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>> The Joe Rogan Experience.

>> TRAIN BY DAY. JOE ROGAN PODCAST BY

NIGHT. All day.

>> David, welcome to the show.

>> Pull on up to the microphone. Get that

sucker up like a fist from your face.

Uh, I first heard about you from that

guy, Art Bell, the GOAT.

>> The greatest.

>> Yeah, he was. Uh, I used to love

listening to his show. uh coming home

from the comedy store. We come home at

like 1:00 in the morning and coast to

coast with Art Bell from the Kingdom of

Nigh. It was awesome. And uh that's when

I I first uh got turned on to your work.

So tell everybody you uh you started off

in law enforcement,

right? That's your background,

>> correct?

>> How did you get involved in this mystery

of people going missing?

So, I had already written a couple of

books and I was at Yusede National Park

doing some research on another topic

and two rangers are following me around

and I went back to my room that was

at the park and about an hour and a half

later, one of the rangers comes to my

room and he's in plain clothes and he

knocks on my door and he says, "Hey

Dave, I'm Ranger so and so. I'm here off

duty. I want to talk to you about some

missing people. I said, "Come on." So,

we start talking and he says that he

knew about me probably the way he knew

about me. And he says, "I know you're

from law enforcement. Somebody look

needs to look into this." About an hour

and a half later, his partner shows up

at the door. And they said that they've

worked at different parks over the

years. And while they were working at

those parks, there were missing people.

And he said at the beginning there was a

lot of publicity, a lot of people

interested, a lot of activity and then

with time with within about 10 15 days

all of that would end.

and he said, 'We got concerned and we

did a Freedom of Information Act against

our own agency to get the reports and we

couldn't get the reports and then we did

a Freedom of Information Act request on

other cases and we couldn't get the

reports and we got concerned because

after that initial 10 14 day period of

searching is all over there's nothing

else that happens. That's it. and he

said, "Somebody ought to look into this

because there's a lot of people missing

and the park service doesn't talk about

it." Now, what was he assuming? Was he

assuming something nefarious was going

on or was he assuming that it was a a

lack of commitment to finding the

bodies? Because you got to assume most

people after 14 days lost in the woods

are probably going to die. I think all

the above.

He thought that there were too many

people going missing. there wasn't

enough follow-up being done

and nobody seemed to care. So, if you

were being pragmatic and you weren't

like diving into mysteries and the stuff

that I like, the fun stuff, you would

say, well, they don't have any

resources. You know, there's not enough

people to go looking. when you think

about the actual square miles that you

would have to cover to find a body and

then also the reality of predators and

all these different animals that are

going to eat bodies. If a body's there,

there's not going to be much left. You

spent obviously you spent time in the

woods. Have you ever seen a dead

mountain lion?

>> No, I've never seen I've never seen a

dead bear.

>> Uh

I've only seen dead bears because I was

hunting. I've never seen a dead bear.

Well, no, that's not true. No, I did. We

did find one, but I think um it's very

rare, but that one was recently dead. He

was killed by another bear. I think most

of the time when you find uh dead

animals, it's very recent. And if an

animal's dead and it's left alone in the

woods, within a certain amount of time,

something's going to eat it.

Everything's going to eat it, including

the bones. There's almost nothing left

by the time they get done with it.

>> 100%.

>> Yeah. But one thing I learned from being

around rangers in all these years now is

that there's few things that belong to

us, what that we go into the woods with

that are always going to be there.

Namely, our shoes, belt buckles, belt

buckles, leather, anything,

um, the rubber waistband of your

underwear. These kind of things stay

stay forever. A rifle, a pistol,

>> a bow. and those things you're going to

find. But getting back to the point of

these guys, there were too many people

going missing in a short period of time

that no one seemed to care about. That

was really their main focus.

>> And somebody ought to look into it.

Somebody ought to start collecting data.

Nobody did.

And maybe somebody from the outside,

they're the inside. Maybe somebody from

the outside would have more luck putting

this all together rather than them. That

was kind of the gist of it. Well,

there's some cases that are just flatout

weird. Like some cases like people go

missing, they die, animals eat them,

that's a wrap. That makes sense to me.

But there's a few cases and one of them

you covered was a guy, I believe he was

from Canada that went skiing in New York

and he went missing and then he showed

up 2500 miles later in California with

his ski clothes on and he didn't know

what happened.

>> Yeah. That was uh he was a fireman from

I think Toronto that went with a bunch

of friends to New York on like a weekend

ski trip and the guys were all getting

together at the end of the day to leave

and they couldn't find him. He says he

wakes up on a truck traveling from like

Reno to Sacramento.

Woke up in the back of a truck. No,

sitting in the front seat. And he said

that he was as he wakes up, he's

talking. It's not like he was asleep and

woke up. It's like his mind suddenly

flashed open. Hey, you're alive now. You

can keep talking. And he goes, "But I

was talking to the driver and we're

traveling."

The driver drops him off at Sacramento

airport.

He doesn't remember anything, but he

remembers his home phone number. He

calls his wife in Toronto and she goes,

"Hey, everyone's searching for you,

thinking you're still at the ski

resort." He go he has all the ski

clothes on. How many days later?

>> I don't remember. But even he doesn't

make sense of it. He doesn't know how he

got in the truck. The truck driver left.

Nobody knows who the truck driver was.

That was kind of the the whole story. It

wasn't a lot.

>> So he didn't ask the truck driver, "Hey,

where'd you pick me up?"

>> I think he was embarrassed.

>> Just embarrassed that he was in the

truck and doesn't remember how he got in

there.

>> Yeah.

Okay. So, he didn't say anything. And

did he have any memories from skiing to

like did he ever do like regressive

hypnosis or anything?

>> If he did, it never went public.

>> H was that the weirdest one?

>> Oh, no. There's there's weird.

>> What's the weirdest one you heard of?

>> The strangest disappearance story.

There's a lot of people

that disappear that don't have a memory.

And if you look back and you study

missing people, those people

historically have been abducted.

And there's something about that

abduction experience where they can take

away part of your mind.

>> You think alien abduction. That's what

you're saying.

>> Alien entity,

>> something

>> some some type of foreign

>> Just want to be clear, we're not talking

about like like a bad person abducting

person. No, we're talking about

>> some kind of entity,

>> okay?

>> And they take away part of that mind

where they were probably doing something

to you that they don't want you to know,

>> right?

>> And

there's a lot of those there's a whole

segment of people that I have chronicled

that were truck drivers

who have amnesia who were found in

conditions that were very strange. There

was a truck driver in the Midwest where

salt of the earth kind of guy drove

drove independently wife and a couple

kids. He picks up a load. I want I want

to say it was pigs and he's his truck is

found like outside of Indiana on a

little two-lane highway stopped on the

side of the road.

He's not anywhere to be found, but his

coat is found in a ditch on the other

side of the other lane. So the sheriff

comes out, they do a huge search,

flyovers, canines, goes on for like four

or five days, nothing.

Week and a half later, his body is found

in that field in the spot where they had

searched all that time. Impossible to

miss. Corner says he's been dead for two

weeks.

Well, the chef can't make sense of that

because he searched that with dogs and

people. That guy should have been there.

