This is Bloomberg Businessweek daily reporting from the magazine that helps

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from in New York. I'm Tim Stanton, along with Norah

Melinda. She's in for Carol Massar.

Norah is a Bloomberg TV markets correspondent, and she is here for a

couple of days. Carol is off this week.

Norah, it's good to have you. Happy to be here on this Monday as we

kick off a crazy week. It's Monday right?

It is Monday. This week we got Jackson Hole.

On Friday we got Nvidia earnings before that.

Uh, and our focus this hour is really on economic day for Iran Treasury Secretary

Scott Benson's plan to isolate Iran from the global economy.

We're gonna have a great roundtable in just a few minutes also.

Wall Street kicking off the week on a cautious note.

We're seeing a rout in chipmakers. The stock's down close to 3%.

There's a decline in oil as the traders are parsing what we just heard from the

Treasury secretary. We're gonna have more on that from

Charlie in just a minute. I mentioned the concept of, quote,

economic asphyxiation. Those are the words of the Treasury

Secretary. He described that announcement of a

fresh set of economic measures to punish Iran.

We're going to have a roundtable with IRA Jersey, Mike McKee.

Nancy Cook joining us in just a few minutes.

Also, a little later this hour, we're talking nuclear.

We're going to be joined by Chris Levesque, the CEO of Terra Power, on

their plans to build a nuclear reactor in this country just in the next couple

of years. The big question.

Who is the customer? And then also, what is going on in

Canada? Our correspondent up there joins us in

just a few minutes. All that and more coming up over the

next hour right here on Bloomberg Businessweek daily.

First up, though, a check of the day's trade and top business stories.

Here he is Charlie Powell. All right I think it very much Tim.

And we have got the Dow higher the S&P Nasdaq.

They are both declining right now. Wall Street kicking off the week on a

downward a rout in chipmakers outweighing an oil decline.

And in the meantime we do have traders sifting through those comments.

You heard live on Bloomberg Television and Radio from Treasury Secretary Scott

Benson, his plan to isolate Iran from the global economy.

That's into announcing an American campaign to sever Iran, warning that any

country doing business with Iran will face U.S.

sanctions. S&P right now down 20, we're at 7653 a

drop now of 3/10 of 1%. Dow up 80.

That is a gain of one tenth of 1%. Nasdaq the composite index down 6/10 of

1%. The Nasdaq 100 index down 8/10 of 1%.

Tough day for a lot of semiconductor names.

The SoCs, the Philadelphia Semiconductor Stock Exchanges Index down now by 2.7%.

The VIX holding below 16, the two year 4.22%, the ten year 4.69% and the 30

year 5.22%. Gold, meanwhile, up 7/10 of 1% 4637 the

ounce. West Texas Intermediate crude 8480 A

barrel, down 2.6%. Brent, the global benchmark, 9193, down

2.6%. And right now we've got Bitcoin up 1.9%

78,878 on Bitcoin. So again recapping here economic day.

S&P down 3/10 of 1%. Right now we've got the S&P trading of

76 of 54. For On-Demand news 24 hours a day

subscribe to Bloomberg News Now wherever you get your podcasts.

Tim and Norah that is on Bloomberg Business Flash.

Hey Charlie, thank you for that update. I want to pick up right where Charlie

left off. And that's the latest from Treasury

Secretary Scott Bassett. He announced what he called a, quote,

unprecedented US campaign to sever Iran from the global economy, warning that

any country doing business with Iran risks facing U.S.

sanctions. Quote, we are launching an economic

onslaught against Iran's financial connections around the globe, the

treasury secretary said at a press conference in Washington.

Here's a little more of what he had to say.

Every country, every entity should know that they should be prepared to face

U.S. sanctions.

And they know no one is above this. Uh, we are going to hold everyone

accountable. And this is fixing the economic

asphyxiation of this regime. And, Jennifer, as I said, no one should

test our resolve. That was the Treasury secretary just in

the last hour. Live from or from Washington at a press

conference. I promise this will be the focus, the

first part of our program. And indeed, that's what we're doing with

just a fantastic roundtable joining us from pretty much all over.

We've got IRA, Jersey, Bloomberg Intelligence, chief, US interest rates

strategist Mike McKee is Bloomberg TV and Radio International economics and

policy correspondent and Nancy Cook, Bloomberg News senior national political

correspondent. Nancy's in Washington, Iris at Bloomberg

Intelligence headquarters in Princeton. Mike's out there in Wyoming getting

ready for the Jacksonville economic Symposium this week.

Nancy, I want to start with you, because Iran has had sanctions on it for close

to 50 years. How is this economic onslaught going to

be any different than the sanctions that it's faced?

Well, what was interesting to me was just the timing of this announcement.

You know, Secretary Benson is making this announcement with about 70 days to

go till the midterms. Uh, the Trump administration, I think,

privately is pretty worried about its economic agenda and the drag that the

economy, that the drag that the war in Iran is causing on the economy.

So I think that they're looking for ways to be proactive and show that they're

trying to bring gas prices down and sort of make the economic conditions more

favorable to voters. And that's why I think you're seeing the

Treasury Secretary talk about sanctions today, even though we're still looking

for a lot of details about what exactly those will look like.

So we're awaiting some of those details. Hopefully we'll get those details in the

coming days. Mike McKee, I want to bring you in here

and sort of ask you a question that follows with what Nancy just said, and

it was also one that was shouted at the at the Treasury Secretary as he left.

