Hey, what's up everyone and welcome to

the WAN show. I got myself a birthday

present today and I'm going to talk

about it.

>> What does a guy with a firetruck get

himself for his birthday?

>> A robot.

>> Okay.

>> In other news,

>> that makes sense.

[laughter]

>> Luke was right again. [clears throat]

>> Oh no.

>> A PBS station in St. Louis has lost 70

years of archives after a cloud storage

reseller shuts down. Luke warned you and

we'll be talking about that later as

well. What else we got?

>> Did I?

>> Yeah, you did many times.

>> Oh, nice. Hell yeah. [laughter]

Uh I don't know. Where's the other one

that was good? You took the PBS one that

I wanted to use. Uh, New Mexico judge

orders Meta to pay nearly a billion

dollars. Do we finally have like fees

for companies that will actually impact

them uh that aren't coming from the EU?

Maybe, possibly.

>> I'm not getting my hopes up.

>> Um, me neither.

Which other thing do we want to talk

about?

>> You know, you have the entire time

before the show starts.

>> I didn't think you were going to take

the PBS one. I don't know why I thought

that, but I didn't think you were going

to.

>> I always try to pick the one you're

going to pick.

Yeah, but I didn't think you'd think I

would pick that one. [sighs] Man, we're

getting into some mind games on these

now. Um, this one's kind of funny.

Whatever. GeForce Now exploit lets you

access full Windows desktop through a

simple file swap, and a modder runs

local AI models on the ultimate tier

with 48 gigs of VRAM and no

restrictions, which is actually just

kind of funny in my opinion.

>> Beast

The show is brought to you today by

Vessie along with Whisper Flow, X

Square, and Hrefs with of course a rap

courtesy of our rap partner Dbrand. a

chair courtesy of our chair partner. Oh

goodness, I have a t-shirt in front of

it, Razer. And our laptops, also

courtesy of Razer. Why don't we jump

right into our headline topic of today,

WHICH IS THAT LUKE WARNED [screaming]

ALL OF YOU WHEN THE CLOUD WAS HAPPENING.

LUKE SAID HE CAME DOWN FROM ON HIGH and

he spaketh such that [cough]

>> on prem will always have a place.

>> Yeah.

>> And a St. Louis public broadcaster

learned this the hard way. Um, they lost

access to 50 terabytes of archival

material after their cloud storage

provider OSS shut down without notice.

After losing access to their data, 9PBS

discovered that the OSS website was

offline and the company was listed as

delinquent by the Colorado Secretary of

State. 9PBS learned that the defunct

storage provider was reselling Iron

Mountain services and 9PBS has sent a

demand letter to preserve its data and

to pay any reasonable costs associated

with its demand. But as 9PBS wasn't Iron

Mountain's customer, they actually, it

turns out,

>> can't just hand over the data.

>> That makes sense. That's so annoying,

but that makes sense. The full story is

a convoluted mess. Dan, can we put in

the link to Gizmodo in the chat cuz you

guys can read all about it there. It's a

fascinating rabbit hole. But really, I'm

only bringing this up because what I

want to talk about was how much Luke and

actually I also, but it's just, you

know, nicer to point out, I guess, your

co-host. I think that's why I was

confused. I was like, "What do you

mean?" [laughter]

>> How both of us were talking about this

for so many years

>> like from the beginning

>> that while there are good things about

the cloud,

>> there are also massive problems because

the second you don't own your

infrastructure,

>> you can lose it. It can be just gone.

And the

>> the cloud is just someone else's

computer. The craziest part of this that

kills me the most is it was just 50

terabytes.

>> You like they could back up 50 terabytes

these days with literally like four

drives in a consumer little QAP Naz or

something. Like actually though

>> it's actually impressing how solvable

that is.

>> You don't need an IT department. But but

you know what the funny thing is? I I

had um was it dinner? Yeah. Yeah. I had

dinner with Pancratz a couple of weeks

ago just cuz like I feel like he's

worked here like a year and I had never

actually like had a meal with him. Um

>> has it only been a year?

>> I know, right? He feels like he's been a

fixture. But anyway,

>> what

>> I had dinner with Pancrats and I was

talking about his past life and like

like you, he used to uh work providing

uh IT solutions for like small local

businesses. Um his was like through a

company whereas I think you were just

like freelance, right? Yeah. But um but

he was talking about how

how different that world is.

>> Oh, absolutely. compared to the

high-tech world. And you know, we he was

he was talking about how like there was

uh there was like an auto mechanic or

something that that he was doing work

for and the guy was just kind of kind of

shooting the breeze with him and they

were going through a bill and Buddy's

basically just like, "Yeah, so I guess I

just like have to pay this because I

don't understand any of it, which is

really uncomfortable for me because when

it comes to something mechanical, I can

look at every O-ring, every washer,

every nut, every bolt, and I know what

all of it is, and I understand the

necessity of it for my business. But

when I look at these IT services, I

literally don't know what any of this

is, and I don't understand if I'm being

charged a fair rate. So, hey, don't

me. Basically, right? And a guy like

Pancratz, I'm sure he never wrote an

unfair bill in his life, even if he

could be a

>> very standup dude.

>> But there's a but there's a lot of

opportunity there. And so, you know, you

and I look at this and we go, "Wow, look

how solvable that is." They could have

just bought four hard drives and,

you know, just set up a

>> one of the ways

solvable in my opinion is through things

like what you just described. But that

relies on them finding someone

trustworthy who isn't going to oversell

them something they don't need. So why

do people end up going with the cloud?

>> Because there's transparent pricing. It

looks credible. It's like a it's low

fees, like low monthly fees, which is a

lot of a lot of businesses. And you know

what? Let's face it, like public

broadcasters don't have unlimited money.

So even though they're, you know, not

small business in the sense that you

might think of as, you know, a mom and

pop candy store or something, uh, they

have a they have a finite budget. So

just buying infrastructure upfront all

at once is not necessarily feasible.

>> Yeah. The the the capex versus opex

[clears throat] thing, the capex is

like, oh, I have to buy Okay, with your

example, I have to buy this QAP thing

and I have to buy three right now very

expensive hard drives. Yeah,

>> that's still a decent amount of cash,

especially if you're, you know, as far

as my understanding goes, these like

smaller kind of local TV stations aren't

making a crazy amount of money right

now.

>> Yeah. Or I mean

>> or anything. [snorts] Yeah.

>> Um so it's it's it's a little bit of a

tough world. Uh but you can try to

communicate the the the potential

savings of that. We're going through

this right now where like I [snorts] was

actually

we

>> should just talk about it. Why don't we

just talk about it? We can a little bit.

Yeah, sure. We're becoming an ISP

apparently, which Luke has given me no

further clarity on. So,

>> no, this is an AJ project. Okay.

>> Uh, so it'll be it'll be most of the

clarity would come from talking to him

cuz we're still kind of mapping it out.

I'm still honestly understanding even

what's happening. Uh, but there there's

a lot of stuff going on. You you guys

are aware of you know RAM price

increases, everything hardware storage,

uh hard drive prices increasing,

>> the price of almost everything is going

up largely because almost every company

involved in the manufacturing of stuff

that you would use in your computer can

also be involved in the manufacturing

for things in a data center.

