Welcome to zero. I am Akshhati

>> and I'm Oscar Boyd. Actually, I wanted

to pull a stat from an article that you

recently wrote with your colleague

Fasica Tedes who's based in Adisaba,

Ethiopia. And the stat is even by the

standards of lowincome countries.

Ethiopia has among the lowest car

ownership rates at 13 vehicles per

thousand people. It's a fraction of the

African average of 73 vehicles per

thousand people. And yet, despite this,

you've just published a longread article

into Ethiopia's car market. Why?

>> Well, sometimes you have to look in odd

corners for good stories. And Ethiopia

has a pretty amazing story to tell. So,

of course, its income is only about

$1,000 per capita, which means you

expect there to be low car ownership.

But even by that standards, it's so much

lower because the country has had

historically very high tariffs on all

car imports. And then two years ago, the

country brought in a ban on all fossil

fuel car imports and then drastically

slashed tariffs on electric cars, making

them much more affordable than they ever

were in the history of just buying cars

in Ethiopia. The result has been a surge

in EV sales. I mean, the pace is

spectacular.

Today, about 6% of all vehicles in

Ethiopia are electric. That's higher

than the global average of 4%. And even

countries like Norway, very rich,

wanting to get electric cars on the

streets, just couldn't achieve that pace

of adoption that quickly. Banning

combustion cars is something that a lot

of countries are wanting to do. The UK

has a target to end fossil fuel car

sales in 2035, so a little less than 10

years from now. Europe did have a 2035

target, but this has now been watered

down. How has Ethiopia managed to ban

combustion cars? How come they had the

kind of political ability to do this?

Yeah, this was the thing that shocked me

the most which is that one of the

world's poorest countries has been able

to achieve what even the richest

countries haven't been able to. And so

we were curious what happened and the

reason it turns out is really economics.

So Ethiopia was going through a

financial crisis as many other

developing countries were going post

pandemic because interest rates had gone

up, the amount they had borrowed was too

much, their interest payments were

rising and they didn't have much foreign

exchange. also true is that most of

developing countries import fossil fuels

because they don't have much of their

own. So Ethiopia was importing about 4

billion worth of gasoline diesel every

year and it was importing all these

fossil fuel burning cars and it was

going through this financial crisis. So

the government just said well why import

both things? Let's just import one which

is get electric cars. Why? Because they

have plentiful electricity at home.

Where does all this electricity come

from?

>> So for the past 10 years or so, Ethiopia

has been building one of the world's

largest dams on the Nile. And as of

2025, it now has 5.15 gawatt of power

coming from hydropower from this one

dam. And suddenly the country has excess

electricity so much so that it is

selling it to Tanzania and Djibouti and

Kenya. And that electricity is really

cheap.

>> How cheap? like 10 cents per kilowatt

hour which is the cost of generating and

sending that electricity to consumers

and if you compare that to its neighbors

which charged twice that much or to

America which is about 18 cents per

kilowatt hour on average last year or

here in the UK which you know you and I

pay 34 cents per kilowatt hour and of

course we have some of the world's most

expensive electricity so having that

really cheap electricity plentiful

was one clear signal for the government

to go electric cars just make sense.

>> And obviously it has benefits for the

people using those electric cars as

well. They have lower lifetime cost of

ownership, right? Because the running

costs are so much lower. But that does

bring me on to the question which is I

think when we imagine getting rid of

fossil fuel car sales in the UK, one of

the big issues that comes up constantly

is well, how am I going to charge my

car? And there are definitely

difficulties around that in certain

places. But there is this superb quote

in the article that you wrote from the

minister Bario Hassan who is the state

minister for transport and logistics.

And the quote reads, "We received strong

criticism when we announced the ban on

ICE automobiles. As many pointed out

that the country has zero charging

stations at this time." That's just an

amazing thing to say at the point that

you've just banned internal combustion

engines and you're now assuming

everyone's going to go to electric cars.

So how are people managing to charge?

>> Yeah, I mean it's a bit funny but the

context is a you can do electric car

charging at home and so installing them

is easy but yes they didn't have any

fast chargers at the time which from a

western perspective sounds shocking. You

know the way we think about policy is

there's planning there is public

consultation there is a transition.

Sometimes though, you just need to do

it. And that's what Ethiopia did in this

instance. It was going through a crisis

of its own and it needed to find ways to

deal with it. And this seemed like a

policy that sure may struggle at first,

but is likely to give them financial

runway that the government desperately

needed. And now 2 years on, we can see

it's working. So according to the

minister now there are about 500 fast

chargers around the country and the way

they managed to get them was to put

regulations on all gas stations to have

charging ports for all EV sellers to

have charging ports and now they've

brought in regulations that all new

housing developments parks will need to

have charging ports as well. So, it's a

combination of regulations that followed

the first policy change that has now

given them some semblance of a charging

network, but there's still a long way to

go.

