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>> Raul. Joe. Very nice to meet you,

brother.

>> It's so good to be here.

>> I have enjoyed your content tremendously

online and uh I really got into a video

this morning that I was watching where

you found this megalithic site that was

undocumented in Peru. It's incredible

that they still have these ancient sites

that for whatever reason, it seems like

the um the money that they get gets

stolen. Like the money that is supposed

to be allocated towards documenting

these things and registering these

things, people just say, "Fuck it. I'm

going to pocket it." And

>> it happens a lot more than you you

think.

>> I just hard to believe, man. Uh some of

the stuff that you documented is very

heartbreaking. Like uh one of them was

when you flew a drone over these ancient

ruins and you showed the amount of

places that have been looted.

>> Oh yeah.

>> And it's just all of it. It's just po.

You see these holes and when I first saw

I'm like what is what is he showing me?

And then you're like, these are all

spots where someone has dug in and

looted and most of it has been done in

this area of Peru over the last 20

years.

>> Over the last 20 years.

>> So from 2006 to 2026, more

>> I I I would have the biggest amount of

looting happened. It's actually died

down some. Uh but the end of the 20 so

1980s to 2010s I would say like when it

really took off

>> and you can tell from the trash that's

left there like cigarettes that were

only produced in the 80s or you know

soda bottles that were only produced in

the '9s.

>> How nice of them to steal the artifacts

and leave trash.

>> Dude, it

they've become landfills of of human

remains. It's uh this this place you're

talking about is I mean it's eight full

kilometers of just it looks like the

moon. Every single location has been

looted and I was like I got to go up up

there and see what this looks like and

and so pull up to the microphone a

little bit more there. So looting what

are they at at that point in time? I

mean these are hundreds thousands of

years old these sites. So what are they

finding? Well, a lot of the mummies that

I've because I I found mummies that have

been torn torn apart literally like

they're the cotton that they're wrapped

in the textiles that they're wrapped in.

I mean, it's just they've been

scavenged.

>> Are they looking for jewels

>> for for some sort of metal urgy like on

the person themselves? Um the

unfortunate thing is I mean all you'll

see is you'll just see these these bones

littered across the landscape with

broken pieces of pottery. And

>> that was also disturbing how much bones

you see everywhere. So, this is you see

a bone right there.

>> These are all human bones that you just

find scattered.

>> That's all cotton. And what we're about

to see here is an actual mummy that's

been torn apart.

>> This is so sad that there's no

protection.

>> Nobody's going out there, man. Nobody

except for the looters. But I know very

little about Peru other than, you know,

obviously the Nazca lines, the mummies,

all these different things, the the

mystery of the place. Can you show that,

please?

>> Uh, the video was over.

>> Oh, it's over. Um, but

>> there there's a there's a couple burial

burial drone shots. You

>> But it's just

>> You go to the top.

>> How big is Peru? I don't even know

geographically how large it is.

>> I mean, Peru Peru Peru is huge. I mean

it takes up this is another this is a

different looted site.

So this is all this all of this is in

the Paracus Nazca eco region. So this is

>> the skulls are just sitting there.

>> So the looters will oftent times leave I

don't know set them up in this fashion.

There there isn't a site I've gone to

where I haven't seen something like set

up like this in in the end. But so I I

pull out to show the scale of it. I

mean, every little piece of white you

see is is some part of a human. Wow.

It's tragic, man.

Just so much history lost.

>> Mhm.

>> And so does this stuff wind up in

private collections? Is do museums ever

get it? Like what what happens to that

stuff?

>> I don't think museums get it at all.

It's a private private buyers. I

actually met a the term is wakero. It's

a grave robber. I actually met one in

Mirror Flores in in Lima proper at one

of the Artessa where they're selling you

know ancient goods. Well, some of them

have real things that they they go out

and they loot. And I mean that

this is one of the things I've been

thinking about like for for the future

like what what can be done about this

because the government nobody from the

government's going out there and so

these things end up in private

collections, textiles, humans, uh

pottery, things that you would see in

museums. It's just nobody from that

official administration is taking the

trip to go out there and preserve these

things.

It seems like just the ancient

civilization of Peru is a massive

mystery. It it seems like there are a

lot of uncovered stories in that area.

>> Peru is a hot spot

>> and it doesn't seem like there's an

incredible amount of research being done

other than by independent people. They I

mean so

Joe there there's just so much in Peru.

I mean you throw a stone and you're

finding an ancient archaeological site.

I mean they're they're doing whenever

they do construction they end up coming

across structures or bones. I mean I

this last expedition I I went all over

the country and there is no lack of

archaeological sites. So the money and

I just the money it would take to fund

research on all these places is just

extreme. It it's extreme. Um, I think

there's a lot of history that that goes

missed uh because because of what's

currently happening, but a lot of times

a lot of the research is focused on

what's going to bring tourism,

>> right? Like Machu Picchu and things

along those lines, which is also insane,

>> but phenomenal.

>> Just incredible. Like that place is like

what? Why? How?

>> Why'd you build it up here?

nuts. a a good friend of mine just

actually went just recently took his

family up to Machu Picchu and he's like

it doesn't even make any sense man

>> dude Machu Picchu is what started uh so

my family's from Peru and so I would

grow up going there and I have this old

>> back when you were filming with cameras

with like a a videape um there's footage

of me finding seashells at Machu Picchu

when I was when I was like 10 years old

back then you you could go wherever you

wanted you didn't have to stay on a path

and so I don't know 10

>> for people that don't No, Machu Picchu

is like what 12,000 ft above sea

>> level. Yeah. And so and so I'm I'm a kid

and I mean I still have the footage, the

grainy footage and I'm showing my dad on

the camera like, "Dad, dad, look, I

found seashells." You know, I saw them

in in inside of uh they were like

glinting in the mud in the wall. And so

I I took them out and that's what

started this whole process for me. I was

just like that it blew my mind that

there were seashells way up there. And I

so I studied about earth cataclysms and

ancient history and and when sea levels

were different and that just that's that

is a moment that started kind of this

whole path for me.

>> How old were we at the time?

>> 10 or 12.

>> Wow.

>> Wow.

>> Um how many times you've been there

since?

>> Well, growing up we used to go every

year and a half or so and that's

continued into my adulthood. It's only

been recently the past two years that

I've been doing what I'm what I've been

doing which is like hardcore solo uh

expeditions.

And so when you look at a site like

Machu Picchu or you know any of these

ancient sites, what what is the timeline

that conventional archaeologists

attribute? I mean they they attribute it

to the Inca which you know 14

late 1400s early 1500s I think the Inca

were conquered in by the Spanish in 15

uh 1530 I think and so mo most of that

megalithic architecture they attribute

to the Inca. However, there's evidence

that there's a site uh Jamie if you

could pull it up it's called Vinyak.

This this place is there's megalithic

architecture with precision that goes

down 50 feet under under this mountain.

It's it

>> check this out.

>> Whoa.

>> So deeply underneath.

>> This is crazy.

