hop in a driverless taxi with the Google

owned self-driving company whmo opening

up its Robo taxis to all users in that

City the technology of course is hugely

expensive alphabet's autonomous vehicle

unit weo completing another major round

of funding Teedra has served as co-ceo

at whamos since

2021 we are on a mission to build the

world's most experienced driver and make

it safe and easy for people and things

to get where they're going this is not a

move fast and break things this is a

move with great great iterative pace and

focus on

[Music]

safety please uh join me in welcoming to

kedra from weo to the

stage hi thank you for thank you it's a

pleasure thanks for coming thank you so

much Hi D thank you tea thanks so much

for being here yeah thank you uh tequa

has been co-ceo of weo since

2021 where she leads the company's

business operations and expansion in

autonomous driving recently weo has been

reported to be completing I don't know

if weo put this out or if it wasn't been

used but over 100,000 pay trips per week

now is that is that public is that like

a true thing it's completely true it's

over 100,000 over 100,000 week week per

week yeah that's awesome and um we can

now see wh Mo's autonomous ride haing

Services in Phoenix La San Francisco in

the Bay Area Austin and I think on X you

announced 5 billion an additional

committed funding from alphabet I don't

know if that was recent to support wh's

expansion it was recent congratulations

and um so thanks for joining us uh the

weo story started a long time ago as a

Google X Project when did you join and

how did you kind of become coo yeah

thank you um so weo started as the

Google self-driving car project back in

2009 and uh actually my co-ceo was one

of those founding team members Demitri

doov and in 2016 at the end of 2016 we

spun out and sort of became wh um and

that's when I joined um at that point it

had been determined that the technology

was on a good enough path to start to

think about commercialization and scale

um and so the funny the fun thing about

joining a moonshot is you know I came

from Big tech company so I'm like oh

product Market fit like it's all there

I'm going to join and we're going to

scale and the reality is it was an

opportunity to learn how much this is a

process of discovery um how much this is

a process of figuring out not only the

technology roadmap but also the external

environment and at that time I had been

head of policy at a lot of companies and

I joined under the idea that if the

technology works the market opportunity

would come from being able to open

markets and so that was super terrifying

to me because if you're at most large

tech companies doing policy work you're

actually trying to

avoid costs or you're trying to defeat

legislation that's harmful but this was

really the opportunity of like how do

you Usher in this amazing technology and

so that's when I joined and then I um

was asked by my prior CEO to help

launched the first Market which was

Phoenix back then it was Chandler um and

we launched that back in 2017 and we've

been since 2018 a lot of people don't

realize we've had a 247 ride hailing

service um Around the Clock it was in

2020 during covid though that we removed

the driver from behind the wheel so we

have the weo driver uh that's driving

the vehicles at all time but there's no

human behind the wheel and we've been

offering that service now we're almost

at four years 24/7 not only in Phoenix

which was a 315 square m mile territory

but also in San Francisco and now here

in La so in that sort of ushering in

from Market one to this role I moved

through this coo role um and that's when

we actually remov the driver and that's

you know it was the we're the first

company that's done that and um so it

was daunting and I think that's one

thing I love about wh we call our team

wonuts is you just have to every time

get to this point of determining what's

good enough uh what's safe enough yeah

and then make that leap and then learn

because you can't learn until you get to

that next point and so of course we have

rigorous safety culture um but it was in

that time that I was coo and then in

April of 21 I moved into the co-ceo role

with Demitri so now now that it's

scaling 100,000 paid rides a week maybe

we can talk a little bit I mean Jason SP

a lot maybe starting with security would

be an interest safety rather would be a

really good idea um you've done it seems

like millions of rides now no fatalities

correct that's right um but there have

been accidents so when you look at the

the accidents that have occurred how

often does an accident occur and in what

percentage of the time is it just

somebody running into the weo versus the

wayo running into somebody else yeah so

we've done 2 million sort of paid rides

um so when we think about we just

released this week our safety Hub so

this you're sort of tapping into an

issue that's really important what we've

been able to determine as of June of

this year with over 22 million what we

refer to as Ro miles those are miles

that are fully autonomous

uh we've been able to have 83% fewer

airbag deployments which of course is

important because those are high impact

um and 74 or 73% fewer injury causing

crashes now that's what we're focused

over a human over a traditional

traditional human meaning the

counterfactual in that area at that same

point in time exactly via insurance

claims and other data ex we're not we're

comparing in San Francisco not on

highways there Apple Apple's comparison

we're comparing in San Francisco or in

Phoenix okay great because this is the

next piece which is you're not yet on

highways that's right we're testing on

highways in Phoenix and San Francisco

saf drivers with employees and a human

behind the wheel at times and maybe you

could explain to us when why you're

taking that approach cuz in my

experience driving a Tesla since the

