what really breaks my heart is how stuck

people are there are things you can do

to change your life for the better and

so let me give you the secret Mel

Robbins one of the most trusted experts

on confidence and motivation her unique

brand of raw and relatable advice has

made her one of the most sought after

speakers in the world don't rely on

motivation motivation garbage because

it's not there when you need it and the

fact is if it were easy to develop great

habits or change your mindset everybody

would have their dreams come true it is

very difficult to change because we are

hardwired to spot patterns that seem

similar and to repeat them there's also

this C voice that is talking to you all

the time going boy you really suck and

you blew that and my God you're never

going to amount to anything constantly

telling you what you think about

yourself and of course what you think

about yourself then drives the things

that you do but luckily there's two ways

around it one is to that absolutely

works

let them let them let them let them the

let them theory is based on a simple

truth the fastest way to take control of

your life is to stop controlling

everyone around you that opinion is

usually driven by your insecurity

controlling nature your anxiety and it

is ruining your relationships but when

you say let them something really

interesting happens you will

notice it it's absolutely

life-changing you will

at this time of year everybody is

thinking about changes that they want to

make in their life but it's incredibly

hard to become a new person when your

circumstances stay the same in this

episode me and Mel go on a journey to

figure out how you listening to this at

home can change your life we go through

the science we go through the proven

strategies and we go through some of the

mindset alterations we all need to make

going into next year if we want to stand

the chance of closing the gap on our

potential and when I say potential I'm

not talking about success alone I'm

talking about happiness and I'm talking

about health things that I think

everybody that listens to this podcast

cares so deeply about and there's one

thing that Mel says this idea of the let

them Theory which sounds so

simple but I honestly think could change

your life whether it's in your

relationships at work with your partner

or when someone cuts you off in traffic

this let them theory for me since Mel

told me about it has significantly

improved my life I can't wait for you to

listen to this episode Mel is just the

best and before this episode starts I

want to make a deal with you about 58%

of you that watch this podcast

frequently haven't yet hit the Subscribe

button if you enjoy what we do here

here's the deal that I want to make with

you if you hit that subscribe button I

promise you that we will keep making the

show better in every single way and we

have huge plans to turn this into more

of a documentary style conversation

where we work incredibly hard to bring

in footage of the things we're talking

about to give you greater context and

greater meaning so if you hit the

Subscribe button I promise you that we

will deliver an even greater version of

this show I hope you choose to come

along on this journey enjoy this episode

[Music]

Mel I'm thinking about the 45-year-old

Taxi Driver that's her dad I'm thinking

about Judith who has an idea for a

handbag business she wants to start but

she's 56 years old and maybe Society has

convinced her that she can't change now

she can't pivot away from where she is

I'm also thinking about the 27 year-old

medical graduate who became a dentist

because their immigrant mother told them

that was success and happiness and they

never listen to the voice inside of them

those people that are in those

situations where they feel like they've

gone so far down a

path how does one turn back move forward

I mean I don't even know what Direction

You Don't Turn back okay well because

here's the thing first of all I'm 55 and

I did not even get started in the

podcast business until I was 54 years

old and so I personally feel that my

life and the business that I've built

and the example that I set every single

day is evidence that you can decide at

any age that you are going to Pivot and

turn in a New Direction and One metaphor

that has helped me Stephen A Lot in my

life is I think

about life as one long road trip and

that that I know it sounds super cheesy

but just bear with me for a minute if

you think about every single year of

your life as a mile marker

and the fact that we all start at zero

we all end at some

point when you think about your life as

a road trip and you're the driver that

means it's about navigating where you go

next and at any single moment you can

pull over stop the damn car like if you

feel lost if you feel turned around if

you have hit a dead end do not find your

way by continuing to drive in circles

stop for a second a that's where you are

tune back into the navigation system

that is inside you and you can turn your

life in a New Direction you do it over

and over and over again in business you

have this Natural Curiosity this natural

drive if your instincts tell you to go

you point towards it I have

that but for everybody that's listening

or watching us who feels like you don't

ever have that moment where your

intuition tells you it's that way let me

give you the secret to how to make your

next big move and the secret is

this pay attention to what sucks in your

life because there are positive

navigational signals and there are

negative ones and when it comes to my

life Stephen you seem to have been able

to tap into the positive I have a much

greater like I don't know I'm I'm more

deeply connected to the negative [ __ ]