But Joe, I have 1,500 of those cases

where canines were brought in, multiple

K9 teams, multiple searches, and people

were not found. And the point I try to

make about this is that it's not that

the searchers are inept

because I don't believe that. And I

don't believe that the canines fail

multiple multiple times because I don't

believe that can happen. I don't believe

they were there when they were

searching. They were left there later

on.

And so you've been you've been into this

for a long time, right? What was the

first case that you looked into that got

you thinking something weird's going on?

Probably would have been at Yoseite and

there was a girl named Stacy Eris

and she just weirdly she grew up

like five miles from me. I I grew up in

a little city, Certino, California. She

grew up in Saratoga, the next town over.

She went with her dad on a trip by horse

sponsored by a contractor in the park at

Yusede, and they were going to ride into

this place called the High Sierra Camp,

her and her dad and five other people.

and they get uh escorted in by a cowboy

contractor and they come to these cabins

and her dad's an older guy. They get to

the cabin and she says, "Hey, Dad, I'm

going to go over here to the point. I'm

going to take some pictures." She brings

her camera and one of the guys, a

72-year-old guy, is sitting at that

point and she goes, "I'm going to go

right there and sit with him and take

some pictures." He goes, "Sure." Dad

watches her walk out. They sits down.

old old guy barely could ride the horse.

She's taking pictures. She gets up and

down at the bottom of the hill there's a

small lake and surrounding the lake

there's trees.

She walks down into the trees

presumably to take pictures of the lake,

but she doesn't come back.

Big search. I'm talking about one of the

biggest searches in Yoseite history. and

they find the lens cap to a camera

inside that path in the treeine. They

never find her.

And

that happened 46 years ago. I filed the

Freedom of Information Act for that

report and all the investigation into it

and I get denied. I appealed. I got

denied.

Finally, a special agent from the park

service. Just so people know, the park

service has uniformed

police officers, National Park Service

police that patrol their parks, and they

go to the National Law Enforcement

Academy.

Up above them, they have special agents,

detectives,

and they are doing all the follow-up

work that the police officers in the

field do. This case goes to a special

agent.

There's been nothing done on this case

in 40 years. The special agent calls me,

"Why do you want the case?" I said,

"Well, that's an irrelevant question

according to FOIA. You can't ask that."

And he goes, "Well, I want to know." I

said, "Well, it's been 47 years. I doubt

anyone's looked at it. Have you looked

at it?" "No, nobody's looked at it." I

said, "Well, I'd like a copy of it just

to understand what happened." He goes,

"You're never going to get the case."

This guy's name was special agent you.

Why you? I said, 'Wh? And he says, none

of your business. You're never going to

get it. I said, 'First of, why talk to

me like that? I'm prior law enforcement.

I'm I'm not being rude. I just want to

know. He goes, forget it. Drop it.

You're never going to see it. I said,

no, I want that case. And he goes, you

don't you've never seen any other

missing person case, and you're not

going to see this one. I said, "Whoa, I

have over 30 missing person cases from

your agency from around the United

States that I've foyed before and I've

received. You're a liar. You said that

to me." I said, "No, I'm not a liar. I

don't lie and this is the truth." He

goes, "Well, you're not getting this

one.

Anything else you want to know?" I said,

"No, I think you've done it." And that

was it.

In that amount of time, I've really

found out nothing more about the Stacy

case. 14-year-old girl, disappeared,

never found. Nobody's ever done anything

on the case in 40 years. I still haven't

seen it. Now, I talked to Tim Burchett,

who you had in here the other day. And I

explained to him, I want an a meeting

with Bergam, and I want to lay out what

I have and explain the obstruction,

>> the head of the Department of the

Interior. Okay. Doug Bergam.

>> Okay.

and explain to him uh the obstructions

that are happening in his agency. Those

are our reports. If nobody's looked at

it in 40 plus years, what does it matter

if I have it?

>> Right. The people that were working back

then aren't working anymore. It's not

like anyone's going to get in trouble.

>> No, half of them are dead,

>> right?

>> And

Tim said, "Okay, uh I'll have my people

get a hold of you." They got a hold of

me. They said that they called DOI. They

said that DO DOI people said, "Yeah,

we'll get a hold of you." I called them

three times. They won't call me back.

So, what do you think's going on?

>> So, when you look at the totality of and

let's just talk about Yusede.

As I dug into it, there's probably over

50 people missing in Yoseite as we talk

right now. When I asked for a list from

Yusede from the Department of the

Interior 12 years ago, they said they

don't have a list. I asked for a list of

missing people from the entire system in

the Department of Interior. They said,

'We don't have a list. And I said,

'Well, okay. I've written so many books.

I'm a printed author. I'm going to ask

you to put that list together for me.

According to the rules, I fit that

criteria to ask,

>> but they said they don't have a list,

>> right? But I asked them to put one

together.

>> Okay?

>> And they said, "We'll get back to you."

They said, "No, you don't qualify,

but if you want us to put together a

list from the entire system, it's going

to cost you $1.4 million.

If you want a list from Yusede, that's

going to cost you $34,000."

So, that got me really upset. Over the

next two years, I put the list together.

Joe, the third year, you know what

Yusede did? They released a list of

missing people from Yuseite. So, I knew

I got all the people from Yuseite. I

wrote about him in my books. They still

haven't released a list from the entire

system.

>> So, do you think they released it

because you were pressuring them? No.

So, like this, you could look at it a

bunch of different ways. I'm trying to

like look at it from the skeptic's

perspective. You'd say, "Well, this is

clear. A bunch of people don't want to

do their job. They're lazy. They don't

like this guy coming along and asking

for information." But you think there's

something weird going on.

Here's a foyer I found on their website

that was sent to him in 2011. It says

that the in that uh appeal was properly

invoked because of exemption 7A. And

here's I'll let you read that. What that

is

>> 7A permits the withholding of records or

information complied or compiled rather

for law enforcement purposes but only to

the extent that the production of such

law enforcement records or information

could reasonably be expected to

interfere with enforcement proceedings.

So

they could withhold it because you could

interfere with enforcement proceedings

>> 40 years later or 30 years later I

guess.

>> That's [ __ ] weird. The exemption is

intended to prevent premature disclosure

of the investigate investigatory

materials that might be used in law

enforcement action. 40 years later,

>> it says the incident is still on in

criminal investigations. The incident is

still ongoing.

>> 40 years later, what?

Okay. Tinfoil hat firmly placed on your

head. What do you think's going on? So,

first of all, missing people

investigations are not criminal

investigations,

>> right? There's nothing criminal about

disappearing. If it's a criminal

investigation and there's criminal

aspects to it, it shouldn't be a missing

person case. It ought to be suspicious

circumstances investigated by a criminal

investigator.

>> Right?

>> It has a classification as a missing

person. And what they're not saying

there is what about the other 40 cases

I've already gotten from them that are

since that that are missing person

cases.

>> Right?

So, that's a little weird. But I could

also see incompetent people that don't

want to work. They don't want to do

their job and they're like, "Fuck this

guy. I don't want to do his work. I

don't want to go. Why is he asking me

for this information? He's just a kooky

author."

I could see that. But like, what do you

think might be going on with these

people?