Why? Why these sanctions now and not six

months ago? Nancy spoke to the politics of this, but

is it also, in your view, uh, indication that the military part of the war didn't

necessarily worker is not working? Well, in militarily part of the war work

to an extent, but it hasn't brought Iran to the table.

And so at this point, they don't have very many options to go on from here to

try to get this straight open and oil flowing again.

This is one of the few that they have that might not lead to military

activity, although my guess is that the Iranians would respond militarily to any

serious, uh, impact on their economy. Uh, the other question that stood out

was, uh, Scott Benson asking. Why would I want to blow up the global

economy? Uh.

Good question. And, uh, there is a chance that

something like that could happen if they sanction all the people who are

cooperating in one way or another behind the scenes with Iran, because you have

the Chinese, a huge participant in trade with Iran.

Behind the scenes, you have India, and you have many other countries that are

allowing, uh, trade to go one way or another, uh, behind the scenes with

Iran. And so, uh, there is a the potential for

a huge impact on Iran and the global economy.

But we didn't get enough detail from Scott Besson today to know whether they

really mean it, whether they'll go ahead with it, uh, and what it would take for

a country to end up in violation. And, IRA, I want to go to you because

there's been a lot of focus as of late on the bond market.

And of course today we do see yields falling.

But that doesn't really take into account all the whiplash that we saw

last week. So talk to me about what you're seeing

right now in the bond market and whether or not there's any conviction behind

today's move. Yeah, I think today's move is just a

little bit of bottom fishing here. Uh, you know, particularly before maybe

we'll get another announcement from Scott Benson later this week because he

did mention that there'd be some, uh, some type of details as far as, uh, the

size of the buybacks that were announced last week.

And, um, so there's a little bit of, I think of, um, you know, kind of follow

through on that. Now, I don't think it will be sustained

when at the end of the day, the, uh, you really need a huge number of, uh, and

amount of buybacks in order to really change the trend, uh, of the, uh, of the

bond market, because ultimately, fundamentals are going to rule.

And fundamentals right now suggests that we should probably be somewhere near 5%

for 30 year bond yield, just where the economy and inflation are.

I, I expected more from from him on the bond market, or at least more questions

on the bond market. Given what we saw last week.

He did sidestep that question that you referenced, and he just said that

auction sizes would be announced at the next quarterly refunding announcement.

But do you actually think that we'll hear from him later this week on this,

rather than waiting for the next quarterly announcement?

Well, he did say last week that we would have more information this week.

But remember, the way that the buybacks work is on or about the ninth day day of

every month, they come out with the statement for what they're going to do

for the next month. And so we're kind of in the middle of

that cycle right now. That's why the buybacks that were

announced last week, they go into effect coming September 9th.

But that's when they start. Right.

So they'll make an announcement on or about you know, sometime before then.

And then the first buyback will be, you know, the 10th or 11th or 12th,

something like that. Uh, you know, maybe they'll wait until

right after the 30 year auction in September, um, in order to buy back some

of the, uh, some of the off the run bonds, which is what they're doing in

the, uh, in this buyback program. Nancy, I want to bring you back into the

conversation. Bond yields aren't typically something

that we're talking about when we think about voters.

But what does this tell you about the fact that now we're seeing this in

mainstream news, and you're seeing voters actually starting to care about

the bond market dropping that? Well, I think it just shows the extent

to which the economy is on voters minds. And this election, I think a lot of

people, uh, voted for Trump for a second term because they were attracted to the

idea of him as a businessman turned politician.

People were very dissatisfied with President Biden's handling of the

economy and inflation, and I think that they wanted someone who they thought

would put the focus more on the economy. Um, you know, I talk to Republican

voters all the time and all of these, uh, you know, primary states that are

having midterm elections in November. And there's a real sense that Trump has

taken his eyes off the economy for all these other priorities.

Be it the war in Iran or redecorating the white House.

You know, there's just a lot of things that are consuming his attention,

whereas I think a lot of his MAGA base really assume that if he got back into

power, he would be a huge steward of the economy and voters.

Even Republicans feel like that hasn't necessarily been the case.

Well, might I actually want to talk to you?

There's been so much focus on the economy as of late.

We do have, uh, Kevin Warsh expected to speak at Jackson Hole on Friday.

Talk to me. What do you think that warsh, uh, does

he actually need to address what's going on with the Treasury on Friday?

Is that something that you anticipate him actually mentioning and calling them

out directly? I know I don't think he will go anywhere

near that right now. Uh, particularly when you see what Scott

Bassett did today in not laying anything out.

I'm sure the two of them have talked, uh,

to each other privately about, uh, this situation, but it wouldn't do, uh, warsh

any good to talk about it at the, uh, Jackson Hole symposium.

He's got enough problems with credibility with the markets these days

and their belief in whether he's serious enough about bringing down inflation.

And I think he'll focus on that. And it's a tight rope enough for him to

walk there because he doesn't want to give any forward guidance, and he's

tried to say as little as possible. Uh, it would be very interesting to hear

his view on this new Operation Twist from the Treasury, because it does make

the Fed's job a little bit more difficult.