the jealousy

frustration um feeling anger anytime

those emotions come up in my body it's

just a directional signal from deep

inside of you telling you you're about

you're you're supposed to Pivot like do

not head in the same direction do not do

not keep going the same speed make a

change

so I hear you say that we can pull over

on the side of the road at any moment in

our life but I guess some people who are

listening to that will think well I

can't stop because I've got a mortgage

to pay I've got bills to pay I've got

responsibilities I I have no time to

even think about that and also there's

this other group of people who maybe

feel the frustration and the jealousy

and the the rage that kind of drives you

and me to some

degree but for some reason even though

they know every fiber in their body

knows that this is not the situation for

them this is the wrong relationship

wrong job wrong C wrong friendship group

they still for some reason just can't

take that step into

uncertainty uhhuh which is I think most

people probably yes I I I almost believe

that people don't

have a signal problem I they we all feel

the same signal but they have a problem

with acting on the signal because

correct so I personally believe that we

are all born the second you come out and

into this world you are hard hardwired

with this natural intelligence that is

your own personal inner compass and that

it is tuned into what is unique to you

it is constantly programmed by the

experiences of your life but it is

always signaling toward what is uniquely

aligned for you if you just accept the

premise that we are energetic human

beings that we give off energy we

receive energy we've all had the

experience where you walk into a like a

retail store and all of a sudden

something feels off that is the compass

I'm talking about signaling to you based

on your experience based on your DNA

based on the generational wisdom that is

passed down through your ancestors that

there is something there for you to pay

attention to the problem is not what

your inner Compass is telling you and

the problem is that you won't listen to

it and I can prove it because if you

have somebody that comes up to you and

says oh man I've been in this

relationship and that relationship and

the other thing and I'm just unlucky and

love and I can't trust myself and I

don't da da da da da da da da I always

say to somebody

stop it's not that you can't trust

yourself because your instincts have

always been right I want you to go back

through the five or six horrible

relationships that you just had and I

want you to look backwards and the

fastest way to do this is look back

through your photos and that'll take you

back on the timeline and that'll remind

you of all this stuff and I want you to

look at your face and I want you to just

be honest with yourself when did you

know this wasn't working and you will

always have somebody admit that they

knew seven years before the divorce they

knew a year before the breakup they knew

before they even hooked up with the

person the first time that this was

probably not the right thing because it

felt a little off but it was confusing

because you know you've got all the

like Rush of the adrenaline and the

attraction and all the hormones and all

that stuff but deep down inside if you

got really quiet you knew that this was

not the right decision for you and so

the issue isn't the accuracy of your

inner wisdom the issue is your courage

and following it because following your

inner wisdom and making decisions that

are aligned with what you are meant to

do in your life the kind of people

you're supposed to be with right now

the kind of support that you need the

things that are interesting to you it

always requires you to do something

different than what you're doing now the

problem is if it requires you to do

something new what's also going to

happen is you're going to have a fear

response and we mistake those moments of

change or those moments where you're

going to try something new the moments

of vulnerability the moments where

you're going to risk a little the

moments that require courage

we mistake the very natural response to

change which is a little moment of

feeling alarmed with your intuition

being wrong and so one way that you can

tell the difference is the feeling of

the decision if the decision is the

right decision in terms of a decision

that is aligned with who you are and

your soul and your DNA and just this

deep wisdom inside you even if it's

scary you will feel a sense of

expansion you will feel like something

is growing that there is

possibility even though you're nervous

about it even though you're not quite

sure where you're going to go if the

decision is wrong when you get quiet and

you drop in you will feel a sense of

shrinking you'll feel constrained you'll

feel a little depleted in your energy

and we often mistake that kind of

nervousness that you feel before you

make a decision to quit your job or a

decision you know what I'm gonna get Ser

about serious about my finances I'm

gonna stop going out to the bar on the

weekends and and I'm gonna commit to

listening to this podcast two hours

every weekend to start learning and

start mastering skills and to literally

put these things that I want first now

on Friday night when your buddies

calling like Hey we're going down to the

pub you want to

come when you are about to say

no you're going to feel that rise up

because you've never done this before

you always go and you know you're going

to get blowback but if you get really

quiet and you drop in and you ask

yourself

okay if I were to go to the bar tonight

does that feel like something

expansive or does that feel like

something that's shrinking me a little

bit and you'll know the right answer for

you and that's a tool that I have used

over and over and over again in my life

to know what to do it doesn't answer

how it doesn't answer when it answers

what there's a quote I heard many years

ago I think almost a decade ago which

stayed with me because I tried to

understand why sometimes it seems like

people need a little bit more pain

before they make a change and the quote

is change happens when the pain of

staying the same becomes greater than

the pain of making a change and I

sometimes this sounds like a crazy thing

to say but I sometimes see people in

certain situations where they're

debating making a change or getting that

gym membership or breaking out of a

cycle that they've has kept them trapped

in a situation which has made made them

unhappy and it appears that they just

need a little bit more pain what you're

talking about is a fundamental fact and

that is you cannot change another person

people only change when they're ready to

change and if what it requires is more

pain or hitting a rock bottom or the

stakes becoming so

high that somebody sees the cost of

continuing to self-sabotage or to go on

the path that they're going

down that for some people is the only

moment in time where they

see that they want things to be

different and you can't want somebody's

sobriety or their healing or their

Financial Freedom more than they do

because at the very bottom we learn I

guess we learned two things as you said

there the cost of continuing but also

the reward of change has is never

greater when you're at the very bottom

of the mountain it's like the cost of

continuing down here plus also the

reward of me climbing that mountain are

at maximum yeah and look you know we're

having an intellectual conversation and

you know the fact is it's really hard to

change yeah if it were easy to develop

great habits or change your mindset and

it could happen like that everybody

would have six-pack abs everybody would

have four companies like you do

everybody would have a hit podcast

everybody would have their dreams come

true and it is very difficult to change

because we are hardwired to spot

patterns that seem similar and to repeat

them and so I do think it's important to

say that if you're struggling if you're

frustrated with yourself if you're at

that point where you're so sick of

yourself and your excuses I've been

there Steven's been there this is a

normal part of the human experience and

at some point either the pain is going

to get big enough or you're going to

bump into somebody's story somewhere on

this planet who has been in the position

that you're in right now facing the

stuff that you're facing right now and

there is something about their story at

this exact moment in time that will

ignite something in you that is missing

and what is missing in you right now is

Hope because when you're stuck and when

you are on a Down Road spiral whether

it's just in your own head or it's in

self-destructive Behavior the thing

that's missing in your life is hope you

don't believe right now that anything is

going to make a difference and so until

you get to the point where you just hate

what you're doing so much that it's

worth

trying or you have somebody crack open a

door and just a little light comes in

and you have this moment where you go

well what

if what if this is the time sobriety

sticks what if I go to therapy and I

actually do change the way that I think

what if I could recover from this

narcissistic abuse that I've you know

been kind struggling with after that

relationship or that marriage what if I

could get out of debt if that person did

maybe I could do it and without either

hope or that kind of rock bottom moment

I don't think you're going to change can

you tell the difference between someone

who is likely to change and someone who

isn't because there must be so many

people that message you and they present

a facade as if they have had that

realization and they're about to change

Mel I'm about to start that business

