were you nervous coming here today

I didn't know how in depth we were going

to go if I knew the questions I don't

think go to slept last night but you

were pathological liar Billy McFarland

he is the band behind the infamous fire

Festival Island Getaway turned disaster

for fire Festival is the subject of two

documentaries I will never forget when

did you realize

so wrong we were at the point where the

timeline I had come up with was just so

off I'd wake up some days it's like we

need four million dollars by 2PM did no

one say to you this is [ __ ] craziness

I just didn't have the ability to like

okay like what's actually happening how

can we prevent this and like almost like

as if On Cue

a storm rolls in Billy McFarland pleaded

guilty to fraud charges sentenced to six

years in prison you come back to a

shitstorm yeah the criminality doesn't

stop though does it but I couldn't like

really understand the magnitude and the

gravity of the crime they did commit

your lawyers tried to get you off the

20-year prison sentence by saying that

you suffered from untreated bipolar

disorder do you have bipolar disorder

um

I did two cents in solitary the seven

month stint was because I tried to do a

podcast over at the Payphone they put

the paperwork in to send me to like a

terrorist facility when you're rendered

useless and Powerless bat just kind of

kills your Humanity that's [ __ ] scary

that keeps me up at night

Andy King

did you ask him to suck a penis here's

what actually happened

before this episode starts I have a

small favor to ask from you two months

ago 74 of people that watch this channel

didn't subscribe we're now down to 69 my

goal is 50 so if you've ever liked any

of the videos we've posted if you like

this channel can you do me a quick favor

and hit the Subscribe button it helps

this channel more than you know and the

bigger the channel gets as you've seen

the bigger the guests get thank you and

enjoy this episode

foreign

[Music]