And, uh, if they did, uh, start buying even more of 30 year treasuries, that

might force the Treasury, the fed into raising interest rates, uh, because a

lot of the fed officials have cast their votes against raising rates as because

the the economy is tight enough. Now, interest rates are high enough

right now. If they start going down too much, then

the fed would have to get involved. And of course, uh, Benson and Warsh have

talked about the idea of a new Treasury fed accord that this might be part of,

but it's too early for that really to come up here.

Okay. We'll have to wait and see if we get

anything on that. Mike, I want to stick with you and go

back to what we heard, uh, and where we began the conversation with Nancy and

this this being political and this being the plan to sever Iran's access to the

to the world economy. Nancy talked about this being, you know,

just ahead of midterm elections. Inflation is certainly top of mind for

voters. The question that I have is, is there

anything in terms of sanctions or at least choking, uh, you know, choking off

Iran from the world economy that that will bring prices down here in the US?

Like, is that going to make gas cheaper? Is that going to make beef prices

cheaper? No, it wouldn't appear that that would

be the case because, uh, obviously if you shut off all oil going through,

including the illicit dark oil, it transits to China and India, then oil

prices are going to go up. And that's not going to play well with

the American people. And there are a lot of other products

that have been stuck in the Gulf there that haven't gotten out, that are

already starting to cause problems on the horizon.

You're seeing more and more stories about how food prices may be going up

because of the lack of fertilizer, and because a lot of the, uh, the crops

can't get out of, uh, Ukraine, can't get out of the Middle East.

And so, uh, there's a lot in there that doesn't suggest it's going to help the

American consumer too much. Uh, I suppose the argument the president

is making is that people will care about whether Iran has a nuclear weapon, and I

think people do in the back of their minds.

But I don't think that's going to be front and center when they go into the

voting booth. Mhm.

And IRA, we've been continuing this conversation about affordability about

the economy. We know that both Goldman and Wells

Fargo are essentially saying don't expect these buybacks to actually bring

to bring down those long term rates. Uh substantially.

So talk to me about that. How are you taking away what are you

taking away from the fact of how the Treasury is anticipating orchestrating

these buybacks and the method that they're going about it?

Yeah, I mean, doing an operation twist. You know, the biggest thing that it's

going to do is help liquidity a little bit.

But and then really uh hurt volatility right.

So I think that one of the things that you know, any kind of buyback like this

does, and you saw the same thing during the quantitative easing period is it

really reduces like intraday volatility. And one of the reasons for that is you

know that if you're buying long term debt and you're a primary dealer, you're

going to have an outlet for at least a portion of that debt.

So it really helps balance sheets and helps liquidity.

And that was the whole point of starting these buybacks in the first place.

Uh, a little over a year ago. Um, so and I think that at some level

they've worked. I'm not sure that they're always

necessary, but but certainly to be regular and predictable, like Treasury

wants to be. Um, you know, you know, they'll continue

to do these types of, of little buybacks.

You know, will it, will it get interest rates lower?

Will it help like your, your 30 year mortgage rate, which is really based

more on the ten year? I don't think so.

And if it does it's five basis points or ten basis points.

Probably not much more than that. I agree with the, uh, my fellow

strategists when they say that I want to hear if you agree with Mike McKee

because Norah asked you about what this means for what we hear from the chairman

of the fed. Uh, come, come Friday in Jackson Hall.

I'm curious about intervention to bring down long term borrowing costs and how

it your view, it could complicate the messaging and at least the way that

market participants are interpreting the messaging on Friday.

That sorry, IRA. That was for you.

Oh. I'm sorry.

Um, yes, I know I said Mike's name, but it's

because Nora had Nora had talked to Mike a little bit about that.

So I want to hear what you had to say. Sure.

So. Yeah.

So. So I think Scott Bason is, you know,

he's already said at the last press conference he's going to talk about the

big questions and lay out some big questions.

So I doubt that he's going to talk much about the markets or really about the

future of policy, because like Mike said, he doesn't really want to, um, he

doesn't want to give forward guidance. Now, I think it is kind of odd because

he he put Mervyn King on the, uh, the communications task force that he has

and I, you know, Mervyn King has an interesting take on what the markets

want and something that central banks should give.

And that's what is the reaction function.

So, you know, if there's 4 or 5 different scenarios that are realistic,

that could be the outcome for the economy.

Where then would the uh what steps with the Federal Reserve take under each of

those scenarios? And I think that's something that would

really behoove Kevin Warsh maybe to say, look, we're looking into this.

We're looking how about how to communicate this?

I think the market participants would actually like that.

And, uh, yeah, because if you tell us that, then we can forecast, right?

If you don't tell us what your reaction function is, we're going to guess what

you're going to forecast. And that just creates volatility and

uncertainty. And that's not something that the

Federal Reserve wants. Nancy the focus really right now as we

head into the midterms is the voter, uh, on the voters and, uh, the Trump

administration. Tell me, do you think that the

administration, uh, risks voters actually hearing Treasury intervention

and thinking that something may be wrong?

There's been so much focus on, uh, you know, borrowing costs, so much.

Focus on gas at the pump. What do you think that the voter is

thinking in this moment? I think that the average voter isn't

really paying attention to things like, you know, Treasury intervention or the

bond market. You know, what they really are paying

attention to is their own pocketbooks. You know, is the price of gasoline going

down? Um, you know, when they hear Treasury

intervention, they probably think that the Trump administration is trying to do

something. But honestly, unless the evidence shows

up in their own pocketbooks and their grocery bills go down and gas goes down,

and they're feeling more secure in their jobs, or they're feeling like their

wages are going to go up next year, it's really not going to matter to them.