>> And what kind of cars are people

actually buying? Is it all cheaper

models of electric vehicles from China

or are we seeing Western brands in there

or Japanese brands in there or

>> So, a useful context in developing

countries, especially low-income

countries, is that most of them have

cars that are essentially secondhand. So

even when they were buying fossil fuel

cars, these were typically fossil fuel

cars coming from European or American

markets that had been used once and then

they were essentially living out a

second life. Sometimes these are really

old cars as well. They've been running

on for 10 years and you're going to run

them on for 10 more years. And so a they

have very high running costs because you

have to constantly repair them. Mhm.

>> They're also inefficient because clearly

western standards for fuel efficiency

keep going up whereas these are lower

efficiency cars. That means their fuel

running cost is very high. So when it

came to electric cars, a couple of

things made a big difference. One, they

had to be new cars. There isn't really

yet a big market for secondhand electric

vehicles. Also, moving secondhand

electric vehicles is kind of difficult.

And so when you're thinking of new

electric vehicles, well the cheaper ones

are the favorites in the market. So Fasa

went to a few dealerships. Uh I also had

a source at the international energy

agency who was traveling in Ethiopia in

December and they basically saw cars of

all kinds. So yes, there are European

cars, there are Japanese cars. Um, but

the electric car that people like the

most are Chinese cars. For taxi drivers,

Changan is the popular brand because

it's cheaper even among cheaper Chinese

cars. And among individuals, it's BYD.

>> And are any of these cars being built or

assembled in Ethiopia or are they all

kind of pure imports constructed

finished car coming from China or other

markets to Ethiopia? So Ethiopia only

gets about 7% of its economic output

from manufacturing which isn't yet a big

sector and the government certainly

wants it to be a bigger sector. So there

never was a fullyfledged

parts to final car making manufacturing

line in Ethiopia even when fossil fuel

cars were the cars that got sold. Uh it

was mostly assembled cars. So you got

all the parts, you imported them, and

then you did the labor and value ad of

actually putting it all together.

So that's what they're doing with

electric cars. They're getting all these

parts from China and then assembling

them in these 17 plants that exist and

the government wants them to be 60

plants doing this by 2030. So the way

the government puts tariffs on these

vehicles makes it clear. So a fully

assembled vehicle will come at 15%

tariff. A semi-assembled vehicle will

come at 5% tariff and a fully knockdown

all parts car is essentially no tariff.

>> Okay. So they are trying to encourage

the growth of local car manufacturing

within Ethiopia

>> at least at the assembly level maybe

eventually at making parts.

>> And obviously the story of Ethiopian

mobility is not really focused on cars.

And we're going to come on to an

interview that you had with a local

entrepreneur there later in the show.

But when we think of cars, is it

accurate to describe this as a leaprock

story? You know, they've got very, very

low penetration of cars in the

population so far, but from here on out,

they're going to skip straight past the

fossil fuel version and go straight to

electric vehicles. Is that what we're

seeing?

>> That's right. I mean, if we were to

think about it from like the climate

movement side, there's a whole class of

people who say like cars are the evil

thing. They are making lives and cities

really bad. you know, accidents increase

as the number of cars increase. We know

that's true. Uh and that really we

should just focus on personal mobility

through bicycles or public transport

through buses or trains. That's great.

If you can afford to make that work,

it's an interesting way to push forward.

But we've talked about Netherlands on

this show before. You know, only about

10% of all miles traveled in the

Netherlands. The friendliest countries

for bicycle is on bicycles. 50% or more

is still on personal cars. So you know

growing up in India it I have seen that

as soon as people are able to afford the

first thing they want is cars. There's

just luxury or status or personal

freedoms that come with a car that

people desire. So it is important to try

and tell the story of what is happening

to car markets in developing countries

and Ethiopia is showing that you can

leap frog you can do what you did with

telephone to mobile phones you know

which I saw growing up in India like we

used to have a telephone and now for the

last 15 years my parents have do not

have a telephone at home it's just

mobile phones and often more than one um

that's what is going to happen in

Ethiopia if this policy continues.

>> For your piece, you spoke to an

entrepreneur who is working in Addis

Ababa. His name is Yuma Sasaki. He's

actually an unlikely figure, a Japanese

man who's moved out to Ethiopia. What's

he doing?