>> Yeah. And it's even affecting, we talked

about this last week on WAN show, it's

even affecting things like the timeline

for our battery bank product. Uh the the

IC's that we need, I think particularly

the buck.

>> Um

>> you can correct things I say wrong.

>> They are they're they're backordered by

something like 44 weeks or something

like that is the current lead time for

us to order the like buck boost

converters or whatever the there's a

particular component that has a super

long lead time on it. So, uh, yeah. So,

>> so anyways, there there's a lot of

different things going on. Like one, we

we got news earlier this week, uh, that

one of the services that we use wants to

increase our bill for the next year. And

this is the whole company, not a flow

plane thing at all.

>> Yeah. Okay. So, you're talking at a

scale that like hurts

>> 20% increase of bill.

>> Uh, there's lots of other things going

up right now because what's what's

basically happening is most of these

services

>> like you you feel the pain. your thing

you're interested in computers the price

of it is going up at a company level you

know laptops your your device that you

use at the company cost of that probably

going up um any servers infrastructure

etc things that they use at a company

level probably going up in cost

therefore their service cost is going up

as well so the amount that we pay as a

company for these external services is

going up the reason why I attach that to

this

>> is because a cloud provider is likely

going to have cost increases. OVH has

been talking about um cost increases.

Let's see here if I can bring this up

>> for context. OVH is a a pretty cool um

hosting option that has been very

affordable over the years and actually

pretty cool for us to work with the

>> good partner for us to work with

>> and

[clears throat] 87% price hikes.

>> Yeah. And to be clear, I don't even

necessarily blame OVH for this.

>> No, you can't see this happen

everywhere.

>> OVH didn't decide decades ago to have

Homer Simpson work at a nuclear power

plant, which apparently did contribute

significantly to people's perception of

the safety of nuclear power. Um,

>> because he couldn't screw it up

>> and cuz all No, cuz all the problems and

the way Mr. Burns runs it and stuff. I I

I have I have read that incredible

places which is like

>> wild.

Um and so that's part of why nuclear

power did not just because like it's

just kind of obvious.

>> That's why it didn't just go to the

moon.

>> That's nuts. Anyways, um anyway,

>> cost everywhere.

>> Sorry. Sorry, Arion.

>> It's pronounced nuclear.

>> Nuclear. Nice. Nuclear.

>> Uh, different places have different ways

of pronouncing things.

>> No, no, it's a joke from the Simpsons.

>> Okay, sounds good.

>> He corrects Lisa's pronunciation. Honey,

it's pronounced nuclear.

>> Anyway, carry on. Uh costs everywhere

are going up and costs at places like

OVH especially things are going up

because not only are their costs

skyrocketing but if you think about it

the people willing to rent from places

like that

in some cases are also going up in what

they will be willing to rent

>> because their unlimited money faucet

from investors has to be spent on

something because if you don't spend

enough of it you don't look like you're

trying hard enough to win the AI race

>> and you know places like OVH might not

be getting as much pressure from that as

some other potential places

>> but when the pressure is coming on them

from both ends when their costs are

going up and the amount on offer from

these customers who are responsible for

the cost going up

>> it can be it can even be indirect like

maybe there's another data center which

is like more like GPU focused or

something and the lower-end clients are

being pushed out of there

>> so they're now going to OVH so there's

more competition

>> or regional power bills are just going

up which just affects everybody.

>> So there there's a lot of different

things at play. I don't necessarily

blame OVH. OVH has been pretty great to

work with. That being said, oh my god,

87% potential increase in bill. U now

that doesn't mean all of OVH's services

are going up by 87%. And this was

largely a warning by them. We're

actually lacking a lot of information on

it to be clear. Um

one second.

What?

>> We didn't record.

>> Oh,

>> well then

>> everyone was on time.

>> Wan was not late because of our fault.

Uh getting No, you know what? Wan was

late because of Sammy. I think Sammy

loses a point.

>> Yeah. Point point against Sammy. Okay,

carry on.

>> Yeah. So, all these prices are going up.

OVH, don't blame OVH. So, we are looking

at potentially bizouncing. We're not

going to plan on bouncing for

everything. We're largely going to keep

our like omega large data store there

because that cost increase is not

presumably going to be nearly as high as

the other ones and the capex or buy a

bunch of hardware cost of setting up a

massive data store somewhere else very

high.

>> Mhm.

>> The capex of the other things that we

need to do relatively low.

>> Right.

>> So you want to do the thing that has the

lower upfront impact

um and the biggest potential benefit of

dodging the price increase. What does

that have to do with setting up an ISP?

>> So you're talking about moving some

equipment on prem. So maybe like

whatever you know AI server is going

through and doing our automated

subtitling like that would just move on

prem because it can just be it can turn

in the background. Is that kind of what

you're talking about?

>> Sure.

>> Transcoding potentially some of it.

>> Yeah. It's

>> and then we can just steer the jobs to

like use as much on prem as we can but

we keep OVH as a backup. But by onrem we

mean a collocation data center

>> that is like Vancouverish.

>> Got it.

>> So it will like latency wise it will

almost like very very very close feel

like to actually onrem. Uh because

there's fiber lines that go like

straight there

>> right.

>> Uh but it but it won't be it won't be

technically onrem. Although the term

onrem gets really confusing depending on

in what circles you use it in. Yeah.

Don't worry about it. Um

>> but yeah so we'd be putting stuff in

there. We would also be putting in these

like insane networking routing switching

boxes.

>> Yes.

>> Which blow my brain cuz they they have

ports that do 400 gig.

[clears throat]

[laughter]

>> They are sick. They're That's where most

the capex is, by the way. Right. Um is

getting those.

>> Who are these from?

>> Uh Edge Edge Core.

>> Okay.

>> So a sick name.

>> Yeah. Yeah.

>> Yeah. So I

>> So I never quite get to experience the

core. Just

>> just right on the edge of the core.

Yeah.

>> Yeah. Okay.

>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

>> Um and then something something

something. We bought our own IPs. Uh so

we bought a range of IPv4. We did

>> IP. When was this?

>> A little bit ago we did that. Uh, we

almost bought them from Canada Post,

which was going to be really funny, and

then AJ found a cheaper uh, set, so we

bought those, but we almost bought them

from Canada Post.

>> I love that IPv4

has been and continues to be one of like

the soundest investments. This is not

financial advice.

>> That's one of the reasons why we bought

it. Uh, it was because we were like we

were like, we're pretty sure we're going

to do this thing, but then AJ AJ found

this like bank of IPs that we would we

could buy, and he was like, uh, these

are up for auction. we should like

probably buy these. And the reason why

I'm saying this now is cuz this is a

decent price and even if we don't do the

plan, you can probably just resell them

and make money. So, I think you should

buy these. I was like, okay.

>> No asks, wasn't there an IPv4 shortage

at one point?

>> Yeah,

>> there's an IPv4 shortage that is ongoing

and will never end as far as I can tell

because it looks like we're just

>> never going to switch to IPv6. I And to

be clear, that is not a prediction.

Hopefully, theoretically at some point,

IPv4 addresses and they're they're

they're limited quantities we have of

them won't matter, but for now it does.

>> Yeah, AJ included this and it's just as

like a footnote because who cares, but

we got some free IPv6, too.

