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Welcome to the Daybreak Asia podcast.

I'm Doug Krer. We have a new wave of

uncertainty after the Supreme Court

struck down President Trump's emergency

tariffs. Earlier on Truth Social, the

president said he will put much higher

tariffs on countries that quote play

games with that high court ruling. And

now we are being told the White House is

working to issue a formal directive to

increase the rate on global tariffs to

15%. But it's not clear if this order

will be finalized before those 10%

leveies are set to go into effect

Tuesday at 12:01 a.m. Eastern time. By

the way, Morgan Stanley is estimating

that the average tariff now on goods

from China will drop from a rate that is

around 32% now down to 24%. for a look

at what's happening in the Asia-Pacific.

I'm joined by Bloomberg's Leant Tingu.

She is managing editor for Asia

Equities. Lean Ting joining from our

studios in Singapore. Thank you so much.

There's so much to talk about. I know

that China is back online today. We're

seeing a little bit of positivity in the

equity market. How much of this story do

you think is related to the Supreme

Court's ruling on tariffs?

Yeah, I think for China definitely it is

outstanding winner out of the Supreme

Court ruling. Um just because China

without that 10% fentinel tariff,

China's now having the same tariff rate

uh with all the other trading partners

with the US. So you can see yesterday

the Hong Kong stock market rallied

pretty hard. I think the biggest gainer

out of Asia uh on that particular news

and of course India was also considered

uh part of that winners part of the

winners but I think overall people still

think China with higher beta to begin

with for its stock market. So there is

more to gain uh for Chinese stocks.

>> Maybe we can talk a little bit now about

artificial intelligence. We had a rugged

session in the states where equities

retreated on a little bit more anxiety

over this AI disruption theme. We had a

report from Catrini Research and they

laid out a couple of different

scenarios. I want to focus on two. One

where delivery apps like Door Dash and

Uber Eatats are displaced by chatbot

made alternatives.

And in another scenario, a case where AI

agents try to save users money by

eliminating transaction fees charged by

payment processing firms like Mastercard

and Visa. I'm curious, Leonting, about

the conversation in the Asia-Pacific

regarding AI disruption. What's it sound

like to you?

>> Yeah, it does feel very pessimistic, uh,

very dis dystopian, uh, when you read

that article. I think traders are uh

very much interested in the kind of

scenario and analysis and how you know

the kind of technology will translate to

job losses and also profit losses for

many of the companies especially the

intermediary uh companies like the food

pro uh food delivery companies and uh

you know anything that has is aimed to

reduce friction is actually going to be

uh the first to be hurt by all these AI

developments. In Asia though, I think

people are looking for winners, right?

We talked about how Asia, a lot of Asia

tech giants are really positioned to be,

you know, the beneficiaries in this AI

boom in the data center buildout. Again,

we actually saw SK Hanx jumping almost

5% during the period when this treaty uh

the report corriter Alapsha was being

interviewed on BTV just now. So, as you

can see, people are really tuning into

what he has to say and are really

looking for winners. And Taiwan today is

another standout winner. TSMC was almost

mentioned, I believe, in that report.

and TSMC and Taiwan all these smaller

chip makers today having a great day up

7% or so last time I checked so I think

in Asia again that's reinforce the

narrative that biggest winners in this

as uh AI trade are in Asia and of course

in the US you know a lot of uh the

intermediaries are listed in the US and

not a lot of those things are listed in

Asia that also sort of explains why Asia

is now considered a little bit of a

haven right now in this AI scare trade

>> I was looking at a story on the

Bloomberg earlier today describing about

something that happened over the holiday

on the mainland where a few Chinese

firms showed off new humanoid robots at

the annual spring festival gayla. Is

there a lot in the way of enthusiasm

when it comes to robotics on the

mainland?

>> Yes. Uh we actually saw that playing out

last year at around this time after the

spring festival gala where uh robotics

robots I should say showed off their

dancing skills. What's different this

time around is um the moves that you saw

in the performance was a lot more

advanced. Uh it seems the development

has really uh sped up during that

one-year period. uh these robots were

able to play kung fu, were able to do

back flips and land on their feet. Um so

so it does uh excite investors. Of

course, a lot of people have warned

that, you know, the real user case for

those robots, you know, they looked

great on TV, but they don't see a lot of

sort of revenue generation venues as of

yet for these robotic companies. And

they there's also a lot of competition

in this robotic sector. uh in China. So

in terms of long-term investment in that

sector, uh some people have warned that

there is not a a lot of visibility on

profit um uh generation.