thank you so much for everything you've

done and you look in their eyes and you

go and you go I don't believe a word he

was saying and then I'll tell you it's

it's that's a that's an energy thing I

mean you're somebody who invests in a

lot of people and I would imagine that

in addition to looking at the business

model you're actually looking at the

person and talk is

cheap like the kind of people that are

actually going to change will thank you

for the hope and thank you for a

specific piece of advice and then they

are mov moving so fast out that door

because they realize that change doesn't

happen overnight it doesn't happen with

one Insight it is tedious it is painful

it is lonely because it is a game of

just moving the ball down the field Inch

by Inch by Inch it's not glamorous it's

lonely as you start changing everything

around you starts changing people around

you like it just it's not even fun in

the beginning and so you'd either have

to have an incredible amount of Hope or

a ridiculous amount of inspiration and

delusion or you have to be in so much

pain that the alternative to continuing

this pain that you're in is to try

something different because it's the

only thing that might be slightly less

painful than what you're doing you get

to that point where you know I call it

the [ __ ] it like this is bad so [ __ ] it

let's try something else like I you know

and so I I I really believe that and I I

think people you can't tell who's going

to change because it's a it's a long

game is there anything that breaks your

heart about what you do for all the

upsides of it for oh my God yes

yeah what really breaks my heart is how

stuck people

are and that there are things you can do

do to change your life for the better

and if you don't have

hope and you don't have this

breakthrough where you have for just a

millisecond this Insight where you go

well what if things did work

out if you don't have that moment most

people stay so stuck in

resignation and actually that's one of

the things that really um I'm so curious

about with you because I like you talk

to so many people and have so many

people writing in and um the number of

people that are living their life at 40

or 50 or 60 and they are defined by the

trauma that happened in their childhood

and that's not to say that the trauma

wasn't profound or wasn't impactful and

having experienced childhood trauma of

my own that I didn't discover until

later in life I I I I find it so

sad that so many people just don't

know that they're stuck in patterns of

abuse or patterns of thinking that they

can change and if you're not aware that

you're stuck in something there's no way

you can change it and so it makes me

extremely sad that there are um so many

people that are not not aware of how

much better and how much more present

and how much more joy they could

experience in their life is much of that

identity like the identity the stories

the stories we tell ourselves about

oursel sort of circulates around us it

becomes this instruction manual for

everything we do believe and think of

ourselves and that is ultimately like

the story of Steven Bartlett that I have

authored based on everything I

interpreted that happened in my life

things happen I write a new line into

myself story about who Steve B is

because of that and then I use as my

instruction manual for forward sort of

facing Behavior I think one of the most

interesting experts to talk to about

that topic is I think his first name is

Paul Dr Paul Ki from Stanford I know his

his last name is Dr Ki um but I just

interviewed him for our podcast and his

work is all on the inner voice and the

subconscious and that there is

this narrative that you have that you

may not even be aware is talking to you

all the time and when you start to turn

toward what that self-critic is saying

you know you're never good enough why'd

you screw that up and you start to

examine what it's telling you it would

be as if I was walking behind you

Stephen all day long going boy you

really suck and you blew that and my God

you're never going to amount to anything

and you're going to be alone and you're

going to do this and it's not and and we

do it to ourselves and so yes your selft

talk which is probably buried somewhere

very deep this is not my area of

expertise in terms of Psychiatry or

Neuroscience but we just interviewed

them and it was fascinating is informing

what you think about yourself and of

course what you think about yourself

then drives the things that you do is it

thought driven or behavior driven is it

nervous system driven first is it

subconscious driven first here's what I

know I know that

until you make a decision

that you no longer want to feel how you

feel or you no longer want to think the

way that you think or you no longer want

to have the kind of results or no

results that you have until you make

that decision that you know what I know

I don't feel great I know I doubt myself

I know I've had a lot of bad things

happen I know there's a lot that I

regret but damn it with the time that I

have left in my

life I really want to start to enjoy

myself I want to take better care care

of myself I want to feel happy you don't

even have to believe you deserve it yet

you can just want it you've got to start

there you've got to start with wanting

something better for yourself and then I

personally think the most important

thing is to start

acting like the person who has the

things that you want right now even

though you don't feel like it and the

reason why I personally prefer to

hack this change of going okay I want to

um like here's here's something that I

am working on right now so I'm 55 years

old I'm in the middle of menopause it's

a complete Nightmare and uh I feel as

out of control with my body as I did

when I was pregnant with one of our

three kids like everything's changing

it's really confusing to figure out

what's going on the um I could go on and

on and on about this as as somebody in

the middle of it trying to figure out

what to do around my changing hormones

and how to get better control of my

health and so what do I do I feel a

little discouraged right now I don't

really know what to do I just know I

don't like how my body is feeling and

how it's changing and so I make a

decision and a commitment to myself that

I want to feel better I want to

understand this and so that decision is

super important because without deciding

that I want to do something I'm not

doing anything and then I start to study

all of the experts and what people have

to say about this topic of hormone

balance and gut health and Women's

Health and how to uh regulate your

hormones naturally and what to like

there's just so much information out

there and then I make a decision okay

well what are the two or three things

that I'm going to do and then I start

doing it and I wake up every day and I

do those things even if I don't feel

like it even if my self self talk is

pretty poor and here's what happens over

time for me personally is if I see

myself taking actions consistent with

somebody who exercises or somebody who

is taking care of her Hormone Health or

somebody who uh is not drinking or

somebody who is writing a book if I see

myself taking those actions it changes

the way that I look at myself the action

first approach is what I personally

believe in because I think it works

faster every everybody that hears you

saying that and everybody who sees

people be disciplined in that way the

illusion is that they're just profoundly

motivated oh my God no no I I think

motivation is garbage I mean I um and I

always thought that was funny given that

I was a motivational speaker for a long

time and here I think it's garbage and

the reason why I think motivation is

garbage is because it's not there when

you need

it and I don't rely on

motivation I do not expect to feel

motivated I do not expect to feel like

doing things and I make myself do them

that does not mean by the way that I

have great willpower that does not mean

that I consider myself to be a

disciplined person that means that I

understand the

biology of how most human beings work

and the biology of how most human beings

work is that you feel a sensation in

your body so let's just take an example

like getting out of bed okay the you set

the alarm the night before I know you

don't but most normal human beings set

the alarm the night before and when the

alarm goes

off you're going to get out of bed right

I mean that's how it's supposed to work

because when you set the alarm the night

before you're setting it for a time

where you're basically supposed to get

up so you are making a promise to your

future self in the morning that you're

going to get out of bed well what

happens all kinds of things happen you

go to bed the alarm rings and the first

thing that you feel is a sensation and

for me the Sensation that I always feel

in my body is something that I would

call I don't know if it's the cortisol I

I don't know if it's partying I don't

know if it's menopause I don't know if

it's the fact that I have a fabulous bed

and my husband's next to me and I don't

want to get out of it I don't know if

it's the fact that it I live in southern

Vermont and it's free like I don't know

but the first sensation

is then perception so sensation

perception then feeling then thought

then action that is the biological chain

of events that happens in a

nanc and I know that this is what's

happening so I have the

feeling I then have the perception

happen which is I look around it's dark

Chris is next to me I then have an

emotion about it overwhelm frustration

like you know usually something negative

then I have a thought which is I don't

want to get out of

bed and that for years would trigger the

action I would take and what most of us