>> Sounds good. What we cared about was

buying the the actual IPv4. But now that

we have that,

we could provide

internet for ourselves

from the colo center.

>> Holy [laughter]

>> Which would mean that you could have

Lionus ISP tips as your internet service

provider at the office.

>> Linus Lisp tips. [laughter]

>> [gasps]

>> entirely possible. You could be your own

ISP with one customer, which is

>> my own ISP.

>> I mean, tech technically there's more

than one customer because the the ISP

>> would have the customer of like float

plane and also the the offices,

>> right?

>> So, float plane's a reseller now. So

okay

>> kind of because float plane services

sauce plus and float plane yeah and does

some other little things.

>> So Black Raven asks what stops an

individual home user from being their

own ISP at an individual home level. Uh

the economics don't make any sense but

there are towns that have had really

poor service from the major ISPs and

have just pulled together their tax

revenues and made their own ISP. that

that is a thing because if you make a

connection to an exchange

then if you own the network addressing

that you need

>> and you can pay to go over other

people's lines which is how a lot of

small ISPs work

>> the internet is just a series of tubes

so if you have the equipment and you

have the lines or you lease access to

them

you can you can join the the network

that we call the internet. Um,

are we sure this makes sense?

>> What we're definitely sure of

>> is it saves a lot of money.

>> Okay.

>> So much money.

>> Does it really save so much money?

>> So much money. Like 400 grand over 5

years.

>> Oh yeah. That's everything combined.

That's having the servers in the

collocation center. That's being our own

ISP. That's basically AJ's been sitting

the back cooking up a crazy witch's brew

and it's going to save you 400 grand

over five years.

>> While we're at it, I mean, I've been

thinking about it some more and I feel

like we should just do the VPN product,

too.

>> I think we drew a very arbitrary line

before.

>> I think we should just do it. We'll

become an ISP. We'll become a VPN

provider. It'll be great.

>> We're both of them.

Shoot, we're going to know what your

traffic is doing no matter what. Nice.

[laughter] You put on our network and

you VPN it, we're going to know. Um I I

love it. Um

yeah, I don't know. So, we're we're

we're moving, we're shaking, we're

trying to make things happen. Uh

okay. Right. So, because we have a rack

at the exchange.

[snorts] So, how does our how does our

access from here to the exchange work,

though? What do you mean? Sorry.

>> Like that fiber line?

>> Yeah. So, we will need to lease that

fiber line. But that's the same way.

That's what I was kind of getting into

is like there's tons of like small like

super regional ISPs.

>> Yeah. Which I know because we use one.

>> Oh yeah.

>> So then what's their role in any of

this?

>> The the super regional one is nothing.

>> Is nothing. No. So we just whatever

>> they are renting lines from someone

else. So we will just skip that and rent

lines for the people that they're

renting lines from.

>> Got it.

>> Yeah.

>> Okay. Yeah.

>> And then would we still have

>> which is another dodge in costs,

>> right?

>> So it kind of layers. It's like an onion

of cost.

>> It's the Shrek of the internet.

[laughter]

>> Shreknet.

>> You just keep saving.

>> Can we can do we need to spin up a new

company for this? Because if we do, I

want it to be called Shreket. [laughter]

Um, and AJ's also pointing out we you

could technically use this as like a

weird form of redundancy as well because

we have the crazy switch at the colo.

Yeah.

>> If like Telus went down,

>> as far as my understanding goes, and I'm

still learning a lot about this, so AJ

can correct me, but if Telus went down,

>> if we had our contracts arranged in the

right way, which this might be stupid,

but I think you could if Telus went

down, I think you could literally just

be like, "Well, I guess we're on Rogers

now." and just not lose internet.

I think

>> as long as it's not somebody putting a

shovel through like our fiber.

>> That'd be a little rough. Yeah.

>> Got it. Okay. And then

>> I think that works. AJ can can correct

me.

>> While we're at it, float plane chat

asks, "Okay, why not cellular service

then?" Um, there's a dead spot right by

my house that causes me no amount of

frustration because I cannot open and

close my garage doors with my with my

phone because it uses your Wi-Fi.

>> Yeah, Adrian said yes. for CarPlay and

Android Auto [snorts] and my cellular

service doesn't work right next to my

house. So, it's really annoying.

>> Oh, sorry.

>> So, if I could just put a tower there,

that would be swell. I would be super

down.

>> Yeah, I have no idea about that at all.

>> Okay,

>> that's maybe a later later thing to look

into. Something else he was describing

to me is because the colo center, we can

make like a LAN ring.

So, like if our network from the studio

to the lab went down for some reason.

Yeah, that's okay because the studio can

talk to the lab through the colo center.

>> Okay. [laughter]

>> Which is like sick.

>> Okay.

>> So, there's like there's a lot of really

kind of

there's been a lot going on, so I

haven't had like a crazy amount of time

to talk to AJ about it, but every time I

talk to AJ about it, I'm just like,

"What?" [laughter]

It sounds very fun. Um,

>> all right. Okay, cool. Um, yes, I still

have the cell repeaters in my house, but

I I ran out of of interior antenna slots

on my repeater, and all of those are

used inside the house, so they're not

useful in front of the garage, which is

where I have my problem right now. Very,

very annoying. And I even just switched

ISPs to make it or not ISPs, um, mobile

providers so that I can do conference

calls on the way to and from work

because the one that I was on before had

a couple of dead zones that were too

dead. And then the new one, I'm able to

make calls to and from the office, but

still cannot open my garage door. So

part of the problem is the noise

blocking glass in my car. It turns out

it's also cellular signal blocking

glass. So sometimes I'll I'll be that

guy where I'm like, I really need to

close my garage door right now. Uh

>> Oh, yeah.

>> Oh, can you hear me now? Can you hear me

now? Boop. Okay. Yeah. Put

>> Yeah.

>> Ridiculous. Add a stop sign.

>> So AJ added the the unfortunate part in

full plane chat.

>> Oh,

>> the two switches will total

not not each about 65 grand.

which will equate like all the costs in

is roughly

what we would have been paying if we

didn't do anything over the course of 12

months.

>> Okay.

>> And then you'll be saving money after

that.

>> Uhhuh.

[sighs and gasps]

>> And we need two of these switches. Okay.

Is the second one just for redundancy?

>> Yeah, but it's total.

>> Can I just have one?

>> No.

>> And not have redundancy?

>> No.

>> Why?

>> Because if the whole float plane service

goes down, it's your fault. [sighs]

>> But it's not it's not 65k twice.

>> No, I got that.

>> Okay. All right.

>> 65k is okay. Is it at least Canadian

dollars or is it like real money?

>> You don't know. You're just waiting for

>> I don't remember. I think it's CAD. I

think it's CAD.

>> Okay. Well, that would help. I don't

remember.

>> That would help a lot.

>> I don't remember.

>> It's in the dock. It's all in the dock.

>> Yeah, everything's in the dock.

>> Yep.

>> AJ's totally going to reply.

>> He'll say,

>> "Man, oh man, I just

>> a break even of 12 months sounds pretty

good." It is pretty good. It doesn't

change the fact that it's still 65K.

>> And [laughter] this is But this is why.

>> Yeah, it's cat.