>> So as long as we're talking about the

holiday period, I'm curious as to

whether you've seen any high frequency

data on things like travel and spending

that may give us some sense of how well

the consumer was engaged during the

Lunar New Year festivities. Yeah, there

have been a slew of data uh especially

on travel stats and uh they are

overwhelmingly

positive. Uh one stat that stood out to

me was bookings for family trips over

the Luna New Year period jumped 76%

year-over-year. That's a big jump. And I

was just talking to some mainland

colleagues uh an hour ago and they were

talking about how packed and crowded uh

those big cities uh were during that new

year period with tourists and hotels uh

apparently were really booked out and

hotel rates quadrupled this time around

but spending was still very strong. So

it does seem like people took advantage

of this elongated period this time nine

nine day I think is the longest lunar

new year period ever to really enjoy the

time time with family and they chose to

spend in a different city you know have

different experience so I I would say

that part is really positive but on the

other side there's also some uh weak

data point out of box office according

to city the box office data uh out of

this new year period was the weakest uh

since 2018 seems there wasn't enough

interesting content to draw uh viewers

into the cinema. So that is considered

negative. Of course,

>> before I let you go, Leonting, maybe we

can talk a little bit about Japan

because I know we have later in the week

uh data on Tokyo inflation, also

Japanese retail sales. The equity market

has been fairly robust. Uh we know that

Prime Minister Taki is insisting on

trying to provide a little bit of

stimulus to the economy. And I know

there is a very um very sharp focus on

trying to relieve some of the

inflationary pressures here. What are

you hearing with respect to Japan? What

are some of the stories that people are

talking about today?

>> Yeah, two things. Two things. Uh one is

the Supreme Court ruling implication on

Japan and the other of course is this AI

trade. I would say for the first one,

Japan net net is considered neutral

because Japan had a 15% tariff deal with

the US before and the US of course Trump

um has mentioned uh he's going to have

that 15% tariff on all trading partners.

So on that front I think uh we're not

seeing a lot of reaction out of Japan.

Automakers last time I checked were up.

Um and if you look at AI, uh Japan does

have some software companies and payment

companies listed and today they are

having a bit of selloff. Uh but there

are also a lot of heavyweighted Japanese

companies on the NIK225 that are

actually you know chip equipment makers.

So we're looking at Advantist, Tokyo

Electron, all these guys are actually

having a great day. So we talk a lot

about Korea and Taiwan being well

positioned in the chip supply chain.

Japan actually has a lot of these names

as well. So that's why you're seeing

Nikay turning more and more positive as

as the day goes on.

>> We'll leave it there. Leon Ting, it's

always a pleasure. Thank you so very

much. Leon Tingu is managing editor for

Asia Equities joining from our studios

in Singapore here on the Daybreak Asia

podcast.

Welcome back to the Daybreak Asia

podcast. I'm Doug Prisoner. In the

States, the equity market retreated on

renewed anxiety over the impact of

artificial intelligence as well as

uncertainty over US tariff policy. And

that's where we begin our conversation

with Ethan Devit. Ephen is managing

director at Moneta Global Wealth and she

spoke with Bloomberg TV host Heidi Strad

Watts and Sher on.

>> We sort of see this continuation of the

momentum driven stock reversal, right?

What do you make of this in terms of

how, you know, definitely you have to

navigate given that I know that you're

still looking for some of those

opportunities within the AI and software

spaces?

>> Well, it's a great question. I'm based

in London, but I've been watching this

blizzard going on on the east coast of

the US and this is a blizzard of

information too that we're having to

cope with and it is extraordinary that

we have now had this cascade through

different sectors. Remember, we started

with the SAS, the software, the service

sector. It moved into my sector, private

wealth, with concern around the altruist

tax preparation software disrupting that

and now we're moving into just

mainstream software areas and and this

is extraordinary that this basically

magical thinking of fictitious report

could trigger this kind of concern. What

we can see therefore is just how jittery

markets really are, just how they're

they're really selling first, asking

questions later.

So when you talk about grid tech picks

and shuffles around AI would you be

opportunity opportunistic right now even

with the high degree of uncertainty?

Yes, that has been something that we at

Maneta have been focused on for the past

18 months has been really as you

mentioned the picks and shovels. What is

not going to change as we have AI

momentum come and go. What is not going

to change is the demand for energy and

we know that that is essentially just

rising around the world. We're looking

at that coming from both renewable

energy sources, traditional energy

sources, and finding the picks and

shovels that play into that. And then a

new sector, grid tech, because that's

where the uninvestment has been made.

The lack of investment has been in the

grids. So that we believe is sustained.

It's perhaps not the momentum side of

markets right now. It is more of a

defensive and even value area, but we

see that as being very much adjacent to

the AI story, but having legs, whereas

AI is going to be more volatile.

Especially

if we're focusing on that infrastructure

buildout, Nvidia earnings will be so

key. What will you be watching?