I certainly didn't understand that

sensation perception feeling or emotion

thinking and then action is the chain of

events that is how you're

hardwired this is how it works body keep

like this is how it works it wasn't

until I understood that holy cow if I

don't reverse the

chain my sensation my perception my

emotions about things and my thinking

all four or five of those things

actually precede what action I take and

I'm not in control of what I'm doing my

emotions and my Sensations and my trauma

and like all of the stuff that has been

running on like autopilot forever that

is controlling who Mel Robbins is and at

some point if that's working for you

fantastic if there's an area of your

life that you're not happy in then you

got to reverse the order or I guess or

and you can go to therapy for months and

months and months and do the work and

slowly but surely you will change the

way that you think which also helps but

I find that understanding that that is

the chain of events and for those of us

that have any kind of of childhood

trauma where sensation is the first

thing that you feel that then triggers

that whole pathway or you have any kind

of anxiety again sensation of the alarm

that then triggers a whole pathway of

action and

reaction this is one of the reasons why

you feel out of control it's because the

sensation and the wiring in your body is

actually triggering this chain reaction

and you don't even realize it it's why

avoiding things or freezing has become

your default response to everything

because every sensation triggers the

exact same thing which leads to an

action of avoidance and the way around

that is to flip that and start with

making taking better actions regardless

there's two ways around it one is to

work with a licensed therapist who can

help you do the deeper work

of understanding yourself and

understanding your default thinking

patterns and doing the work to challenge

those assumptions and change the way

that you

think that absolutely works if you will

commit to the process of doing

it the second way and you can do these

together certainly how I did it is to

look at your behaviors and understand

that there is this chain of this there

is this order that happens in your body

and reverse it take a behavior first

approach what if if you want to get in

better shape what is somebody do who is

in the kind of shape that you want to be

in ask yourself what the behavior is

because I'll tell you the reason why

you're not taking those behaviors is

because this chain of events in your

body from Sensation to perception to

feeling and emotion to thinking is

constantly telling you I don't feel like

it I don't want to it's not going to

work anyway I'm gonna eat that thing

yeah I'm gonna eat that thing I'll do it

tomorrow and you can reverse it it's

funny because everyone

knows how I well I believe I believe 99%

of people know how they should behave to

become the person they want to become

they know they probably shouldn't have

that I don't know bowl of ice cream at 2

a.m. in the morning right they know that

they probably should get up in the

morning and run for 5 kilometers they

know they probably should check in with

their friends and family they probably

etc etc etc um but here's the thing

you're not making your behavior

decisions with your brain you're making

them with the sensation in your body if

you don't feel like doing it you don't

do it see before it even gets up here

you feel it in here and this was the

thing that was revelatory for me it's

like oh my God like my emotions drive my

entire life and that's why I feel out of

control and that's why I'm frustrated

with myself and that's why I can talk

till I'm bleue in the face about what I

need to do and what I should do and what

this and what that but when push comes

to shove if I don't feel like doing it

or I'm scared or I'm this or I'm that I

don't do it that means my emotions and

the sensations in my body and and the

patterns that have been hardwired for a

long time and the coping mechanisms that

just run on autopilot that's what's

driving you it's not up here so we've

broken our cycle who has well I don't

know I I I dude I wake up every I still

I know all this and this is the other

like I think is a really important thing

for you to hear not you Stephen but

everybody watching and listening to us

and that is that I I personally feel

like it's important understand that you

may never like the things you need to do

and you can still do

them like I I I will never like getting

out of

bed and I still get out of bed when the

alarm rings I don't like emptying the

dishwasher and I still do it I don't

like exercising I still do it I don't

like eating healthy a lot of the times I

still do it I don't

like taking a breath and centering

myself

when I really when I just scream at my

husband and I still do it because I let

my

emotions and my anxiety and my trauma

responses and my fears run my life for

far too long and I would rather be in

the

daily I don't know if you call it a

battle or you just call it I'm just in a

daily dance with myself to to constantly

come back

to alignment and peace and showing up as

the kind of person that I want to be

rather than how I may feel in the

moment one of the things I did want to

speak to you about is about how we know

what we want and how we set set goals

again we're we're in that part of the

year now where everybody's thinking you

know we've talked a little bit about how

one changes themselves but then even

knowing what direction to aim at is a

whole challenge in and of itself how do

one know at 30 years old in my

life what

real goals I should be aiming at because

part of the concern I've had is I wonder

if I'm driven or being dragged and what

do you think don't know I don't really

know the difference [ __ ] you know no

I don't you are the most driven person I

know why why I don't know I'm gonna ask

you just give me this part for my

interview well this is something why why

are you the most driven person I know

why are you me yeah um well I think I

was out running something for a very

long time sounds like being dragged is

it I I genuinely have sat here with

hundreds of people and every single time

they explain their motivation to me I go

sounds like you're being dragged by

shame your father's opinion of you

insecurity whatever like the AR that's a

negative way to say it I mean I feel

like that's why people don't like it

they sound powerless they sound like

they're attached to the back of the Lor

and it's flying down the motorway well

if you recognize that's what it is you

suddenly become powerful yeah and you

can drive yes yeah so for me if I put it

through the lens of like the bad things

that happened it would probably be

um uh just like outrunning like a

psychiatrist once said to me it's very

interesting to me that when this you

know incident happened in the fourth

grade and this kid climbed on top of you

while you were sleeping you are in a

state when you're sleeping where you are

completely supposedly safe and so I'm

not sure Mel your nervous system ever

reset back to a place of feeling safe

and then the hypervigilance of having

you know care caregiver who was always

kind of very erratic with their

personality also made me feel always on

the Move always on the Move always on

the move you know if you're on the move

nobody can catch you and so slow down if

you put it in that context becomes

unsafe

right however if you look at a lot of

our experiences growing up most of us

get a lot of positive attention when we

achieve and so we become whether you

want to say driven or dragged it's

probably just a matter of whether or not

you're in control of it a lot of us are

driven by the desire to want to feel

seen the desire to feel loved the desire

to get get the accolades which is why so

many of us feel driven to achieve

because it's tied into a sense of

selfworth it's tied into a sense of uh

being loved being

seen for me um I think I was probably to

use your words dragged since I wasn't in

control of it um but more and more I

feel profoundly driven I often think

people need to be dragged to a place

where they realized that it's failed

them that something has failed them for

them to then take stock and decide to

become a little bit more intentional and

to take hold of the steering wheel cuz

in my situation I was 100% dragged to

thinking that I needed a million pounds

a six-pack a girlfriend and a range over

Sport and then upon getting those things

it was like almost a bit of an

existential crisis like what the [ __ ] am

I doing here right what failed me and

why did I come to this part and then in

that moment I could really take stock of

what my own intrinsic drivers were and

then do things a little bit more

intentionally um and aligned with

disassociated from the thought that any

of these things would validate me at

some deeper level I think a lot of

this that we're talking about isn't

conscious decisions that anybody's

making that there is so much

conditioning and programming that

happens that we are unaware of as we're

growing up and as we're moving through

young adulthood that you don't even

realize how much you avoid stuff or how

much you're coping by being busy or

you're coping by drinking too much or

you're chasing stuff because you feel a

deep sense of self-loathing and that

most of the decisions at least this is

for me were all reactions just again

like just trying to do the best that I

can but not really in control of

anything and

until I really believe this until you

can drop into your

body

and just calm down your nervous system

and not be revving that internal engine

so much but to be able to just I I this

is not a technical term I feel like I've

smoothed out my nervous