And so, you know, the Trump administration has made a number of

efforts to try to bring down costs or show that they're working on it.

And this to me is just the latest example.

But, um, I don't think voters are going to buy it until they see it themselves.

Well, we appreciate the three of you joining us, and there will be plenty of

conversations with all of you before we get to those midterms in November.

A big thank you to Nancy Cook, Bloomberg News senior national political

correspondent in Washington, also Michael McKee Bloomberg TV, radio and

international economics policy correspondent out there in Jackson,

Wyoming. And of course, IRA Jersey, Bloomberg

Intelligence chief, U.S. interest rate strategist out there at

Bloomberg Intelligence headquarters in Princeton.

Coming up next on Bloomberg Businessweek daily.

We're going nuclear. That's next.

Since 221 on Wall Street, we do check markets all day long here at Bloomberg.

Stocks mixed oil is declining as traders assess Treasury Secretary Scott Benson's

plan to isolate Iran from the global economy.

Right now, West Texas Intermediate crude down 2.5% 8484 barrel barrel of Brent

crude 9196 Brent crude, down by 2.6%. The Dow has been higher all session

long, up 130, now up 2/10 of 1%. But the S&P, Nasdaq the Nasdaq 100 index

Russell 2000. They're all trading lower.

The S&P right now down ten. Drop there of one tenth of 1%.

Nasdaq Composite Index down 102 drop. There were 4/10 of 1%.

Nasdaq 100 index down 6/10 of 1%. The Sox, the Philadelphia Stock

Exchange's semiconductor index, is down 2.1%.

This ahead of Nvidia's earnings after the bell Wednesday.

The VIX, meanwhile, holding below 16 the two year, 4.23%.

The ten year, 4.69% gold is up 7/10 of 1%.

4635 the ounce and again, West Texas Intermediate crude, 8489 a barrel down

now by 2.5%. Most emerging market currencies holding

on to earlier losses as the U.S. unveils its campaign to further isolate

Iran. The Bloomberg Dollar Spot Index up now

by 2/10 of 1%. California Attorney General Rob Bonta

has canceled a meeting with Paramount. Skydance after details about the

discussions leaked over the weekend. Paramount has been trying to resolve

antitrust concerns about its planned acquisition of Warner Brothers

discovery. Paramount.

Skydance up 6/10 of 1%. Warner Brothers Discovery up now by 1%

for On-Demand news 24 hours a day. Subscribe to Bloomberg News Now wherever

you get your podcasts. Tim Stenbeck and Nora.

Melinda. That is Bloomberg Businessweek.

Charlie Pelley thank you for that. Well, this story from Ron Will, we're

getting our attention last week. Terror power.

It's the only company building utility scale nuclear power plant in the US

expects to announce its next project this year, one intended for a data

center. It would put the company, which is

backed by Bill gates, on track to break ground on its second project in 2027.

That's according to the CEO, Chris Levesque.

Chris Levesque joins us now, along with Will Wade.

Bloomberg News energy reporter. Chris is in Bellevue, Washington.

Will here in the studio with us. So Chris, who is this customer?

Well, thanks for having me. And, uh, we're not ready to announce

that first client yet. But I can tell you there's tremendous

interest in Atrium reactors here at Terra Power.

And I think the interest is really driven by, you know, what we've shown is

that with that first plant we're building in Wyoming, um, where we're

really the first mover in the US, it's the only grid scale power station, uh,

under construction, you know, in nuclear today, um, got the first Nuclear

Regulatory Commission approval. And then, you know what I think you also

saw with, um, our trip to Korea a couple of weeks ago, you know, just massive

announcements with the supply chain there.

Um, we've had great relationships with with Korea going on five years now with,

with SK, um, being our second biggest investor, um, as well as Hyundai being

part of our supply chain. But, uh, two weeks ago, we announced a

framework agreement for up to eight reactors with with Hyundai Engineering

and Construction and, um, you know, that Korean supply chain is, um, formidable.

You know, Korea has been building. South Korea has been building nuclear

plants. Um, over the last decades, while the US

hasn't been building very many. So, um, they're they're raring to go.

Um, you know, they also are committing to, um, um, you know, reach our, our

cost and schedule targets, which for our technology means delivering the atrium

reactors in just three years following groundbreaking.

That's that's what we're validating with, uh, with our design.

And that's why people are so interested in, uh, the atrium for AI is, uh, the

much shorter construction time that that will be all that she with the atrium.

Well, Chris and I just very briefly here, and I promise I want to, you know,

harp on this too much about the the which customer this will be.

But what is the reason that you're not ready to announce it?

Is it because the the ink hasn't dried on the agreement?

There is no signed agreement. Like like what is the reason you can't

announce it yet? So, um, I think it's important to

realize that, um, we're in a period now where, um, you know, largely driven by.

I demand, um, utilities and AI customers, namely, the hyperscalers are

entering into discussions with companies like ours to start some of these new

projects. And I think you have to realize that,

um, the US and Europe have been super successful in the past with, with new

nuclear. So, um, you know, we spend a lot of time

structuring these new projects. And for us, um, kind of the formula, the

winning formula is, you know, continuing to show success in the project with that

first plant and Wyoming, uh, where we're the first mover on multiple fronts.