>> So, when I was in law enforcement, I

worked on the SWAT team and we had

canines assigned to our team. Joe, I

can't ever remember us looking for

someone with a dog and the dog didn't

find the person.

>> Right.

>> I have 1,200 to,500 cases where they

bring a canine to find a missing person

and the dog can't track, won't track, or

turns around, comes down and sits down

and is not interested in tracking.

That's totally outside the behavior of a

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that what happened to that woman

recently that went missing that was uh a

part of this whole group of scientists

that were involved in propulsion

research?

>> Reza.

>> Yeah. Same sort of situation, right? She

was with her friend. Uh they were

hiking. They had just talked. The friend

was ahead of her. And the friend turned

around to ask her a question. She was

gone. They do an investigation. They

bring in dogs. Can't find anything. The

lady's just gone. 100%.

You're 100% right. It doesn't make any

sense. And it does. It fit that 411

criteria that I laid down, which is why

I did a video about it.

her disappearance doesn't make sense.

So, do you have suspicions?

Like, do you think something

supernatural is going on? Do you think

something extraterrestrial or

interdimensional? Like, what do you

think is involved in these people going

missing?

First of all, I don't know.

>> Right. In my books, I've laid out facts

and I let the viewer decide.

But one thing I did find because I've

written about a lot of hunters that have

disappeared.

And let's say you and I go out and we're

going to go pig hunting at your friend's

farm down the way. And you say, "Hey

Dave, you go that way and I'll go that

way and I'll meet you in an hour." Okay.

So, in my world, I call that point of

separation.

Every time on a missing hunter case,

it's at that point of separation that

something happens. It never happens when

they're together. It always happens when

people are alone. That's point number

one. Number two is the canine issue.

Canines failure to pick up a scent. They

bring in professional trackers and they

can't find tracks. That's not normal.

Um, a lot of times, say in Alaska, they

have some great native trackers up there

and they can't find people and every

other time they can. So, it's like if

you're going from A to B, you're going

to leave a scent and you're going to

leave a track,

>> right?

>> Well, they can't find that and that's

not normal.

So, in my I made a movie called Missing

411: The Hunted. And in that movie,

there was a case of 12 12 guys are

planting trees on the side of a mountain

in Washington State. And there's a herd

of elk at the bottom of the mountain.

And all of these guys see this classic

UFO come up the mountain, hover over one

elk.

The herd scatters, but one elk doesn't.

It just stands there. And then without

anything between the UFO and the elk, it

picks the elk up and it's gone. The guys

all say, "F this. I'm out of here." The

whole group of planners leave and the

manager for the company says, "Whoa,

guys, hold on. What's going on?"

So they call Muon out, Mutual UFO

Network. They bring some investigators

out and they interview these guys one by

one. And they all say the same thing.

and they say, "What we're afraid of is

we're next. They just took that elk, but

we're next." So that's in the movie.

Keep that in your back of your mind.

There's a guy named Carl in Wyoming.

He's hunting in the Medicine Bow

National Forest alone.

Sees some elk 100 yards away. Lines up

with his rifle. Boom. He says, "Dave,

it's like everything went into slow

motion. I see the bullet come out the

gun. about three or four feet and it

drops to the ground.

Says, I walked over and he goes, they

all didn't move and I pick it up the

bullet. I put the bullet in my pocket

and then two alien type entities walk up

to me and they engage him in mind speak

and they what they do is they eventually

take him on a craft and they take the

elk on the craft

and it's like the elk are frozen there

in time

and they have him march behind a screen

and they said we don't want you. You're

going back, mind of mine. And he goes,

"What's going on?" He goes, "You're

going back." He says, "The next thing I

remember is falling 10 to 15 ft." He's

guessing. He hits his shoulder, probably

displaces it, and he rolls down a hill.

They're already searching for him

because he's missing his wife, the

sheriff, and they take him back and they

take him to a hospital

and they're taking X-rays. and he had

tuberculo tuberculosis scars as a kid.

Those are no longer there.

And he had other medical issues that are

completely cured.

The investigators came out and they the

Wyoming Department of Law Enforcement

looked at that bullet and did an exam on

it and they could not figure out what

that bullet hit to make it deform in the

manner that it did. I have pictures of

it in the movie. It's It's very odd.

See if you can find the Is the pictures

online?

>> I'm looking. I'm looking.

>> Of course you are.

>> If you go to Tuby Tubi, Missing 411 The

Hunted, the uh the movie is there for

free. You guys could watch it.

>> Also, check out Gearheads Gone Wild.

It's my friend's show. Okay. So, uh No

Tuberculosis, Scars, The Bullet.

So, I'm talking to Carl and I said,

"Well, why do you think they sent you

back?"

He says, "Well, I think it's cuz I had a

vasectomy."

I said, "Oh, did they say anything to

you about that?" "No,

okay." So, he was 91 years old when I

interviewed him. Sharp as attack. How

old was he when this encounter happened?

>> I think he was 38, 39.

And uh

again, this happened in the Medicine Bow

National Forest.

>> Where is that? Medicine Bow is directly

uh I'd say about 75 miles northwest of

Cheyenne.

So at about the same time, the Air Force

base in Cheyenne is having a group of

cluster UFO sightings above the ICBM

sites.

And that was never made public at this

time. It was 30, 40, 50 years later

through uh Robert Hastings and other Air

Force personnel came out that these

documents started to show up. So Carl

would have never known what was

happening at the same time these things

in Cheyenne were happening.

And then you think about what's going on

in Wyoming that would cause this. But

really the epiphany to me with Carl

is there's a lot of people in the woods

that are found quote unquote they fell.

They always fall alone and they always

fall in places where if you and I are in

the woods, we're going to be pretty

careful when we're alone. We're not

going to be walking off a cliff. We're

going to be careful. A lot of these

people are found under very unusual

circumstances dead at the bottom of an

area that you just don't think makes

sense

and they couldn't be tracked.

So with Carl,

when you think about him being taken, a

hunter

hunting elk, nobody gets seen, nothing's

heard.

So, I did a circumference around the

area where he went

and it's in the movie. There's a group

of German hunters. Carl was German.

German hunters that have disappeared.

Nobody else but German that have

disappeared in that area.

And then when you look at the scope of

what I've done in my work, I went

backwards and I found there's a lot of

German people that have been abducted

more than the normal population of

people.

And these German hunters really were the

opening valve to me that something odd

was happening with German.

>> What do you think that is? Why German?

>> I really wish I knew. That's probably

outside my pay grade. I don't know. Oh,

I mean there's a lot of rumors about the

Germans having associations with aliens.

>> Oh, during the Nazi times. Yeah.

>> Right.

>> Well, there's a lot of like weird occult

stuff going on with the Nazis, right?

>> And they were making like what looked

like a UFO. They were constructing these

things that looked like flying saucers,

>> right?

>> Yeah.

>> Um, you know the Travis Walton case?

>> Oh, very well.

>> Yeah. This is I have his bobblehead. he

came in here. Um, that's another guy

that went missing in the woods and it's

a similar story. It, you know, he was

taken aboard some sort of a craft,

multiple witnesses, including people who

hated him. One guy who he actually got

in a fist fight with earlier that day

and they all told the same story. They

all passed polygraph tests. He shows up

days later

um with this crazy story that he had

been hit by a beam of light. They took

him aboard this craft, fixed him, fixed

whatever happened to him and

communicated with him and then dropped

him back off.