how are you doing it's been crazy uh

a little less than three and a half

months since my sentence ended

and really just been a whirlwind of

finding the right people finding the

right opportunities

and really just dealing with this

overhang of Probation and the constant

fear that there's someone out there who

could send me back at any time by taking

a wrong turn so

trying to avoid paying people back in

every sense of that word and emotion

while dealing with this fear that I can

wake up one more into a phone call

saying ha like joke's over you're going

back

so take me back um one of the things I'm

so curious about everybody that I sit

here and talk to is their earliest

context in the early start bringing and

how that's like ultimately shaped who

they are today so take me way way back

to New Jersey when you were you know

under the age of 10 what was that what

was your context your parents the the

situation in which you grew up yeah I

grew up in a pretty normal suburban

American household and I think the

defining moment was

when I was 10 years old were I got a

cable internet line into my house and

this was the really early days of the

internet and it was pretty much like the

Wild Wild West era where a lot of like

the framework and Regulation and mature

social platforms that we have now just

didn't exist then we were in the

emphasis of like HTML and CSS and the

practicality and accessibility of some

10 year old putting a website online

and I really found the internet to be

this Outlet where I could push the

boundaries of everything that I thought

was possible as this young Suburban

child and really as a way to start

getting in trouble and seeing what it

was like to get in trouble and see where

I could go

talk to me about your parents I've not

heard um much about them in your

interviews but I'd love to know the

influence they had on you and how that

shaped you I think they're great you

know super loving super supportive and I

think I've been asked this question you

know so many times but whether it's like

the jail therapists like or the

information department and

I think it's interesting that you know

there isn't like a defining moment I

think that kind of set me down like the

entrepreneurial Journey

um

I think I was just like really weird in

this desire to make my own path

and to really test what was possible and

so it's always kind of looking for

Journeys to start businesses and really

like test the bounds of you know of

reality and of the constraints placed on

me at various times in life and

obviously like the constraints of a

ten-year-old are much different than

they were when I was 24 in the midst of

the fire festival and much different at

27 in solitary confinement but I think

the reoccurring theme was trying to find

ways to test those restraints and that

took me to the very best times but also

the very worst times in doing four years

in prison and you know owing the world

whether that's time money friendship and

apology uh so yeah it's been been quite

the journey my question still becomes

like why though so testing the

restraints of like what was possible why

does a kid want to do that like what was

it about about you when you were that

age and your childhood or the

circumstances you found yourself in or

you know what Behavior was being

reinforced and what Behavior was being

punished that made you go off on that

Journey you referenced a sort of a

jailhouse therapist and then probably

asking you these kind of questions as

well yeah did you learn anything about

yourself from that those conversations

totally and

I I think there's always been this

desire to prove that I was different and

I don't think

I really understood like what different

meant I don't think it meant trying to

be like the smartest or the most

interesting I was like trying to prove

that I could create my own path and I

think that's always why been the desire

why did you want to create your empath

and prove that I hear this word proving

a lot throughout your story like a

desire to prove yourself right and prove

yourself to others it comes up over and

over again in the conversations you've

had where did that desire to prove

yourself come from

I think yeah I remember back to like

getting an alpha Smart in you know early

grammar school and I was so desperate to

like hack the teachers like admin

password for the alpha smart to change

the settings on it and just wanted to

show or I think is really proving to

myself that I could do something

different and

I never really did well in terms of like

a structured like learning environment I

was always either like super

disinterested or very very passionate

about something whether it's technology

or computers the Internet and just like

want to dive in and just like almost

testing against myself that I was

possible and what wasn't possible

did those around you like teachers and

your parents have high hopes for you in

your opinion

I think so but they were also you know

I don't want to I don't like the word

like realistic I think they're very like

realistic and structured hopes and my

path was certainly frowned upon by

teachers you know friends uh Etc

throughout the years even when you were

younger people even when I was younger

yeah I think like teachers were always

concerned that like why is he starting a

business and not focusing on his you

know math test so it was it was a

problem since a young age do you

remember getting sort of like critical

or pessimistic feedback at a young age

about your Ambitions and what was

possible for you yeah absolutely and

give me some examples yeah so it's like

uh

I had started a social network a couple

of years later when I was 12 years old

and

this is early days in my space before

Facebook had really gone outside of like

Harvard in the initial Ivy League

schools I created a private Social

Network for my middle school and like

out of nowhere like the site blew up and

you know it was like the talk in middle

school for a few days and the teachers

basically called me in and said like the

internet is not safe you know you have

to stop this right now you have to get

rid of the website and how did that make

you feel

it made me feel like I thought I was

creating something of value but I felt

like that what I viewed as value wasn't

you know agreed upon by everybody else

they'd almost create this like

reinforcement we're like no I know this

is tangible I know this is real and I

know people like are enjoying something

I made and I felt it was just so cool to

have at the time it was hundreds of

people whatever but having hundreds or a

couple thousand people using something I

made as a 12 year old was just really

really interesting to me and I think it

kind of created this

deeper desele and like desire to prove

whether it was to those teachers or to

the friends who like weren't supportive

that there is a different way than you

know the way that we're all taught what

did your parents want you to be you know

like I think my mom wanted me to be I

actually remember my mom's from from

Nigeria she didn't get an education like

uh we do I was born in Botswana in

Africa as well and my mum I think wanted

me to be a doctor or a lawyer okay I

think she was set actually on Doctor

what did your parents want you to be in

your own opinion I don't think they

really cared as long as I followed the

traditional path of like super studying

hard school doing well going to a good

college having a good college experience

I think beyond that

um didn't really care too much I went to

school to study Computer Engineering

didn't last very long so didn't really

you know study Computer Engineering but

that was the uh that was the intent

what's the defining difference between

both of them you know like my mother is

x in terms of characteristics my father

is why what other if you had to describe

them in a couple of words each what

words would you use I think

entrepreneurial uh you know quick like

in terms of like you know quick minds

are sharp they're smart and like honest

I think like Integrity is like the big

thing they're very honest good people

and like that's you know has been part

of the hardest part to me is them and

not just them it's like other family

members and friends trying to understand

how it could go down this path where I

was just lying and you know lying to

investors and partners and employees and

whatever it may have been it's like

understanding how I got there

from you know the the path I had taken

have you had that conversation with them

I have and

it comes down to I think you've you've

nailed it super early on it was just his

desire and I think more than a desire

probably a need to prove myself and fast

forward many many years later with like

fire in the fire Festival that need was

to these these investors who basically

took a chance at me when I first dropped

out of school and had been backing me

for five six seven years before the fire

Festival came to be like

my life I felt and it sounds so silly to

me now but my life I felt to me at that

time was making them happy and making

them money and obviously like the

initial investors if fire didn't work

and didn't work honestly they probably

would have been okay and they would have

been far more understanding than the

fact that I ended up lying at the end to

get their support but it's like need to

prove that I could do it and the ones

who did believe in me the need to prove

that they were right to believe in me

really led me down this terrible

terrible path of however long it was

where I was lying that need to prove

myself

um it can it can go on some fantastic

results in life because you end up

striving and being ambitious and it acts

as a source of motivation but then it

can also

um because I can relate to it it can

also get ugly at some point when that

need overshadows the need to be like

ethical or to even have work-life

balance whatever it might be

have you ever managed in all the time

you've had to reflect on it have you

figured out why you of all people had

that and used the word need not not

desire you you refer to it as a need to

prove yourself like where did that come

from do you do you know I don't know

um

and as I said I've been asked so many

times by people obviously not as smart

as you but I've been asked by a lot of

people and I don't think I've given a

good enough answer and that's probably

something that

I need to think about because it's

dangerous if you you know I'm thinking

about self-awareness here and if that's

still driving you from the back room of

your subconscious

um where that might take you again in

the future right

agree and I think it's more about where

I can find fulfillment and making people

happy because they've made money or

invest in a success

probably is most likely the wrong

formula in a lot of different situations

and I think like especially prison has

made me very very relationship focused

and I feel a stronger need to be trusted

by someone more than to make them happy

and I think that's the furthest area

that I've improved in over the past five

years I've never had you talk about the

um the conversations with your parents

in the wake of everything that happened

and

what what have been those conversations

if I was privy to some of those

conversations in person what would I

have seen

yeah I think I've just

tried to find a way to apologize and

it's been to everybody it's been to

close friends who I think were hurt

emotionally as well other family members

other supporters and it's like trying to

explain to them like why and finding the

real words to apologize