>> I found his story fascinating and we'll

hear more from the interview, but

typically if you go to a developing

country, you will see the main mode of

transport is two wheelers. But in

Adisababa,

there used to be no two-wheelers. Uh the

government had essentially banned giving

licenses for two wheelers. And this

Japanese man comes in and says, "No, I'm

going to try and convince the government

that they need two wheelers. And not

just two wheelers, they need electric

two wheelers." So let's have a listen uh

to my interview with Yuma Sasaki, the

founder and CEO of Dodai.

>> Thank you, Ach.

>> Thank you, Oscar.

After the break, I talked to Yuma

Sasaki, founder of the electric

two-wheeler startup Dodie. If you want

to get in touch with Zero with guest

suggestions, feedback, or anything at

all, write to the show at zeropod

bloomberg.net. And while you're at it,

write us a review on Apple Podcast,

Spotify, and YouTube. It helps new

listeners find the show.

Yuma, welcome to Zero.

>> Thank you very much for having us and

then putting spotlight in Ethiopia.

>> Before you tell us the story of Dodai,

tell us about how a Japanese

entrepreneur ended up in Ethiopia. When

did you first visit? What was the

country like? And why did you feel like

you wanted to work here? I've been here

in Ethiopia for 3 years, but this is not

the first time that I've been in Africa.

As you said, I'm originally from Japan.

Uh I was interested in coming to Africa

and then the first time I worked in West

Africa about 10 years ago, 2016. And I

spent two years working at startup and

then I I got convinced that Africa is

the future. So I though I went back to

Japan and worked at uh Uber uh I always

had a interest and then try to find an

opportunity to come back and then I did

research and Ethiopia is the market or

the country where a lot of opportunity

uh while it's famous for a difficult

market to do business. uh I decided to

come to Ethiopia and then decided to

start with e-mobility

uh about three years ago and then just

moved in Ethiopia.

>> So why Ethiopia though like tell us what

is it like on the ground?

>> I always say three reasons cuz people

are very surprised that I chose

Ethiopia. First reason is a big market.

So especially as a foreigner being away

from your country, your culture, your

food, everything that is comfortable, uh

you want to make sure that if you make

it, uh the impact is big. So to make a

big impact when it succeeds, it needs to

be a big market. So I only look at the

three or four biggest markets in Africa

first of all in terms of the country. So

I look at Nigeria, DRC, Congo as well.

That's first criteria. And then the

second criteria which is pretty

contrarian is choose difficult market.

When I say difficult market, difficult

to start, difficult to survive. Those

are the good markets in my opinion.

Especially when you are small because

easy market when I say easy, easy to

start. easy to start market usually most

difficult market to win because all the

competition is there to me like Kenya

and Rwanda if you are small startup and

then if you go to easy to start market

where very competitive you cannot win at

the end in my opinion so there's no

point to go there while very difficult

market also the competition is least so

you can focus on building a good team

and a product though the chance that you

can start and then survive is low. When

you make it, you are the only one who

stands there. So that's the right market

that I think and Ethiopia among those

big markets one of the most difficult

market. And then the third uh this is

more personal again as a foreigner or

expert it's important that you really

like the people there because you work

every day and the work is very tough and

uh if you're just fed up with everything

tired of the people you are you are

surrounded by you easily

uh give up and then go back to your

country which I see a lot in my experts

friends you know after two or three as

you give up and then you start

complaining or even when you are here

you complaining by drinking with your

your friends from same country right I

didn't want to be that uh like that I

once I committed I need to make it and

it will take five years 7 years uh 10

years so to make that commitment I

really need need to like the people so I

visit Ethiopia a couple of times and I

got convinced that the people are the

ones that I want to build a future

together. So those three reasons big

market, difficult market and then great

people to me. Yeah.

>> Well, let me explain the difficulty.

It's not just about business or being a

developing country. Yes. It's 130

million people population in that

country. So it's a big market. Sure. But

in 2019, the Ethiopian government in

Addis Ababa banned personal use of two

wheelers. and you wanted to start a

company that was going to make and sell

electric two wheelers. So what were you

thinking that the government will

suddenly think you know oh these

electric two wheelers which we banned

because there was too much crime on the

street is not a problem anymore.

>> Yeah. So first of all what they banned

is not necessarily electric two

wheelers. They banned two wheelers

including electric but fuel and electric

two wheelers. Um yeah so I'm I worked at

Uber in Japan and uh when you start new

product for the market new concept of

course there are back and forth and then

actually I get nervous when there's no

back and forth because if everybody

thinks it's good idea you know that

means that it's too good to be true and

everybody can start. So first of all a

good level of challenge whether it's

regulations or technology side I I don't

mind at all rather I prefer some level

of uh blockers or difficulties

challenges that most of people most of

average people decide not to go uh two

why but why do I get um conviction that

it's okay to start electric two wheelers

in Adi Sababa is simple if If you look

at big picture AI Sababa, you know, some

people say 7 million, some people say 10

million, you know, different definition

of Adis Saba, but roughly 8 to 10

million uh metropolitan.