I know Travis well. In fact, I was doing

a conference in Phoenix and he brought

his son to the conference because his

son wanted to me meet me because a lot

of my work focused around things that

happened to Travis.

And I I think Travis's case is probably

not unique and there's probably

thousands of people out there that just

don't want to talk about it. They just

want it to go away

>> cuz it's too weird and cuz you feel like

a fool.

>> Yeah. That and I think maybe they're

afraid that they're going to get pigeon

holed as what you just said. Odd,

strange.

>> You're a crazy person.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah. Yeah, the Travis case is very

interesting cuz I I mean this is just

I mean I'm just saying this but most

people who lie they lie about a lot of

stuff. They don't just have one crazy

lie from the 1970s that they keep

repeating exactly the same way and have

witnesses. You know that's the whole

thing is very strange. Also the fact

that he went missing in the woods and

then showed up multiple days later.

There's nothing wrong with him. He's not

dehydrated. He's not starving to death.

He's fine. He's just weirded out. And he

has this crazy story.

And it's not like his story is unique

either. That's what's very strange. The

people that have been abducted, they all

have very similar stories. They have sim

similar stories about medical

examinations, being taken aboard a

craft, things communicating with them

telepathically.

you know, um there's there's no like

delusions of grandeur like you have

you're the chosen one, you're unique,

you're Neo, you're the one we wanted, we

came here for you. There's no nothing

kooky like that. It's all just they want

to know what's going on with the human

species and they find a specimen, they

do an examination, and it sounds

completely insane, but we do that. We do

that with species. We do that with other

things. We do that with primates. We do

that with all kinds of different animals

that we research. I mean, people,

there's probably someone doing it right

now in the Congo, probably looking for

some animals, you know, tranquiliz

tranquilizing some animal, doing studies

on it, releasing it back into the wild.

We do it all the time. Yeah.

>> One of the things I say at conferences

is, "What if we're the ant farm?"

>> Yeah,

>> that took a while to find. So, this is

the bullet.

So, this is um Thank you, Jamie. This is

the bullet that this guy shot and it hit

something right in front of him. It just

completely deformed. That bullet looks

like it hit a wall. Like it hit like

something like a a giant plate of steel

or something. I mean, it's just

completely flattened. That's not like a

bullet that hits an animal,

you know? bullets that hit well it could

hit bones and stuff and get distorted

but it wouldn't be intact like that.

That looks like an intact bullet that

just flattened out hitting something

completely immovable.

Very weird.

One of the things that Carl said that

they told him is when he got on that

craft is he said, "Hey, you have my

elk." And they said, "Yeah, it's Carl."

They said that we often come down to

your earth and we take animals and we

study them and

you happen to be one of the people that

was right there when we were taking

that. So, we took you too.

And I've heard this before from other

abductees that just like you said, we

look at and test animals. Apparently,

they're monitoring the health of our

planet by testing animals themselves.

So he said they communicated with him

telepathically. Yes. What did he say

they they talked to him about?

So the elk Why are they interested in

elk? That's a good question. And

>> because they're cool. Elk are very cool.

>> Pretty cool. Yes, they are. Um, now

there's an that's an interesting point

because there are more hunters that are

abducted or that disappear hunting elk

than any other animal. And it's not that

there's more hunters hunting elk.

There's more hunters hunting deer on the

whole in the United States, but for some

reason there's more hunters that

disappear hunting elk. And I've said

this in my books before. Well, for as a

hunter, what one thing that I would say

is that when you're hunting elk, you're

in the back country for the most part.

You're in wild remote areas with

mountains. You're in um a place with

very few people. It's very hard to get

to them. Um whereas deer hunting, a lot

of is done on farms, a lot of is done on

flat land. You know, a lot of treeand

hunting. deer, whitetailed deer

specifically in America, North America,

are the most hunted animal. Uh but if

you've ever gone whitetail hunting, a

lot of it is in and around farmland. And

um you you never very rarely at least

you're hunting whitetail deer in the

mountains, remote mountain ranges. uh mu

deer. You hunt mu deer in remote

mountain ranges, but whitetail deer,

they're they tend to populate around

humans and and around agriculture.

So, that kind of makes sense if they

want to be stealthy. If they're trying

to not be detected by as many people,

you would you would pro also you

probably if you were gonna abduct

someone and be reasonably sure that no

one was going to see you do it, you

would probably go where there's very few

people and just some random guy who's

decided to hike up to 10,000 ft and

chase a herd of elk.

Another thing I've heard from Carl is

that he was told that these entities,

whoever they are, have the ability to

freeze time and space. And remember what

I said, elk, the elk he was looking at,

he said he shot and they didn't move.

It's like they were frozen. And they

were frozen in that same position when

he got on the craft.

Time and space being that everything

around him, nobody could walk in, nobody

could walk out. It's like the time and

space that he and the entity and the elk

were in were frozen.

It's a hard thing to grasp, but I've

heard this before. It is a hard thing to

grasp. But the people that speculate on

how these

advanced species, whatever they are,

they're able to travel that there's some

sort of manipulation of spaceime that

it's not as simple as like what we do,

which is very crude. We do propulsion.

We burn things and push stuff out the

back and it makes stuff go forward. Or

we have an internal combustion engine

that does the same thing. It's makes

explosions inside the engine, burns

things, pushes the pistons around,

forces the transmission, and it moves.

What these things supposedly do, and

again, this is all just crazy talk, but

what they're able to do is manipulate

spaceime itself and instantaneously

travel from one place to the next cuz

they have a control over the universe in

a way that with us it's like completely

theoretical. Like there's this woman

that speculates that in the future

someday, you know, with many many many

advancements and who knows how many

years of we will be able to travel

quantumly like the way quantum particles

are entangled. She believes that perhaps

the entire universe works that way and

that everything is connected and that

this

thing that we have this idea that the

distance between stars is far too vast

for a human to travel because you can't

travel past the speed of light. And if

you did travel past the speed of light,

it would still take, you know, even if

you went like two times the speed of

light or three times the speed of light,

it would still take thousands and

thousands of years to just get to the

closest planets outside of our solar

system. And she thinks that one day

perhaps, if not humans or whatever is

coming after humans, we'll be able to

quantumly travel. And you would imagine

that would involve some sort of

manipulation of space and time. that we

can't quite understand

that we're just we're just we're talking

about it like it's magic. But again, if

you were talking to someone from the

1400s about a cell phone, hey, I can

FaceTime my friend in Australia, they'd

go, "What the [ __ ] are you talking

about?" Well, I pick out this device in

my pocket that's as thin as a few slices

of paper and uh through that I can I can

like stare at my friend and he could see

me and I can see him. Like that's magic.

You're talking crazy talk. There's

nothing. There's no accord. There's no

nothing. Somehow or another. There's

like what are you sending that's being

received and it comes into HD video with

sound and it it perfectly lines up with

the way the person's talking. You hear

it in real time. That's crazy. That

doesn't even make sense. But yet we just

are so accustomed to it that it's

normal. Oh, I'm getting a FaceTime call

from my friend. Oh, hey. What's up,

buddy? You know, we think it's normal.