and

it was just so crazy as I've had all

this time to obviously reflect about it

how

I thought I was trying to make people

happy but I was really just like burning

down these relationships and hurting

them along the way and it's just how

messed up that pursuant path really was

have you actually apologized to your

parents oh absolutely yes

and what's their stance been throughout

jail and before and even now how what's

their perspective been

it's been like

close family is different because

obviously we're in touch and you know

everybody

families your family and I think for

like childhood friends who I was

probably closer with like on an

emotional level it's been a little weird

when I essentially was on the sideline

in a way for four years or whatever the

time frame was and then during that time

I'm kind of sheltered from like the

media and the comments and everything

like I don't necessarily hear or even

see everything that's happening and so

like the bulk of that is directed

towards other people like whether it's

family or friends so after so long of

like being The Target just because I'm

not there to be the target they start to

like you know form different opinions

and their minds start to wander and then

I think when I've seen people for the

first time like since jail and then I

can kind of see like a switch flip in

their head after like four or five

minutes like oh okay he's the old Billy

that I used to know and they start like

acting normal again which like really

crazy to me that when I was in jail I

just didn't really understand or

appreciate the terrible [ __ ] basically

that close people to me had to go

through just because I wasn't like

available to

be at the receiving end of everything

that's happened what did they go through

I think like the the emotional trauma

right and people are looking to blame

someone and to you know throw shade and

hate and I deservedly say I want someone

and if I'm not there like to be able to

take that hake some physically locked

away somewhere people need a target for

it and you know unfortunately I think

for a lot of people who and I learned

this in jail too A lot of people in jail

the ones that take it the hardest are

the friends and family is because

they're not the one they're not the

reason why you're there but they suffer

almost the most from it it's just it's

not fair did they tell you that they had

been on the receiving end of that that

abuse yeah and a lot of friends too you

know what what kind of abuse do they

tell you explicitly what kind of abuse

they'd been on the receiving end of

I think it's just like the mental and

it's like emotional anguish

um

I've had like friends even who didn't

work with me but you know who were super

close and around for a lot of the build

up of the events and whether it's from

like their family or their friends or

their employers like how could you not

know how could you have been with him

and

people are looking for I think the

public looks for someone to blame and if

I wasn't there to receive that blame or

wasn't responding to it that blame they

just look for other targets and like

I think that's what crushed me the most

is on this limited contact with friends

or family whatever from jail like

hearing

the sadness and abuse they were taking

and being able to do absolutely nothing

about it just like totally powerless

going back into a story it's you know I

was reading through all of the sort of

entrepreneurial endeavors

you you did as a as a young man even

before the age of like 15 years old

you'd started companies you'd sold

companies

um just just a long long list of

continually starting another business

starting at like nine years old you

started programming 13 you start this um

this this Outsourcing startup which

eventually gets sold on an auction site

called um your hot site I believe and

then at 15 years old you create a

company called 24 scene which is

eventually sold to Buddy TV when you

were 15 years old you go off to you

graduate at 18 from I guess high school

high school yeah we call it different

things in the UK

um you go to university and in your

freshman year you drop out and start a

company called spling and you raise four

hundred thousand dollars in a series a

round for this company called spling at

18 years old right the financing around

today are a little different so this is

this is like 2010 but yeah crazy how the

world's change right yeah yeah so you

raised that Capital at 18 years old yes

is that your first sort of window into

the fact or point of awareness we think

[ __ ] I can raise capital for things that

I have ideas for I think the biggest

thing there was

having someone so much smarter and older

and like more successful than me

actually like believe in me and back it

up

the idea to like any friend in any

family that I'm taking time off school

or dropping out of school was like

totally not okay but the fact that I can

point to like a small group of these

early investors who were clearly like

established and you know

like amazing

almost like icons in their own fields

that was when I was like look I have

this real group who is supporting me

beyond their words and I need to show

not just them but I need to show the

world that these people were right and

everybody else who was saying like what

I'm doing is wrong is incorrect who was

saying you were wrong at that age 18. he

was betting against you I think like

every peer you know all your friends all

the friends all your family members I

think all your family members

at all I think the majority um and I

think that the big thing was like

my friends at that age who especially

like the ones who like did better in

school and you know probably a little

bit smarter

it's just really as much as like they

can't admit it and I know I do this to

other people too so I think I see it as

much as they can't do it like they don't

want to see someone and obviously we're

super young at that age but succeed

Beyond them and it's like hey I'm

studying 70 hours a week you know I know

I'm smarter than he is and I'm working

just as hard or harder than him you know

why can he go and do this and I can't so

I think that's kind of like a a mantra

that you know I've noticed a lot amongst

like close friends and obviously I see

that same behavior in myself so yeah I

think that that bar just sucks on spling

yeah it was an Avenue for you to

eventually move to New York yes what

happened to that company eventually

failed yeah so uh moved to New York

actually in the second ever we work

space in New York uh this is 2011 I

think yeah it's a second ever we work

space in New York and spling starter is

a social network and I was kind of like

parlaying off of what I had built in you

know middle school and high school and

you know had this really small you know

websites that ended up selling which is

great

um the social networking aspect display

never really took off and ended up

making software and started to sell it

to like these record labels and TV

networks and I was like the Suburban kid

who was already weird for programming

and now I'm the Suburban kid who's weird

for programming crazy for dropping out

of school and now I'm sitting in the

office with you know the heads of these

like massive media companies that we've

all heard of that like I didn't even

know really like existed like to go meet

with like the boss at Def Jam or Hearst

or like Discovery or Disney like all

these companies that were just like a

logo on TV for me as a young kid I was

now like tangibly there and they were

like paying for something I was building

it was just a wild experience to go from

you know being in a dorm room in the

middle of nowhere to

in the midst of the entertainment World

in New York and so at some point you

make the decision to close spling down

so spring was going and I just got super

distracted

by these entertainment companies that I

was going to and like I kept trying to

tell back like these childhood friends I

kept trying to explain to them like what

was happening they didn't really believe

me and now it's really the Genesis of

magnesis was that I wanted to take like

the 19 year old me who wasn't working at

spling and give him access to this world

of like entertainment and fashion and

like media that I was like finding

myself stumbling into in New York and so

I'm trying to get to the point of like

there comes a day where you go

I mean I've had this in my life my first

startup yeah as well when I was

literally 18 and then I left it at 20

inside my next business but there's a

day where you go

[ __ ] that I'm gonna do magnesis instead

so I basically said [ __ ] that I'm gonna

do magnesis but like still keeps playing

going so okay yeah so spring now is like

my biggest mistake so explain kept

operating for you know a few years with

let's say 10 to 15 hours of a week of

attention Okay whereas like you know the

vast majority of my time was focused on

magnesis I think like one of the

reoccurring themes is just not seeing

things through and like it happened

again with my nieces into fire but like

jumping ship when

spring would not have been as big as

magnesium or fire could have been but it

still could have it still was okay and

like I could have had a successful exit

for people who were involved and just

like not seeing that through it was just

wrong

reoccurring theme yeah

um I mean I see that throughout your

childhood and then internally into early

sort of twenties yeah that that um that

I guess ambition

and that sort of constant inspiration

you have leads you to kind of abandon

the last thing and and an entrepreneur's

currency is their time and attention so

as you as you cited there it's finite it

means that the old thing gets a fraction

of your time when really if it's going

to succeed in that market it needs more

than all of your time yes um this leads

you on to magnesis in 2013 yeah we

launched 15 2014 eventually yeah

magnesis was a tell me tell me what it

was and why you chose to switch your

attention to this yeah so magnesis was

a network that was seeking to give young

people living in major cities access to

better benefits events and networking

than their like credit card would give

them

so like literally this is 2012 I just I

started doing the magnesis card before

it launched I went in Alibaba this is

like 10 years ago before Alibaba is

Alibaba bought this like blank black

sheet of metal and a Credit Card Copier

and literally went and copied my like

really crappy debit card with 20 onto it

onto this like black metal card and just

like went to the pizza parlor across the

street and the guy just made a total

scene when I went to pay and went and

showed the card off around wework and

started selling cards to like

interesting entrepreneurs at wework and

that was like literally the Genesis of

magnesis and the cool of the proposition

was that it was kind of elite and

exclusive yeah so it was definitely

trying to cater towards this like

upwardly mobile

entrepreneur style crowd

that feels like a through line across

many of your businesses that went on

which was like appealing to people's

desire for

status and clout because when I was

reading about magnesis at the end of the

day it felt like it was a a black metal

card which was again appealing to

people's egos because everybody wants

that American Express black card but

they can't get it because you need to

spend you need to spend like a quarter

of a million to get it yeah so it makes

people feel amazing and then you're

promising them

the application process was only a few