beginning with full self-driving and

autopilot before that um it seems like

it's better on the highway than is on

local streets where you have people

jumping out and weird things that occur

on the highway you very rarely have a

run into a weird thing it's it's pretty

ABC so I I would think it was the

opposite but is it because speed kills

what what's the thinking there so I

think so just for everyone to orient um

when you think about the levels of

autonomy we are only focused on level

four and above level four and above

means you do not need a driver's license

nor do you need to sit behind the wheel

so when you're focused on tackling the

hardest challenge first it's really

important to for the driver the weo

driver to ingest dense Urban

environments because that is where the

driver is going to learn the most

sitting on freeway seeing the same thing

every day can be predictable it's not

entirely predictable but it's not

additive to what the machine learns

that's a great answer so we're trying to

learn as much as we can learn and we've

always from the beginning been focused

on freeways it's just that freeways

isn't actually how the machine learns

the fastest in the most sophisticated

environments but because you brought up

you know sort of a level three or two or

one system I think it's also important

that for systems where you need someone

to sit behind the wheel you can have a

completely different approach to this

technology but we're really when I don't

know how many of you here have had the

chance to take a away my ride here in La

it actually includes this campus where

we're sitting right now but we you don't

you can't sit behind the wheel so

there's no ambiguity you sit in the

passenger seat or you sit in the back

seat so let's talk about the lar versus

camera bet elon's been pretty clear hey

you don't need lar it's a waste of money

the lar on Whos I believe is still in

the $1 to $220,000 in incremental class

am I ballpark correct I not sure oh okay

um so with that as you scale costs go

down yeah of course

so who's who's right I mean are you

using the liar and is that a critical

piece of this or do you think eventually

hey the cameras are seeing

360° they have higher Fidelity than

human eyes so and if humans do a great

job and you just have to beat the humans

at driving why even have the liar what

do you think so obviously we have

conviction that we need liar radar and

cameras uh we have all three it's given

us the opportunity to scale at this

point we're the only company that's

doing level four driving on public roads

24 hours a day it's very different to

get to the place of a demo we learned

that ourselves back in 2015 and 16 and

17 we had an autopilot Highway um

product we allowed employees at the time

Google employees to ride in that product

we told them to pay attention we told

them you have to be alert and be

prepared to take over what did they do

they do we're human we want to do other

staff when we're in the car like I want

to be on the phone I want to get to that

meeting I need to send that last email I

need to check whether or not my son's

doctor's appointment is tomorrow and

next Thursday we're distracted and so

what happens the thing's beeping at you

it's telling you to re-engage and pay

attention and what we learned is that

that's not a way to improve road safety

and so the question is what's the end

goal is it to improve Road Safety or not

for us as a company we are obsessed our

our culture is about safety this mission

is about safety and we want to expand

the number of people who have access to

Mobility options if you need a driver's

license then it's just like every other

Mobility platform you have to be behind

the wheel can I sorry go ahead I'm

curious about when this flips from a

technology problem and a go to market

problem to one of Public

Health um because that's a staggering

fact and you know we all know people

that have lost somebody close to them

whether it's just a road accident or the

dunk driving or to you know I don't know

if you guys saw anybody follows hockey

but the you know Johnny hocky who was

killed with his brother the day before

his sister's wedding by a drunk drive

this is like so avoidable so what does

it take for a politician or a group of

of politicians and I don't even know at

which level this decision would get made

where they say okay we've seen enough

that should be the only solution and are

you pushing for that so we are pushing

to make sure people who put autonomous

vehicles on the road have to demonstrate

their safety case we think the worst

thing that could happen is introducing a

new technology that doesn't actually

improve this problem because it'll kill

the whole industry because it'll kill

the whole industry and the State of

Affairs 4 ,000 Americans 1.35 globally

dying annually from Road crashes is

avoidable and so the challenge that we

have to tackle with a lot of humility is

how prepared is the public you know

humans can kill other people how

prepared is the public to accept that

this isn't going to be a Panacea and

it's not going to be perfect you didn't

hear me say 100% 100% 100 right was 70

there'll be a small error R there's

going to be a small and so that's the

work that we're doing which is we have

Community Partners Mothers Against Drunk

Driving national Safety Council a host

of organizations who've been trying to

tackle this issue who we partnered with

early because it's it's actually in both

of our interest to figure out how to

tell the story that if this technology

can reduce 60% of the uh fatalities then

it's worth the exposure to the risk are

you on any sort of internal shock clock

meaning there must have been a moment

where you convened a meeting or you guys

had a meeting and you said all right we

have enough data let's go we're going to

pull the guy out of the car or hey this

is it we're ready and then you show it