system by doing traditional talk therapy

guided MDMA therapy with my husband um

EMDR uh all of the behavioral activation

therapy which is kind of leading with a

behavior first approach and start acting

like the person you want to be let them

let them okay well I was so fascinated

by this Theory this let them Theory

which is kind of a behavioral technique

I guess would you describe it as a

behavioral Technique No what is it so

the let them

theory is based on a simple

truth the fastest

way to take control of your life is to

stop stop controlling everyone around

you you have no idea how much time and

energy and

attention you are

wasting trying to control other people

you have no idea how much energy you are

burning through thinking about worrying

about obsessing about what other people

are doing what they're not doing what

they're feel feeling all of which you

have zero control

over and so the let them theory is this

simple theory that I credit my daughter

with teaching

me uh that has created so much peace in

my life because like every other human

being on the planet I had no idea how

many

opinions how much frustration and

expectation

I had about what other people were doing

or what they should be doing like it's

just

unreal how obsessed we all are with

everybody else and what they should be

doing and what they're not doing and

when you start to use the let them

Theory you will

notice it's just

unbelievable how much you need to use it

there are exceptions I mean I can

explain a lot about this I'll I'll give

you the quick story about how I learned

it because I think it's very helpful so

it was our son's um Junior Prom so he's

a 11th grader in the states

and like most moms you know completely

obsessed about everything it's also my

son and this is his first prom and I had

had daughters so it was a totally

different circus with our daughters and

I thought that his would be drama free

because he's a guy but it actually

became more dramatic because he doesn't

say anything and so everything think

Steven was a last minute scramble right

like from getting the tux to he needed

to have these certain Stan Smith Adidas

sneakers and we had to overnight those

to the fact that he was just going to go

with his friends and then all of a

sudden he asked a date and then she

wants a butiner she doesn't want a bout

iner and then we're going to the pre and

every step of the way I had internal

opinion why does

he so we get to the pre-prom photo party

that's a lot of peas and our daughter

happened to be uh home from college and

so she was there for the

weekend and all of a sudden it starts to

rain out of nowhere and by rain I mean a

hail storm it is raining sideways and I

realize none of these kids have

umbrellas none of these kids are

prepared for this and so I turned to our

son and I'm like Oak where are you guys

going for dinner and he's like well I

don't know and I turned towards my

husband I'm like they don't have plans

for dinner what do you mean they didn't

make a reservation for the prom and so I

start to get all worked up and now all

the other parents are like wait you

didn't make do you want me to call the

in would you guys want us to order

pizzas and the ramp up is happening and

I start to jump in and my daughter grabs

my arm and she says let them just let

them do what they want and Oak yells

over and says hey Mom I think we're

going to go to this uh Taco thing now

the taco place that they were going to

Stephen is like the size of this table

there are 20 kids it is hailing outside

they are dressed to the nines and I

could feel that volcano of control

coming up like you can't go to the taco

place you're in a tux and you got the

new sneakers and she her dress is going

to get ruined and you don't even have an

umbrella what are you thinking and

Kendall has my arm she's like let them

if they want to go to a taco stand in

the pouring rain and ruin their dress

let them it's their problem not

yours and as she said it I started just

repeating those words even let them let

them go to the Taco Stand let them let

him ruin his shoes who

cares let let him do what he wants to do

why am I worried about what he's doing

why am I not worried about where I'm

going to have dinner and so it was just

this moment and it immediately kind of

unhooked me and then from that point

forward I just noticed a million

situations sitting at the restaurant

that night and the waiter is busy with

other stuff and they're not coming to

the table how does everybody feel when

that

happens let them let them be

busy let them take care of the other

table standing in line and people I

don't know what it is about the world

today but people cannot stand in lines

fidgeting and this and that and the

other thing and the person is letting in

people from that line and they're not

letting in people from this line let

them let

them and some of the like really

important topics too like if your kid

wants to drop out of school you can say

what you need to say ultimately it's

their life let them what's going on

there at the heart of that is that just

a lowering of one's expectations so that

going back to the point we said about

expectations and happiness

we alleviate the chance of

disappointment and because we're just

let we're saying fine Let It Go like

what is that the very Crux of that on a

psychological level that's allowing us

to feel liberated from that stress and

need for control

what do you think it

is I think when we take on other

people's

problems um we create

expectation for them like in the case of

your son you had an expectation of what

his night would look like and where his

trainers and Tuck were going to go and

that unmet expectation is causing you

unnecessary suffering control stress

angst Vig V vigilance and just by saying

do you know what like I wish well you're

just cutting the cord of a whole another

stream of expectation that you

absolutely do not need you didn't need

to volunteer to make your yours and look

how much stress it created yeah and look

how much agit it created yeah so there's

so many things going on Stephen and

first of all I should also say there are

exceptions first of all you're not just

going to let your kids do whatever

they're going to do if you're a parent

because you're supposed to put the guard

rails up right but there is so much

controlling that we do in our lives of

other people and it is ruining your

relationships and a great example of a

way to use this is let's say that you

see that your friends are going out for

brunch this weekend they didn't invite

you happens all the time with my team

let them yeah let them yeah because

here's the thing that's really important

is it's really not about other people

see energetically you're hooking

yourself into other people because you

have an opinion about what they should

or shouldn't be doing and that opinion

is usually driven by your in security or

it's driven by your controlling nature

or it's driven by your anxiety or it's

driven by whatever it is that you may

have but once you get your energetic

hook into somebody else you've now just

lost control because you are now trying

to gain control of anything in your life

what your friends are doing for brunch

this weekend by focusing on them when

you say let them this is what's very

interesting it's very different than

saying I'm just going to let go I don't

give a hoot I don't care I baloney if

you're feeling a wave of energy about it

or emotion about it you do care because

the emotion is evidence that it is

impacting you and so most people

understand that you should just let it

go or you shouldn't care but they don't

know how when you say let them a couple

really interesting things happen number

one you acknowledge what's happening

which both acknowledges that your

friends are out to lunch without you and

it also acknowledges that it bothers you

and when you say let them you're

acknowledging the situation and you're

almost saying I'm above it and I'm

permitting this because I see it

happening and then something really

interesting happens because you're no

longer all worked up about what they're

doing you are forced to look back at

yourself let them if if my friends are

going out to brunch and they didn't

invite me and it bothers me that much

and I'm just going to let them do it

instead of sitting here stewing about

it what do I need to take responsibility

for you're toxic yes probably or I

didn't I don't ever invite anybody

out or if I want more experiences with

my friends I should be the one

organizing everybody to go out to brunch

or

maybe my friends can just go out and I

don't have to always be included and it

doesn't have to mean anything and maybe

I've got work to do with therapy and so

what happens is as you start to use let

them to lower your expectations to stop

focusing on other people and what

they're doing it forces you to take

responsibility for what you want in your

life linked to that was this thing that

I found which people just loved when you

said it which was you should stay in

your peace and stay in your power yes

and it sounds somewhat correlated to

that very much so so when you start

using it you will notice how often you

get agitated or frustrated by what other

people are

doing and it's strangers in a coffee

shop it's your

relatives it's like I we were just in a

situation this uh here here in the

states for Thanksgiving where we were

down visiting my parents and they're in

a place that's small so we had a place

that we had to rent so that we could all

kind of be together but it wasn't that

close and every time it was a moment

where it was are we going to their house

we going to our house and

somebody had an expectation about where

we should be normally the old Mel would

get hooked right into that person i'