>> Yes, we're going to be looking at um

really the sustained demand and how

Nvidia we know that that is going to be

an outlier that has been a market

leader. It is dominating the US stock

market. But good a good a strong story

of sustained demand there and their

outlook will be critical to I think

uplift this shareholders expectations

because they are really quite depressed

right now in terms of the uncertainty

around AI. So we're looking for some

shoots of good news at this stage.

A lot of uncertainty also on the trade

environment of course with President

Trump potentially now according to

reports announcing new national security

tariffs on top of 15% tariffs as well.

How do you factor that in when every

time we have a new trade deal with the

United States? It seems to change at any

point.

>> It was interesting. First, it was

Bitcoin and digital assets that were the

canary in the coal mine for trade

uncertainties. That's long since passed

because the the volatility has just

really enveloped the entire Bitcoin

area. So now we have to look at other

asset classes risk on which are showing

signs of concern around trade. This was

not the news that markets needed. It

initially seemed quite good news. There

could have been a rally in the US

economy if some of these rebates and

tariffs uncertainty was removed. Then

the the rear guard action by President

Trump to really double down on his

tariff policy. That's what seems to have

thrown markets off today. But remember,

we're looking at uncertainty for many

different areas. Private credit too is

having a difficult spell right now. And

this really just does underscore how

much the markets were priced for

perfection up to now. The resilient

economy has confounded expectations over

and over again and now we can find

cracks everywhere and that's what

markets I think are overreacting to at

present.

you're not concerned about the private

market uh issue that you mentioned

because we have the likes of Apollo,

KKR, Blackstone all investing in this

infrastructure buildout and at this

point the uncertainties of course as we

have discussed could actually extend to

all of the investment that these people

have made as well.

>> It's a very good point. What we've been

looking at the low volatility in fixed

income public fixed income markets that

has been the the tight spreads that

we're seeing there the move index being

so subdued that is it does not cohhere

with what we're seeing and the other

jitters of markets. So where has the

risk moved to within bonds? It seems to

have moved into the private credit area

and now investors are waking up to that.

There definitely is going to be

contamination from the software arena

drawback to the private credit area

given their exposures. But time and time

again we've heard that this is not we

cannot paint the entire private credit

area with one brush that it is is very

much a question of of of some firms

having the the pick of the crop and

other firms in crowded areas with less

compelling returns. So we shouldn't be

too sweeping about our outlook for the

private credit area. But it's true that

there have perhaps been due diligence um

problems and we've seen that time and

time again and that the default level

will rise. But we do expect that overall

private credit is quite sound. But these

cockroaches that Jamie Diamond mentioned

are going to stop start cropping up and

the question is whether markets

overreact to them.

Even we have this situation where time

and time again there's hits coming from

usually trade uncertainty or

geopolitical uncertainty but it feels

like the sort of uh risk and volatility

response can be muted going forward. You

raised a question of where that risk is

going to go, right? What is your

assessment of I guess how that

volatility gets spread in the coming

months.

>> Well, I think we have to remember that

when we do have these pullbacks in

markets, they're very short-lived at the

moment. And that's because we do have

this strong inclusion of retail

investors in all markets everywhere. We

know that the millennials that are

priced out of the real estate market are

investing like stocks like never before.

Main Street is participating in Wall

Street like never before. So that's on

the sidelines. This huge amount of money

in money market funds is on the

sidelines. They are out there looking

for bargains. So and essentially when we

have spreads in fixed income as low as

they are as I mentioned and we still

have inflation ticking away in the

background, nobody is making money

owning bonds. So there is still strong

demand for owning equities. So I that's

why I believe that these pullbacks will

be short-lived and that's why markets

are really somewhat apart from these

momentum problems we're having just now.

Markets have been somewhat immune to

geopolitical developments, they have

been immune from domestic political

developments, they don't seem to care

about the large fiscal budget deficit

across many developed nations because

the underlying company earnings have

been so compelling. So that has been the

the market's ability to hold two ideas

at one time. Now we're seeing some

jitters in that respect, but I don't

believe it's fundamental.

>> That was Ethan Devit, managing director

at Moneta Global Wealth, speaking with

Bloomberg TV host Heidi Strad Watts and

Sher an bringing you their conversation

here on the Daybreak Asia podcast.

Thanks for listening to today's episode

of the Bloomberg Daybreak Asia edition

podcast. Each weekday we look at the

stories shaping markets, finance, and

geopolitics in the Asia-Pacific. You can

find us on Apple, Spotify, the Bloomberg

Podcast YouTube channel, or anywhere

else you listen. Join us again tomorrow

for insight on the market moves from

Hong Kong to Singapore and Australia.

I'm Doug Krer, and this is Bloomberg.