to regulators and they say okay is there

a set of these really important

Milestones that we're going to feel like

goes to other cities like is it only

grid cities where this works like so

where do you go from here yeah I hope I

hope that what over time you start to

experience is one because we are you

know super focused on safety you'll see

us scaling

um and because we're building a driver

and not a car you'll see a scaling in a

number of ways so we have Partnerships

right now we have a partnership with

Uber in Phoenix why are we doing that

people are like oh my gosh I got my Uber

Eats in AO like why are you all doing

that it's because we're building a

driver and so we're trying to figure out

all of the ways in which this driver

could be applied to future use cases and

so over time you're certainly going to

see us announce new places but you're

also going to see like in San Francisco

we launched a 24-hour service in a

limited territory and over time we've

expanded that territory is a step

functioning complexity to go to cities

that are more how would I call it more

chaotically City planned it is

definitely an opportunity for the driver

to learn more and so coming to Los

Angeles for example was more like being

in Phoenix going to Austin exactly

exactly going to Manhattan we will

certainly benefit from our work in San

Francisco same thing with DC start with

the GD cities and work your way into

more complex Series so can I follow up

on the um on that that last point I I I

have a friend who's the third or fourth

investor in Uber and

um and he he's uh he's very worried that

once this product scales there's not

really giv me a need for Uber anymore

right why would you need Uber if you can

just summon the robot car directly or

the robot driver whatever you want to

call it right driver car whatever I mean

doesn't this logically disrupt

Uber at you know once it's at

scale I think

um well they're a current part I said we

have a partnership with right I mean I

have we have a partnership your friend

hasn't sold enough

share your friend's doing just fine we

have the partnership with Uber because

we think it's important for us to create

an AV ecosystem around this technology

like this isn't going to be we've

created technology we're going to figure

out everything ourselves like that would

be foolish and very expensive and we'd

never find ourselves profitable but

having companies that are experts in

integration having Automotive partner

you know we have we're not building the

car having network Partners having Fleet

operating Partners public officials like

there's a lot that is built around us

and these are the early days the early

Innings and so that's part of it is

learning in the I'd say five years ago

people would say to me you know Network

operators would say oh this is exactly

like we know how to do this well this is

a constrained Supply it's not a supply

you just sege this is a driver that you

need to understand actually how to

operate with and so I think we're going

through those steps to learn together

and so what I would say is there's room

for a lot of people under this is the is

the insurance Lobby in the insurance

industry a proponent

or do they would they try to constrain

your progress so one of the largest uh

reinsurers in the world swisser is

actually been doing our safety yeah they

would want to underwrite this yeah but

I'm talking about more like the Geico of

the world same I think they're very

eager to get the data sets that we're

releasing like we released set 20 uh

safety papers last year they're all

wanting to understand what the actual

impact of this technology can be because

you know one of the things I think

that's hard for us to grasp as as humans

or at least I'll say for me I don't like

speaking for everybody the

you know we drive in a week more than a

human drives in a

lifetime and you can say that as a

company that runs fleets but we're the

only company where it's one

driver and that's not like that's not

the way the world is organized right now

right FedEx has a lot of drivers all of

you who have Teslas have a lot of

drivers like everyone has a lot of

drivers and all of those drivers have

different capabilities this is one

driver learning all the time in

unison and so like what can we

demonstrate that's possible and it

really goes back to your other question

of like what do what are policy makers 5

years from now really going to want to

know and how will they be able to derive

from what we're doing today where were

you when you heard the news of Cruz

dragging that woman in San Francisco 20

feet and then where were you and what

was your reaction internally to when you

found out Cruz covered it up

um I don't remember where I was uh when

I learned but I um you know it's we're

here to improve Road Safety so it was

pretty um upsetting I think to me and

the whole org I think as we learned

about the lack of transparency like our

view has just been be transparent it's

not Perfection like it's technology yeah

but you're considered they contemporary

and you have a different approach you

would never cover it up um they

obviously had something dysfunctional

did that set the industry back

significantly how are Regulators talking

to you before and after that if

differently if at all it definitely led

to more scrutiny in San Francisco

because there was already an active and

continues to be a fairly active voice

against technology in San Francisco and

so we needed to continue to engage which

we were already doing provide more data

which which we're of course willing to

do and I think over time what we'll see

is you know we have to get to a place

where the amount of data that we're

providing actually advances the safety

concerns I think at that point it was

just providing a lot more engagement so

if the mission is to reduce those debts

and to really scale this technology Uber