people could apply it was all appealing

to that people's desire to be

that's what it started out when I was

like 19 or 20 whatever the time was and

then it ended up growing and the real

benefit was in network and there were

certain members or card holders who were

meeting other members and kind of giving

them value and I think like the first

concept of magnesis was one I wanted the

black card for sure now it was like the

fun novelty like more of the marketing

aspect of it but two is I wanted like a

vehicle to share and really invite my

friends to all these like Entertainment

Properties where I was starting to

experience and explore because they

didn't believe me so it was almost like

show them what I was telling them was

actually happening and have an excuse to

bring people along through this club or

Community built around magnesis and you

raised capital for magnesium 1.5 million

before you launched and then three point

something off yeah I think that the

total was in like the mid mid threes

yeah so nothing crazy like but okay and

um jar rule comes into the picture

sometime around the magnesis yeah so it

started basically like once again

magnesium is all about One fulfilling

like my fantasies of places I wanted to

go and can get to and then once I was

there having all of my friends come too

and I just like loved hip-hop as a kid

so throughout magnesis we booked

probably close to a dozen and a half or

even like 20 rappers to come perform

these small concerts for magnesis and

that's what started the whole ball

rolling towards like the fire app and

that concept so when did you meet Ja

Rule uh during one of these magnesis

member events and the thing that's

really struck me at the time was how

hard it was to book him

and when he finally like received the

offer he said yes and like almost like

instantly right and the problem was this

like web of

quasi-agents and middle management

managers who all kind of claimed like

represent another talent but in reality

they knew someone who knew like a sister

who knew a brother who knew a cousin and

it's like this terrible

really like opaque nasty world and

coming from like a technology background

it made no sense to me I knew there were

other like kids like me right who would

you know pay something reasonable to get

access to this kind of like music Talent

so we started talking about building an

app which ended up becoming the fire app

to provide like a window into like

entertainers pockets for anybody to give

them offers directly and because of that

experience with Ja Rule and just general

General artist booking that's what that

was the Genesis of this fire app that

was a complete Genesis was like booking

a lot of these rappers through magnesis

realizing that almost every single time

we were going through middlemen who like

weren't really like the the manager of

the agent and then realizing okay I now

had this network of you know 20 artists

and their real managers so I can give

like access to other people through

technology

and from what I was reading

um this is the when one of the first big

lies was told which was around the

success of fire mobile app I read this I

think I can't remember where I saw it

might have been the Hulu documentary or

something it said that an internship to

investors it was claimed to be worth 90

million dollars but was actually doing

60k in business what is the truth around

that where was the where was the LIE

told here yeah so the fire app and the

fire Festival really all come together

at the same time

um

it's crazy to think back like how how

quick I went down a bad path but how

quick everything happened as well during

that time period

this is all 2016. um the fire app was

launched at some point mid-2016 and the

fire Festival was you know conceived in

September October of 2016. so it was all

kind of around the same time Wi-Fi

Festival how did that come to be that

because the fire app came first fire out

came first how did you get from there to

fire Festival so we had a townhouse

space basically this Clubhouse if you

will for magnesis members and one of the

people working at the front desk I lived

a handful of blocks away calls me one

night and says there's this guy here who

is building some crazy things at Google

but he says he flies planes and wants to

fly you I think he's telling the truth

you have to come and meet him so I ran

over the townhouse and met this guy and

like absolute genius like one of the

best

like developers of AI I've ever met in

my life and you know he's going to go on

to I think change your world in very

many ways but he's like listen like I

Fly for Fun I have a bunch of friends

who do the same thing we should take a

few planes and do a trip to the outer

islands of the Bahamas for your

magnesium members so we've been running

these trips for years

and I found these outer Islands to

essentially be this like welcoming

playground where there might be 10

people who live on the island who are

just like so amazing and kind-hearted

and warm and once you bring 18 20 24

people there from New York everybody

kind of drops like their pretense and if

you connect them around these like

almost like life-defying experiences and

Adventures they really really come

together so it was running these trips

for a number of years when I literally

brought like one of these childhood

friends that I mentioned and fire app

had just launched he said hey man you

should totally do a music festival here

for all magnesis members so that was the

real person who came up with the idea

and that's how the fire Festival

happened and when was where was the the

first light holding yeah in the

fundraising process was it on raising

capital for the app was it capsule for

the magnesis yeah so the the fire

um

the fire Festival app didn't raise much

money prior to like the festival

announcement

we came up with a festival idea in

September of 2016.

shot and released at promotional video I

think a lot of people saw in December of

2016 and announced a April of 2017 like

launch date so the period was super

super short so somewhere in like the

weeks leading up to that December

promotional video I started lying and

that was lying to Fire apps investors

lying to fire festivals investors lying

about magnesius's numbers it all kind of

hit when

oh [ __ ] fire Festival is real we're

announcing a festival we have X number

of months to build a city in the middle

of nowhere how the [ __ ] are we gonna do

this that's just like set me off down

that that path

from

I think from what I recall there was

four months between you announcing the

festival and the festival happening so

you're going to the middle of nowhere

you've got to build sewage yeah

infrastructure basically a city from

scratch at 25 years old with

out the capital to do it and without the

experience in doing it in

four months in 120 days so stupid

so bad

I think I I got my 25th birthday we

launched the trailer for The Fire

Festival

and I still didn't think it was real at

that time like we had these great trips

with a few dozen people and those we

could totally handle we launched a

trailer then I remember waking up like

you know quasi hung over five or six

hours later and we'd sold like a half

million dollars to tickets if I said

that to people now in my team and you

know I've you know I'm I'm 30 now same

age as you yeah um you know I've got

huge amounts of resources in terms of

like contacts and capital everyone in my

team would turn around to me and give me

that look and say this is not possible

Stephen

did people say that to you

did no one say to you this is [ __ ]

craziness absolutely and I think that

part of the curse and and part of the

gift at the time was

a lot of their reasons that were being

given to me by things were impossible

we're all solved with these short-term

Miracles and of course everybody said

hey the end goal is impossible you're a

[ __ ] like you don't understand like

what this takes

and then they would give three or four

reasons about like smaller problems

right and then I would go and like

create Magic and solve these three or

four problems and be like look we've

proved that like we can handle the

bigger stuff too and I think it just

took

so many random like rolls of the dice to

go our way to be able to create a

failure so large because if we found

like a stumbling block or a roadblock

earlier on it would have stopped the

whole thing but it was like this weird

combination of

smart crazy people all kind of coming

together for this wild idea and solving

things we should never been able to

solve until we couldn't

lying plays a big role in that though

100 I think you have to add line to the

mix because I don't think he would have

gotten those people to that Island on

that plane without a series of

almost like nuns stop lying there's no

way that you would have well in my view

um if people knew the reality of my view

if people knew the reality of the

numbers and the situation on the ground

and I remember watching the

documentaries which I know you haven't

seen yeah still no yeah we're going to

talk about that but I remember seeing

the there were moments where you were

saying to team members don't don't tell

this investor the nature of the

situation and had you been honest I

think investors from my experience of

building companies would not have backed

this the reality of the situation if if

they knew the truth they wouldn't have

backed that agree

I always think that like lying hurt

things the most

they lying

really pushed away the help that I

needed and I think that how we just

announced the festival with our trailer

video

we had already proven our ability to you

know create hype to bring a manageable

number of people to these islands to

give them like an amazing experience

if I just like threw my like hands up

the next day and said okay I didn't

expect to sell this many tickets and I

don't have the resources or or like

wherewithal to actually execute this now

I think the professionals would have

flocked to me and said okay like we are

experts in doing this like let us take

over and you do what you're good at but

like let us you know be the adults in

the room and make this thing actually

happen and why didn't you put your hands

up and say that I I that's like a type

of lawsuit over the past five years but

that's where we're like Beyond lying

like breaking all the ethics and morals

which like totally didn't totally wrong

it pushed away to help

are you a pathological liar

this is a claim that I've I've heard

leveled at you by the judge in your case

by other people that were working on

fire Festival

um people in the documentaries

yeah I think like my entire

Mantra and drive right now is to form

like super super close relationships and

I want those six or eight people

to never question my integrity and I

think like getting on a microphone and

telling the world hey guys like I'm not

a pathological liar he's like yeah shut

the [ __ ] up but it's like I want to feel

Pride where I can like go home tonight

and I know like these six to eight

people that I can call or they can call

me you know we will have our backs and I

really don't have the answer in terms of

like how I adjust it to the world but

it's like the six to eight people and

you guys know who you are like

let's build that trust because that's

one of the even when I was thinking

about doing this interview obviously you

know the foundation of the Diary of SEO

is honesty yeah and I'm thinking after

all this stuff I've seen in these

documentaries how do I know that he's

not just going to come here and [ __ ]