So, I believe they filled in the top to

uh in modern times, but there's

>> at the top.

>> And very soon there's going to be a guy

who shows us a map.

>> That's incredible.

>> Wow.

>> And so you see very different

construction.

>> Very different construction

>> from the bottom to the top. But that's

how it always is, right? The most

complex stuff. So that's that's showing

that this architecture here, it goes

down 50 feet

>> into this mountain.

>> And what do they think this was?

>> So this complex is all attributed to the

warry. It's attributed to the culture

that came right before the Inca, which

doesn't make much sense to me because

what you see on the surface, that's

worry construction,

>> which is small stones,

>> right? And

>> what are what are they held together

with?

>> Uh mud mortar. Mud as mortar. And uh but

then so this site has only been 4%

excavated.

4%. It's underneath all of it is that

type of architecture which is crazy. So

you have mud and mortar with very small

stones. Then underneath it you have

precision cut mega megalithic stones.

>> Yeah. And how big are these stones and

where are they supposedly coming from?

>> Uh that so here's a funny story. Um so

this place if you look you can you can

find it on on Google maps is you know

they call it the elo de warry. So the

warry complex, but if you go back to the

Spanish chronicles, um Pedro Seza deleon

when he was in Tijuana, so Tiwanakco

where Puma is in Bolivia, when they ask

the natives, you know, who built this,

they say, "We don't know. It was built

before us from the people from the lake.

The same people who built Vinyak, that's

what the natives said. that place Vinyak

is

800 a thousand kilometers from Tijuana.

So, and it's the same construction. So,

would it make sense kind of what they're

saying the people who built Tijuana also

built this place

but before they know before they knew

that uh they didn't witness it. They was

just there when they got there is what

the locals said.

>> Well, that's a lot of stuff, right?

That's part of the weirdness of South

America.

>> Yeah. And you know, even Mexico, right?

>> Yeah.

>> It's that's the the weirdness of the a

Aztec structures. I didn't know that

until pretty recently that the Aztecs

labeled like uh Tinoitlan the place

where the gods were born.

>> I didn't know that.

>> Yeah. Like they they don't attribute

that to themselves. They they found it

>> when they cleared the area.

>> I mean, you think about it. I I've

still to this day, you know, I I was up

in Lake Titty Kaka and I mean there's

structures all over the place, but

you're like, where were these people

living? And you because there's no

remnants of cities or towns. And the

reason is is because in modern times,

people have recommissioned the blocks

and started and used them for their

farms and their homes and things like

that. you have a good location, a place

of reverence, a place you're going to

build the next the next culture is going

to build on it, you know, and I think

that's happened a lot in a lot of

places.

>> Yeah. Well, everywhere, right? I mean,

that's Lebanon, too. That's Balbeck.

It's it seems to be the case that those

>> Yeah.

>> those immense stones where the Romans

built on top of them. But there's the

Roman documentation is pretty precise.

They documented everything. They never

talked about these enormous thousand ton

stones that are 7 m up in the air.

>> Now, we're just going to put them in the

base of our structure.

>> What? They didn't even talk about them.

They talked about the the these

beautiful structures that are on top of

that are clearly Roman,

>> but the stuff underneath it just just

defies logic.

>> And some of the stones that were never

moved and put into place that were cut

and quarried, but just never moved.

1,600 tons

like how

>> and things you can't replicate, you

know, nowadays. It's

>> that's what's crazy like with modern

machinery, we can't do it.

>> I mean, it's

I've always when I started this path,

you know, I was, you know, Fingerprints

of the Gods was one of the first books I

picked up as a kid. My dad had it in his

library and uh and and and that just

that set me off on a on a course and uh

the the inability to be able to to I

don't know. I don't I don't buy the

mainstream. Uh it's it feels a little

bit lazy the the responses that that the

mainstream kind of gives to some of this

stuff. um as opposed to just saying I

don't know.

>> It's purposely ignorant. It's more than

lazy because if it was just lazy the I

mean they've been confronted by all this

other alternative archaeology evidence

and all these other people that have

like explored these things and shown and

then there was always the conventional

wisdom that there was no society back

then that was capable of doing this. So

they had to attribute it to more recent

societies

>> until go back le

>> then you're like okay you guys need to

shut the up.

>> It's I mean the the

there's a power in admitting like you're

if we're looking for the truth here then

it's like okay we got this evidence that

disrupts this that we thought before.

All right just say that right you know

what I mean just say it it

>> it's fascinating that they can't you

know because they are like every other

form of academia. They're they are just

like I mean you might as well be talking

to a gender studies teacher just like

they don't want to look at reality. They

just they just want their narrative and

they want to be the gatekeepers of

information and then they just want to

push that narrative forward and they're

so mean.

>> Dude, it I only started recently being

on X within the past year and I'm just

like the cattiness of it all, man. It's

>> just exposes them. exposes their

personality and they're just not the

type of people that I want to talk to

about anything. Especially not, you're

not the gay people. If you're a

41-year-old person, you're not the

gatekeeper of ancient history. You can't

be. There's too much.

>> There's too much all over the world. It

doesn't make sense. None of it makes

sense. And that's I think why they're so

terrified of people like Filipio Beyond

>> and the scans underneath the pyramids

because if he's right and it appears he

is over 200 different independent scans

>> and they all say the exact same thing.

If he's right, you guys are

because you have to you're going to

eventually have to say we're wrong.

>> It's it's you you you have a a moment

here where you can choose which which

direction to go. pretty soon that

moment's going to be lost. Uh

>> but it's like this is what the evidence

is presented and like you said verified

over 200 different studies. It's like

all right, we might be wrong. Let's

>> Right.

>> Meanwhile, they don't want to do that.

>> They're still digging their heels in and

they're just discrediting themselves,

which is fascinating. It's really

interesting. It's really interesting to

watch these just like flounder.

Well, and and it it makes me think, you

know, what's the reason behind it? Is it

pride? Is it ego? It's is it because you

wrote some books on it that you need to

keep selling? Is it because it's in

textbooks that universities use? I mean,

it there's a lot of layers to it.

>> It's all the above. But you can tell

just by the way they communicate online.

A lot of it is ego.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah. A lot of it is ego and just really

bad personalities. you know, these

people that are accustomed to never

being questioned, accustomed to being in

the hierarchy of academia where, you

know, you have these tenur professors

and then they have the people that are

coming up under them and they all follow

the same sort of rigid structure. And so

any heterodox thinkers, anybody who

comes in from outside the box, they just

get all over.

>> Yeah. And there's no open-mindedness. I

know. I don't know if this is like a

parable or something, but you know, I

don't know, some story where there's

there's a truck going into a tunnel and

it gets stuck and it's backing up

traffic and nobody can get through.