But then it's about showing that we have a supply chain, and we have an

experienced supply chain who is willing to say to the utilities and to the

hyperscalers customers that will stand behind delivery.

And, you know, Tara Power and the rest of our delivery team like HD, Hyundai

and Hyundai Engineering construction. Um, that's what we're seeing, that the

market right now is that, you know, not only can you look at that first plant in

Wyoming and see that we're, you know, going to deliver the first nuclear plant

in a long, long time, uh, and make electricity in 2031.

But right behind that, we're going to be quickly scaling, uh, up to something

like ten reactors per year by the middle of the 2030s.

Well, Chris, so when you're doing now is for utility and that that's the

traditional model for nuclear power. Build a power plant and have a utility

to take the electricity there. How is it different now that data

centers and I and Big Tech have entered the equation here?

Yeah. Thanks for the question, Will.

And thanks for following up our so, so closely over the years.

You know, I grew up in New Hampshire watching, um, uh, the Seabrook Nuclear

Power plant take over ten years to get built, and it was had a lot of ups

opposition on the news every night, and it was paid for by the ratepayers alone.

I can remember my parents, you know, complaining about seeing this line on

their electricity bill related to that nuclear power plant.

And every time there was a cost change, it hit the ratepayers.

Um, we're in a new era now where, um, you know, the the white House and

governors are not going to allow, um, elect existing electricity ratepayers,

mom and pop to pay for the CapEx of these new plants.

So what you're seeing in the deals we're structuring is, yeah, the utility will

be present. Um, they'll probably be running the

plant with when it goes online, and they may even own it.

But in the deals that we're structuring, we're going to be looking for the

eventual electricity Customers to enter into power purchase agreements that will

essentially pay for, you know, the capital expenditure for that plant.

Um, and that'll be a long term PPA that lasts.

Uh, 20 to 30 years. Our data center operator is willing to

pay a premium for nuclear power. Uh.

Because they need reliable power so badly.

Uh, some are, uh, some are raising their hand, uh, Nora, and saying, yes, we will

pay a premium, uh, both to assure that security of supply, but also to have,

you know, emission free source like nuclear.

Um, but for a long time at Tera Power, you know, coming straight from our

chairman, the goal has been to, you know, develop a power source, our need

for, um, reactor that will be competitive with renewables and gas and

what we've seen in our design, uh, because, you know, our an atrium reactor

can be built much more quickly, Requires less steel, less concrete.

Um. We have a design that, um, you know,

once we come through our first of a kind, you know, non-recurring

investments, we're going to have a design that will be competitive with

other energy sources. And, you know, the US is the hardest

place because we have cheap gas. It's the hardest place to compete with

cheap electricity. Um, so we'll be we'll be successful

competing in the US, but then we'll have super low cost, uh, nuclear, you know,

available to, you know, countries like, like the UK, um, or even, you know, in

South Korea, we think there's, you know, tremendous demand growth there, not just

from I, but from, uh, semiconductor fabrication.

And we will have a very economic power source for, for this century.

Well, Chris, when you talk about not letting mom and pop ratepayer get stuck

with the bill, when we talk about big tech companies willing to pay a premium

right now for nuclear, that's kind of tacitly admitting that, at least now

these first ones are not going to be cheap.

They're definitely going to cost more. When do we get to this cheap nuclear

power that you're talking about? And how do we get there?

Yeah. Um, you know, every business has an

investment. Um, you know, uh, pharma, you name it,

all have investments to get your product out the door.

We're making that non-recurring investment right now at Terra Power with

with our investors, you know, like Bill gates and SK.

Uh, Nvidia joined us as an investor last year.

Uh, and that investment is being matched by the US Department of Energy.

Uh, that's going to allow us to deliver, um, the first plant, um, with the

non-recurring costs covered again by our investors in the Doe, not by the

ratepayers. Uh, will then by way of, you know, these

orders that are coming, be able to quickly move down, uh, you know, the

cost curve and supplier partners, like, you know, HD Hyundai, the biggest

shipbuilder in Korea, and Hyundai Engineering Construction, who really has

a, you know, formidable, uh, um, reputation.

Those delivery partners are going to help us quickly get down that cost

curve. So how much of the conversation you're

having with data center operators is about clean energy versus just simply,

we need a lot of power and we need it now.

It's both. I see the hyperscalers still, uh, really

committed to clean energy. Um, I also see them, um, facing

tremendous, uh, you know, electricity demand.

It's a problem they have to solve now, and it's a problem we've been trying to

solve at Terra Power by, uh, driving a design that can be built much faster

because, you know, it's true. Nuclear has been a great source of

electricity for the last 60 years in the US and Europe.

But the construction projects have just been too long.

So I think the reason Terra Power is getting a lot of attention right now is,

you know, we're turning heads that we're actually building the thing in Wyoming,

and then we're validating that we can deliver these things on a 36 month

construction schedule once you break ground.

So you're talking about being able to do ten power plants a year.

When do we get there. Mhm.

Yeah. By the mid 2030s will.

And you know that'll be a huge change. Um but you know I really have to hand it

to companies like Hyundai. Uh Chairman Chung there uh turn to Bill

gates and I and he said you know, we build up to 100 ships a year in our

shipyard, you know, let us show you how to scale.