me yeah how do I know that I'm not going

to be one of the investors or one of the

other people that was was lied to how do

I know he's going to give me the truth

yeah

how do you receive that

it's just so hard to hear like it's it's

super hard to hear and I think like

natural reaction is to always like fight

back and argue oh I'm not a lie of then

you just like and it's just like

digs you down

a further hole

so I think it's just finding pride in a

different area and it's like I am highly

flawed and like any claims made to the

contrary are just are wrong and for

whatever good ideas I've had I've had

you know 10 times many bad ones and like

clearly I Allied to an extent that

I would really hope that the vast

majority of the population like would

never be comfortable doing so yeah I

highly highly flawed and I think like

the next 30 years of my life will be

defined by can I focus on my skill set

can I be honest with a small number of

people around me and like can I get help

in those areas where I clearly need it

as you know Intel are now sponsoring

this podcast and last week I introduced

you to Intel Evo platform the badge of

approval for high spec laptops that pass

Intel Zone strip requirements and enable

you to be more productive on the go as

someone who spends most of their life on

the go it's Intel Eva that really caught

my eye when we were discussing this

partnership the idea that Intel gives

your laptop the seal of approval for you

on all things like all-day battery life

fast charging and high performance makes

my life easier when I'm buying a new

laptop because I know that if it's got

that Intel seal of approval then it's

going to be able to keep up with me

they've basically done all the hard work

and research for you and confirmed it's

going to be able to keep up with your

busy life on the go head to intel.co.uk

EVO to find out more about the televo

platform also for a limited time you you

can currently get 15 off all Intel Evo

devices at John lewis.com the code is

Evo ceo15 that's

e-v-o-c-e-o15 until December 11th so

head over to John lewis.com to check out

the intelivo designs and get your 15 off

terms and conditions apply see more

details in the description box

for many years people have been asking

for a coffee flavored Hill and quite

recently he'll release the iced coffee

caramel flavor of their

um ready to drink Hills and I've just

become hooked on it over the last couple

of weeks I've been on a really

interesting Journey with huel which I've

described and talked about a little bit

on this podcast I started with the berry

ready to drinks then I moved over to the

protein salted caramel because it's 100

calories and it gives you all of your

essential vitamins and minerals but also

gives you the 20 odd grams of protein

you need and now I'm balanced between

them both I drink mostly the banana

flavor ready to drink I've got really

into the iced coffee caramel flavor of

heels ready to drink and now I'm

drinking that as well as the protein

make sure you try the new ready to drink

flavors that the caramel flavor is

amazing the new banana flavor as well is

amazing and obviously as I said the iced

coffee caramel flavor has been a real

Smash Hit so check it out let me know

what you think on social media I see all

of your tags and Instagram posts and

tweets about your you haven't watched

the documentaries no

the first prison I was at or like when

they appeared when they came out the uh

the guys got like a USB stick with both

the documentaries and watched them and I

was like I literally went outside I

think I was like one of two people who

wasn't in the TV room watching the

documentary but couldn't do it why

I think at that time

I was still like this is early 2019 so I

was less than a year into my sentence I

think I was still like in the combative

phase where I just hadn't like come to

reality with everything that happened

and I was too scared to hear allegations

or comments by other people and not be

able to respond and I like realized like

being locked up

and then having someone say something

where it's probably like 70 true and 30

false I wouldn't have like focused on or

internalized the part that was true even

though that was probably most of it I

just would have gotten enraged by the

false part but I wouldn't be able to do

anything about it so I felt like if I

was not like stable enough or mature

enough

at that time to to watch it and I

probably still I'm not but really yeah

because I was gonna ask you to follow up

was why haven't you watched them now

then if that was 2019 in 2022 now so why

haven't you watched them still so I

caught myself the other day someone

asked me the same question and I said

and I think this show is like I'm not

like mature enough to watch it yet I

said no one in this is probably slightly

true but exaggerated I said no one real

interviewed for the documentary like why

would any business person who has

anything going on in their life you know

attach themselves to the event that's

mostly true obviously but but still some

of the people who did interview I'm sure

were you know sharing real stories of

real things that happened so I'm just

I'm not ready there's no way I don't

know why but I'm not ready

because of how it might make you it

might trigger you in some type of way or

I think so and yeah I just I did ask

myself I said would you if that happened

to me when I watched the documentaries

and I'm gonna be honest I don't know

yeah I don't know but you must

everywhere you go now have

piece together those documentaries

because people like me ask you seven

questions for sure

unfortunately I think I've heard more

than than I wanted to but I think I

understand

how do you feel about the fact that like

probably for at least some time now the

center point of conversations you have

and interviews you do is going to Center

on

that that's gonna like that's gonna be a

real defining thing for for many that

meet you I think it's super interesting

like

think about personally and it's almost

like weird because a lot of the people

who have watched documentary whether

they're friends or family members other

people

their advice is like you are incompetent

you can't do anything going forward like

you know go work some entry level like

desk job for 70 hours a week for the

rest of your life and and shut up and I

think it's kind of like ironic right

because then you're stuck living with

the remorse the guilt the failure of

what you did before and I think the

other option is

can I go about it but go for it and go

for it honestly and if I fail it's okay

but you know at least take the swing and

like which path would you know make you

prouder and I've chosen the latter which

might be right it might be wrong but I

just think it's really weird to me how a

lot of like the close friends who have

watched a documentary almost all their

advice have just been like you can't do

anything now and maybe they're right but

it's like that's been like I think

that's the hardest thing to internalize

from the whole

like after effect process where we

currently stand

well you've clearly got a

internal bias to just prove everybody

wrong which doesn't seem to have left

you right so when you hear that the

Billy that I mean I've come to learn in

the last you know couple of minutes

speaking together with just 100 use that

as fuel right I think like

I find Pride differently now and when

you're locked away for four years and

ten months like when you're alone or

with a cellmate but like in solitary

confinement you can't leave you have to

find pride in like the littlest and

weirdest things and you know once you

leave 95 of it it's just like irrelevant

and gets out the window but I think like

finding pride is where it stands and

do I want to be the the guy who's honest

but quit or the guy who's honest but

went for it and then whatever the

outcome is the outcome is and like to me

I can find more pride in that path

fire Festival you raise more than 20

million dollars

now that alone is not an easy thing to

do

you know lying yeah definitely aided

that for 100 but even if people were

lying even if someone was just purely

lying there's still an element of

salesmanship that goes into

accomplishing such a big investment

raise for a first-time Music Festival

when you're 25 years old

what are your skill sets that that made

that happen let's just lying it we put

that on the table you lied yeah but what

are the other skill sets that

enabled that massive failure

so I think it's like taking a second to

like dive into the lies and why it was

so bad I think there's like a