Everybody's trying to figure out what

the hell to get this truck through and

just, you know, some some farmer walks

up and he's just like, "Take the air out

the tires

and and problem solved." And so

the inability to let other people come

in with with thoughts and opinions, it

just it really um

>> I think it's it's a real detriment to to

to the study of these things because

>> in my approach to some of the places

I've gone, I think it is that

>> yes, we have research, yes, there is a

level of understanding at a lot of these

places what happened, but it's also that

going into with a with a fresh set of

eyes, you know sometimes I mean I get so

locked in my work sometimes I can't see

outside of it you know sometimes it

takes another party to come in and then

all of a sudden your mind is blown in a

completely different direction I don't

see that level of openness to things on

the side of a lot of a lot of the

mainstream academia when it comes to

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Limited time offer. Well, people have to

really understand that the whole concept

of being stream academia is only a few

hundred years old. And that's what's

weird. It's like, so these very recent

structures, these very recent

establishments want to be the

gatekeepers of information of a vast

swath of the world.

>> I mean, it's not possible.

>> It's not possible that you know

everything.

>> It's it's not I was thinking about

>> it's not bad.

>> They know a lot. They know a lot about

things they have discovered. They do.

They know a lot about Mesopotamia. They

know a lot about Iraq. all the the the

amazing stuff that they find. There's

some stuff they they've very accurately

dated, but it doesn't it doesn't explain

things that you can explain and they

want to try to just

>> fit it into the Yeah,

>> that's what's goofy.

>> Yeah, that's I mean, look, if the puzzle

piece doesn't fit, stop trying to force

it.

>> Well, it's also it's like more gigantic

spectacular pieces and you're like,

well, those aren't important. I mean,

um, Ben Van Kirkwick with, uh, this most

recent discoveries where they're using

the ground penetrating radar to find the

labyrinths and this 40 m long metallic

object that's inside of an atrium down

there. Like, what is that thing?

>> Yeah. I I have my I hope it's something

my my if if whatever if they go looking

and I hope they do, this is the other

thing. It's like, let's start putting

money toward towards this like now. You

know what I mean? like figure this out.

Um

I don't know why I thought this. I think

it might be a meteorite if if it's some

sort of like metallic thing.

>> 40 m long meter.

>> I know. I know.

>> That's a civilization ender.

>> But and imagine the next civilization

coming across that thing and hearing the

stories. It's like let's worship

this or like let's rever it somehow and

put it in an atrium. That's just my

thought. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. Like

there's 40 meters.

>> Yeah. There's a meteorite at Mecca that

they all go to touch.

>> Yeah.

>> Which is kind of crazy, right? But

completely makes sense, right? Something

comes from the sky. It lands causes

chaos and

>> then you worship it.

>> I mean that uh also wasn't one of like

King Tut's knives was made out of a

meteorite or something like that. I mean

so they were finding these things. Yeah.

40 meter one is pretty big though.

>> I know. But also tic tac shaped. That's

the That's the other thing. I'm like, so

when it come I'm just like, let's go.

Let's go.

>> Well, you know, that's part of the Bob

Lazar lore.

>> I I remember

>> Bob Lazar said that when he was told

that at least one of these things came

from an archaeological dig.

>> Like what?

>> What? What? What? What do you mean? He's

like, that's what they were telling me.

I don't know, but they told me that one

of them was from an archaeological dig.

So these things are really old,

>> dude. and and his accuracy with some of

with the element 118 115 something like

that

>> from 1989

>> when element 115 wasn't even discovered

until the 2000s.

>> I mean that's why when when he I forget

who I was talking to outside but we were

talking about I think it was talking to

Jamie about that about uh Bob Bob Lazar

talking about some of these things

coming from an archaeological site. So

>> yeah,

>> let's go find it. Right. You know what I

mean?

>> Well, that's where it gets really weird.

Where it gets really weird is these

mummies.

>> Oh, we're gonna go into the mummies

here, Jamie.

>> Uh Eric Berles, a representative,

talking about how he's asked the White

House to give DoD the power to let them

go see this stuff, including that a

buried UFO. reportedly an object that is

not in this country that is so large it

cannot be moved uh that they've built an

entire building around it. And I think

that I think uh either Greer or another

individual has actually mentioned this

site, but I'm not going to mention it

because it is a classified location, but

there is a a really apparent there's

reported a really large object and and

that's one of the locations that I' I'm

requesting to to get to. It's going to

involve a lot to get to make that

happen, but that may be the uh final

destination.

like that makes me want to run for

president cuz that's all I would care

about. The economy would be in shambles.

I'd be like, "Show me the UFOs."

>> Do you think Do you think they do it?

Cuz because I've heard that like

>> kill me.

>> Uh I mean it on on that need to know

basis where they're keeping stuff from

presidents. You know, Kennedy got too

close. Like

>> I don't think that's what they killed

Kennedy for, but I think there's a bunch

of things. But no, there there's a whole

lot of layers.

>> Yeah, but the UFO people love to think

that it's UFOs is why they killed

Kennedy. But they think everything's

UFOs. But it it's it it definitely seems

like

I don't know about the evidence, you

know, because it's just stories. And

that's the problem is that a lot of this

stuff, and this is how I feel when a lot

of people come on the podcast and talk

to me, you know, supposed

whistleblowers. Some of them I think are

legitimate and some of them I think are

disinformation specialists. I think

they're designed to muddy up the water.

And this is the what, you know, what

they're saying is designed to muddy up

the water. And that's what they're

trying to do. They're trying to make a

lot of this stuff look silly and and

push certain narratives and just create

confusion. And I think a lot of it is

probably some blackbudget weird science

stuff that we have. But then it begs the

question, where'd you get that?

>> Is is that really like the Diana Pulka

work where she's talking about there

essentially these things are donations

and that we're supposed to like take

these things and try to figure it out.

And then you look at some of the

creation of some different inventions

that happened very quickly after

Roswell.

>> I mean our our our civilization just I

mean just been on a boom ever since.

>> Yeah. Weird stuff like the fiber optic

stuff and transistors the just the the

the history of the creation of the

transistor and the people that were

involved in it seems awful

fishy.

I mean, I I try to stick with what I

evidence that I can make out tangibly,

and it just gets so murky like like you

said, it just it just all of this gets

so murky that I I don't I don't know how

the truth would

even land, you know? Well, the truth

would have to land if there was an

overall comprehensive

effort by all of the world governments

and there would have to be some sort of

unity in this and some some sort of like

a a recognition that this is really

important for the entire human

population to understand our past.

>> And if this is nonsense, let's find out

that it's nonsense. And if this is real,

this changes everything. And when you

look at just just look at the vastness

of the cosmos. It's not outside of the

realm of possibility that this stuff

either came from somewhere else or was

here because they were here.

>> That there was an advanced civilization

here. Whether it's our civilization or

whatever the hell those mummies are,

>> you know, m the tridactyl mummies are

weird. We could we could

>> that we we could talk about that cuz I

went uh I I I did a deep dive with my

friend Will and for there there is

>> there is too much a muck going on with

these things for me to for me to

objectively say uh that they are what

people are claiming them to be there

there's just there's too much wrong with

this with the picture.

>> Right. Well, first of all, a lot of them

are fake.

>> Yeah, for sure.