And then you got to imagine if you could

just push into the future and imagine

thousands of years of innovation in

technology. Like what what does that

look like? You know, communication used

to be you had to shout. You know, Bob's

over there 100 yards away. You have to

put your hands, we're going to the left.

You know, now you could just text them

or you could call them. and that the

ability to communicate at vast distances

will one day be very similar to the way

we travel. We can travel vast distances

instantaneously.

part of the entanglement idea that you

talked about. What if you're in Austin

and I go back to Whitefish, Montana? And

what if we had the ability to think,

"Hey, Joe, I forgot to tell you this

when I was on your show and I told you

by my mind." Now, people would say, "Oh,

that's stupid. That's ridiculous." But

I've talked to people that are way

smarter than me that say that part of

this entanglement is is that what if

you're in space and you're on the far

side of the moon? And what if we all

have that ability right now to affect

others in other places and our thinking

and our mind is really more powerful and

we are this spiderweb of entanglement

that we don't quite understand right

now. And let me where this came from is

George Knap been on his show like 30

times. He had a guy named Colum Kellaher

who was the head of all investigations

for Bigalow at Skinwalker Ranch. And

George said, "Hey Dave, Keller wants you

to come out to Las Vegas. He thinks some

of the work that they're doing at the

ranch right now overlaps with your work

on missing people."

So I came out to Las Vegas three or four

times, met with Keller, and we talked

about just what you're talking about

right now, this overlapping of

understanding consciousness because it's

much more complex than some people are

willing or even for us to understand.

But what if what's happening on Earth

right now, whether it's abductions,

cattle mutilations, UFOs,

is really something that is so beyond

us. We try to think in rational terms,

well, they're taking us for our sperm or

they're taking us for our eggs. What if

it's something a lot lot more deep than

really we could comprehend right now?

>> Like what?

>> I don't know. I'm asking you, Joe.

But he his point being that all the time

they spent almost 20 years at that ranch

investigating things. And he tells me

about this one incident and he says,

"I've got a physicist up on the hill

with another researcher.

It's 2:00 in the morning. They're

looking down at the meadow and they see

this bright light

and this bright light starts to get

bigger. And if you could tell your guy,

he could pick it up right now on uh if

you go to Amazon to the movie American

Sasquatch Man or Legend. It's my movie.

We have it there. And it starts getting

bigger.

>> Uhhuh.

>> And one guy doesn't have night vision.

The other guy does. And this round thing

keeps getting bigger and bigger till

eventually it's like you're looking down

a tube. And he says it's almost

three-dimensional because you could see

something at the far end of the tube

and the physicist is handing the night

vision back and they're sharing it.

Eventually the tube gets to be about

this big

that something twice the size of you and

I could crawl through.

All of a sudden they see something

crawling down the tube.

It crawls out. It jumps down onto the

land and they see it's so dark even with

night vision that they could just see a

silhouette and it's bipeedal

seven or eightt tall all black in color.

>> Is it that

>> is this it?

>> No.

>> Okay.

>> Well, sound like it sound like what

you're talking

>> is that the the documentary you're

talking about?

>> No, it's not mine.

>> Something different.

>> Yeah.

>> Sasquatch. American Sasquatch.

>> Man, myth or monster.

>> Isn't that what you said?

>> Is that it?

>> That's it. Yeah,

>> that's okay.

>> So, this is your film?

>> That is the film, but that's not what

I'm talking about.

>> Where is it in the film? Do you

remember?

>> It's near the near the end, like

threequarters of the way through it.

It's with my interview with Keller, and

he's talking about it and and this

thing, and then it walks away on on two

feet. And when we talk about this, he

said, "Doesn't make any sense to us."

You know, did we just see a portal open

up and an entity from another dimension

crawl through into our dimension? And is

that the access point that they're

using? And can they open this at certain

times and close it at certain times at

will?

And really that was the first time that

I had heard this from someone credible

that this can happen. And if you think

about the people at the ranch today,

they said, "Well, the amount of energy

it takes to open a portal is so many

times greater than an atom bomb that it

doesn't make sense that that could be

the answer to this." Well, maybe their

answer to what a portal is is different.

But what these guys saw doesn't make a

lot of sense to us. Well, the whole

Bigfoot thing doesn't make a lot of

sense. One of the reasons why the

Bigfoot thing doesn't make a lot of

sense is that um Native Americans don't

have a lot of mythological creatures.

It's not like they have a ton of dragons

and demons and pixies and wood sprites.

There's not. But there's over a hund

Isn't Didn't we look this up? The the

the the name for Sasquatch?

>> Yeah, there's a bunch. There's like 50

different names that they have for this

one thing that they universally

described as a bipeedal hairy ape-like

creature that's 8 to 10 feet tall.

And there's so many sightings of this

one thing. It's not like people keep

talking about different animals like I

saw an elephant that has six legs. No,

it's always bipeedal homminids.

It's weird. It's a weird So, because

like

I've never seen compelling Bigfoot

footage. It all looks [ __ ] The

Patterson footage I think is nonsense. I

think it's a guy in a monkey suit for

sure. I think uh most of what you see in

terms of like photographic evidence is

nonsense. But there's too many stories.

There's too many stories for me to

completely dismiss it. And I've always

wondered if it's some sort of an

interdimensional experience and that

this thing may be the fact that it's in

the woods and that they happen under

heightened awareness because you're in

the woods and you're probably very

nervous and freaked out. So, you're

probably in a very bizarre state of mind

and all of a sudden you encounter

something that makes zero sense and the

same thing gets encountered by people

over and over again. And you could write

that. Now, if you're a cynical person or

a rational person, which I'm neither one

of those, you you could you could write

it off and you could say, "Well, there's

an archetype. People have talked about

this creature, you know, for so long

that that's what you expect to see. So

that's what you make yourself see, you

know, maybe maybe it's a bear that walks

on two legs because we know they do

that. Particularly black bears, they

walk on two legs all the time. I've seen

them walk on two legs. It's very weird.

But they don't describe it like a bear.

They describe it like an ape. They they

they say it has long arms like an ape

and that it looks at you and that these

things exist in the forest like deep in

the forest where there's no people and

then when people go out there they

encounter them and the story is just

it's like the UFO abduction story. It's

so similar. It's so similar over and

over again. like a very similar story.

And you've always got to separate the

kooky stories because there's always a

bunch of crazy people that make things

up. There's a bunch of people that are

probably on psychiatric drugs or they're

tripping balls on mushrooms or whatever

it is. There's a bunch of people that

see things that maybe aren't there at

all. But then there's enough of these

stories where you got to go, man, if

just one of these is true, one out of a

hundred. And then there's thousands of

them. Like, how what is going on?

Not an ape. It's not a gorilla. If it

was, we'd have it in the zoo. And we

don't. The It walks like a man. Ape and

gorillas don't walk like a man.

>> Well, Gigan Giganthopythecus did, right?

>> No,

>> it didn't. There's no evidence it was

bipedal at all. I thought it was the jaw

structure. So, they have one piece of

jaw and a bunch of teeth and there's a

lot of theories behind that, but there's

no evidence it was bipedal.