He's he said, normally nuclear does things 1 or 2 at a time.

Uh, and we're really seeing in our five year relationship with Hyundai, um,

they're providing design input to us. They're showing us how to get the cost

down. And really, how does how to scale to

that kind of delivery rate, I should say, if you want more reporting

on the nuclear industry in South Korea, will wait.

Has done some great reporting on that. Uh, after a visit last year, will, I

believe was maybe it was the last year. Yeah, last year there.

So check out that on the Bloomberg terminal.

Uh, really appreciate you joining us, Chris.

Uh, today on the program. Don't be a stranger.

Come back before the mid 2030s when you're doing, you know, ten of these a

year. Uh, we're going to follow it closely.

Chris Levesque, uh, he is the CEO and president of Terra Power, joining us

from Bellevue, Washington. Also with us.

And a big thank you to Will, uh, Will way to Bloomberg News energy reporter.

Check out Will's reporting on the Bloomberg terminal and at Bloomberg.com.

When we come back, we're going to be getting a dispatch from Canada on the

latest between the tensions, uh, between the US and Canada.

Right now, the S&P 500 just down one tenth of 1%, the Nasdaq Composite down

4/10 of 1%. The Dow up 3/10 of 1%.

Take a look at the stocks which is under pressure ahead of Nvidia earnings this

week down more than 2%. At last check we had the majority of

members of the Sox lower coming up next on Bloomberg Businessweek daily.

We're going to Canada and we're talking trade tensions.

This is Bloomberg.

Which? Is 240 on Wall Street.

We do check markets all day long here at Bloomberg.

The Dow higher the S&P NASDAQ Nasdaq 100 index.

They are all declining right now. We've got the Dow up 3/10 of 1% up on

39. Dow industrials being led higher by visa

Disney and Walmart Nasdaq is down 7/10 of 1%.

Stocks are falling amid a chip selloff. The Nasdaq 100 index down 5/10 of 1%.

Nasdaq 100 down 7/10. The Russell 2000 index down 7/10 of 1%.

Semis hit particularly hard today with the Sox the Philadelphia Stock Exchange.

Semiconductor index down now by 2.2%, two year at 4.23% with a ten year, 4.69%

for 30 year, 5.22% gold, up 6/10 of 1%. 4632 the ounce West Texas Intermediate

crude oil down 2.3%, holding just above 85 a barrel.

Brent 9215, down by 2.4%. You heard him on Bloomberg Radio.

Watched him on Bloomberg Television. Treasury Secretary Scott Benson

threatening economic punishment against any country doing business with Iran as

part of an economic D-Day campaign. Besson says the U.S.

has unveiled sanctions against more than 60 entities, focusing on five of Iran's

most vital lifelines. President Trump, meanwhile, pledging to

double the auto tariffs on Canadian vehicles and parts beginning next year.

Shares of the automakers today are trading lower.

General Motors, down 1.1% for shares, down 3.3%.

Stellantis, parent of Jeep and Chrysler, down now by 3.5% for On-Demand news 24

hours a day. Subscribe to Bloomberg News Now wherever

you get your podcasts. Nora and Tim, that is up Limburg

business flash Charlie, thank you for that update.

We do appreciate it. Well, let's go to Canada because Prime

Minister Mark Carney said his government is still working on options for

retaliating against President Trump's new tariffs on Canadian goods, but added

that he's willing to continue trade talks if the US adopts the right

attitude. The discussions with U.S.

negotiators revealed that the president, President Trump that is, wants to

destroy Canada's major industries steel, aluminum and autos with unfair terms.

This according to the Prime minister. Here's what the Prime Minister said

earlier, speaking from Quebec. The goal

of our trade negotiations with the United States has always been to get the

best deal for Canadians, never a deal at any price or on any timeframe.

Well, we made progress. We did make some progress in recent

weeks. In the end, that momentum reversed and

we could not accept what the US had offered, nor could we give what they

asked. That was Prime Minister Mark Carney

earlier. Speaking from Quebec, the Prime

Minister's comments came hours after President Trump pledged to hike tariffs

on Canadian autos to 50% starting on January 1st.

The current rate is 25% but applied only to non US content and finished vehicles.

I want to bring in Melissa Shen, Bloomberg News Toronto bureau chief.

She joins us from Toronto. Melissa, how would you describe the

state of negotiations right now? Yes, I mean, it has been quiet the past

couple of days. Um, you know, last Wednesday, uh, it

seemed that we would have a deal, um, between Canada and the US.

And then, um, as of Friday, you know, those talks fell apart seemingly at the

11th hour. Um, and so now the feeling here in

Canada is very much of defiance, um, ready to, uh, you know, hit back against

the U.S. and kind of digging in for a fight.

How long could this fight go on? Uh, so, according to reporting from our

colleague Josh Wingrove. Um, you know, there is openness to, uh,

resuming, uh, the, the, uh, discussions. But, uh, you know, Canadian officials

are also getting ready for something that might not.

Talks not resuming until after the midterms, um, or even until, uh,

President Trump leaves office. So, uh, you know, earlier today, uh, you

played that clip of, uh, Prime Minister Carney.

Uh, he did say that, uh, Canada is open to returning to the negotiating table if

Canada is treated with respect. Um, and we did also hear, uh, from Vice

President JD Vance and, uh, Treasury Secretary Scott Benson, both of whom

sort of hinted, uh, that under the right conditions, talks could resume.