So if you look at the world and then

look at metropolitan of 8 to 10 million

population, uh there are three ways to

me only three ways that people move

around uh relatively uh efficiently. one

which is exception is a US uh people

move around with the cars you know it's

a richest country the land is huge so

let's forget about that then other than

that only two options one is like Tokyo

Paris and London the majority move

around with a relatively efficient metro

uh for 10 million population city the

other option is most of the Southeast

Asian cities like Bangkok Jakarta uh Ho

Chi Min where 80 90% of people moving

around by two wheelers motorbike because

average people can't afford cars also

the road infrastructure is not enough to

accommodate if everybody drives cars so

people end up driving two wheelers which

path Adisaba of 10 million population

will go in the future I don't know

whether it's one year or 5 years but at

certain point for majority of people

moving around efficiently what's the

right path then to me obviously it's

going to be two wheelers and then the

other part okay in Southeast Asia mostly

fuel two wheelers but for Ethiopia fuel

does make sense no fuel is very

expensive uh importing and then put a

pressure on the government finance uh

while electricity is one of the cheapest

and also abundant that if Eopia even

selling surplus to neighboring

countries. Okay, that means at the high

level macro level electric two wheelers

is the future for Aji Sababa. The only

thing that I don't know is a 3 years, 5

years, 7 years. That's why I decided to

go for it.

>> And what was it like to try and convince

the government to start to allow

electric two wheelers or any two

wheelers again on the street? because

you clearly succeeded, you have a

business now, but what were the

conversations like and how long did it

take for you to convince the government

to allow two wheelers to come back on

added streets?

>> Uh basically two things. So one is job

creation site and then second bit is uh

security safety or security concern that

government had about two wheelers. So

first one is most important one I think

um two wheelers not just for commuting

but one bike is one job in the gig

economy uh and it's important piece

for e-commerce that will grow or that

even the government want it grow um so I

basically convinced

um them that without the two wheelers

without electric two wheelers because

it's very difficult for e-commerce to

grow fast enough uh and then create

enough jobs. So that's one part job

creation and e-commerce. The other side

is security. So you know Adisaba is also

has headquarter of African Union. It's

very important politically important

location. It's a hub for Ethiopian

Airlines. they really care about the

security and then they don't the

government doesn't want random you know

100,000 people driving crazy without any

security measure. So what we suggested

we put GPS and we put IoT where if

necessary government can have access to

and of course we get consensus from our

customers because customers doesn't care

much whether the government can have

access or not rather they care whether

they have access to electric two

wheelers to make money by delivery. So

those are the two things that I try to

explain over and over again to a

different government entity that that's

the main reason. So still to make it

clear uh electric two wheelers for

commuting is not allowed yet. It's

mainly for gig workers for commercial

purpose.

>> So you're in this journey trying to

convince the government you succeed.

you're building this business and then

while this is happening in January 2024

the government brings in this ban on

importing fossil fuel vehicles what does

the electric vehicle market outside of

two wheelers look like in Addis today

>> totally changed in a positive way um

I'll give you an example there's a ride

share service in Ethiopia it's called

right when I came to Ethiopia 3 years

ago 100% % we when you call right share

100% it's fuel cost fossil fuel car uh

now 70 to 80% chance that it's electric

so that that tells how much change that

um yeah how much impact that has on the

electric mobility scene at least in

Adisaba and also I'm from Japan and

Japan roughly 150,000 electric uh cars

um 420 million populations In just two

years, Ethiopia surpassed that from

zero. So you can see the the level of

change for electric mobility. And Fasika

Tarisi who's the reporter in Adis Sababa

who works for Bloomberg and and wrote

the story with me also told us about how

there are these huge lines at gas

stations to try and get fuel and you

have to wait hours sometimes to even get

fuel even if you can afford to pay what

is pretty expensive energy right

>> that's correct and also those are this

is one of the things that I witnessed 3

years ago uh okay two wheelers didn't

have a spotlight light but it's going to

be important for giga economies but at

the same time it should be electric uh

not fuel again that was way before the

regulation change came uh I never

imagined that actually regulation change

or shift to electric mobility uh would

come that fast yeah but looks like a

high level government and uh what I'm

what I had seen aligned luckily

>> now let's talk about your business. So,

how many years ago did you start Dodai

and what's the journey been like?