>> Oh, that's number one. Number two,

there's no evidence of it's ever been in

North America,

right? But the sightings that they find

of this thing are in Alaska and the

Pacific Northwest primarily. This is

where you get a lot of them. And the

idea would be that when the bearing land

bridge was around before the ice age or

during the ice age when the ocean levels

were much lower and there was more land

exposed that these things could walk

across Asia like we know the shortfaced

bear did and we also know people made it

from Siberia into North America.

So let's just let's just take

Gigantopithecus. That wouldn't be some

an environment it could live in though.

>> That was that was a jungle animal.

>> Right.

>> Right. In Asia.

>> Correct.

>> So let's let's getting back to that. But

there's all before you go on, but

there's also

>> Gigantopithecus.

They found less than a hundred years

ago. So, these um I believe they were

anthropologists and they were searching

for different bones in an apothecary

shop in China and they found a moler

that was extraordinarily large, like way

too large and it was a primate mer and

they were like, "What is this?" And so

they took them to where they found it

and then as they started digging they

found some more bones and some different

things. I don't how much stuff have they

found of Gigantoythecus?

>> Only jaws and teeth.

>> That's it. Yeah, it says, yeah, this

says it was.

>> Now, imagine if they never found that.

Here's the here's the question. If they

never found any of that stuff. Show me

what they got.

>> It doesn't say what I mean, it says what

they have here.

>> Okay. We only have jaws and teeth for

Gigantopithecus, not pelvis, leg bones,

or full skeleton. So, its exact gate

can't be observed directly. Researchers

infer its posture and locomotion by

comparing its anatomy and evolutionary

relationships with living great apes,

especially orangutans,

which are all quadripedal and not

habitual bipeds. So why do they think

it's okay? No, gigantopithecus is not

thought to have been bipedal. Scientific

consensus is that was a large mostly

quadripedal ape. So why does some people

say it's bipeedal? Where the idea came

from? Okay, a minority of researchers

and many Bigfoot enthusiasts have

proposed a bipeedal gigantopithecus,

often linking it to Sasquatch. But those

arguments rely on speculative

interpretations of jaw shape rather than

solid postranial fossils. These bipeedal

reconstructions are generally rejected

by specialists in fossil apes who regard

them as highly unlikely given current

evidence. So, Perplexity, our AI

sponsor, says no. Says Bigfoot something

different. So, but the thing is, if

Gigantopithecus was a real thing and all

we have is these a tiny amount of

fossilized bones and and teeth.

How many things make fossils? Very few.

Very few. So, there very well could have

been a bipeedal ape like a human that

was much larger. I mean, we know at one

point in time bipeedal homminids like,

you know, the early versions of human

beings were very hairy and some of them

were larger than us.

We just don't have fossils cuz most

things don't leave fossils. Like the

fossil record is incredibly incomplete,

right?

>> Oh, yeah. Yeah. So, you know, in East

Texas there's a lot of Bigfoot

sightings.

>> Really? East Texas.

>> East Texas.

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What kind of uh terrain?

>> Uh

mushy, swampy.

>> Okay.

>> Uh wet. Yeah. Right on the border. East

Texas.

>> Uh Tennessee. the border of what?

Oklahoma. Uh, no, down near the ocean.

>> Oh, okay. So,

when we talked about you you were

talking about Alaska, Pacific Northwest,

a lot of Bigfoot sightings.

>> Mhm.

>> A lot of Bigfoot sightings in Tennessee,

too. Kentucky. And

>> a lot of moonshine in Kentucky.

Tennessee, too.

>> Yes. A lot of people smoking crank.

>> Yes.

So, after I was a policeman, I had a

master's degree. I worked uh technology

for a while. I had masters in HR and I

ran HR organizations.

Did that for five, six, seven years. I

said I had enough and I'm leaving. I had

young kids. I was going to leave with my

family and have fun.

Two founders of this company, super

rich, come to me and they say, "Hey

Dave, we got a job for you at your own

pace, at your own will. Here's the

story." When they were younger, they

didn't know each other. They grew up in

different parts. They went up into the

woods with their families, backpacking,

camping, having fun. They got up in the

middle of the night, take a leak, and

independently didn't know each other.

They saw Bigfoot.

They found each other. They formed this

company, made millions of dollars. One

day they're at lunch and they start

talking to each other and they had the

same experience. They said, "Wow, that's

that's freaking bizarre. So, let's get

to the bottom of it." So, I'm leaving.

They know I have an investigative

background. They said, "Hey, we're going

to hire you. We want you to go find out

if it's true, false, or hoax." They

hired you to go check to see if Bigfoot

was real. Flipped the whole bill. They

said, "You do it at your own pace. Own

will. We'll pay for everything." I said,

"Not interested." They came back to me

like four or five times. Finally, at the

end of a year, my wife is divorcing me.

I now have only 50% custody. I have 50%

of my life open to do whatever I want.

They came at me again. I said, "Okay,

very I'm going to shorten it down to

from what took five years to five

minutes."

Tennessee,

Great Smoky Mountain National Park.

There was a man there named uh Scott

Carpenter. Scott, rest his soul, has

since died. But he took me into an area

in the park

and he said, "Dave, this is the part

where I've I've had all kinds of

evidence."

>> What kind of evidence?

>> Footprints,

hair,

>> hair,

>> hair.

>> So, has he ever had the hair analyzed?

>> Okay.

>> So, we start talking about it. How can

we get a good sample of hair? So, I

said, 'You know, with Bear, they take

bear samples and DNA samples from bear

all the time.

Let's try this. Let's take some

packaging tape, wrap it inside out on

the outside of a tree. Put something at

the fork of the tree, some kind of food,

whatever, honey, something. If they lean

up against the tree, it's going to pull

the hair out, which we need the follicle

for the DNA.

Let's see if that works. He says,

"Billiant, we did it. It worked. In that

area, we had tracks." Now, just so you

know, and everyone else knows, there's

hair and fiber experts in the world, and

they testify in superior court all the

time. Uh, like out in the lobby, you

have all these different kinds of

animals. If we took a hair from one

animal and gave it to a hair and fiber

expert, he could tell you within two

minutes what animal that came from

because every hair looks different. So,

we took those hairs, went to hair and

fiber expert,

and they said, 'Well, where'd you get

that?' And I go, "What do you mean?"

"We've never seen that hair before. It's

not classified. It doesn't exist."

Hm. Okay. So, that means we're on to

something. So, then I took

>> Does it have follicle? Can they do a DNA

on it or is it just hair?

>> They did.

>> Okay.

>> It did. So, I I called the I was living

in California at the time. I called the

University of California, Davis, the

biggest animal lab in the world.

And they said, "What do you got?" I

explained it. They said, "Bigfoot, we're

not touching it. We don't want anything

to do with it." I went to University of

Texas,

UC Davis. I went to like six or seven.

No one would touch it. But then I found

a woman that testified in the courts

here in Texas as a DNA expert. I called

her up. Her name is Melba Ketchum.

Dr. Ketchum, I have this sample here.

Would you be willing to do DNA analysis

on it? Absolutely. It's going to cost

you so many thousands of dollars. I go,

"No problem. We've got somebody who's

going to pay." So she goes, "Okay, let's

do one better, Dave. Send me the sample.