just be like let

him that per the people in your life are

allowed to have their emotional

reactions and it's not your

responsibility to manage their emotional

reactions part of the reason why we get

hooked into these toxic Dynamics with

people because you're part of the

dynamic somebody does something that

triggers you you go right in you start

to change how you show up you start to

compensate you start to people please or

you get all mad and angry and next thing

you know it erupts and it's the same

thing over and over and over again and

you wonder why it never changes well

part of the reason why is that person's

never going to change you cannot control

that but you can change the energy

you're putting into the dynamic when you

were asked what was the worst advice you

ever given do you remember what you said

I do not what is it you said the worst

advice I was I've ever received is that

someone else can make you happy oh it's

so true it's so true money can't make

you happy someone else can't make you

happy and it's correlated to what you

were just saying there in a way it's

very correlated because a lot of us are

putting our energy into trying to push

other people to show up a certain

way when if you were to pull all that

energy

back and conserve it for

yourself you suddenly start taking

respons responsibility and you have more

energy to take the steps and to change

the way that you think so that you can

have what you want in your life and

there are exceptions look you're not

just going to let somebody get behind

the wheel of a car if they've been

drinking so if it's dangerous if it's

self-destructive it's if it's

discriminatory you have to step in in my

opinion and do something but here's the

rub hold the intervention with your

friend who is an addict offer to pay for

the treatment center if you can afford

to to do so but then you have to let

them do what they're going to

do it makes the responsibility of how

you show up entirely on you which means

you are now operating based on your

values and based on what you want in

your life and based on the kind of

person that you want to be not because

you're doing it out of obligation or

manipulation or that sort of

transactional nature that we get into

with people it seems to be both self and

selfless at the same time in a way I

don't think it's selfish at all really I

actually think it's one of the most

generous things you could

do how is not controlling other people a

selfish thing to do I'm not saying I

don't

care I'm saying I'm aware that you are a

independent human being with his own

feelings and his own life path and his

own values and

expectations and when I step in and try

to fix everything for you or change how

you feel I actually rob you of both the

breakdowns that you need I rob you of

the responsibility that you need to take

and I don't own the part of the equation

in every relationship every relationship

has an energetic exchange I do

something and now you are going to react

and are you going to react based on

what's align for you are you going to

react as a way to try to

change how I am taking that hook out

though feels like it serves you in a

profound way as well which is the self

selfish part of the equation doesn't

feel selfish but over the long term it's

going to serve you so it's it is a an AC

of self-preservation or taking care of

oneself yeah and I also feel like

there's a healthy dose of curiosity in

this because it's going to reveal all

the things in your life that really

bother you because right now you're

distracting Yourself by being upset

about other

people instead of pulling that energy

back in and going oh well if it really

bothers me that my sister-in-law never

comes to visit me then I clearly care

about this

relationship and so do I care about the

the them be me being right and them

always coming to me do I care about Tit

for Tat or do I actually just care about

building a good relationship with

somebody this is also extraordinarily

effective if you're dealing with

somebody that has any toxic Tendencies

any narcissistic trait like when you

look at the research around especially

narcissism and the fact that people are

not born that way they're made that way

and it's highly unlikely that they're

changing based on the supply that they

constantly need when you go let them I'm

going to see what's coming I'm going to

anticipate what's coming I'm going to

let them have their tantrum which is

what typically happens and

I'm going to go into this wide open I'm

not going to allow myself to get

triggered by it because I am saying I

know who this person is I know what's

going to happen I've been in this

Dynamic for years and I'm going to let

them do what they do and when that

happens you also kind of pres it's

almost like a a emotional force field

that goes up does this apply to Chris

too oh hell yes I mean I um I'm trying

to think of um how is Chris we talked

about him a bit last time um Chris is

fantastic he's getting a master in

transpersonal Psychology oh wow and uh

he I'm really really really proud of him

he has started the he he's been doing

men's Retreats uh for six years and um

why why was there a catalyst yes um he

came out of his uh restaurant business a

broken human uh because the venture did

not succeed and he felt like an abject

failure and based on you know all the

messaging that men in particular get

about providing he felt like he had

completely failed his wife and his three

children and all the friends and

families that had

invested and as I

scrambled and did whatever I could to

start try to keep us afloat when things

started to take off for me the shadow

that I cast just made him feel even

worse and so he was looking for

something that would allow him to really

reconnect with himself to connect with

other men and so he created something

called Soul degree and um it's been a

real passion project of his he just does

two or three Retreats a year he just

opened up next year's registration and

sold it out in 24 hours which tells you

a little bit about the demand and the

desire for people to have deeper

experiences and deeper connection and

you know to kind of circle back on that

topic about goals if you want to go

there

um I think it's very important you know

every this time of

year when January 1 rolls around January

1 is what's called a temporal landmark

and a temporal Landmark I I'm not going

to get the definition right but it is

this term used for moments of

significance moments that create a

before and an after and we've all had

experiences on birthdays ten 30y was one

of them yes of course right a before and

an after the reason why there are more

people that go to a gym on the first of

a month is not only because of the uh

incentive with pricing but it's because

it's a temporal Landmark quarters in a

business temporal Landmark but January 1

is a really huge temporal landmark

I think it's very important to do an

assessment or an audit of where you are

before you jump into what's next and I

think this is the piece that everybody

misses when they sit down and they write

out a list of goals the most important

part of setting goals for yourself I

believe is first understanding where you

are and there's a simple exercise that

you can do

it's sort of like um if you think about

directions it's mathematically

impossible to give somebody a set of

directions unless we know you're

starting point and where you want to go

and most people pick their head up and

go I want to go there without going well

where am I right now and so just take

out a blank piece of paper and write out

all the categories of your life it

there's no formula for this literally

you could do 10 different categories you

could do five you could do relationships

money my health my happiness

and just rank them where are you 1 to 10

1 to 5 whatever you want and explain

why and I think a really good goal is to

Simply say to

yourself how do I make this number two

or three points

higher that right there changes your

direction you know where you're starting

from and you ask yourself well if my

health is a two what would a five look

look like and can I work towards that

and to me that's what goals are goals

are that sort of point on a map that are

your next couple steps dreams are

something else and dreams are just as

important because dreams

are that moment where you pick your head

up and you get really

quiet and you tune in to what your mind

body and spirit is telling you kind of

aim that inner

Compass out into the distance and you

ask yourself where do I want to

go like if you think about five or 10

years from now and and the easiest way

for me to figure out that is who am I

jealous of that usually shows up a lot

faster than who am I inspired by because

jealousy is just blocked desire you

can't feel jealous

of somebody unless you

authentically want something for real

that you think that they

have and the jealousy happens because

you have somewhere in your psyche told

yourself you can't have

it and that's why it comes up as

negative but I want you to consider if

you were to allow

yourself at this time of year or right

now after this podcast to just

span the world and ask yourself who am I

either inspired by or who am I jealous

of give yourself permission to do that

and then get curious well what is it

exactly because it might not be the

fancy cars or the things that you see it

might be a sense of Peace it might be

that they seem to have a great uh family

life it might be that they

uh have a very vibrant energy to them

that there's something behind the stuff

on the surface that really is aligned

with what is hardwired in you and pay

attention to that because those dreams

are there for a reason see I think that

they are the beacons out in the future

that are directional

signals just because you have this dream

doesn't mean you're going to get it the

dream's purpose in your life is is to

get your head out of the sand and to

look out ahead and to point you in a

different

direction dreams dreams and

goals it's funny because as you were

saying that I was wondering what your

dreams and goals must be and it made me

think of this comment that I saw on our

last conversation last time you came on

the podcast it said dear Mel you've

touched me I've had a similar molest

experience I came out after the

experience and I told my parents about

it but I didn't tell them for many many

many years because I thought I would be

blamed for it because that is how my

mother always treated me I can finally

totally relate to somebody in you I've

been living in fear all of my 71 years

of life

fear Capital words controls me to this

day now thanks to you I have the answers

I can now live the rest of my days

better I've spent my life trying to fix

me with you I have directions to follow

now so thank you

Mel thank you for sharing that

um I um you know one of the things that

is profound about the let them Theory

is that if you're in a situation where

you're terrified of somebody's

reaction just tell yourself let

them let them have the reaction that

they're going to

have because if you allow the space for

your parents in that situation to have a

really horrible reaction you've

anticipated that it's coming and you've

also allowed them to be

human and you to empower yourself to

then do what you need to do for

yourself which is to say it out

loud and to tell the truth about what

happened to you because it's not about

your parents reaction it's about you

finding the courage and making the

decision and taking the action to say

this

happened and that's the beginning of of

your life moving in a completely

different

direction because you know

fear is something that runs people's

lives it makes you avoid it makes you

shrink it makes you live in silence it

makes you deny what you're

feeling and too often the fear that we

feel the most is we're afraid of what

other people are going to say we're

afraid of other people's reactions let

them have it let them be human let them

do and I'm not saying let people treat

you

poorly what I'm here to tell you is that

when you take responsibility for your

truth and you take responsibility for

expressing it and then you take

responsibility for your

boundaries and you take responsibility

for your

healing you do have the possibility of

living the rest of your life in a

completely different

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cards.com but I'll also include it in