misconception at least from what I've

heard that I woke up one day made a fake

spreadsheet which is totally true and

then with that spreadsheet you know went

and raised a bunch of money I think the

reality is it's like not that simple you

know I can make a bad spreadsheet

tomorrow without my background and

you're just not going to go and raise 20

million dollars straight it's like it

doesn't go like that

I think the hardest part is a trust is

that the majority of the people who are

backing me

had either invested in me since I was 19

years old or I'd see me work since I was

19 or were you know referred or trusted

someone like who fell into one of those

camps so it was like six years of

trust and failure and struggle that I

had to go through to get to the position

where I could even ask for that kind of

money so more than the lie but the

revenue at the time which I almost think

is not as bad as betraying the trust of

the years it took to get to that point

where I was even in the position to lie

about the revenue

so there's that trust building which

again the jury's probably out on whether

that trust was built honestly yeah

because you talked about

magnesis also being inflated in terms of

the numbers they're being lies there but

then your personal skill like what is it

in hindsight you think why did these

people

back me as an individual what are your

skill sets like Charisma or is it your

ability to talk your communication

skills what was it I almost think that

you could find

similarities in these early trips that

led to the fire Festival in some of the

magnesis experiences which

is taking people who wouldn't usually

meet bringing them together and then

taking them to a place

they've never been before whether that's

like

a jet ski race at midnight around these

like uninhabited islands or like spear

fishing for your own Lobster with

someone you've always wanted to meet

it's about just like connecting

interesting people with like a tinge of

crazy around these adventures and like

those Adventures could be physical it

could be virtual but that's kind of

always been I think what is intrigued

backer someone that's a friend a partner

a sponsor an investor is to be part of

that

you know tornado of activity and

connection and excitement interesting so

the people so what I got from that is

the people that invested in you wanted

the same thing as the people that bought

tickets to fire Festival they wanted to

be part of something really really cool

themselves they wanted to meet

interesting people and do interesting

crazy [ __ ] like that's like that's the

ammo and you ended up selling some 8 000

tickets for two weekends at fire

Festival yeah

I mean everyone remembers the orange

tile campaign and the use of influencers

and we had Kendall Jenner Bella Hadid

Haley Baldwin Emily ratatowski and you

shot this in this promo video

um in the Bahamas which became pretty

viral because no one had ever seen that

group of influences together before yeah

um

at that point you know you know you know

two months three months out from the

festival you've sold these [ __ ]

tickets this is when the lies get really

bad out there like in one of the

documentaries it says that you put a

villa up on the site for a quarter of a

million to try and raise some money that

you didn't have

um and then I read further and further

and I was trying to understand the world

you were in that was causing you to

continually lie and lie and lie and I

heard about this urgent payment sheet

what was this urgent payment shame how

is that driving you we were at the point

where the timeline that

I had come up with it was just so off

and ridiculous

it just like made all the payments and

vendors just kind of go through the roof

in terms like the cost to make something

happen so quickly and like we just had

no money right we were just trying to

get money from any Source whether it was

investors or sponsors or customers or

ticket sales consulting jobs I was like

you know wearing 10 hats to trying to

get the income we needed to fund the

fire Festival

and

the money crunch was so bad I'd

literally wake up every day you know at

9am to a sheet where we had a list of

every payment we had to make before the

bank wire cut off at four o'clock that

day so I knew that by 2 pm I'd have that

money come into our account is the team

had enough time to wire it out before

the four o'clock wire deadline and so

I'd wake up some days it's like we need

four million dollars by 2PM so I'd have

five hours to go out Source the

investors

come to terms with them and actually get

the money in the account or else people

are dead in the water four million yeah

we managed to survive like this for

almost 60 days and some days it was 100

Grand and some days it was four million

dollars but like it was it was Wild on

that day that it was four million

dollars you got till 2PM

what'd you do start started calling

investors and saying well I think like

I was telling them we were [ __ ] unless

we had this money and I think that like

a lot of the investors almost adapted

a similar mindset to me that we're in so

far that hey we've already spent X

what's an extra couple million dollars

at this point because if this thing

works we're all going to make money

and that was the that was the mindset

that I was trying to build and I truly

believed obviously it was so silly now

to look back on because one of the in

one of the documentaries they paid they

paint the opposite picture they say that

you were calling investors and not

telling them the extent of how bad

things were because yeah there was one

particular moment where you'd sent an

email telling someone not to tell the

investor the true nature of the

situation with the accommodation because

they wouldn't give more money so the

documentary tells a completely different

story about being opaque yeah

untransparent to investors in those

crunch moments I think like one of the

bad thing is is I definitely sheltered

information like not every investor

would have the same information not

every team member of the same

information so I certainly kept

a lot of the logistical problems in the

dark

but if I knew like one investor could

solve this problem you know I would tell

them about the logistics problem

but then say don't tell anybody else but

we need your help here so I was picking

and choosing people who I thought would

be sympathetic or capable of handling

certain situations so I mean terrible

approach but it was like a mix of hey

we're in this far we need a little bit

more so give it to us and also a mix of

well we can't tell everybody this

because if people realize you know we

need

four million dollars by two o'clock

today we sound crazy and we're dead

people hearing that situation where you

have this urgent payment sheet and

you're waking up in the morning and it

says 100K on it 250k yeah um four

million yeah

um one of the things in the documentary

showed that you were

popping up like fake Villas and stuff

like that to meet the debt owed on that

payment sheet so if you owed if you

needed 50k that day pop a villa online

call it the Dolphin Villa sell it for

50k and that would cover the decision is

that true I don't think it was as one to

one as that right um

we certainly were trying to sell as many

expensive ticket packages possible that

didn't exist that whether it was like

boats or Yachts that like you know we

would go in Charter or whether it was

like high-end Villas that we were trying

to rent but they didn't have them at the

time

so I think our numbers were not like one

to one at the end of the day however we

did rent a couple hundred Villas so I

know I've heard so many conflicting like

stories from this but you know we did

rent a couple hundred Villas and uh I'm

sure we were off by a number but it

wasn't like hey we had no Villas on the

island there was a quarter million

dollar package for like a villa or a

yacht or something yeah did that sell

um I think we sold a couple couple boats

for like in that range quarter million

dollars and then we had there was a

couple houses in the island which were

like these like 10 bedroom you know like

private estate type things we sold a

number of them I don't think it was like

it wasn't tons but we sold a couple well

the boats did the boats exist yeah on

the day we partnered with like basically

like this like yacht brokerage company

so we would just like ride it through

there

and as the so going back to my point

about that urgent payment sheet you just

said that you'd wake up like yeah wake

up on days look at the Urgent payment

sheet that you should you'd be like oh

[ __ ]