Let me look at it first. I'm going to

give it to my hair and fiber expert."

They look at it. Fiber hair and fiber

expert says, "It's nothing we've ever

seen. So that's good." So she goes,

"Okay, here's here's what we're going to

do. Can you get any more samples?"

I said, "I I have an idea. Let me try."

So, I go on coast to coast and I I laid

it out. I said, "Hey, we have these

samples. We're looking for hair samples.

Don't don't [ __ ] us because we'll

know right away. Send us hair samples

with with everything attached and we're

going to send it to a lab. You don't

have to pay the bill. We got 125 valid

samples that were not deer, analopee,

bear, whatever."

She goes through the DNA analysis on it.

Cost I think it cost us $400,000 at the

end of the day. It's a lot less

expensive now.

And they all so hair will will give you

mitochondrial DNA from the maternal

side, but it won't give you fraternal

DNA from the father's side. That you

need nuclear DNA, blood, tissue, saliva.

And we got some of those son of a gun.

At the end of the day, the DNA comes

back

12 to 15,000 years to the Middle East on

the mother's side.

Father's side, it doesn't exist in

Genbank. 352 billion base pairs of DNA

does not exist. The father's DNA does

not exist. Jenbang says it's impossible.

Since that time, other people have come

forward and said, "Hey, you know, on

elongated skulls,

we've had the same problem. We can't

find the fraternal DNA just like you."

That's a guy named La Marzulli that was

doing the research there. And then Ron

Morhead, who is doing other DNA studies

on elongated skulls in South America,

said the same thing. That's odd, Dave.

So

the f the maternal we understand the

fraternal we don't and

the the DNA they did a paper about it

it's online

had a lot of people say oh you know what

that's BS it's it's bad

but nobody else has ever done a test and

I could get you more hair within two

weeks if we wanted to

nobody wants to test it I'll passed it.

What do we have to do?

>> The truth is The truth is The truth is

>> Jamie, you ready to go? Let's go. Let's

get some tape.

The truth is

>> it'll all come back the same. And I

believe that the researchers who have

done it, they've gotten the same

results.

>> And so if you say that it on the

fraternal side it doesn't exist, on the

maternal side it's showing thousands of

Explain that again. So,

like I'm Greek.

>> So, they could they could chase my DNA

backwards through time to I don't know,

Greece,

>> right?

>> 10 15,000 years ago. Well, they were

able to chase the maternal side back to

the Middle East 12 to 15,000 years.

>> And what did they say it was?

>> That's all they said. But what they're

saying is is that, and a lot of people

have picked up on this, well, that has a

lot of religious connotations to it.

Why does it have religious connotations

to it?

>> Because of the Middle East 12 to 15,000

years,

>> right? But why is that religious? It's a

part of the world 12 to 15,000 years

ago. What what gives it religious

connotations other than the fact that

that's the origins of a lot of

religions? That's it.

>> Right. But it's also humans and

different animals lived there. Like

there's probably deer down there that

weren't religious at all. and you know

their DNA tracks back to that too. Uh

specific results she reported she

claimed 111 samples from 34 North

American sites produced two patterns

human MTD DNA and unusual or novel

nuclear sequences that supposedly did

not match known animals. Her

interpretation was that about 15,000

years ago, an unknown hominin male

population interbred with modern human

females, leading to a hybrid lineage

whose descendants are today's supposed

Sasquatch. How and where it was

published. Study did not appear in a

normal established peer-reviewed

journal. Instead, it was put into an

obscure outlet called Denovo Scientific

Journal, which Ketchum herself

effectively controlled to get the paper

online.

Science reporters and skeptics noted the

absence of transparent peerreview, the

payw wall for a self-published paper,

and the lack of independent labs

reproducing her findings. But did

independent labs try to reproduce her

findings? That's the question.

Scientific criticism. Genetics,

geneticists and forensic biologists who

examined the data and methodology have

repeatedly pointed to contamination and

poor lab practice as the most likely

explanation for her hybrid sequences.

analysis noted that the MTD DNA being

100% modern human is exactly what you

would expect from contaminated or human

origin samples and that the odd nuclear

sequences are consistent with mixed DNA

sequencing errors or lowquality data not

a new species. current status of her DNA

claims. No major genetics lab or

independent research group has

replicated Ketchum's results or

confirmed a novel hominin genome

corresponding to Bigfoot. In mainstream

science, her study is treated as an

example of flawed junk science

interesting to Bigfoot enthusiasts but

offering no accepted evidence that

Sasquatch exists. But here's the thing.

Did anybody else try to test those

things?

>> No. And let me explain that argument

they just used.

>> They're talking to a bunch of idiots. So

when they say it's contaminated,

>> right?

>> So let's say I contaminated the sample,

>> right?

>> Well, Joe, my dad was Russian.

>> Mhm.

>> The contaminated sample would show on

the m fraternal side Russian,

>> right?

>> It wouldn't show nothing,

>> right? That's why that argument makes no

sense.

>> Well, I'm not a geneticist, so I don't

know if it makes sense.

>> Yeah.

>> You know what I'm saying? Like if if

that you could say, "Oh, this is why,

you know, if you had someone who

understood DNA and contamination and the

whole process, they could maybe explain

it in a better way."

So, what the idea that humans interbred

with things is not a new idea. You know,

I read something recently. Um, I

actually watched a YouTube video and

then read an article. I think we talked

about this, pretty sure we did, where

they believe that Neanderl, they used to

think that Neanderl was a a subspecies,

like a different version of humans and

that they interbred with us. There's a

group of people that now are speculating

that Neandertol was the result of humans

breeding with another ancient hominant

and that that created Neandertol. So

it's not that we interbred with

Neandertol, but that humans actually

created Neandertol by breeding with this

other homminid.

So there's only one country in the world

that ever took this topic seriously.

>> Which country?

>> Russia.

>> They took their science academy and took

the five top scientists. This happened

40 years ago. And they started studying

what was called Almasti, the same as our

Bigfoot.

>> Okay?

>> And

I'm not bullshitting you. This is 100%

true. Two of their scientists came to

the US. I met one of them at a

conference in Colorado seven or eight

years ago. And I walk into the room and

he's holding both of my books as I walk

in. And he says, "Dave, you're the only

guy to tell the truth out of everybody

out here. What you're saying about the

DNA, what you're saying about the the

lineage is 100% fact. It's what we

found. And we know that they aren't any

kind of ape or gorilla. It's it's a

human hybrid

that people don't understand.

>> So, did the Russians think that it

exists currently?

>> 100%.

>> So, how are they hiding?

>> How are they hiding?

>> Yeah.

>> So, if you think about we don't even

have the ability to do something with a

DNA like they like whatever this is.

>> It's making a hybrid,

>> right?

>> Okay. So something

far greater than us has learned to

manipulate DNA.

And if you think that Bigfoot is

interdimensional,

then wherever that came from

probably makes a whole lot more sense

scientifically than something

organically made here.

And there is there in lies the reason

that we've haven't found a body.

Uh, it can move in and out like it did

through that tube at Skinwalker Ranch.

And there's footage in our movie of what

appears to be a Bigfoot

evaporating into nothingness.

>> What footage is this?