the description below wherever you're

listening to this episode when did you

receive your diagnosis of ADHD uh I was

I think like

47 how did it change things well it was

amazing I I absolutely amazing you were

recently diagnosed right yeah um so it

changed everything because um I

finally had an explanation

for something about the way that my mind

worked and the way that I felt that made

me for 47 years feel like there was

something defective about me and I

couldn't figure out what it

was and I was diagnosed the way that

most women that are adults are diagnosed

and it goes a little something like this

you have a kid so my husband and I have

three children and um our youngest

Oakley was this just amazing kind of

casseroll of things and one of the

things that he was is that he had a lot

of trouble in school he just we didn't

even know that he couldn't read I mean

talk about being a parent that asleep at

the wheel we didn't find out that he

couldn't read Stephen until he was in

the fourth grade and the reason why we

didn't know and the school didn't know

is is because he had so

overcompensated in the classroom by

being so verbal first kid with the hand

up blah blah blah blah blah like talking

talking talking that

nobody knew that he was having trouble

and all of a sudden the math problems

get harder because they become word

problems all of a sudden reading

comprehension and you know not not to

mention the fact that he also had dis

graphia which basically means that it

looked like he was writing with his feet

I mean his handwriting was so bad and I

was befuddled by this because he could

literally sit in front of the TV and

play video games for hours and have

hyperfocus and all this dexterity and so

I just thought oh he's acting out he

can't stand school so we have this great

teacher in the public school system who

says you really need to get him tested

and I wouldn't test him in the school

and luckily we were at a point where we

could afford to go get I think it's

called a uh psychographic

something something it's like a long

word and sure enough the testing comes

back and the uh PhD neuros pych guy is

like yeah well he has profound dyslexia

he has profound disg graphia he has

executive functioning issues which is

basically the conductor or the secretary

in the brain sort of helping you stay

organized and a couple steps ahead he

has

ADHD and as I'm reading through this

report I'm sitting in the pediatrician's

office Stephen and I'm looking at this

report and I'm reading it and I look up

at his pediatrician who I had become

good friends with because we had three

kids in the practice at this point I'm

like

Mark do you

think maybe have I I have

ADHD and he puts his paper down Stephen

and he goes do I think you have ADHD of

course you have ADHD you are the most

ADHD person parent in my entire practice

I'm like what do you mean he's like Mel

you're brilliant and yet you never do

what you say you're going to do you will

leave here and tell me you're going to

call you never call back your kids go

years without coming in because you miss

all their Wellness appointments you

scramble every single year for the uh

physicals that your kids need and you

beg us to it is Clockwork of course you

have ADHD and I look at him Stephen and

I'm like why didn't you tell me he said

because I'm not your doctor and so I

went and I got the testing Stephen and

and turns out yes ADHD dyslexia same

profile as my son

and what was interesting about getting

the diagnosis because I didn't

understand what ADHD was I always

thought that ADHD is that you can't pay

attention same that's not what it is at

all and so

learning about what it is and learning

that boys and girls present completely

differently so there's an entire

generation of women I don't know if you

know this but there's an entire

generation of women called The Lost

Generation and what happened is when

they were studying ADHD I guess in the

late 60s and early 70s they only looked

at boys and so boys tend to show the

symptoms of ADHD around the age of seven

and it typically is around um the

hyperactivity or the inability to kind

of like focus and and control their body

movements girls on the other hand don't

sh start displaying symptoms until about

the age of 12 and the symptoms are very

different girls become um inattentive

but in a kind of daydreaming fashion

they become a little bit more

disorganized and they aim all of this

back at themselves and so as you become

kind of more Inward and you are

inattentive and you're disorg Oran and

you start to wonder what's wrong with

you and now plus the average age of

girls for puberty is right around then

too so all this other stuff is starting

to happen and hormones are starting to

change if you

don't get properly diagnosed and treated

and by treated I mean the whole array of

things that you can do whether you're

talking about medication or just the

different habits that you can have or

systems that you can develop to support

yourself if you don't get properly

tested and you don't address it do you

know what the number one thing that

happens you develop anxiety oh really

well of course because you're sitting in

a classroom and you can't get yourself

to focus and you're disorganized and you

start to feel this sense of alarm that

you're going to walk into a test and

you're not going to be able to do it

that you're going to yet again open your

locker and the stuff's going to fly

everywhere that yet again you're going

to forget your friend's birthday or

you're going to forget to do this thing

and so all of this anxiety Rises to the

surface so get this so they call us The

Lost Generation of women because what do

you suppose if we were not diagnosed so

I'm 55 if I'm in elementary school in

the late 70s and the you know and and

they've only studied boys and so none of

this is on anybody's radar screen you

now have a generation of women who are

developing anxiety at Big levels in high

school and college I was textbook and so

we get treated for the

anxiety and medicated for it without

addressing the underlying issue all

along which was undiagnosed ADHD so for

me it was

absolutely lifechanging and it was

life-changing to understand that ADHD is

not about your inability to focus it is

about the fact and I'm sure you probably

have dug into this and you know this but

for you know anybody anytime I talk

about this the number of women that are

going to write in the number of dads

that will write in about their daughters

the number of people that say oh my God

I had anxiety in high school too and now

now I've been uh diagnosed with ADHD and

it was because of my kid going through

this and this is exactly my story it is

happening over and over and over again