>> Oh, yeah. A lot of them people have

seemingly created with a bunch of

different animal bones

and human bones and pieced them

together. But then there's the weird

ones, you know, there's the weird ones

that are mummified and they're in the

fetal position and you see a structure

that doesn't exist in the human body,

but it's complete with tendons and

ligaments and some of them have eggs

inside of them. Uh that Joe, I'm telling

you, man. I look, I want to believe

>> I think it is much closer to

than it is reality.

>> I think what we're dealing with here are

real human beings from the past. They

are ancient uh that have been put

together. Will Will from Incredible

History has done some amazing work with

some amazing specialists. I mean, people

at the top of their field on this stuff,

looking at the X-rays and the DICOM

files and calling out um calling out

cuts, calling out incisions that were

made, calling out why things don't make

sense.

>> And

for me, the reason I put out my last

video on the Nazca mummies is because

there's this whole other narrative, too,

of where the money is, who's making

money off of these things. And and I

think that

>> is there money being made off those

little mummies?

I was

>> Please let me something.

>> Yeah.

>> So, I remember I forget who you were

talking to. It might have been uh Jesse

Michaels, but

I remember you saying, you know, these

are one of the greatest art projects if

they were fake, right?

>> Well, if you just scroll to the right

here, this is what the

>> That's a goofy one.

>> Yeah, but that's what the Walkerto is

selling. He sent that to me personally.

the the guy selling these things. These

goofy ass.

>> For people at home, you can't see it.

>> There there's a folder on there that has

the pictures uh in the photo ones. But

what is the one that is the female

that's in the

>> Maria?

>> Is that what they're called?

>> Uh Maria is one of them. I mean, so Will

had on um Dr. William Morrison and uh

Dr. Proctctor, Dr. Wilson. I mean, like

people in the in the in the top of their

um

in the top of their field analyzing

these things. And

>> this is this looks fake as

>> Yeah. Yeah. Everybody, you can get this

for $15,000. This is come this comes

directly from the wa finding these

things, by the way.

>> Yeah.

>> I I I did like a little undercover thing

uh trying to see what I could lure out

of him. Um

>> this is not particularly compelling to

me. Um but in the same it's in the same

class coming from the same place

supposedly the same group of people are

providing these things to the um yeah

this is in this is in the eco museum

this is where they're housed

>> monsterat is that what the

>> monserat yeah

>> monserat so these are like again these

are not that compelling to me

>> the small ones no the big one so the big

ones though are um

gosh they they keep coming out with new

specimen there's a new one Antonio who's

a teenage boy except for his feet. His

feet are have arthritis in them and and

which indicates that they put the

footbones of another specimen on on this

thing.

>> Now, what what these doctors have done,

look, and here's the thing. I mean, I

want to I want to be clear. I would love

nothing more than

>> Peru to be the hot spot of of of some

new species. I I don't think we're

alone. I don't think we've identified

every species, but also I'm not

I'm not putting my money on these things

coming out as uh authentic. I think they

have been used with authentic bones,

which is why they're getting the dates.

Um I think that

dude, I I I did a deep dive on this.

>> Please go. No, feel free. Tell me tell

me what you found out. I initially

wasn't going to make the video I did,

but after spending

days staying up doing this research, I

just I I I I couldn't not do it. Um, and

I found like like I even watched the

whole Gaia series on this stuff and and

I found myself like getting entranced by

the like maybe maybe and then right

>> and then also watching the whole reason

of of putting this stuff out there is

like look make your own decision but

don't just take in the fantasy take in

the the other possibilities too and and

just have all the information before you

make your decision.

>> Well clearly we know some of them are

fake. Clearly, clearly, you know, even

people like me who want so desperately

to believe, and it's also the the

corresponding artwork from the past, the

three-toed, three-fingered artwork,

which is weird.

>> That is that is weird. And I saw some of

those ge geoglyphs down there in the

middle of nowhere, you know, these. And

so, um, and then the whole thing with,

you know, the,

uh, with James Fox and the the Brazil

incident and that thing, you know, uh,

the the

>> the three-fingered thing is a weird

>> thing in history. um

with these bones.

I mean, I'm going to have to point you

to some of some of the videos that that

these specialists have come out

analyzing the the files. So, but where

where the money is is

exactly what's happening now. It it's

it's

we have this possibility. We're going to

make a show about it. We're going to put

out this new thing. We're going to It

goes It goes deep, Joe. Okay.

>> The the same doctors, the same

specialists that are verifying

currently the Nazca mummies have been on

the same team for the past 20 years

verifying other species and specimens

that they've

>> alien hybrids and say the same pe

literally my whole video I'm just like

>> this is what he said in 20 2007.

>> This is what he said about this fake

thing in 2012. This is what he said

about the fake thing in 2017.

>> And I put it back to back. So you it's

the same narrative,

>> same people.

>> It's the same people, the same

narrative.

>> And so you think that the construction

has just gotten more sophisticated?

>> 100%. 100%. They learn

>> what is that the the major one?

>> Maria and and uh Monzerat.

>> Well, look at let's find Monserat and

see see the Jesse Michael stuff because

he went down there and looked at them

and they did scans on the bodies and

>> and then if uh I have I have a link to

I think it's Dr. Morrison talking about

Monzerat's feet, the the X-rays of of

his feet and uh pointing out that's

that's on the spreadsheet.

>> Well, let's see that. I'd like to see

that. So, do you think that these are

recent creations of old bones? Is that

what it is?

>> That's what I think.

>> Okay. And how do you think they did it?

Is there any speculation? I think that

so they're uh

>> So here's the cut off.

>> What's that? Jimmy

>> just asked him a question. I cut him

off.

>> Oh,

>> how did you think they did it?

>> How do you think they did it?

>> Well, I think that they uh I think

they've gotten very good with uh

taxiderermy,

>> right? Like because we've seen that

before where you take like an owl and

you attach it to an iguana. In fact, in

in the research I did, there was this

dude, there was this demon fairy thing

in 2017.

>> If if you want to pull up my my video,

let's start with this. Let's start with

this. We'll get to the demon fairy thing

soon.

>> This is wild.

>> So, metatar.

>> Okay.

>> Um, this is a from a surface scan that

was available. And I went in and just

kind of removed some of the fuzziness so

that I could highlight the bones. And

one of the things again that you notice

is that the joints have a lot of spacing

between them. These are not joints that

are in contact. So they're dislocated.

Um now the main the main part here this

the central area where the kaoforms are

in the cuboid. Those articulate with

five metatarscils normally. Um the way

the way these are lettered a would go

with the big toe and E would go with the

little toe. And um again just like in

Maria those are missing but the joints

are not lined up properly. Um that the

shapes of the joints don't don't go with

the uh matching bone on the kaoforms or

the cuboid.

>> Um that's exactly what I was seeing in

CT. So none of the articulations of the

the meotarsal

junction really made any sense and some

of the bones didn't even meet an

articular surface at all.