>> Filmed by Scott Carpenter.

>> What is it called? What's the the same

one that we're just talking about?

>> American Sasquatch.

>> Can we see that footage? Where is that

in the film?

>> Um, it's during my interview with Scott.

And so who took this footage?

>> Scott. And what year was this taken?

>> Sometime in the last 10 years.

>> Okay. And it shows something evaporating

like that. There's it looks like a

Bigfoot evaporating into nothing.

What what you see is something kind of

like smokiness looking down a trail.

>> Uhhuh. And then it slowly evolves

to look like something that you and I

would call a Bigfoot. Okay.

So,

what you're saying is that we're not

dealing with a

standard biological organism. We're

dealing with something that's probably

the product of some advanced species and

that they've created this thing and this

thing has the ability to move in ways

and appear and reappear in ways that

don't make any sense to us.

>> Correct. Well, that would make sense if

it was true. And again, putting that

[ __ ] tinfoil hat on tight right now.

That would make sense if you think about

how many sightings there are and that

there are no bones and there's no body.

No one's found anything. There's

nothing. There's been footprints. The

footprints are weird. So, uh I'd like to

dismiss the footprints. Like, oh, come

on. Somebody just like made a fake

footprint. The problem is there's dermal

ridges on these footprints. Some of them

exhibit what's very similar to

fingerprints

and that's very strange. And these are

going back decades. So super hard to

reproduce something like that. And

someone you would have I mean you'd have

to be a very very advanced person and

have some sort of uh incredible ability

to manipulate material science just to

just to be able to create something that

recreates a dermal ridge and then use it

and make footprints with it that are

similar to what like a a creature would

make. It was very heavy moving through

the ground and pressing down on moist

ground or mud and leaving footprints

that have fingerprints in it. It's weird

because these are not it's not something

like you know I weigh like 205 lbs or

something like that. Like it's not like

that. It's like something that weighs

like 700 lb like deep into the ground.

It's weird.

>> Abnormally heavy.

>> Yeah. Abnormally heavy. large feet, but

again, no bones, no nothing. And the

only DNA it's like, you know, there's

it's disputed. But of course, people are

going to dispute everything. No one's

going to look at it and go, "This is

definitely not human." You know, they're

going to go, "Well, who did this? How'd

she do it?" You know, oh, this is a lab

that's like not not doing it well, and

they're publishing in some journal

behind a payw wall. This is nonsense.

But then you have to think, well, okay,

but are any other reputable labs,

these reputable labs, are they

interested in doing this work? Have they

done the work? Have they taken the same

stuff and done it through the exact same

process, but not found the same results

that she had, or is there no other

studies? Seems like there's no other

legitimate studies of the same DNA. Dr.

Ketchum took that DNA to four certified

labs. One of them was the University of

Texas. And all of those labs got the

same result.

She extracted it. They did the analysis.

She did the comparison to Genbank. And

she did this all herself or she had

other scientists do it.

>> So she wrote a white paper and six

different PhDs wrote it.

The the slam job there.

I I think it's interesting because have

you heard of an organization called

BFRO?

>> No. biggest organization in the United

States for Bigfoot sightings.

>> Oh, okay. Bigfoot research organization.

Yeah. Yeah. I from finding Bigfoot.

>> Right. Right. So, a man named Wally

Hersam was their benefactor. He gave him

millions of dollars over the years and

he they had one job,

find DNA.

10 15 years they said they couldn't find

it. We found it in less than a year.

Wally came over when we had the DNA and

looked at the results, met with Dr.

Ketchum, said, "I am completely done.

You guys have proven to me exactly what

it is. I now know what it is." Pulled

all of his funding at that point. He was

out of the Bigfoot world. And he goes,

"You guys did what nobody else could

do."

How come there's no good camera trap

photos? You know, like there's a lot of

trail cameras out there that hunters

use.

>> How come there's no good trail cam

photos? Do you think the idea is that

these things know that cameras are

there?

>> So, I think they have that ability to

look in the infrared range

and they just stay away. Well, if they

are from somewhere else and you know,

we're assuming they're primitive because

they're they're covered in hair, but

what if they have some sort of psychic

ability or some sort of intellect beyond

what we would attach to an ape and they

understand what cameras are?

>> So, do you know what the hitchhiker

effect is?

>> No.

So at Skinwalker Ranch, the

investigators coming onto that ranch

when they left and they went home, they

took those entities home with them. And

the entities didn't ever bother the

scientists. They bothered the relatives,

the wives.

They did spooky things. They'd come

around, show up in the home, chase the

kids around in the yard.

>> What kind of entities?

>> A variety of things. sometimes orbs,

sometimes silhouettes of people, but

things that never happened before

happened after these scientists went

home. And they talked about it on their

show, and it's happened a lot.

>> One of the things that happens to people

that study Bigfoot is they have the same

hitchhiker effect. It doesn't matter

where you go for some reason. And you

were talking about, you know, maybe they

read your mind or something. There's

something there's some kind of effect

there that they'll they'll follow you

wherever you go. As an example, I live

kind of in the middle of nowhere and

there's big woods behind my house and I

was walking behind the house one day.

One track, middle of a muddy trail, no

other tracks any place else. 17 in,

just one track.

I can't tell you how many times other

friends of mine and researchers have had

the exact same thing happen. In the

movie I interviewed, I think seven or

eight researchers, all the best ones,

they all say this has happened to them.

It's that hitchhiker effect that they

talk about at Skinwalker Ranch, which

goes to the point of it being something

extradimensional.

I went to Skinwalker Ranch with my

friend Duncan a few years back. We I was

doing this show for the sci-fi channel

called Joe Rogan Questions Everything.

And one of the things we did was we went

to Skinwalker Ranch and we talked to a

bunch of people there

>> and you know what some of them were just

clearly full of [ __ ] But there was this

one guy who was not and um he didn't

have a lot of stories but he said uh

there was this one experience that he

had where these orbs made it into his

house and this orb flew through his wall

was inside of his home and it seemed

like it was interacting with him and

then it was like paused frozen in front

of him and then took off. This guy

seemed like

a completely rational, regular guy. He,

like I said, he didn't have a bunch of

crazy stories about other things. I

forget what his job was, but it was a

regular job, regular guy. Seemed totally

normal to talk to, but he said he had

this one inexplicable experience. He

said it was very strange. He said this

thing just flew into his home. He said

it was like I think he said it was like

the size of a softball, maybe a little

larger, and it seemed like it was

interacting with them. So, uh, one of

the people I interviewed for the movie

was a former Navajo Ranger. You ever

hear of those? Yes. So, they went to the

Federal Law Enforcement Training Center,

full law enforcement credentials, super

smart guy. He comes back, he works 10,

15 years for the Navajo Rangers. One

day, the lieutenant calls him in. He and

his partner, they say, "You got a new

assignment." "Oh, what's that?" "You're

gonna do nothing but investigate Bigfoot

and UFOs."

I'd be like, "Fuck yeah."

He goes, "Wait a minute. I don't want I

didn't sign up for that." He goes, "I

don't care. That's your new job because

you guys are the two most credible

people I have. You're going to go do

that."

>> Well, because why? They had some sort of

a suspicion. Oh, they had tons of calls