>> This is Okay, that helps a lot. So, it's

like 40,000 real dollars. like 45. Um,

but th this is why businesses have a

hard time

>> all the way back

>> making these kinds of decisions because

paying a few grand every month is

something that you can plan for. You

could you just it smooths out your your

your your expenses and your income

because I don't I don't just suddenly

have necessarily

$65,000 of excess income right now. I I

it's hard to plan around that. I mean,

think about it for like your personal

life as well. Why do so many people

finance a car? You're paying way more.

>> Why do you buy the okay thing that's

going to break down pretty soon instead

of the the really expensive thing that

might last you your whole life? Cuz it's

really brutal to buy the really

expensive thing.

>> And so I just

>> super normal. [sighs]

>> I mean, realistically, we're probably

going to do it. It'll make a great

episode of Holy on the channel.

>> Dude, the switches are nuts. Okay,

[laughter]

AJ linked me the like product page for

them. My brain exploded. I was crazy.

[laughter]

They look so wild. I've never even

considered something like like I knew

that type of infrastructure would exist

somewhere, you know,

>> but I've never really considered like

what it would be. Tell me this like at

at what point like would I would it make

sense if I wanted like super low latency

like the best quality internet at my

house would I should I should I lease

the line to there like like where where

does it end? We could look into how much

that would cost.

>> Like what would it cost to be our own

ISP for like everyone who works here?

>> As far as my Well, okay. Yeah.

>> Like if you're

>> That gets really messy.

>> What I'm asking is is what what how does

the lease work? Is it by the like the

line where it goes? I wouldn't think so.

It probably wouldn't even be by

wavelength either because a lot of that

would be shared. So is it just by total

network utilization? So as long as we

told if we told the staff here like as

long as you have you know Telus fiber to

your neighborhood then we can offer you

lisp for

[panting]

[laughter and snorts]

uh for a low for a little low low price.

>> I knew it was going to end up being

Lion's internet service provider

somehow. I knew it. It's It's in my like

Jo We have a all hands on Monday. It's

in my like jokey notes for the all hands

is Linus [laughter] internet service.

>> Oh man.

>> Like could it be a better price than

buying from Telus or whatever?

>> Okay. Apparently no no apparently AJ

just said we can actually gain access to

Telus last mile gon service which I

think is AJ Ford. Yes.

>> I don't AJ that's so complicated. I

[laughter] don't want to be an internal

ISP for all the employees. That's going

to be so much work. But it wouldn't make

sense for us since we're power users.

>> What does that mean?

>> That doesn't mean anything.

>> That means nothing, AJ. And I think that

was intentional.

>> Maybe [laughter]

maybe

I think we need to not

do this.

>> We might use the availability that we

have.

>> Yeah. And we're better off we're better

off sharing quota with grandma who

>> sends like three emails. Yeah. Okay,

>> that actually makes sense.

>> Sorry, AJ. That was

>> That makes sense.

>> Reasonable. I don't think we should be

>> an ISP for all of LMG employees. I don't

think that's a good idea.

>> Do it. Do it for Do it for fun.

>> It'd be pretty badass though.

>> Oh my god.

>> Be so cool.

>> Okay, buy a bunch more fat switches.

>> Oh no.

>> Yeah, there you go. No,

>> no, [laughter]

>> no.

>> Got him.

>> So, how many I how many IPv4 addresses

do we own then?

>> 256, I think.

>> Wow, that's not bad.

>> Yeah.

>> Okay.

>> Pretty sure. [laughter]

>> What do we pay for those?

>> Seven grand.

>> Oh, okay.

>> Again, we could resell.

>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

>> That's like actually an asset that I was

like fairly unconcerned about about

acquiring.

>> That's crazy. The switches,

>> I don't know how many people are going

to be looking for them on Facebook

Marketplace. Um, so those might just be

>> they're gone

>> a cost. Yeah.

>> Yeah.

>> Yeah.

>> And now we have those switches forever.

>> Yeah.

>> Neat.

>> Yeah.

>> I mean, a lot of networking equipment is

like that. No life outside of the data

center. Like some home labber might

tinker around with them here and there,

but the the the size of the market for

these things, the secondary market is

like negligible.

having a 400 gig port, dude.

>> And how many does it have?

>> My god, several. As far as my

understanding goes.

>> No, don't look them up now. We'll save

it for

>> the total switching capacity has to be

obscene.

>> It's it's uh Yeah, it's uh it's kind of

mind-blowing. Um

>> Okay.

>> And we're not we're not getting like

bougie ones. We're also not getting like

ratttastic ones either. Okay. Um,

>> AJ, send me the specs. I want to look at

them when I go home.

[laughter]

>> That would have its own potential

problems, you know, but we we got like

fairly scrappy ones, but but ones that

seem good.

>> Okay.

>> Um,

>> yeah. I mean, I'm potentially open to it

as long as we can make content out of

it.

>> The problem is if we don't do it.

>> Yeah.

>> The costs

again, doing this saves 400 grand over 5

years. not doing this costs 400 grand

over five years, right? So, it's like

65k now,

>> right? Penny saved, penny earned.

>> Yeah.

>> So, I don't know. I mean, you it's it's

technically in your guys' hands. I've

also talked to Taran about it, but I

know that an expense this high is going

to have to go up. So, I'm going both

angles right now cuz if you guys do

decide to say no,

>> I would just question

what the strategy is. Uh because the the

okay the 400k savings over 5 years as

far as my understanding goes also is

just from the OVH payments.

>> Well, that also just assumes that

everything's going to stay flat for 5

years.

>> That too which it like very likely will

go up more.

>> Yeah, I know.

>> So it's like

I I understand it's tough.

>> Yeah, it is.

>> It's a lot of money.

>> It's very tough. It's maybe a lot of

money when

>> it's a step above tough.

>> It's a lot of money when things are when

things are rough, too. But think about

it, man. We can potentially get

enterprise

>> hardware and sponsors and stuff on the

videos. We can make videos about it.

>> Yeah.

>> Do you want to make videos about being

your own ISP?

>> Yeah, I do.

>> That's kind of fun.

>> That's pretty cool.

>> A lot of this project sounds really

freaking sick.

>> Can we shoot at the Colo?

>> I don't 100% know yet.

>> Okay. Cuz that would be amazing.

>> Being able to shoot at the Colo would be

sick.

>> As far as my understanding goes, we

reached out. I don't think they just

like said no.

>> Okay.

>> I think there was they were like,

>> "What?" Um, but it wasn't an immediate

no. There's some issues because of other

people's stuff.

>> So, what I was going to say, I know it's

a thing where you can maybe it's for a

fee or something, but you can have like

blanked out covers. So, maybe we just

have covers on ours so we can do

whatever we want inside ours. Maybe we

could suggest that

>> so that we can't see anybody else's cage

from inside our cage.

>> Yeah, something like that. Maybe like I

I'm going to try to play ball with them

because I would like to

>> AJ AJ says they said most likely.

>> Nice. Okay. I didn't hear that update,

but that's great.

>> Yeah, that's that's terrific because

that makes a huge difference to us

because all of a sudden like

>> that's been crazy. I'm behind on emails.

>> We could we could go to someone like uh

you know, I don't want to I don't want

to put any words in anyone's mouth, but

we could we could go to companies in

this space and they have such an

appetite for oh, you're doing something

that's like actually kind of sexy and

cool with like boring business iron.