So that jumped out to me immediately

because then my first um question goes

to how would that even be a functional

foot? So Monserat that's

>> so that's

why does Monserat have tendons? Click on

that. Keep it going a little bit. where

I thought I saw the razor rey section.

Um because people were talking about

there still being tendons and stuff

intact and I would agree that some of

those metatarscils are as Dr. Proctor

pointed out in the correct position but

then some are just missing. So if you

wanted to elevate the illusion, one of

the ways you could do that would be by

performing a raise resection. And

essentially that's a function conserving

surgery where if you've had damage to

your metacarpals or your metatarscils,

they'll remove that metacarpal or

metatarsal and kind of rearrange your

fingers or your toes and the remaining

metacarpals to keep your limb

functioning. So her feet, Monserat's

feet were just a little bit different

where I think they might have used more

um complex procedure like that versus

Maria where her feet just looked more

like um arts and crafts to my eye.

>> So and that's the So Maria came up if

these things are are are hoaxes. Mhm.

>> There is also, if we're just going with

that angle,

>> there's a clear evolution of the work

that goes into them behind the scenes.

Like that one came out after the first

one. The first one got called out on a

whole bunch of things. All of a sudden,

the next iteration doesn't have the same

>> issues. Oh, right. They're correcting.

>> Yeah. And so, and that and that's

actually uh I forget there was there was

an archaeologist on X. He said that's

very common in in the world of fake

antiquities. Like they learn once they

get called out on something, they'll

figure out how to make the pottery

better or something like that.

>> Is there a lot of money in this stuff?

>> Yeah. I mean, apparently, uh,

>> where's the money coming from? How does

it

>> for me? It's not even in in the It's not

in the sale. The the most money coming

from this is not in the sale of these

things. It's in the shows that come from

it.

>> It's in the series. It's in the

subscriptions to get to the next season

where they're going to tell finally

reveal the truth about it. There's a lot

of be money being made in the background

with and and that's part of the deep

dive I went on like following the money.

>> So, who do you think is making them? Do

you have a theory?

>> Uh I believe that uh

there's actually uh

it was in it was in my video and one of

Will's videos. There was a a grave

robber, a whistleblower, a grave robber

who was part of this team, and he shares

how um

he was getting stuff for Mario, like the

main guy. I There's got to be a team of

specialists working on this stuff. And I

mean, money went into money went into

making these things because money's

going to come from it. I mean, that's

>> Seems like a lot of money, though.

>> Yeah. But you you would think that that

would kind of fall apart. I would I

would think that

>> it is falling apart,

>> but it is understands, but I would I

would say like someone would rat

somebody out like these are unscrupulous

people.

>> So that's

part of the reason I also decided to

make this video and and a lot of the

push back on this stuff is like, oh, you

don't you don't trust, you know, uh,

Latin American doctors or any. No, it's

it's it's not that. It's the Latin

American doctors from Peru and and

journalists from they're afraid to talk

about this stuff because things can get

violent down there surrounding this

topic.

>> Article from 2012 about a mummy being

stolen and it goes on to talk about um

there's a right at the bottom. I just

>> the eco mafia.

>> Yeah, there's a mafia.

>> The eco mafia. And in fact, the mafia,

>> the guy Mario, who um

>> there you go.

>> Officials have warned about the

existence of a mafia dedicated to the

trade with links throughout southern

America and Europe. And at the time is

$18 million a year in stolen

archaeological artifacts. Peru estimated

was being taken out of the country.

>> So this is all going to like wealthy

people in other countries that want to

have these artifacts in their homes.

>> Yeah. And

>> I've seen the text messages with some of

the American buyers.

>> Really?

>> Yeah.

So, these guys are just like, "Come on

into my den. I'm going to show you a

mummy."

>> The this what I'm talking about

specifically was um tapestries and and

it was actually the guy I met in the

artisanales in Mirror Flores and and he

showed me video. He was very open with

me. He showed me videos of uh because

the the buyers want to see Providence.

The buyers want to see them pulling the

the artifacts out of the ground,

>> right? So, they just bury them and then

they just Well, I mean that sells this

stuff.

>> Mummy crowdfunder leaves archaeologists

fuming. So there's a guy in London

that's selling this stuff.

>> So Victor Wind Museum in London

>> cabinet dedicated to dead people

>> and they were trying to get a mummy from

Peru.

>> Wow. So it's um

>> What do you think is going on with the

skulls? The elongated skulls. If you

Jamie, I have a

>> um

I think that

it's one I found.

>> Here's one.

>> You found that one?

>> Oh, yeah. That's one of three I've come

across.

>> Now there supposedly there's a

difference in the way the the skull, you

know, when you're a child, what is it

called?

>> The sag the sutures. Yeah. I found some

uh without the I I every elongated skull

that I've the three I've come across all

had the sagittal all had that suture

>> like a normal human does

>> like a normal human.

>> So these would be from pressing boards

on the child's head when they're in

development binding.

>> Yeah.

>> But then the question is why would you

do that? And I mean I heir on the side

of you don't just come up with that,

you're trying to imitate something,

right? You know, and so that that's um

>> and then you see it in Egypt and the

hieroglyphs and stuff. So I I I do think

like there is,

>> you know, there there's

we've we've labeled things other species

with just a bone fragment, you know? I'm

like there there's there's deserts of

these things and and I think that if the

right study went to them, you might have

a separate species. If if you put the

money towards studying this stuff

because it's all out there, man. It's

>> like a separate branch of the human

species.

>> Possibly am,

>> right? Which makes sense. I mean,

they're finding separate branches all

the time.

>> All the time.

>> The Dennisovvens,

you know, all the all these different

ones that they found within the last 20

years. And there could be something with

a larger head, an elongated head.

>> Yep. And that's the um I I don't know

enough about osteo whatever to

>> go in depth about it, but it

>> I mean either you had whole cultures

just doing this or

there's there's too many of them for it

to have just been kind of some elitist

practice. I I think

>> and a bizarre practice at that. Like why

would you want to do that to your kid's

head?

>> Yeah. when clearly it's probably not

been done to your head. At least the

first people like what were you trying

to imitate

>> there?

I forget who told me this. Uh

there is some I think Will told me this.

There there's some woman who who did

this practice on herself like actually

treponated her own head to um

>> Yeah, we talked about that.

>> Yeah.

>> Well, we've talked about trepation when

we had that woman on.

>> That's to herself.

>> Okay. Okay. Well, wait. So, you had her

on?

>> Yeah. Well, a woman who did what was her

name again? The psychedelic lady. She's

I believe she passed, didn't she?

>> Recently.

>> Really fascinating woman.

>> Amanda Fielding.

>> Amanda Fielding. She she died recently,

right?

>> Yeah.

>> So, uh

>> but she did self-trepation.

>> She did self trep. Uh

>> but that's not elongation of the skull.

>> No. But if there's an idea that

what that trepidation might have done in

in the ancient days, they did it like to

release the evil spirits if somebody was

afflicted with some sort of psychosis or

something like that. Uh but and I forget

if it was Amanda um

something happens in in in with your

brain waves when like the brain is

exposed or something like there's some

sort of I I don't know. Uh,

>> how the do you find that out

without doing it?