now I've I've sat here with um the CEO

of one of the disruptor banks out in

Europe called Tom monzo and he talked

about the like mental torment he had a a

red phone by his bed he's running a bank

here yeah so he'd wake up every day and

he'd have a moment of like Dread waking

up because

the stress and the pressure of you know

having to run a bank when you're waking

up one of those days yeah what is the

like the mental health implication what

did you feel

it was awful and I think

the one benefit and detriment that I had

was an end date like this is all going

to end on whether right or wrong like on

the Festival date right where they're

going to succeed and like be Champions

or we're gonna drastically fail and

either way like let's go all in to try

to make that happen

and what was the you say the word awful

take me into the world's word awful give

me a description of what that actually

means in reality what are the symptoms

of that I mean I was fat as [ __ ] like my

heart was out of rhythm you know your

heart was out of rhythm yeah like I

think like

lost interest in

sexual relationships lost interest in

like friendship relationships that

weren't transactional and it became like

all work and nothing else mattered I'm

like look terrible felt terrible and I

could just it sucks and I can't imagine

like the red phone at the bank because

like that's never ending right like

maybe you can say Hey you know I'll sell

or hire a new CEO in seven years but I

can't imagine like that kind of window I

would yeah well he ultimately quit after

seven years building out of business I

think it was valued a billion billions

when he quit and when he did a piece in

one of the newspapers he cited his

mental health

um yeah did you experience anxiety

for sure

um

I was I was afraid to show weakness

right so it's like

I didn't acknowledge it to myself I

certainly didn't acknowledge it to

anybody else but like I knew something

was wrong I shouldn't be 24 and my

heart's skipping beats like you know

that's not not normal there's no reason

why that should be happening but um yeah

I just refuse to acknowledge it and like

would tell myself you're just soft like

plenty of people have had to live with

like much worse stress in this

figure it out suck it up do you know

that feeling of anxiety the one I'm

talking about where it's it's like

constant state for sure and you

experience you were experiencing that in

the lead-up to the festival absolutely

how badly

it was bad

and yeah I mean like looking back it's

crazy like no one wants to live right

with a dread to wake up every morning

not knowing like what that Excel

document's gonna be and then who I have

to beg or call or plead or sell to to

solve that problem it just a shitty life

but you you thought you were in too deep

and you couldn't turn back yeah I

thought that like

I wrongly convinced myself that there

was an end goal and there was a solution

like if the event worked and it went

well we'd have a great brand and

everybody's happy everybody makes money

everybody's gonna want to come next year

and obviously it was so stupid silly but

that was a pure

I had to finish line in sight

when did you realize

it had all gone wrong yeah the night

before the so the festival was scheduled

to be Friday Saturday and Sunday for two

weekends

um we had a charter to 737 planes and

open up like a temporary terminal in

Miami to basically fly everybody to the

island and given we only had two planes

we started to fly guests in early on a

Thursday morning before like before the

festival started on Friday and late that

Wednesday night we were like rushing to

get everything ready in time

and it's like walked into the room

around midnight and like the entire team

was like slumped over on their chairs

like asleep on the couch like heads like

leaning on the kitchen table

and it seemed like all the energy at the

same time but it's like left the entire

team

and like almost like as if On Cue as

I've written by a movie a storm rolls in

like late that Wednesday and then it's

like oh [ __ ] like I've lost a team

you can't beat the weather like or we're

not in a good spot

thinking back to the promo um video that

you made and comment you made on the

full send podcast about how the guy that

buys the yachts and gets all the girls

to come and then pays for it subsidizes

it is never a happy man yep

um are you this was the question I was

putting as I was reading about your

story is like what are your insecurities

because a lot of this seems to be driven

by some kind of like deep insecurity to

like prove the prove others right to be

the man to be the guy to throw the best

party and the validation on a

psychological level that must be giving

some kind of insecurity some whole it

must be filling for sure yeah what are

your insecurities

and what were they

good question yeah

yeah this I think the need it always

kind of came back the need to prove

this path right of like I don't need

school I don't need the path that we

were all taught as a right path like my

path is better and it leads to more

interesting and more exciting life and

like I think I always knew that but I

was so insecure and I wanted to have

everybody else believe it and I would

get frustrated when people didn't share

those same beliefs as me

so I think it's been part of the

learning process as well is to

understand that everybody can't believe

and like the same thing and that's okay

and like not taking it personally when

that happens

have you got any insecurities around

women

I don't know yeah yeah

it just seems to be centered on this

desire to like prove everybody wrong and

like [ __ ] the system yeah

um

I still I'm still not quite clear in my

mind where that where that came from I'm

like was he bullied in school was it was

there a teacher that said some [ __ ] to

him that he couldn't do it was his

parents told him he couldn't do it I

think part of it is like the curse of

of things never being enough right and I

guess I don't know what the derivation

of that is but

you know whether it's business success

or friendship success

where you live your home your

possessions like your the love that

someone has for you

especially during that time of my life I

was almost like jaded into always

thinking that it wasn't enough like if

someone loved me they didn't love me

enough or if like I had a great like day

at work the day wasn't good enough and I

think it all kind of come back to like

maybe I'm thinking out loud here maybe

it was like the early exposure at like

18 and 19 to like Titans of industry and

then me comparing to them where it's

like not feasible to get there without

you know 20 30 40 years of work that

they had put in but it's like I wanted

everything at that level and I wanted it

now so if you gave me this much but it

wasn't like where they were I wasn't

satisfied with it so I think it was like

the early exposure

combined with like the impatience and

need to have it there's this really um

well publicized scene where you're stood

on a crate on the day of the festival

you've got all of these party goers

around you kind of screaming and asking

questions and some of them a little bit

drunk because they've been off yeah sent

to a bar on the other side of the island

when you're trying to sort of buy

yourself time

what was going on when you were still in

that crate and what were you thinking

and feeling were you [ __ ] yourself I

mean right now I realized like how bad

my management skills were at the time

like where the [ __ ] is everybody like we

had they weren't all full-time employees

a lot of them were like local

contractors or whatever we had almost

800 people you know the day of the

festival like working there I just felt

like I was surrounded by these people

I couldn't find any of my team members

and I had I'm not going to name the

publication I had a publication on the

phone with me saying you know we heard

you ran off on your yacht with like

cocaine and hookers like I don't have a

yacht never done cocaine like there were

no hookers and but they're also live

streaming on the on the cover of their

web page so I'm like yelling at them I'm

getting yelled at by like you know the

50 or 100 concert goers right there I

just couldn't find anybody but just goes

to show I just like didn't have the

systems in place to or the knowledge to

manage everything but that was my first