Yeah, let's do it. Um they tend to be

pretty enthusiastic about it. So that

would be really exciting.

>> Yeah, it's just there's a lot there's a

lot of cool um that comes from it.

There's a lot of like and to be

transparent, one of the reasons why the

capex is actually so low because that

capex for those switches is like almost

all of it.

>> Okay,

>> there's very little outside of that.

Like genuinely very little.

>> All right, that's good.

>> Um and the reason for that is cuz we

just have a lot of stuff,

>> right? Oh, that's what Thomas was doing.

>> Probably.

>> I saw him dumpster diving and just like

he had just like every server from the

warehouse and he was like going through

them.

>> We're trying to make stuff happen,

Brett.

>> Ah, [groaning]

I like it. I like it.

>> The inside of the rack is already

isolated because of physical access,

right? Okay. So, that makes sense. So,

you have to be able to go there.

>> Yeah. And because it's a colo center, so

you have to be able to go there to

service your own stuff,

>> but not all of them necessarily have

like complete like blanket coverage.

>> Yeah. So, we just got to we just got to

make sure. We just got to make sure

>> it it Yeah, it might even I I'm just I'm

not Yeah, I'm not sure what the

situation necessarily is, but it's it's

the whole thing is very interesting. Um,

so yeah, again, a lot of the big bulk

storage would still be over in OVH in

Quebec cuz that pricing is expected to

not go up as much. And buying 10

trillion hard drives right now sounds

terrible. Uh,

>> it really does.

>> So, we'll just keep doing that. That

also kind of helps because my 321 backup

brain goes, "Wait a second.

>> Earthquake."

>> Yeah. So,

>> we live on a major fault line and

>> that is way overdue.

>> My entire life. Yeah,

>> I've been told the big one's coming.

[laughter]

>> Not here yet.

>> Any minute now. The big one's coming.

I'm like, all right.

>> And as far as our understanding goes,

the big one here, if it does happen,

will be

>> the longer it goes, the more

pressure there is, apparently. I don't

know. I'm not a geologist.

>> Yeah, I don't know either.

>> I don't know how fault lines work,

>> but apparently this one's going to be

very brutal.

>> Yeah, there you go. Nice. Both of us.

Um, so yeah, the data would still be

kept over there. Yeah.

>> Um, the compute stuff, Jonathan's done

some just insanely attractive things

with Kubernetes. So like if it did all

blow up, you could spin it up somewhere

else really quickly. Um, so we're not

super worried about that part. Um, so

>> all right. Yeah,

>> good luck everybody.

>> Yeah, cuz I know there was there was a

question of like we moved uh we moved

some things I'm going to be slightly

vague. I think you know about this onto

float plane infrastructure recently

which saved like 17 grand a year and

then there was some questions that came

up with when I've been kind of talking

around about this project internally

where people were like well what

>> what's happening with that cuz you like

just talked about that it's like well

that's still happening and literally

where it was still happening like we're

not even moving that part.

>> Yeah

>> we're moving a lot of the compute and

everything. Um,

>> do we need to look at like uh what is

it? Next cloud.

>> Like we've had all these conversations

about like teams and

>> Oh, I was like, how would that help us

with this? [laughter] Okay, other

things.

>> I'm just talking self-hosting in

general.

>> Uh,

>> is it is it time?

[snorts]

>> It's time to consider some of it. Um, I

know like you and I have talked about

Okay, so we have we have Slack for some

of the labs people and all of the flow

plane people. We have Google Workspace

for everyone.

>> Yeah.

>> And we have

>> Teams for

>> Office 365 for like everyone minus

maybe a couple.

>> Yeah,

>> it's basically everybody.

>> Um,

do we do we consolidate these services?

It's gonna

>> or do we get rid of all of them?

>> Feel like ripping my own heart out, but

we're almost certainly going to get rid

of Slack.

>> So, that's that's one that's just going

to go. It's way too expensive per user.

I love it compared to Teams. Teams is a

rotten pile of poo. U I was in a meeting

earlier today and I really needed to

look something up that was in Teams

messages and they just wouldn't load.

It's like cool, nice. Um Discord would

have loaded just fine. I wish Discord

had a corporate edition, but they don't.

Um,

I know one of the opponents to leaving

Office 365 because I've brought up like

how painful would it be to lose Google

Drive and you amongst many others

including myself have been like that's

not really an option.

>> Um,

so the easier one for me would be

Microsoft. One of the opponents to

losing Office 365 is infra because

the like authentication stuff,

>> yeah,

>> is

>> single sign on, baby.

>> Is more ubiquitous. It's not necessarily

better. I think it's worse, but it's

more ubiquitous on the Microsoft side.

>> Yeah.

>> So, it's like

>> Jonathan did pipe up in here. I don't

know if you noticed him in float plane

chat. He says, "We have Nexcloud with

high performance backend running in

Kubernetes with custom Helmchart." Yeah,

that was a project we did internally to

try to validate if we can use it.

>> Oh, okay. And

>> not for everything.

>> Maybe for some stuff though.

>> I know they're moving pretty quick and

they are like

>> they do seem to be moving pretty quick.

>> They are,

no offense you guys, but kind of overly

attached girlfriend about working with

us, too. [laughter] Like they email me

probably once every quarter or so going,

"Hey."

>> The second you mentioned them on the

show, I was like, "There's an email.

[laughter]

It's like, "All right, incoming." Uh, we

have not forgotten about you. I'll say

that much.

>> Yeah, we're we're aware and they do seem

to be moving pretty fast.

>> I think they're moving fast. And I get

the feeling that if we were to move on

to them,

it would be a benefit to them having an

organization like us give feedback to

help guide bug fixes and and short-term,

you know, fires that need to be put out.

I suspect they would be very motivated

to do that, I guess, is where I'm I

think there'd be a bit of a give and

take there. Yeah, there's there's so not

to be mean xcloud I think it's a really

fantastic project. Uh VDKA in full chat

said too bad nextcloud breaks their own

stuff every other update. My notes app

has been dead for weeks because of a

right lock bug they have not fixed

Google Drive is going to work.

>> Yeah,

>> like pretty much no matter what. And

like I I I trash on cloud stuff all the

time. This topic is technically us

trashing on cloud stuff because of the

uh wherever it went.

>> Okay,

>> station losing their data.

>> Fun fact. Okay, this is me trying to

open a Google doc earlier today.

>> Can't open this document. Sorry. Google

Docs is the reli the reliability of

Google services

>> has been moving the wrong direction for

me for 10 years.

>> Yeah. No, I agree. And do you know how I

fixed this?

>> Search is also useless now. Yeah.

>> Want to know how I fixed it? Watch this.

It's the stupidest fix ever.

>> I already see where it's going.

>> Make a copy.

>> Yep.

>> I made a copy

>> and then the copy's readable

>> and immediately it opened.

>> Yep.

>> Unfucking believable.

>> I also have issues where I can't

freaking find anything in Google Drive.

Um like very often it's an issue. I

think the search is really bad now.

search for Google in general has just

gone down the hole, which is wild. It's

weird to even say that. But search on

everything for them. Man, the fact that

I've been finding it easier to find

certain YouTube videos by googling it

than searching it on YouTube is

mind-blowing.

>> Ivonne did that the other day. I was

like, why aren't you searching on

YouTube? And she's like, this just works

better and she found it immediately.