>> But if the skull is elongated, I don't

know if it gives extra space to uh

it I forget who told me this, but

>> it like changes the the chemical

uh structure of the brain that like kind

of like a DMT experience. You're open to

more things. Huh.

>> And so an idea an idea is that if you

elongated it and had that extra space in

the skull for the brain to have more

>> oxygen, I guess uh maybe it affects your

brain chemistry. I don't know.

>> Just pure speculation.

>> Pure.

>> But one one of the things about some of

these skulls they found is that the

volume is larger than a than a human

brain.

>> So how would you do that just by

stretching it out with boards? I mean,

it would seem like you have the same

volume. You're just changing the shape

of it, right?

>> That Yeah, but there are there are some,

like you said, that have more volume

that would appear to have more volume.

>> And have there been no studies on these

weird ones? The ones that don't have

those sagittal lines that that

correspond with human base?

>> Uh, cuz some of them fringe studies.

>> That's the problem.

>> That is the problem.

>> What are we looking at? Are we looking

at an animal head that they've kind of

like shoved onto like human features and

glued things together like

>> Oh, with the with the mummies

>> with I mean some of these skulls.

>> Well, I mean some of like like the one

you just saw. I mean they're they're

there. Um they're they're just out in

the desert. I don't know why funding

hasn't been

>> And you found them just sitting there

and you just leave them there.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah. I put a pin on I mean eventually

one day I would like to um

I don't know have form some sort of

relationship with the Ministry of

Culture because the thing is nobody's

going out there and and I spec I

specifically went to places this last

expedition that I went the first year

just to see what happened a year later

and those places were looted even more

the things I had found and come across

and documented like an elongated skull

wasn't there anymore so these things are

being taken and sold Um, makes you

wonder how much of it was there in the

past,

>> dude. I mean, I don't like that eight

kilometers of looting, it was all bones

and textile and

pottery and I mean just eight full

kilometers and like

>> kilometer graveyard.

>> Yeah. Yeah. Um,

>> when I'm looking up trepation, uh,

that's a weird one.

>> This elongated skull is coming up.

Apparently, this one is in Oklahoma,

a museum of some kind.

>> That's the one that looks like it's had

surgery on it, and there's like some

sort of a metal implant put

>> and it's come up in that in that

context. Like this one's coming up, too.

But what they're saying is that the

metal implant is used after

trepination's been done to sort of patch

the bone.

>> Sometimes that that has been um that has

been documented as as happening.

>> What kind of metal are they using on

your head? That's the weird

thing, too, cuz that metal has come up

in the skull scans on like Monzerat. I

don't know which one in particular had

it, but they're saying it's got like

metal that wasn't available, you know.

>> What's that one in the lower leftand

corner? That one looks crazy.

>> Oh, that's the Chungo school.

>> What's that? Okay, so that one looks

>> Yeah, that's

>> It says it's in Paracas. I mean, that's

>> Click on that.

>> It's very close to where I found the one

I showed you from my footage.

>> Okay, that skull looks nuts. So, that

doesn't look like a human skull at all.

No, that one is

>> Look at the lines on that one. That's

crazy.

>> That doesn't seem like it has any of the

normal lines that a human skull has.

>> The museum unfortunately is closed now,

so you can't go see it. I tried to.

>> Well, where is it?

>> It was in par. They The Ministry of

Culture shut down that museum.

Oh, the collection often exceptionally

elongated skulls found in Paracus,

particularly around the village of

Chongos

near Pisco, dating to around 700 B.CE to

200 CE. His skulls exhibit severe

artificial cranial deformation practice

used by elite Paracas culture members to

signify status. Huh.

That that is the the one we just saw in

that in that museum is the largest one.

>> But it's weirdly large. Can you find

some more images of that one?

>> Trying to find some other stuff that's

not three years old or older.

>> Oh, it's okay. We'll just see the images

of it.

>> It might be hard for that one since the

museum closed.

>> Right. But there's images.

>> Yeah.

>> So that looks like it's a lot more

volume than a human head. The one on the

far left. Just the one. Yeah. Either

one. The one below it like that. Just

the image alone of that, how do you get

a normal human head to be that large

>> without some sort of

>> looks like you stuffed a balloon into

someone's eyeball and kept pumping it

up,

>> you know, while they're a baby. Like,

what what the hell is that? That's so

much bigger than a normal human skull.

And then you think if it you know with

the skull binding practice I mean are is

there going to be some form of mental

difficulties with that human being now

>> if it's a human being

>> or or expanded capacity or expand. Yeah.

>> Yeah. Because

>> so the cranial capacity is 25% more than

a normal skull. It weighs 50% or 60%

more than a normal skull. Also, the eye

sockets are larger and the jaw is larger

and more compact.

God, that looks like a different kind of

human.

So, there's there are And when you go to

these museums, there's all sorts of

There's What's that one up there? The

one to the right of your cursor. What

the is that? Is that real?

>> That's why I was I didn't want to go

here. This is bringing up a bunch of

fake too. That's why I was trying

to

>> Is that fake?

>> I seen that one before. I don't I mean

it taking me to Facebook is already a

big red flag. I know Facebook is a hub

of fake

>> Oh man.

>> Yeah. You can't can't escape it on

there.

>> It's the same picture. So a lot of them

are probably AI generated. But that one

that's 25% larger than a normal human

skull and larger eye. Look, the eye

sockets are huge. That's also

weird.

Like that's the problem with all this

looting that's been going on for so many

years. It's like they there might have

been some evidence of a different kind

of human that lived with these people.

And I mean, imagine if we find out that

that different kind of human was what

populated that area and they were the

people that built Saki Huan and because

they Paracus isn't Paracus is the

highest concentration of the ones that

have been found, but you find them up in

the Cusco region too. Um there's

uh there's a video I have uh I think I

think it's chi chiseri ch h i s i n

>> can I ask you what what is the

conventional explanation for the larger

capacity of the skull and then the

larger eyeballs the eye sockets

>> I don't know that there is a

conventional explanation other than

>> seems like you would have to explain

that like if that's not something

cranial

>> homo sapien human being like you or me.

What is that? That seems that's a

different thing, right?

>> You would think,

>> right? Like if you look at a Neanderl

skull and you look mine's pretty close

to one, but if you look at a Neander

tall skull and a normal human skull, you

can clearly see the Dennisovvens, you

clearly see the difference. Homo

Julian's, you see the difference. That's

different, man.

>> It's different. and and some of this uh

some of the stuff in their in their jaws

and with like the set of teeth, there's

differences. I mean, I haven't done a

deep dive into it personally. Um but

there there are a multitude of of

differences that have been highlighted.

>> And for people that are skeptical, one

thing you have to recognize is that it's

really hard to make a fossil. fossils.