reaction is like where the hell is

everybody

I heard you made the decision to cancel

the festival when someone incorrectly

told you that people had died yeah I was

told

shortly after that moment maybe an hour

or two later that three people had died

and thankfully no one was physically

hurt like at all to my knowledge but I

was told these elaborate stories who

told you that uh team members and place

and I think the reality was looking back

now is that concert goers were like

reading things on Twitter and then

coming running to employees and telling

them this but like verified Twitter

accounts is back in what 17 were like

nothing like gunshots fire like people

hit like it was going all over Twitter

and people were getting shot and things

like that and like none of this was true

but by the time it got to me the details

were so vivid

I just didn't have like

the ability to like step back take a

deep breath

recalibrate and try to like think

through the information I was like oh

[ __ ] people are dead okay cancel this

turn the planes around get everybody

home how did that feel when you heard

that if someone in my team came to me

and said that I was putting on an event

and three people were dead already I

mean I just freaked out and said get

everybody out of here get everybody back

to Miami I know it's like that was your

response but

yeah I was just

I just didn't have the ability to like

okay like what's actually happening how

can we prevent this it was more of it's

like a quick knee-jerk all right send

everybody home it's over

one of the I think legendary moments

from the documentary which I know you've

been asked about and heard about before

is when

Andy King

says that he you called him and asked

him to suck a dick suck literally suck a

penis to have the water imported because

the Border agents had held it up

what's the truth in that situation like

did you ask him to suck a penis I've

heard so many variations of this story

and no he was never ordered to go suck a

guy's dick I literally put mouthwash in

he was gonna suck suck some dick he was

yeah that's news to me or I mean I

probably heard the story many times but

I think the the comment was ingest like

go suck this guy's dick get this water

like whatever it takes more of like you

know go suck up to him and get the water

released like do anything beyond paying

this guy right like you can't you can't

pay the Customs people so like go do

whatever it takes and just convince him

that our Festival is going to fail if

people can't drink water there's he's

obviously a gay man

and the Border agent was gay right I

think so yeah so the assertion of the

documentary was because he was gay you

had asked him to suck suck a dick if he

had to and he he took that literally so

he says he he went and put mouthwash in

and he headed down there fully prepared

to suck a dick I think that makes for a

good TV but yeah I certainly don't

recall it happening like that

unfortunately

crazy

do you still speak to him

um I've heard from him recently yeah so

are you in good terms I think it's a

good guy I think he tried his best to um

to help and unfortunately he was brought

on pretty late in like the process so he

wasn't there from the beginning but I

think obviously if he was willing to do

that he went above and beyond to you

listen if I try to make the festival

happen I'm sure yeah I wish him all the

best if I had a friend that was willing

to go to those links for me and I have

no friend that would do that for me

um I certainly would would stay in touch

and keep them on side yeah um in the

wake of fire Festival what happens you

eventually fly back to New York one of

the scenes that really did get me in the

documentary on an emotional level was

watching that wonderful Bohemian lady

talk about how she lost her life savings

um you know who I'm referring to right

uh I do know yeah yeah

um

how do you feel about that when you hear

that that some that locals you worked on

that hadn't been paid and then you know

they're in they're not living privileged

lives necessarily yeah

I mean it's terrible and the reality is

there are people who are owed there

and they're over for the last two weeks

of work before the festival I think

everybody's a little bit different but

getting them paid back

super important to me and trying to find

ways to start that process now

um I never met that lady before but no

her story is obviously super sad and you

know

um

I have heard from her through friends

recently and you know hope we can figure

out you know what is owed to everybody

and start making those steps there but

yeah unfortunately never met her but

hope to make right by her when you when

you leave the Bahamas off to that event

you come back to New York you come back

to a shitstorm yeah I mean the people

that have given you what 26 27 million

dollars in cash yeah

must be pretty mad for sure I I land

back on like the Sunday night after the

festival around midnight and then that

morning early the FBI is at my door

and I think like the initial investors

who got really mad thought that the

whole festival was a hoax and then I had

stolen the money and had it hidden

somewhere and it was like lying about

the entire thing

and so just like enter this Whirlwind of

of Hell your investors but basically

went to the FBI Yeah Yeah from from what

I understand yes what makes you what

gives you the understanding

basically I was called until it was

going to happen it's like you [ __ ] up

it's too late like here's what's gonna

happen now and and like I was totally

totally guilty and I would have gone to

jail like if no one made that phone call

I just made the process happen like the

process kicked off faster but once it

kicks off you know it's out of the out

of the hands of the investors and into

the justice system and I was black and

white guilty there was no gray area

there and you're one of your investors

called you and told you that if you

didn't give them X dollar yeah cash they

would

the exact lines were like we need this

amount of money or else you're going to

be on hanging handcuffs from the front

page of the Wall Street Journal and I

just like didn't have the money first of

all how much was it uh I don't want to

say because people will know the

investor probably is but seven figures

yeah yeah yeah more than a million

dollars more than one less than 10. so

um I didn't have it and then I was also

kind of like certainly naive in my

response at the time I just couldn't

fathom like that I was lying to

investors right like I knew I was trying

my best to make the festival work and

the media's initial like a line of

questioning and the guess line of

questioning as was all falling apart was

like this is a scam you didn't try to do

this so my reaction was like no I tried

I'm trying my best but I couldn't like

really understand the magnitude and the

gravity of the crimes I did commit

so I was still kind of fighting back I

go ahead and do anything wrong I tried

my best and then of course like I get

back and realize

oh [ __ ] I mean it didn't happen

overnight but here's what actually

happened

and yeah when you get when you get back

um the criminality doesn't stop though

does it no this is the bit honestly yeah

that really got me in the doctor because

I was like oh man you know some could

say young kid negligent inexperienced

his ambition was greater than his

execution told loads of Lies

at that point he learns his lesson but

then for the criminality and lying to

continue beyond that point with this NYC

VIP access where you start selling fake

tickets

give me the context why did that happen

yeah I've

many smart people officers have said the

same thing as you and

I was just caught in this process where

okay this investor he didn't threaten me

but the investor kind of gave me an

ultimatum

I blew him off and he was right he got

me arrested it's all about the money I

have to pay everybody back now all right

I'm gonna I'm gonna get him his money

and I wasn't like communicating with him

at this point but I'm gonna get him his

money I'm gonna pay everybody else back

and then this is all gonna go away and I

can solve this and I thought that the

proper response to a criminal process

was to solve the problem when the proper

response to criminal process is to sit

down shut the [ __ ] up and like accept

your punishment just just take it and

any other response just like the wrong