So, um, you know, hope is not lost, but certainly, uh, there are, uh, you know,

it's not it's not anything scheduled or immediate at the moment, and does the

threat of 50% tariffs starting on January 1st.

That's months from now. That is, after the midterm elections.

Does that buy time for these two countries to actually work out a plan

before then? It does seem to.

And the thought, you know, is that given all that time, there is this

understanding of how important the auto industry is to both countries and how

much of an effect putting those tariffs on, um, Canadian autos would have on

both countries and on the US. So potentially, uh, that is with the

thought we, we never know what's what's in President Trump's head.

Uh, but uh, yes, we did observe certainly that there is quite a bit of

time before, uh, that could take effect. But also anything can happen.

Let's have a headline 50% tariff number sounds economically seismic, but the

measures cover only about 5% of Canada's exports to the U.S., and that doesn't

even count some of the strategically important products like energy critical

minerals. How much damage is this likely to cause

and where will it be felt most sharply? Yes.

So let's just make sure we're talking about the 50% tariffs that came into

effect on Saturday. Um, and so yes, that actually affects

sort of a wide variety of Canadian goods, but not big, big sectors in and

of themselves. So Whigs are among them a hockey sticks,

uh, plywood. Uh, and so it's sort of it's a very

interesting list. Um, and that makes it very difficult to

kind of, um, it's not a huge number in and of itself.

Um, the one estimate from a University of Calgary professor is that it will be,

uh, about 90,000 jobs that would be affected, which is 0.4% of, uh, the

working population. Uh, and so that, uh, would only be if

the, uh, tariffs were to continue for quite some time.

So, um, but it's a lot of small businesses, it's very hard to help those

small businesses because, you know, you don't necessarily know who they are.

Um, and some of the support that have been out there have really been aimed at

large sectors like autos, like steel and aluminum.

Mhm. We'll talk to be a bit about the

political support for Carney. I mean is it something that you think is

durable, especially when we start to see economic costs rise.

It's a great question. Um, and just to sort of bring it back a

little bit, um, you know, as soon as the threat of tariffs against Canada came

into effect early last year, um, and as well the commentary about, uh, Trump

annexing Canada, making it the 51st state.

That's when Canadians really started to listen and started to, um, you know,

boycott products, limit or eliminate travel to the U.S.

whenever possible. Um, so this movement that Canadians have

been doing has been happening for more than a year now, but a year and a half.

Uh, and that is wax and wane, of course. Is also the talks waxed and waned?

Uh, as of now, there was a flash poll done over the weekend that found about

three and four Canadians support the direction that Mark Carney.

Prime Minister Mark Carney is going in. Um, and but to your point, if the

economic pain continues for quite some time, uh, you know, the cost of living

is expensive here as it is in the US. And at some point it is sort of

important to look at the pocketbook effect.

And, uh, it can be sometimes more expensive to buy local or to spend

money, uh, within Canada. And so it just really will depend in

terms of the reaction, uh, how long this pain goes on.

We should note to, uh, Prime Minister Mark Carney, he did serve as the

chairman of the board of directors for Bloomberg LP starting in August of 2023.

He left that position when he, uh, ran for prime minister.

I just want to point to in the last minute that we have a post from on

social media that the president posted earlier today said Canada has been

ripping off the United States of America for years.

Their ridiculously high tariffs on our farmers and farm products has made life

impossible for these great American patriots, and has long created a $60

billion deficit between our two countries.

I'm not going to have you fact check this one, but, but but for people who

are, uh, having trouble keeping up with what this is about, is it about this is

about wildfire smoke. Like, what is what what are the issues

here? Uh.

Great question. Um, I think a lot of the negotiators

might be asking themselves the same question.

Um, yes. There's a lot of long standing

irritants, um, between Canada and the US, it seems, despite the fact that we

do have a free trade agreement that Trump signed in 2020, uh, himself in his

previous term, uh, you know, you mentioned dairy, uh, you mentioned

wildfire smoke. Uh, there's also, uh, some issues that

came up at the last minute in the negotiations regarding trucks and

whether they would be, uh, tariff exempt.

As, uh, Prime Minister Carney mentioned, uh, the U.S.

seemingly wants to remove autos and steel and aluminum as areas in which

Canada can thrive. Um, so it just seems that there are, uh,

various issues that have come to light. Um, French language requirements.

Um, so, you know, which is the most important one?

We're not really sure. Well, I'm glad you're keeping track of

them for us. And we appreciate you taking the time

this afternoon. That's Melissa Chen, Bloomberg News

Toronto bureau chief, joining us from Toronto.

Coming up next on Bloomberg Businessweek, Dahlia, check of markets

and stocks on the move. This is Bloomberg.

This is Bloomberg Businessweek daily with Carol Massar and Tim Stent event on

Bloomberg Radio and television. It is Bloomberg Businessweek daily.

That is Nora. Melinda.

She is in for Carol Massar today. Carol out for the week on a week.

That is a pretty busy one. We have earnings coming up.

We've got Michael McKee out there in Jackson Hole, Wyoming, getting ready for

the economic symposium. There's a lot of it's a lot going on a

lot also for the bond market to digest, where we've really been seeing this

whipsaw in the market. A lot of volatility there.