and so here's what really also helped me

Stephen and it's this

understanding that focus and the ability

to focus in appropriate ways requires

two different neural networks in your

brain and you can think about it this

way if you think about you know the

prefrontal cortex this kind of part of

your brain really has the job of almost

being like a conductor of an orchestra

this is the best um example that I've

heard in terms of what's happening if

you have

ADHD and what's happening is if you

think about an orchestra and and the

orchestra's warming up right it's

like and the drums are Ting ding ding

ding ding and people are shuffling in

their seats we know that sound right and

then all of a sudden the conductor's

like

TI and everybody silent

right in order to conduct an orchestra

you got to be able to do two things at

once you got to be able

to lower the volume on the strings over

here and then you got to be able

to

amplify the focus on the percussion over

here and what happens when this part of

your brain is not switching properly is

you are like Mel Robbins in college and

I would be with my books and I would be

in the Stacks at Baker Library at

Dartmouth College and I'd be there

because I'm going to study

right and my Orchestra conductor cannot

shush anything so the second I sit down

if I'm G to study I have to do two

things I have to be able to quiet all

the ambient noise I have to be able to

quiet all the signaling in my body so

that what I can amplify my attention on

what I'm reading when this part of your

brain doesn't work what ends up

happening or at least this is the way

that it's been explained to me is that I

can't focus on my books because I'm

paying attention to the fact that my

stomach is grumbling and I hear people

walking and then I'm looking around and

then I'm paying attention to the fact

that I have to go to the bathroom so

then I'm up then I'm walking around and

that is how I lived for a very very long

time do you think that's a survival

response what do you mean becoming very

aware of your

surroundings you know what I mean has

anyone ever researched whether or not

there is a link between trauma and ADHD

yes and Gabel mate I believe is the is

the one that's made a pretty pretty

compelling case to me that ADHD appears

to be linked to Childhood trauma which

is you I'm going to butcher this so

please forgive me everybody the case he

made to me was that when you have a

chaotic or traumatic or stressful

childhood as a survival mechanism you

learn to tune out and that's that's

that's protective so if your parents are

always screaming in the house for

example it makes a lot of sense for you

to learn to tune out in that moment but

also to know when to tune in obsessively

and maybe that's the hyperfocus bit the

bit that he really stressed to me was

that kids that go through some kind of

interpretation of a stressful

environment at a young age or a

traumatic environment are more likely to

have ADHD because they've learned to

tune out in order to sort of conserve

and survive it's like my rough

understanding of it well it makes a lot

of sense right because um if you also

have a really chaotic environment it

might not be safe for you to tune out

yeah and so you've got to stay in that

hypervigilant mode which I think would

fry the conductor in your brain it does

yeah because you're both paying

attention to the the survival signals in

your body at the same time as the chaos

in your house and even if you're tuning

out the parents who are screaming at

each other you are still tuned into it

because heaven forbid B it escalates

yeah you got to know yeah and so I think

it makes perfect sense honestly but it

was just a GameChanger and it was a

GameChanger to know kind of the

distinction between boys and girls and

the link with anxiety uh in terms of it

developing uh in a pronounced way for

those of us that have had this

experience of having this as a diagnosis

learning it late in life and then

tracing it back and going oh my god I've

been treated for anxiety for all these

years when the real issue was this

attention issue and if you take gabber

mate's Theory which I think is probably

accurate dial it back even further and

it's probably some form of childhood

trauma that put a kink in the

wires menopause you talked about

menopause earlier yes do we have to I

mean Jesus okay why what do you want to

know wh why did you respond like that

you know because it's um um it's really

confounding and it's confounding because

there's I don't even know if that's the

right word it's overwhelming everybody

my age is talking about it because what

happens is you start to lose control of

your body and um you're going through

all of these changes that you feel like

you are not in control of and so you

know I realize I look like a very lean

person and so the truth is that I am a

very lean person I have not changed my

habits in I don't know eight years I

have very very healthy habits because I

force myself to do things I don't feel

like doing

um and yet they're not working and my

body is expanding and brain fog is

increasing and I am like a furnace to

sleep next to at night

and um all of which is a function of the

changing levels of estrogen in my body

and what's very challenging about um

dealing with kind of hormone changes is

that there's so much conflicting advice

out there and to truly know what's going

on in your body you have to be drawing

blood you have to be looking at what's

going on in the inside that is extremely

expensive for most people it also is a

big maintenance issue it's a gigantic

pain in the ass and it doesn't feel like

anybody really has a good handle on this

and I think as a woman it's very

frustrating to know that women were not

even involved in uh medical research

until the late 80s and it's even more

frustrating to know and look I could be

wrong on this but we had an expert on

our show explain that they only use

postmenopausal women because they don't

want women women's hormones to throw off

the results of the testing that they're

going through with medication and so it

just feels like a massive gray area for

more than half the population our entire

network from the brain through the

entire body is running on estrogen

there's new research around like just

stopping menopause altogether because

women's uh Health out women's um I'm I'm

you know I'm not a medical expert so I'm

trying to learn all this stuff to

educate myself do I take a pill do I put

a cream on do I have this little patch

do I sleep on a pad that makes me cold

so my husband won't like complain that

I'm sweating like through the sheets do

I do on bamboo like it is

so overwhelming and then and you know

and I even feel my cheeks getting hot so

it could be a hot flash coming on I