is doing a quarter billion rides a week

uh you just raised five billion it's a

big number uh that gives you another

50,000 cars um which is a fraction of

the rides in but one city

it seems like you need a lot of Partners

in the car space to build this so

wouldn't the best strategy be to license

this technology to every car maker and

then allow the Ubers the lifts the door

dashes um and Fleet managers to handle

cleaning the puke in the back of the

cars and putting the air in the tires

because I don't think wao wants to be in

the back of that car cleaning up the

puke and the and doing the air Tire

right there has to be somebody who

manages all that so so maybe talk a

little bit about that possibility of and

even a more beautiful thing would be for

you to open source it so has there been

a discussion internally about open

sourcing this technology so I'll start

at the beginning I think what you just

described is exactly the AV ecosystem

that I'm talking about and yes out of

necessity and because we are the I mean

whoever was first was going to need to

create this it doesn't exist right so

we're doing that um I think the second

part of what you're talking let everyone

do what they're good at like we're good

at building this driver there's though a

period where we have to become really

good at what does it mean to operate at

scale and that's the that's where we are

right now what does it mean to operate

at scale what does it you know

technology can work and not be

delightful not be reusable not be

repeatable and that you know we don't

just want people having tourism rides we

want people actually integrating this

into their lives and we just did a a ux

study and we found that a third of

people use the service in San Francisco

to go to their doctor appointments we're

like that feels like real life and 36%

uh we using the vehicles to go to local

businesses which is also real life and

so these are the kinds of signals that

we're trying to get as far as like

personally Owned Cars we've always said

as part of our strategy from the

beginning that we would start with ride

hailing and local delivery and that

eventually we would make our technology

available to um Automotive companies so

that this you know at some point you'll

find wayo cars sitting on showroom

floors for sale oh wow so you you we

could go buy one and then put it into

whatever Fleet we want yes what does it

cost to make one of these cars today and

where do you see it in 5 years yeah and

just I guess on that question where's

the Tipping Point Unit economics so if

you look at on the ride hailing business

based on I know a lot of people drive

during rush hour and then they don't

need rides the rest of the time so

there's a lot of excess inventory

sitting around so if you look at the

utilization of a car over its lifetime

and the cost of the car over the

lifetime what's the the breaking point

where the unit economics Mak sense yeah

um so your question of cost of car we

just don't break it out since we're not

um reported separately for alphabet

we're just bundled rumor is a buck 50

right now it's

close Okay fck 25 not commenting on

rumors not commenting on rumors wa wait

if that's that's just the um the system

for self-drive the car plus the system

The Car Plus but what 125 to 150 is the

rumor rumored cost for the car today

actually is like comment on the rumor

well but but that's I mean that's

obviously a lot more than a Tesla right

so

yeah t 40,000 50,000 yeah so do we do we

know ballparks here what can we

say keep on so fun we're just we're

poker players so we're trying to read

you and bait you and it's not working we

didn't know you were a Jedi so so so

sorry let me just ask is it about

Reinventing the system or getting the

next gen of the system before the unit

economics break or is it about volume

what's the breaking point of where the

unit economics become profitable become

positive um yeah not not going to get

into that other than to say to you I is

the thing I spend all of my time focus

on and we are on but there's a path

there there's completely a path there

well without getting into costs so is

one of the plans here to sell this to

you know all the car makers so that they

can compete with Tesla because most of

the car companies do not have the

technical capabilities to develop their

own self-driving it's just impossible so

are you guys going to be like an oem to

all the car makers so that they can

provide self-driving yeah we've said

sort of publicly and we've had

Partnerships where we've made the

technology available um it's a question

of when you know when will a level four

sort of product be available and

interesting to Consumers at scale you

know that's part of the question but

absolutely this is part of our strategy

friend of mine can I that yeah of course

I'm sorry friend of mine um who couldn't

make it here um is an angel investor and

Uber and um

he uh

was no uh if you look at the business

outside of the United States actually if

you look at Uber's business um there's a

lot of opportunity in other markets and

sometimes in other markets they will

prove probably more able and open-minded

to taking like the public health

priority around these things so why such

a heavy Reliance on America considering

the scale and the impr premature of

Google could probably pull you into any

number of markets anywhere around the

world yeah so we really think about it

as this sort of Learning Journey but

it's also just where we started right I

mean part part of the conversation we

get to have now is what would if the

driver was at this level of maturity

where would we have started um that said

we have Global aspirations we are always

thinking about the does it just take one

geography to prove this point or do do

you view it the problem that way like

it's like we're training we're training

we're training and then at some point

there'll be some City or yeah County