So we'll see how this proceeds here. Uh volatility in the semiconductor

space. Today we got the Sox down uh more than

2%. It was down as much as 3% earlier in the

session. We do have all 30 names of the Sox lower

the S&P down about 2/10 of 1%. The Nasdaq down about half a percentage

point. I am looking at Nvidia just ahead of

earnings. I know you're on decliners a little

later. Oh yeah Nvidia shares down 2.5% ahead of

those results. Dragging all the other names down with

it. Yeah that's what happens.

I'm Tim along with Norm Melinda. We're joined by Bloomberg News equities

reporter Avalon Purnell for some stocks on the move.

Hey, Avalon. Hi.

We have to start off with some travel names.

Expedia. That's ticker XP currently moving up

about 4.7%, and that's to hit a record high.

And that's after Evercore lifted its price target on the online travel agency

to a street high $430. For reference, that implies about a 34%

jump from Friday's close for that stock. This analysts saying that Expedia has a

most attractive valuation on a PE and free cash flow basis relative to some of

its peers, like Airbnb and Booking. And also worth noting that Expedia has

really shaken off some of those broader concerns about global travel trends,

with management still highlighting earlier this month that they still

expect some strong travel demand despite the ongoing war in the Middle East.

Are you guys using sites like this, like these OTAs, online travel agencies, or

do you go directly with, you know, the rental car company or the airline?

What do you do? It depends.

For me, yeah. It depends.

I mean, I feel like my my parents, they're definitely into the whole

speedy, uh, what else travel advice. What are the losses?

Yeah, all those different websites. I think I tend to go with whatever my

credit card points will work for. I like that, okay.

Yeah. I also love Skyscanner.

And so whatever they tell me is like the best way of getting, like, the flight.

That's typically the way that I'm going. What about you?

I'm going to start going to Avalon for the answer, because it sounds like, as

you sure she can do all the research. All right.

What else you got for us? Canada Goose, that is ticker GEOs.

It is currently falling about 6.8% to hit its lowest level since last April.

And that's after Wells Fargo downgraded the cold weather clothing maker to

underweight from overweight, the analysts pointing to a couple of risk.

More specifically, like increasing challenges from the 50% tariffs that the

U.S. has put on Canada, and also some

potential headwinds stemming from a stronger than expected El Nino, which is

just a periodic weather pattern that could also weigh on outerwear sales if

the winter is a little bit warmer. Yeah, and I think people who don't

follow this industry closely might be surprised to find that everything Canada

Goose makes is actually made in Canada. Yeah.

It's unlike you know, I've talked about this on air before and somebody got in

touch with me and I can't remember if they were making fun of me or not, but

pointing out that, you know, Patagonia clothing is not made in Patagonia, for

example. Yeah.

Canada goose, they're sticking with it. Yeah, they make sure that it's homemade.

And born and bred. Where else are you looking right now?

Hims and hers. That's ticker.

Hims is currently dropping about 9.5% most intraday in nearly a month.

And that's after our very own Maddison Mueller reported Friday after the

markets that the telehealth platform was put on notice by visa for excessive

customer complaints and its weight loss subscription business.

Company will need to get its dispute rate to be under 1.5% to get out of this

program. And it's all about this like Hims and

hers subscription to get weight loss drugs.

I'm curious what they're what they're upset about.

I know this is a stock that you cover really closely on our equities team,

because you cover all the health care related stocks.

This is a name I feel like this has been on the move so much.

I'm curious what these complaints might be.

Yes. So part of the complaints are the fact

that the introductory membership is about $39 for the first month.

However, afterwards it increases to $149, but that does not actually include

the price of the drugs. So if you get prescribed to a go V or

something else, you have to pay that on top.

And we already know these drugs tend to be slightly expensive as well.

So you can imagine and having a pretty big surprise coming in on your credit

card. So 70 are they still had to compound

these and sell their their own versions, or are they not allowed to do that

anymore? They're not necessarily allowed to

advertise it. But as long as they're doing like, you

know, adding like vitamins and it's just a personalized that is still,

technically speaking, allowed. Okay.

Wow. I have one for now.

You know, with today's stock movers. For more conversations like this, check

out our Stock Movers podcast. You can subscribe for five minute

episodes on the biggest winners and losers in the stock market.

You can listen to Stock movers on Apple, Spotify, or anywhere you get your

podcasts. Taking a look at how markets are this

afternoon on this first trading day of the week, the S&P down 2/10 of 1%.

Though you do have more stocks moving higher in the S&P 500, 295 versus 206

declining. You do have the Nasdaq down about a

little over half a percentage point. The Dow.

Up about 3/10 of 1%. Coming up next on Bloomberg Businessweek

daily. We got a great couple of hours.

If you're sticking with us on Bloomberg Radio, Bloomberg, uh, podcasts, and of

course, Bloomberg Originals and our YouTube channel.

We're going to be joined by David Auerbach over at Hoya Capital.

We're going to talk about the state of real estate rights.

He's going to be joining us in just a few minutes.

Also, it is today's big take. It is one of the most read stories on

the Bloomberg terminal. It's about how more and more banks are

actually forming and how much easier it is getting to get a national bank

charter, and how the president's family is actually joining the sprint to get

one of those. Also, we're going to get an update on

real estate here in New York City from Lisa Litman, Oprah Brown, Harris

Stephens, all that and more. Coming up next on Bloomberg Businessweek

daily.