We I mean most things that die and have

died forever do not become fossils. They

get consumed by the earth like a normal

thing would, you know. That's why you

don't find

>> I mean Yeah. Yeah. And uh I mean, and if

you're talking about going back 10,000

years, that's why you're not you're not

seeing much evidence of stuff. I mean,

it's been so long. These these things

are preserved because they're between at

at most

typically at most 2,000ish years in in

that region old. They're preserved so

well because of the climate there, which

is I mean when you're going in these

barrel, you still see the hair of

people. It hasn't disintegrated like

it's it's there. Um

>> God, that's so creepy,

>> dude. I have some creepy photos for you,

man. Like I don't know. You might want

to put a disclaimer out before

people know on this show. You don't need

a disclaimer.

>> Here's a quick question. I found a video

of a guy with an elongated skull. is

talking about these and showing it. Uh,

I'm just size of reference to his hand.

Does the skull seem small?

>> It does. Unless he's got some giant ass

basketball.

>> That's kind of the size of the one I I

the one I showed you earlier. It was

smaller than you would think.

>> But a lot of the people there back then

were very small, right? They didn't have

access to a lot of protein. Like I went

to Chichinita and uh one of the weirder

things is how small the people are

there. how small the mind people. I'm

short already and the I was a giant

compared to these people. It was really

weird.

>> Yeah, it's t typically the same. Uh

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>> Same same in Peru until this when the

Spanish came. M and then the

interbreeding.

>> And then interbreeding. Yeah.

>> Yeah.

>> But if you go to uh Jamie, if you just

open up the photos remains folder, this

is this is the stuff you see. I mean,

there's still skin on some of these

things. Like

>> which is why

>> Whoa.

That's creepy.

>> Yeah, man.

>> And how old is that hand? probably uh I

mean at this burial site based on the

artifacts I was seeing it's Paracus or

Nazca. So

>> go back one Jamie please.

>> Yeah one second.

>> Look at the cloth next to it too. So

what is that piece of cloth you think?

>> Uh it's like it's braided in the bottom

and then the

>> I didn't see a hole in the middle so I

don't think it was a it's too fancy for

a sling I think. Uh, so I'm not I'm not

100% sure.

>> Unless it's a fancy sling like some

people could fancy bows and arrows,

fancy guns.

>> True. True.

>> Look at the hand, man. That's so crazy.

>> But so, and what you see to the right of

it is like what kind of looks like

burlap is. I mean, that's what the

mummies were wrapped in. They were

stuffed with cotton or put in the fetal

position. uh wrapped with textile, then

cotton, then more textile and ropes and

and that's some of the uh cotton and

wrapping that

>> the grave robbers had torn apart trying

to find gold and jewels and things like

that. Yeah.

>> And what's unfortunate is some of the

Oh, some of the most beautiful pottery

there, too. It's just completely

destroyed.

>> Wow. Whoa.

Look at all those bones. This is You

found this?

>> Yeah. Um,

>> God, that's got to be creepy just seeing

all those dead people's bones and rope.

>> It's it it it affects you, man. It it

definitely does.

>> And what's the time period of this?

>> This this is um

2,000 years.

This that that picture actually isn't

isn't from Nazca. That was another I

have a video of this to show you. this

place.

>> There's just so much weirdness about

Peru. Just the Nazca lines alone. Like,

what were they doing? Why were you

making artwork you can only see from the

sky?

>> That's crazy.

Oh, look at the hair. That's nuts.

>> Oh,

normal size skull, though.

>> Actually, that one I I I I don't have

the pictures in that folder, but I

measured it. Uh, it's it's it's

incredibly bulbous. It's much more

bulbous than a normal skull. That's

>> So you're just getting a side view of

it. It's

>> Yeah. And I put the tape measurer there

next to it. And

>> that's crazy. You see the skin?

>> Yeah. Isn't it?

>> The skin and the hair on the skull. Oh

god, that's creepy.

>> It's why Yeah. And I mean that,

you know, I I thought that I had gotten

this is another thing that's been set

up.

>> And you think the grave robbers do this?

>> You know, there were some places where I

found things set up like this with

little candy, little modern candies. And

what that is is it's a tradition called

pago latier, paying the land. Um, and so

whoever left the candy I don't think was

a grave robber was probably a lo and it

was a it's a way of giving back to the

land, giving back to the ancestors. I

started doing that with, you know, if I

had a soda bottle or something, you pour

out some Coca-Cola,

pay the land for walking to for walking

to it and documenting this stuff.

>> It was nice little practice. But

um

so the uh I would say that like 2,000ish

years old just just to circle back. So

some of these things

this is all on the surface. I I don't go

digging. That's not right.

>> It's not on me. Uh but the weros do and

that's where they're finding these

things intact.

They're finding these things intact

where you can put them into a CT scanner

and it's going to show the

the whole insides. And has any

have any paleontologists done or

archaeologists

brought these skulls and brought them

for examination to try to find out if

there's intact DNA that can be studied.

>> They're supposed they're supposed to be

doing DNA tests on six of the specimens.

Uh but if you watch my video, uh you'll

see each time they've done DNA tests on

all the hoaxes that they've been a part

of before, I imagine the results are

going to be the same.

>> Yeah. But I don't mean the hoaxes. I

mean the elongated skulls with the large

eye sockets, things along those lines.

>> Uh you know, there is a lot of

the the bureaucracy of how to go about

doing anything with the Ministry of

Culture in Peru is

it's so disjointed. you can't get things

done. You just can't get I know I know

Brian Forester for decades was trying to

get some sort of official path to do DNA

studies on these things. And um

so I mean I'm I'm hoping with the work

that I'm doing with Pillars of the Past

that that some of those boundaries can

be broken where we can actually get

permission to study these things because

>> it's the it's it's Peru's patrimony. You

can't just go in there and you know

>> that makes sense. And so and and it

costs money to do those things, too. And

you have to do it in in the above board

way. And so it's kind of waiting for the

okay from them. Well, it seems like at

the very least the most bizarre

elongated skulls should be studied more

closely. It shouldn't just be like, "Oh,

it's in a museum. Look at the head. Big,

huh? Weird eyes. Let's move on.

>> Look at this bowl. It's broken, but you

know, pretty interesting. Let's move

on." Like, no. What the is going

on?

>> Put some money. figure it out. And cuz

if it turns out that there was a totally

different branch of the human species,

>> it's huge. It's huge. Uh

>> lots of

>> I don't know the accuracy of this.

That's why I'm hesitant to even bring it

up. But as you're asking about that,

that video I pulled up is this guy said

that they tested 12 or 18 skulls.

>> That's Forester

>> and some of them came back as Native

American. I'm trying to I'm reading the

the closed captioning, but some of them

did not.

>> Some of them came back from the Black

Sea area,

>> the Caspian Sea, Black Sea area from 2

to 3,000 years ago,

>> which there have been skulls found out

in those areas, too.

>> Wow.

>> I don't know. Say it.

>> Black and Caspian seas, as in the

Cauasus Mountains.

>> Whoa.