which point I just want to make sure I

understand this idea where like you can

prove that it's just so reliable and

valuable and that you're saving just I I

really care about that idea yeah to who

who who would it prove the point to the

people that would make the rules I guess

yeah I think I hope I I don't know I

think there's a lot of noise in the

system there's a lot of confusion about

full autonomy versus partial

autonomy um there's not a lot of

legislative activity that's informed by

experts right so I don't know right like

certainly It's My Hope and I think one

of the things when you think about

certain countries around the world there

is more of a nation state top- down

approach to some uh regulations and so

that could be easier Singapore yeah you

prove it it's codified into law you

launch um it had it that hasn't been the

primary way we've thought about Market

entri or opportunity but certainly one

of the yeah are but as long as some

markets adopt the rest of the markets

will see and they'll fall behind and I

mean you just have to penetrate some

markets yeah from Google had amazing

success with Android and open source so

back to that open source question you

must have had this discussion many times

internally why not open source the

technology and then provide you know the

premium Android to people who want want

to pay and is that something on the road

map because I hear there's a big

discussion internally to car OEM just

open sourcing the maps the software to

make everybody contribute to it to just

get this out quicker so where where are

you at with those internal discussions

that wayo give away the whole business

yeah exactly no well I mean Android it's

worked right I 20 billion in it's like

let's just give it away well I mean but

freedberg if you look at Android it's

only gotten stronger right completely

different I think that that was

Defensive on search but not your answer

no I like it when you guys answer each

other's questions cuz I get to learn

what you actually want to see your

answer we we fight a lot it's fine no

it's fun it's actually fun for me um so

feel free to keep so on the question of

open sourcing that isn't something that

we're spending a lot of time talking

about right now let's talk about level

six which I believe is inclimate weather

and really heart yeah oh level five

rather sorry um and I know when I'm in

my Tesla it gives me a little warning

hey in Clement weather and the FSD might

be degraded you know extra attention

time um how close are you you know to

feeling comfortable with these things

driving in snow ice rain or when that

happens do fleets just pull over and

game over you know you have you can't

use these this technology yeah we've uh

been improving weather we've tested

across 25 cities specifically for that

so we had massive storms in San

Francisco last year and we didn't take

down the fleet like our fleet was able

to handle all of the rain so rain and

flooding pretty good rain May good

because of like uh liar and radar

maybe you said it okay fog snow ice um

so we've tested

in we've tested in snow and ice we don't

have any deployments there but that's an

area that we're learning fog we've been

able to master that

280 no problem same thing with those

sandstorms in Phoenix that was an early

like those are actually you know very

challenging and then there swarms of

birds in Phoenix like really and and

heat right you have a machine brutal

it's like it's like Revelation

like there's a lot there's a lot and you

know we're the only company that can

pick you up autonomously at the airport

right and so

like is whole thing what has been the

hardest um challenge for you as CEO

I think we've heard I mean we've heard

all these rumors about like cultural

issues at Google or whatnot but you know

I get the sense that you're much more

separated in terms of building a much

more Technical and specific culture but

what what have been the hardest

challenges for you I think one of the

hardest challenges was making we made

such a big decision in going fully

autonomous which is sort of the reason

we're here during CO mean getting that

person out the person from behind the

wheel scaling this and so then bringing

the culture back together to now scale

so we just needed like we needed a

minute to lock back in that's one of the

things and the other one I would say is

what you just said which is you know

it's a brilliant team and the team works

really hard but like bad things are

going to happen in the real world with

human drivers around our cars and the

team takes that so seriously and so

that's it's it's like a it's like having

worked at I mean I worked at a I know

there too but like other kinds of tech

companies I know every kind of company

is stressful it's a different kind of

stress When people's lives are

completely and they personalize work

yeah and so that's it's just a different

level of stress and

accountability responsibility

differently because of that pressure or

no you do when things happen in Industry

you know we need people to sort of you

know stay buckled in and believing that

this is something that is worth it it's

audacious it's hard but it's worth it

and it and it's bigger most people come

because they have lost someone like

they're very Mis can I be very honest

with you it's it's an incredible framing

you gave and I I totally missed it for

so many years which is when you said

we're building one driver I thought for

whatever reason you were building an

autonomous driving system which I I

interpreted very technologically for a

very long time but you're absolutely

right you have one goal it's very

clarifying actually the world's greatest

driver one the world's greatest driver

world's most trusted driver most trusted

driver Teedra thank you forred yeah I

mean incredible thank you so much

yeah thank you it was awesome thank you

so much