brand love fashion that's so brand

at the launch for the Brandon was like

it was amazing I feel like 3 000 people

turned up like Victoria Warehouse

and then at the night time

little baby was there we've got a little

baby to perform

anyway even big big then

um

but I just wanna

I just want to be happy and do things

like

I want to do to make me happy

and

you know the investment the business

side of things

of course I want to set up things

from my little sister from my little

brother

for my daughter when she grows up like

they can just go into straight away and

I think with the media company

um it's called One Touch

and guess what it's got one touch

uh because you play one touch with your

granddad mm-hmm

something at One Touch

um and obviously the channel 4

documentary came from from Latin

I feel like it's just easier because

if I do a commercial now

JBL commercial

and

they're getting their production

but I can be like well you can use my

production then

like the talent can get paid

um Productions you can get paid at the

same time

so it's a win-win and all the con like

anything that we do that we

um video record we get last like final

say so anyway so it's all under our

umbrella

and like I say after football I want to

go into acting

so

maybe starting this now and

maybe start doing a little bit of voice

over work and like you know reanimation

kind of thing

um but I need to say drama classes I've

not done that yet why acting so when you

think about your life after football

some people think about being a pundit

or a manager or a coach whatever you're

thinking acting yeah how come

this is all films man I just I've always

been a big film lover

and

you know to be involved in

you know a film or a series would be you

know be amazing and

like I say I need to

to really you know

home in on on the drama side of things

and you know learn like I'm really bad

Reliance to be honest what would be your

dream role have you got an idea in mind

for what

um what kind of like acting

let's give me an example

I think I'm gonna start comedy comedy

I'm gonna start comedy first

and then

you know when you see the interstellars

and the inceptions

them kind of rules but that's going to

take time like you're not going to be

you're not gonna be thrown in straight

away

maybe a bit part here and there but you

know for the for the for the future with

with a media company I've got so many

things you know in in the lineup and

obviously it's based in LA and that's

where

eventually hopefully I want to finish

football

you want to finish in America yeah I

think so

at the very center of your documentary

is the story of your mother

I found this

wonderful picture

what does she mean to you

no she's everything mom

like she's been through it Mom