>> In Ethiopia, you need a business license

to start business. So, business license

exactly 3 years ago. Uh I got and uh

started hiring first five people like

literally three years ago and then spent

6 months to yeah prepare the factory

and order first container. Um and then

we started assembling and then start

selling.

Yeah. And then we now selling two and a

half years roughly.

>> That's pretty rapid. I mean for for

difficulty of doing business in a

country like that that's pretty good to

turn around. How did you assemble these

vehicles? So where are you getting your

parts from? What does assembly look

like? Did you have skilled workers to do

it? So first of all the parts uh we

designed in a different team different

country including a Japan and Singapore.

We have a Singaporean

uh responsible for hardware. Um and we

have a partner in Germany but yeah

majority significant majority of parts

coming from China uh including batteries

and uh we import in CKD which is

basically 150 to 200 parts and we

assemble in Ethiopia. So skilled workers

yeah it's actually difficult. So two

things, one is difficult, but electric

two-wheeler assembling is significantly

easier than fuel bike assembling which

is very helpful for us to build a team

and uh operations. two, I would say

Ethiopians in general pretty good at

learning the process and then doing uh

things and then they don't deviate much

from what they are supposed to do uh

which really helps for manufacturing.

>> Tell me how have you succeeded like how

many units have you sold? What does the

market look like now for you?

>> Yeah, I never use the word succeeded but

yeah thank you very much. U yeah we sold

about 1,800

bikes uh as of now and about 95% market

share in Adisaba.

What we sold is called uh fixed battery

bike. So battery is inside the bike and

then customer purchase together with the

battery and then they charge by

themselves. Uh they can charge at home.

Uh and then we are starting now what's

called a battery swapping. So customer

purchased the vehicle bike without

battery and then we provide a battery

swapping service. So we basically have

hundreds of stations in Adis Sababa and

we are waiting with a charged batteries.

So when customer comes to one of our

stations just like ATM or gas station uh

they spend two three minutes and then

they go back because what we need to do

is just swap the batteries. their

depleted batteries and our charged

batteries at the station. Uh we just

started.

>> And what is your goal in the years to

come? Is it to just grow in Ethiopia? Is

it to grow across other markets?

>> It's a it's very fancy if you say that

you go all Africa. But we I I'd say

honestly focus on solving the problem in

Adisaba first. And I don't want to rush

in expansion. Uh so next two years focus

on Adis Sababa. Uh this year we want to

create um the reliable battery swapping

network meaning 100 or 200 stations

everywhere uh with a 3,000 users. That's

what that's our goal. Once you get 3,000

to make it 30,000 is relatively easier

than zero to 3,000, right? So that's our

focus for this year zero to 3,000 for

battery swapping. Um and then next from

next year just scale up and at the same

time we are building uh everything is

software based. So customers, drivers

needs to software to swap battery using

QR code and payment also our software.

So that with that software we want to

expand to other markets uh once we uh

solve the problem in Adis Sababa in two

years time.

>> And what about money? How much money

have you raised? Has it been easy or

difficult? uh we raised so far $7

million in uh until the previous round

and actually we are closing this round I

cannot share the exact numbers but we

are closing the round more than $10

million next month in March we will make

it public

>> and it's not been difficult raising

funding

>> of course it's difficult always

difficult uh difficult but in a way it's

similar to what I mentioned earlier

about like Kenya and Rwanda Imagine that

if you're Kenyan startups, it's easy in

a way that you don't have to convince

investors to invest startup in Kenya.

You just need to convince them to invest

in you rather than not your competitors.

Ethiopia is opposite. Once you convince

them to invest in Ethiopia, it's

automatically us because we are the we

are the e-mobility sector. We got the

95% market share also all sector

startups we are the biggest now so but

convincing them to invest in startups in

Ethiopia is of course very difficult

yeah it's been great talking to you Yuma

thank you also for allowing our

photographer to come to your factory uh

I hope listeners will go and check out

the story that we've written about

Ethiopia and its electric vehicle

journey which features some of your

photos um and uh I look forward to

meeting you in Addis when I come for COP

32 hopefully.

>> Thank you.

>> And thank you for listening to Zero. Now

for the sound of the week.

That is the sound of a non-electric

moped engine. A sound that one day may

go extinct if entrepreneurs like Yuma

Sasaki succeed. If you like this

episode, please take a moment to rate

and review the show on Apple Podcast,

Spotify, and YouTube. This episode was

produced by Oscar Boyd. Our team music

is composed by Wonderly. Special thanks

to Fasika Tades, Somar Sadi, Laura

Milan, and Sharon Chen. I'm

Akshhatraati. Back soon.