>> So, that's very intriguing. Um, what I

can also share with you is what I

believe was the migrational pattern

because these people like the some

indigenous people of the Caspian area

and Black Sea area um

were and are dark redhaired and also

very light skin and green eyes. And this

seems to correspond as well with the

elongated skulls. So, I believe what

happened about 3,000 years ago,

>> the uh ancestors of the Paracus decided

to leave the area because they were

being invaded by someone.

>> And so, they traveled south through Iraq

and Iran to the Persian Gulf. And there

they wound up sailing

eastwards

and eventually found their way to the

coast of Peru. There are different

>> That's just making speculation. That'd

be

>> Yeah. Well, so that's the thing with

with theories like this. I'm like, let's

put some effort to peer review this

stuff, you know, like let's let's do the

studies that are needed. Uh have

multiple universities test these things,

come up with the standard set of results

and then

>> I mean,

>> so what is missing funding interest?

It's It seems like this is in in in

terms of like really doing a

comprehensive study of archaeological

sites, Peru seems like the least

studied. Is that accurate?

Half halfway, I would say. only because

look there there's a part of me that

also feels for the Ministry of of

Culture in a way where

there's so many sites in Peru that to

have eyes everywhere to protect it to

have teams excavating things every I

mean isn't that alone kind of crazy how

many sites there are in Peru and the

fact that also you have Sakai Huan you

have the Nazka lines you have all this

weirdness

in this one part of the world like why

you have the oldest stone pyramids in

the Americas pyramids that predate the

pyramids of Giza by thousand years.

>> What do they look like?

>> If you look up uh Kal

uh they are dude I've done a whole

thesis on this like I I plan to write a

I don't think I'll ever get it peer-

reviewviewed but I plan to write a paper

about my my theories on some of the

stuff I found. So, Coral was this area

on the coast. It's uh C A R A L. And

these pyramids had Graeme Hancock's been

looking into this stuff, too. Um this

sunken circular plaza. So, they're just

This is a

>> Whoa. This This predates Giza. Well,

what we think is

>> the the the great conventional the

conventional dating, right?

>> So,

>> all right. Let's Let's see if I can

condense this. Uh,

>> okay.

>> This site has, I don't know, eight of

these pyramids. They're actually all

throughout the valley and four valleys

around it. The earliest one in a

separate valley close to this dates back

to 4,000 BCE. It has the remnants of a

sunken circular. The main thing that's

to keep note of is that sunken circular

plaza because it's a feature that you

not only see there in that those four

valleys, but you also see it 200

kilometers north of Peru. And

>> and what's the conventional explanation

for these sunken circular plazas?

>> Uh ritual uh ritual spaces. Some people

say collecting water, some people say

the acoustics are different. Here's the

interesting thing about this site was

discovered in

the 1940s.

>> Wow. Look at that artwork.

>> Nobody did anything about it. The the

archae this is what you'll this is what

happens in Peru in the from the 1900

early 1900s to 1940s.

Archaeologists and historians were going

up and down the coast finding stuff. I

mean just finding stuff. And they would

write it down. They'd put it on the map.

That's why the Ministry of Culture has

it on their archaeological database.

They pick through it what they could,

put stuff in museums, and just move on.

That site, Carral,

predated any any ceramics. I mean, this

was a pre-ceramic culture, so there were

no artifacts to find. So, they just they

just moved on. It wasn't until Dr. Ruth

Shady in like the 80s and 90s actually

put research in and figured out, hey,

this is older than everything else we

found because they just overlooked it.

There were no no artifacts. They were

just like, we're going to move on.

>> When you say no artifacts, like that

seems weird to me because like why would

you make these immense structures and

not have a bowl to put rice in, right?

>> They uh a lot of animal skins uh and and

the weaving they

So, uh, these cultures, what they found

is, so that's a little a little further

inland, they had a sister site on the

coast. And so, what they would do, they

the only agriculture they would grow was

cotton. That cotton they would trade

with the people on the coast so they

could make nets and fish with it. The

fish they would bring back, they would

give back to those people whom made the

cotton for them. So, it was this weird,

you know, interplay. And uh the other

unique thing about this time period is

there was no evidence of warfare for a

thousand years. Nobody was fighting each

other. It was very just everybody. No

weapons, no anything like that.

>> No weapons.

>> No weapons for a thousand years.

>> That seems insane. Is that just no

evidence of weapons?

>> That's currently no evidence of weapons,

>> right? But maybe someone stole the

weapons. That's that's possible

>> because I mean you you're talking about

a place that's been looted ad nauseium,

right?

>> That's true. I mean they've they put in

a lot of work though excavating

especially that site corral.

>> So you feel like somewhere they would

find some sort of an axe head or

>> they found um the only artifacts of

major note um are some of those carvings

that we saw and then bone flutes with

carvings on them and the nets, the

fishing nets. M.

>> And so my whole um

my whole theory is this was a pocket.

It's called the Norte Chico culture.

It's a little pocket of these four

valleys. And I and I I I went all over

them documenting these pyramids. They

don't look like pyramids anymore. They

look like mounds. This they're so old.

Um but there's another place 200

kilometers north in the Casma Valley.

And what they have found is underneath

the structures that are currently

exposed, they found deeper layers of

temples with that sunken plaza in this

whole other location. And those are

dating to the same time. So I firmly

believe that what we what archaeologists

currently say is the oldest culture, I

believe it was it went the whole coast

of Peru.

>> Wow. I mean like this was a cradle of

civilization. I mean, hands down,

>> cradle of civilization 6,000 years ago.

>> 6,000 years ago.

>> So, which is right around the time we

think the cradle of civilization

happened in Sumere.

>> Wow.

>> And so, the hard thing about it is like

you you'll have car you'll have some

carvings in adobe that's been preserved

in some of these places. Uh so there's

some sort of iconography. Uh but there's

no writing like the Sumerian. The the

whole thing about Peru is like there was

no

no writing system that we know of. There

is a theory and I and I believe this. I

believe the kipus the the rope strings

with knots. Yeah. I believe that was a

language.

>> But the Spanish burnt as as soon as soon

as the Spanish came over, they burned as

many as those things that as they could

find and they killed the people who

could read them. So we don't we will

never know.

>> Oh god. Spaniards, how dare you. But

there's like there's evidence that they

would they took some some of the Incas

to the Spanish court and so there's and

Inca in the Spanish court in front of

the queen or king reading off of these

kipoos reading stories telling the court

and

>> from knots on strings

>> from knots on strings.

>> Yeah.

>> And that understanding of that stuff is

lost

>> there. It's it's lost. Currently, I

think for the last few years, there's

been some studies being done in Harvard

trying to use AI to figure out what

these mean. I mean,

>> how many of these are left over?

>> Uh,

can we see some images of them?

>> I think 500 to a,000. I mean, that's it.

I mean, the Spanish went on a mission to

burn all these things

>> because they were trying to convert them

to Spanish and

>> get them to speak the language and y

>> become Catholic.

>> Pretty much. Yeah. Yeah.

>> And and and so much history is lost