>> Does Yeah, it like actually does.

>> And that's with Google search degrading

the way that it has.

>> Yeah, which is just wild. The whole

thing is just very confusing. Um,

so I don't know. It's it's an

evaluation. We've been honestly a little

bit brains sniped by this collocation

thing. Um, because there are renewal

dates upcoming.

>> Oh,

>> that are like very important.

So, we're trying to move fast,

>> right? Is one of them related to the

email chain that AJ and I were in? I

see.

>> But there's like a bunch of them.

>> I understand.

>> Yeah. Um, so like

>> and getting it all aligned so that

you're not paying for your expensive

off-rem stuff at the same time as your

capex on your onrem or like colloccated

stuff

>> and there's like shipping times,

>> right,

>> and things that we need to be taking.

>> And availability of anything with an IC

in it these days is not to be taken for

granted.

>> Uh-huh. So it's tough. It's uh

>> I think that's a habit you picked up

from me. what they so it's tough.

>> I say that all the time. Every once in a

while [laughter] you hang out with

someone for long enough that you you

just you pick up mannerisms from each

other. I I have lucisms too that drive

me nuts because [laughter]

I'll say them and I'll be like I can

hear I can almost hear it in your voice.

>> You you combing some things with bricks

or what?

>> No, the ones that make sense. Um,

[laughter]

man, I can't even think of it off the

top of my head, but they'll just pop out

of my mouth and I'm just like, "Oh, I

picked that up from that freaking guy."

Drive me crazy.

>> I wonder how many people like actually

even know actually where that reference

is from anymore.

>> Comb with a brick. It was a W show a

thousand years ago.

>> It was a W show in the garage.

>> Yeah, something like that.

>> Yeah. [snorts]

Um,

yeah, it's tough. Oh, yeah. There it is

again. Um, now I'm not going to be able

to say [laughter] that without thinking

about that.

>> Uh, but it's this and this is happening

to be clear. Like we've got some really

exciting things going on. It's

terrifying for short-term checkbooks,

really exciting for long-term

checkbooks. This would save us money

even if the price increases weren't

coming.

>> Noki's got it.

>> Exciting.

>> I say that's wild. That's all 100%

Lucasm that I picked up. [laughter]

>> Yeah. Thank you, Noki. Yeah, you nailed

it. cuz I never said that before in my

life.

>> That's interesting.

>> And I picked it up from him 100%.

[laughter]

>> Uh but yeah, this is this is happening

to everyone. Um don't get it twisted. We

are not the only ones going through this

problem.

>> No. And and that's part of the problem

is that it's happening to everybody

right now.

>> Yeah.

>> This is not isolated. It's like

industrywide. This is macro forces that

are just making their way in unexpected

ways um into the daily lives of just

like randos running YouTube channels.

>> Speaking of unexpected ways, I I think

I've talked to you about this before,

but like I met the guy a while back. I

don't know if I don't think he still

does this anymore, but I met the guy a

while back who runs like he was the CTO

of I think it was Kroger International.

>> Yeah. All right. Turns out they have

like massive amounts of like servers and

stuff.

>> Kroger like the paper company.

>> No, the grocery chain.

>> Oh, that one. Sorry. Sorry. Which one's

Oh, is there

>> But this Sorry.

>> I was thinking about this earlier today

where like I'm looking at this and

talking about how it's all cyclical or

not cyclical. It's all uh circular. Oh,

Krueger, correct?

>> Krueger is a paper company. No, no,

you're right.

>> Oh, okay. Okay. Um

where like you know [gasps]

all these other things are making other

costs go up which make other costs go up

and all cascades. That's the word I'm

looking for. Um,

you're like bananas

are going to cost more because of AI

cuz companies have to recoup their

costs.

>> That's bananas.

>> I'm going to go with that now instead of

that's wild. That'll be my own

[laughter] thing.

>> If if they have crazy costs going up

because of

uh, you know, hardware increases. If

they have costs going up because, hey,

their password manager just is going up

20%. If they have costs going up because

of etc, etc., etc. that are cascading

all over the place. If their machines

for automated checkout need to go up in

price, if they're etc., it's all going

to cascade down onto costs, which are

going to cascade on down onto you, which

is going to make your bananas or

whatever else you're buying potentially

cost more. So, it's it's impacting like

everything. And obviously different

companies are going to get impacted to

different degrees. For some companies

it's going to make effectively no

difference. For other companies it's

going to make a very large difference.

For flow plane for instance this is like

oh god [laughter]

really bad terrifying solve the problem

now uh type situation for other

companies would be less impactful.

>> Um so

noi found it using filot.

You ready Dan?

>> No.

>> Nope. Wait, the wall was white.

>> So the wall

>> is that the

>> tech link?

>> Uh, no. No, this is um this is at the

Langley house, I believe.

>> Yeah, but you had a Oh, not Tech Link.

Sorry, Tech.

>> This was with the boxes piled up, but

sometimes they all fell down. [laughter]

>> So, we just had product boxes behind us

as a as a set.

>> I just I thought the bench area had

pegboard in it really fast.

>> Uh, no, that was in the garage. This is

at the Langley house. This isn't in the

bench den. This is in the bedroom.

>> Yeah.

>> Weird. I I had remembered this being in

the garage. Okay.

>> Scrutiny. That thing.

>> Oh, I can't hear. Am I supposed to be

able to hear

>> will be combed with like a brick?

>> That's when you're just [clears throat]

moving into the house. Okay.

>> Yeah. I guess we weren't

>> They'll be able to

Oh, all right. Well, you just said

scrutiny. That thing.

>> Hey, look. After party link. It was a

separate

>> people. Was it on the same channel?

>> What does that mean?

>> Like everything will be looked at.

>> It comes with a brick.

>> Yeah. [laughter]

>> Your face.

>> I can tell when I said it. [laughter]

>> [laughter]

>> I've never gone back and watched that.

We've just [laughter] had this reference

for years.

>> That is That is the most

What did you just say that I think I've

ever

[laughter]

>> Oh man, that was pretty good. [laughter]

I couldn't even hear it. That was pretty

good. [gasps]

>> 13 years ago.

>> Yeah.

>> Oh, dude. We're so old. especially me.

Speaking of which, we should probably do

a new topic. I got myself a birthday

present.

>> Yeah.

>> Not on purpose, mind you. I ordered it a

year ago. These guys apparently build

these things to order.

>> Oh.

>> And in spite of the fact that they're

seem like a decentsized company and have

been around for quite a while, they make

um tennis training machines. So, you

know those ones that just like lob balls

over the net and you can return them?

They do them for soccer. Apparently,

that's a thing. You just load it up with

like

>> soccer balls and it just kicks them at

you or something. Uh, volleyball,

squash, table tennis, uh, reaction

lights, paddle, pickle ball. They have a

pickle ball training feeder thing. Well,

guess what? They also make badminton

feeding machines. This was a

recommendation from that uh English pair

that came over for a couple of collabs.

And apparently the German national team

uses

uh I believe it is

this guy right here, the 8025A.

Can this go away please? Badminton. Oh

my god. Websites are unusable. Okay,

there we go. [laughter]

8A hardcore quality

intelligent equipment. Uh, this arrived

today.

>> Have you used it? Did you use it?

>> I tried it today. I So, I'm going to

talk about this in a little bit more

detail at the all hands on Monday, but

there's going to be a bit of a content

pivot on LT.

>> Oh, okay. LTT is going to become

>> a little bit less of like,

>> okay, this is the type of video that

goes on the Linus Tech Tips channel

versus this is the type of video that

goes on Techquicki or on Short Circuit

or on wherever whatever other channels.

And LTT is going to be way more just

what I want to make a video about.

So, sometimes it'll be an unboxing,

sometimes it might be a review,

sometimes it might just be like I'm

building a weird AI server in my

basement. Um, and I feel like it's been

a long time coming.

>> I think this is great, especially right

now. I think this kind of has made sense

for a long time. I also think this

especially makes sense right now because

I don't know. I I I had a this chat

quite a few times at

>> He changed it. I [laughter] tried to

press I don't know.

>> That's wild.

[laughter]

>> What does mine say, dude? [laughter]

>> He changed it. THAT'S WHY

[laughter]

this uh this paid dividends.

>> Oh man, little text buttons.

>> That was [laughter] that was pretty

good.

>> All right.

>> Uh man, what was I even saying? Oh,

right. At open source, we had a bunch of

conversations with people about like

>> what do you even do now? Like I I make

content in a field that the field is

toxic right now.

>> Yeah.

>> Like it just sucks. No one wants to be

looking at this stuff right now.

Computer hardware is way too expensive.

Even if you can still afford to buy it,

it's really painful, man.

>> And it just sucks. And it just feels

bad.

>> The whole thing.

>> And sometimes And sometimes you can find

deals.

>> Y

>> and people don't want to hear that

either because the deal is not as good

as it was

>> and 10 months ago,

>> they might not be able to find one

because it I mean I found one. It took

me months.

>> Yep.

>> Like this is it's not super reasonable.

What if your timeline had to be shorter?

Like, it's it's it's just kind of icky

right now. But it's not like when that

viewership floats away that nerds who

like nerdy techy things are just gone.

>> No. If anything, I feel like they're

hungry for something to engage with.

>> And we have seen that in some cases

where there's like tech creators that

aren't making stuff that's super

centralized around like performance

computer hardware. Y

>> that are actually doing better than they

were.

>> I mean,

>> but most like effectively everybody

that's in the computer hardware tech

creator space thing is going down, but

people that are close to it are going

up, which is just very interesting.

>> I mean, even looking at the kind of

stuff that

>> dude, you buying a printer

>> is successful on our channel.

>> Dang.

>> I mean, just replacing a battery with my

daughter almost a million views. That's

the kind of cont

meat on this bone. I don't know if

there's enough learnables. But then I

was just like, "No, my daughter's phone

is broken and this is an opportunity for

her to do something she's never done

before. And there's a whole new

generation of viewers that is just like

her and hasn't seen me replace a battery

before. Why are we afraid to do this?

>> It's also not as normal now. That's this

is

>> which makes it interesting.

>> And she had a blast. Actually, you know

what's really kind of funny, but also

she like was almost in tears about it is

on uh on last Friday uh no not last

Friday, earlier this week um my other

daughter broke that phone, [sighs]

dropped it and the screen shattered.

>> It's kind of Yeah, you're right. It's

kind of funny, but it's also really sad.

timing. The timing blows.

>> She just fixed it.

>> So, Cat just fixed it. She just had this

like honestly kind of fun experience of

like she's invested in it and she has

like more of an emotional attachment to

it. It's something we did together and

I'm looking at it going, "Okay, well,

like now what path do we take?" Because

[laughter] it's already a six or

sevenyear-old phone or something like

that. And I like was barely even wanting

to buy a new battery for it, let alone a

new screen, which is a way more invasive

replacement.

I'm like, uh, and more expensive than

the battery. Do we just do I just get

her a new phone now? It's pretty close

to her birthday. Also, it would put her

on the same cycle as the other two kids

who both just got new phones. Like

there's a lot of reasons, but then part

of me is just like, "No, but we should

just we should just Frankenstein's

monster phones it and we should just I

don't know which which way would you

go?" She needs a stylus. Not needs, but

she loves the stylus. So, that really

limits my options.

>> Even cool that she likes the stylus,

too. I would almost see that as a

benefit. What new phones have a stylus?

>> Very few. like the top end um the top

end S series phones do, but they're

huge. Whereas the Note 10, not the Plus,

the Note 10 was a very reasonable size

for a kid stillish.

Like I meant I miss reasonable sized

phones.

>> Yeah.

>> What the heck?

>> Is there a route? Oh man, this stuff is

so complicated cuz it's like how how

does the kid respond to it? So, I was

going to say like this is this is more

expense. Sorry. By the way, $65,000 in

switches. Uh but uh what if you got her

to replace the screen and as a reward

for replacing the screen?

>> Then she can sell the phone and we'll

get her new one. [clears throat]

>> She gets the nice new one.

>> Yeah. Or something like that. I I could

see us doing that. Um yeah, I'll I'll

think about it. How

>> because like I don't know how much that

phone's worth, but I think

Just the process of if if she enjoyed

the previous one, showing her that there

can be a reward in fixing things I think

is is cool. Does that make sense? Even

[clears throat] if it's not fixing it

for you.

>> Dan's in chat. You know, you you're

right here, Dan. He says, "Make the one

who broke it fix it."

>> Yeah. Why not? Why not?

>> She's still a little young for that

delicate of an operation.

>> I don't think so. The phone's already

broken.

>> Yeah. And the stakes are lower this time

because

>> absolutely

>> of what happened last time. I did set up

backup on it. So at least

>> we're not like

don't break this thing.

>> I started when I was like three and I

turned out normal.

[laughter]

>> So

>> I'm excited for that project next

weekend.

>> Me too. [laughter]

>> See make her fix that screen.

Do it.

>> What?

>> I'll think about it. I'll think about

it.

>> Yeah. [clears throat]

>> I think fixing the screen like if if you

know I think you did this with 3D

printing. You you sowed an interest.

She

displayed some interest in Thank you. Uh

in replacing the battery.

>> Do you just kind of keep that going?

It's 80 bucks. Kind of sucks. Maybe you

can recover some of that cost reselling

the phone. I really don't expect a

seven-year-old phone to

>> Worth a couple hundred bucks still.

>> Really?

>> It's It's Well, it's kind of a unique

phone.

>> I would definitely do it then.

>> Yeah. And it has a fresh battery

>> whether you keep it or not.

>> I would I would replace the screen.

>> Brand new screen, brand new battery

version of that phone. It's probably

worth an okay amount.

>> Yeah, it's probably worth something.

>> Yeah.

>> Um anyway,

>> video [clears throat]

uh video coming soon on the the

badminton machine 8025. Here's a much

worse version of it, but it just kind of

craps shuttles at you and then you hit

them. It's pretty cool

and it works surprisingly well.

>> Be rentable at the bon.

>> I don't know exactly what to do with it.

I mostly got it because I always wanted

one and I thought it would be super

cool, but I wasn't sure what to do with

it. It could be interesting as like a

nighttime rentable thing because during

prime hours, I'm assuming you want more

more

feet on courts.

>> Yeah, I was say butts and seats, but not

in this case. You want feet on courts.

Um, but maybe at night time when you

have like idle empty courts,

>> you could rent out the the practice

machine.

>> Yeah, I could see that. I mean,

depending on how much people are paying

to rent the machine because it would

have to have a pretty considerable cost.

Yeah,

>> cuz we have to like set it up and tear

it down

>> for you presumably. So, I would assume

it would be like a hundred bucks an hour

or something like that.

>> I have no idea.

>> And it's it's like a it's like a

>> it's going to have to be not that cheap.

>> Yeah, it can't it can't be super super

cheap.

>> Maybe it could be a program thing where

you get like you buy like a bundle of

sessions with it or something. I could

see something like that

>> because I could see someone potentially

pairing that with um a training program.

Uh, Magi 1999 says that's too steep. Do

you have any idea how much a coach to

sit and feed you shuttles costs? Like

it's So, first of all, we're talking

Canadian dollars, so that's something.

Um, but like coaches are over $100 an

hour for the ones with like a good

reputation these days. And from the

limited time that I've spent with it so

far, the feeding quality is super

consistent. How how long does it take to

set up and take down?

>> It's pretty quick.

>> How much is the cost of the thing?

>> Uh it was like eight or nine grand. Like

if you're if you're renting, you go to

like um like uh like United You go to

United Rentals or something. You rent a

paint sprayer,

>> right? You're talking like a $700

uh or actually they're a little more

than that these days. I think they're

like probably closer to a,000 plus. Like

you rent like a $1,000 paint sprayer,

it'll easily cost you like a hundred

plus dollars a day easily. Like the

economics around renting stuff are kind

of crazy to me. That's why we bought all

the tables and chairs for whale land.

>> Yeah.

>> Because by the time we ran I think it

was like three lands. We could literally

afford to just buy all of our own tables

and chairs.

>> I think like like Okay. So how much is a

coach an hour? You said a little over

100. So it's like 115

>> up to like 150 160.

>> Okay.

>> Like for the for the really good ones.

Now, obviously, a machine like this is

not giving you feedback on your form, so

there's a trade-off there, but it also

is able to feed super consistently. You

will get in more reps with this. So,

horses for courses, uh, I could see it I

could see it being I could see it being

a little lower. Um,

>> I mean, I have no

horse in this race.

>> And also, uh, the shuttles, so you can't

just I don't think you can just put

garbage shuttles in it. And we today we

stacked $2,000 Canadian worth of

shuttles in it. [snorts]

So there's a cost there because they're

hitting them, right? They will wear.

>> Okay. So it includes the the shuttle

cost.

>> I could see that

>> if you want to soften that blow.

>> Yeah.

>> But keep it the same price. I think you

lower the cost of the machine but make

someone buy effectively new shuttles

with it because you don't want bad

shuttles going through it because it'll

hurt the machine. I I think people would

put bad shuttles in it if you don't

include them. So, I think it's better to

have a combined rate and we just control

the quality of of the projectiles.

>> You take your shuttles home at the end

of the day when you're done playing with

the machine.

>> Um, no one's going to be able to do that

kind of an upfront. Yeah, I'm going to

buy two grand worth of shuttles to put

in it. So, it would have to be provided.

>> No, no. I'm saying that's like part of

the benefit.

>> You take them home.

>> Yeah.

>> No, you wouldn't. So they would go back

in the machine because they can they can

be reused for quite a while, but it

would include the wear and tear on them

that you that you go through in your

session kind of thing. I could

>> How do you So So okay, because there's

$2,000 worth of shuttles, whatever.

They're never reloading as a you as a

user.

>> Uh they might have to, but they'd have

So they have Do you have to It's And

that's like the worst part of Admonton

training is picking up all the stupid

shuttles and

>> Yeah. I was thinking because like if I

this might be a sketchy part of renting

it out

>> is what if somebody loads a bad shuttle.

>> Yeah. Then I I think it shouldn't just

like be destroyed by a slightly worn out

one. Like it's not that big of a deal.

>> Okay.

>> And the all the hoppers are clear so you

could see what's in it.

>> Got it.

>> So if there's like crap in it then you

could just I don't know if the

butttheads put the thing in. You just

put a new one in.

>> Anyway, so I've got a video coming on

that. It was pretty exciting. I

co-hosted it with my son. That's another

thing that I think you guys are going to

see more of is just like

>> this is something that, you know, me and

the family are interested in. So, we're

just going to like make a video about

it.

>> Are we doing the thing that I uh

>> what I retire and I'm replaced by my

children? Is that what you want? Fine.

Fine. You know what? No. Fine. No, I'll

quit. I'll quit right now.

>> Okay, I'm back.

>> This What is this?

>> Uh,

yeah. I don't see why not. Can I should

I bring that up?

>> Sure. Yeah. Let's talk Let's talk about

it.

>> Uh my something that I've been talking

to Lionus about doing is my my dad's

system. So my dad

>> It's a crazy build.

>> It's so wicked. Uh my dad is a plumber

by trade. He's a plumbing instructor

now. And he built this case out of

copper pipe. Uh like fairly big copper

pipe. Uh whole frame all the way around.

If you've been to Whaleand, you might

have seen it. He's brought it a couple

times. Um, he wants to use the case

itself as a radiator with an emergency

out for like particularly hot summer

days where he can connect it to an

external rad just in case, but normally

it should be fine. He did a bunch of

math on it. He was working with Rod on

it. Uh, Rod said it's such a cool case,

which to me just means that it's a fact.

Um, I So yeah, we're going to do I don't

think I've even mentioned this to Rod,

but uh here we go. Oh, that's one of the

reasons why I wanted to mention it now

is cuz I knew Rod was in chat. Uh, so

we're going to try to do that on the

channel. Uh, which I think like a couple

years ago when the idea first came up,

it didn't make as much sense for the

channel, but with the new vibe that

you're talking about, it like suddenly

makes a lot of sense for the channel.

>> I think so, too.

>> Um, so there's some plans. I have yet to

ask for it, but we've been thinking that

like, oh man, it's such a perfect board

for this. I hope they say yes. Uh, what

is it? The Asus 20,

>> the anniversary one. It's so per It's so

expensive. It's so perfect for it. Oh

man,

>> it's upstairs.

>> It's so perfect for it.

>> Should I go get it?

>> Sure.

>> I think I know where exactly where it

is. Maybe just do a do a quick check out

message while I'm gone.

>> Impossibly perfect for this build. He's

going to grab it. But there's a bunch of

copper accents on it. Uh the heat sinks

are are like kind of exposed copper heat

sinks and it has a back plate on the

motherboard which is just this like huge

copper back plate inside of

>> You don't have to describe it.

>> He's going to go get it. Yeah. Uh,

inside of a case that is all copper

tubes. It's going to be freaking sick.

I'm very excited about it. Rod's going

to theoretically come up and and help us

build it. So, it'll be myself, my dad,

and Rod. Uh, Rod, Rob, and Luke. Uh, and

we're going to Yeah, we're going to

build away and have fun. And it should

be should be really cool. Sorry. What

were we going to do? What did you want

me to do?

>> Maybe a com.

>> Sure. Do you have one?

>> Yeah, I got one for you. Uh, if chicken

was suddenly outlawed, what would you

eat for protein?

Uh, if chicken was suddenly outlawed,